PinkCarnations Posted February 22, 2015 Posted February 22, 2015 She's definitely into you. No girl invites their "friend" into bed with them and proceed to hold their hand all night. Either she wants to take things slow, tease you sexually, or was waiting for you to make a move. If it were me, and I was acting that way towards a guy I like, which I sometimes do, it means I wanted them to make a move. Sometimes I like to act like I'm being innocent and only wanting to cuddle with him, but really I want him to take the reigns and pounce on me or something haha. It usually leads to hot sex. Anyways you guys are both acting really weird towards each other. Just make a move already and go in for the kiss. 4
katiegrl Posted February 22, 2015 Posted February 22, 2015 The answer to this one is simple. If a woman won't kiss you on date one, there will probably never be a relationship between you two; she's just not attracted to you enough. Everything after date one was a waste of time. Women who feel something for you, enough to kick off a relationship, will kiss you on date one. The kiss test is one of the greatest signs of attraction there is. True assuming the guy attempted to kiss her and she turned away. From what I have read, the OP NEVER even tried to kiss her! So how does he know she doesn't want to kiss him if he never tried in the first place? What I am scratching my head about is why he didn't go in for the kiss while they were snuggling together in her bed? I am imagining that scenario ... and not kissing her..or at least trying to kiss...sounds unbelievable to me...under those circumstances. 1
losangelena Posted February 22, 2015 Posted February 22, 2015 I've gone out with a girl 4 times - the first meeting was drinks and we talked about getting together again at the end of the date. She didn't want a kiss - so it was a hug. Actually, katiegrl, OP does say this in his first post. What we don't know is if he tried to kiss her and was rebuffed, or if she explicitly said she didn't want to be kissed, or if he was waiting for her to kiss him, and it didn't happen. OP, I'm still curious about a couple of things. You never answered my question about what she was "aggressively questioning" you about. Or what kind of contact y'all have between dates. Is it calling, is it texting? Are you the one to do the majority of it?
mysteryscape Posted February 22, 2015 Posted February 22, 2015 Four dates without doing the deed makes her a cuddle b itch? That is absurd! Plenty of women insist on waiting a lot longer than that -- just read the answers to the questions on OKC. Maybe she is just being cautious, maybe she has been badly burned. Maybe she doesn't want to sleep with someone she doesn't know and then get dumped right away. You need to find a way to find out where she's really at. The line between "romantic" and "platonic" is often not so clear. It is not usually an on-off switch. 2
smackie9 Posted February 22, 2015 Posted February 22, 2015 Cuddle bit ches is the guy people!!!!! He is being her cuddle bi tch.........!!!!!!!
smackie9 Posted February 22, 2015 Posted February 22, 2015 BTW if a woman wants to take things slow, she shouldn't be inviting a man into her bed! What she is doing is immature, and she needs to step up and verbalize her expectations instead of playing games like this.
writergal Posted February 22, 2015 Posted February 22, 2015 fluidian - your thread reminds me of another thread here where both people wanted different things yet didn't voice that clearly to each other. What she did (invite you to cuddle platonically with her on her bed) at her age is pretty immature, considering it was just to tease you and not progress towards anything sexual. No one cuddles platonically on their bed with their date, unless they have serious intimacy issues and like to play games where they call the shots, and force the other person to bow to their demands. So that's a clear strike against her. But then there's your behavior. Why are you dragging your feet around her? Why are you inviting her out if you have no interest in her romantically? At this point, if you or she invite the other out again, it's up to you to make a move to gauge her interest. Until that happens, this game of cat and mouse you two are playing, isn't helping either of you. 2
Author fluidian Posted February 22, 2015 Author Posted February 22, 2015 OP, I'm still curious about a couple of things. You never answered my question about what she was "aggressively questioning" you about. Or what kind of contact y'all have between dates. Is it calling, is it texting? Are you the one to do the majority of it? Losangelena - aggressive question started rather benign and related to how I treat and perceive people - when I described the people that I normally spend time with and how they are not representative of the normal population (i.e. PhDs, MDs, and MBAs from top tier schools, 6-figure salaries, etc.), she dug in hard, was accusatory of me not being able to relate to the baristas, and it just kept going - trying to deconstruct my personality, and whenever I said something that she disagreed with, she was not scared to let me know why I was wrong. Anyhow, contact has been a combination texts and calls - she's always been responsive. Usually there was ~1 call a week that lasted 30-45 minutes - conversation has never been hard - most of the time on the calls is light, funny banter that culminates in firming up date plans. Texting has been every day or two - again, she's very receptive. Since date 3 (Valentine's dinner), she's been initiating more. For instance, she initiated texts with me last night at ~11:15 asking me about how my night was with my buddies - note that I had left her apartment earlier that day - so there was maybe only ~12 hours of silence. And I had mentioned, she had asked me out on Friday. Truthfully, the date on Friday night was the first time it actually seemed a date (excluding the first meeting) - the other two were likely influenced by aggressive question and the associated fallout.
Author fluidian Posted February 22, 2015 Author Posted February 22, 2015 True assuming the guy attempted to kiss her and she turned away. From what I have read, the OP NEVER even tried to kiss her! So how does he know she doesn't want to kiss him if he never tried in the first place? . As losangelena mentioned - I was going to kiss her the first time we met, but she gave me a cheek, so I just offered the hug. Second date was the aggressive questioning, so I didn't bother, and date 3, while maybe she was getting marginally more comfortable, she was still on the more awkward side of the scale. Meeting 4 - this Friday - when we were on her sofa at ~2 a.m., while the way that she positioned herself made it very hard to go for a kiss on her lips (she was digging the top of her head between my jawline and shoulder), I did actually kiss her on the cheek, although it was extraordinarily brief, as it was just for a split second when she pulled her head away from my shoulder - it's possible she didn't even know what it was. Regardless, she didn't pull back, but didn't come back for more. When I left her yesterday morning, when she asked first for an awkward side hug and then upgraded it to an actual hug, I did sense a bit of tension - it may have just been me, I have this odd feeling that she was wanting a bit more. The awkward side hug comment maybe a bit misleading, as it was effectively an inside joke...
Author fluidian Posted February 23, 2015 Author Posted February 23, 2015 Ok all - an update - she's still interested and seems very keen on hanging out this week. I just got a block of her time on Tuesday night - so we'll know the answer to my questions in a few days. I'm just going to go for it and see what happens...worst case I get a half ass kiss and a slap in the face. To me she's interesting enough to at least see it through to a yes or no...regardless of whether or not there's been some odd chemistry - I think that's kind of worked it's way through the system. And don't worry, I won't go cuddle bitch again... I appreciate all of the comments feedback...it's helped me figure out what to look for, what to do, and what not to do...not it's all an implementation game. I'll update later this week. 3
Vintage79 Posted February 23, 2015 Posted February 23, 2015 Congrats Fluidian - I'm glad to hear that you're finally taking (or at least suggesting that you will take) the active approach. I'm not sure how it will work out, but I always have to give someone a thumbs up who's going to try. Definitely let us know how it pans out.
losangelena Posted February 23, 2015 Posted February 23, 2015 Can we please put a nail in the term "cuddle bitch" now? Christ on a MF cracker, we are adults. That is the vernacular of children. OP, you be the man you are and assert your wants and needs in what's going on. No more, no less. 1
Fhsjkfjrhsdh3646 Posted February 23, 2015 Posted February 23, 2015 Can we please put a nail in the term "cuddle bitch" now? Christ on a MF cracker, we are adults. That is the vernacular of children. OP, you be the man you are and assert your wants and needs in what's going on. No more, no less. What? It's a valid term... If you're a guy who will cuddle with a girl when she sees you ~platonic and she wants all of the comfort but won't see you on a romantic level - you just became the cuddle bitch lol.
Author fluidian Posted February 23, 2015 Author Posted February 23, 2015 OP, you be the man you are and assert your wants and needs in what's going on. No more, no less. Crossing my fingers I won't back down - even if it doesn't work out with this girl, I think it will be good practice. The question I'm noodling on now is how to make it at least somewhat natural and comfortable as opposed awkward (only because kissing/make-out + more hasn't happened yet). I also still have to figure out what we're doing...which is something to think about tonight.
Author fluidian Posted February 25, 2015 Author Posted February 25, 2015 Just wanted to provide a quick update, as I said I would. I met this girl last night (5th meeting). As I had alluded to, her behavior seemed very different on the 4th meeting relative to the first 3, and the behavior of the 4th meeting continued - she was much more comfortable, not aggressively confrontational, this time she was actually flirting, initiating contact - all of the typical telltale signs of a girl who's interested. We had dinner, she came back to my house afterwards and we watched a movie - she was getting super close, tons of contact - and then she fell asleep during the movie - although at that point it was about an hour past her typical bedtime. She woke up towards the end of the movie -immediately jumped on me a bit - a short a make-out session and I drove her home. Before she got out of the car, kissed goodnight and she was already asking about when she could see me again and was seriously asking if she could see me tonight. I said no to tonight, but that Thursday should work. Overall, not crazy romantic escalation, in part because she was literally falling asleep, but I think the story is relatively straight forward and any ambiguity is slowly fading. Who knows what will ultimately happen - but that's life.
Fhsjkfjrhsdh3646 Posted February 25, 2015 Posted February 25, 2015 Just wanted to provide a quick update, as I said I would. I met this girl last night (5th meeting). As I had alluded to, her behavior seemed very different on the 4th meeting relative to the first 3, and the behavior of the 4th meeting continued - she was much more comfortable, not aggressively confrontational, this time she was actually flirting, initiating contact - all of the typical telltale signs of a girl who's interested. We had dinner, she came back to my house afterwards and we watched a movie - she was getting super close, tons of contact - and then she fell asleep during the movie - although at that point it was about an hour past her typical bedtime. She woke up towards the end of the movie -immediately jumped on me a bit - a short a make-out session and I drove her home. Before she got out of the car, kissed goodnight and she was already asking about when she could see me again and was seriously asking if she could see me tonight. I said no to tonight, but that Thursday should work. Overall, not crazy romantic escalation, in part because she was literally falling asleep, but I think the story is relatively straight forward and any ambiguity is slowly fading. Who knows what will ultimately happen - but that's life. Did you even try escalate for sex? Sounds like she's initiating contact more than you are, and you're just going along with it. Sounds like you are on some solid footing now at least - she seems interested in you.
fitnessfan365 Posted February 25, 2015 Posted February 25, 2015 This reminds me of a woman I went out with three times. On date one, gave me the cheek. Yet, she instantly followed the date up with a "I had a really great time and can't wait to see you again" text. Usually if a woman gives mixed signals, I don't call her ever again. But I did have a good time. So we went out again the next week. Same thing. She would always touch me, lean in close, etc.. At the end of the night she says "I'll give you a ride back to your car." In most cases, this is code for "kiss me goodnight". So once again she avoids kissing. I say to her "Gotta be honest. You're giving major mixed signals here. So I don't think we should see each other anymore." Then she was all over me because I called her on her BS. Then for the third date, she was 45 minutes late and that was the straw that broke the camel's back for me.
Author fluidian Posted February 25, 2015 Author Posted February 25, 2015 Did you even try escalate for sex? Sounds like she's initiating contact more than you are, and you're just going along with it. Sounds like you are on some solid footing now at least - she seems interested in you. Last night I initiated all of the initial contact, but then she matched and then (probably) took the lead. No - I didn't push for sex for a few reasons. She was essentially asleep 30 minutes into the movie (~35 minutes after getting back to my condo), and based on her other behavior, she's on the reserved side (as am I), so I don't see any need to really rush it. Basically, I just was looking for positive confirmation of romantic interest...I don't really feel like trying to have sex with someone who the last time I met her literally offered an awkward side hug as a good-bye...
losangelena Posted February 25, 2015 Posted February 25, 2015 Well good, I'm glad that went well. I agree about the sex thing—get more comfortable with each other first.
Fhsjkfjrhsdh3646 Posted February 25, 2015 Posted February 25, 2015 (edited) Last night I initiated all of the initial contact, but then she matched and then (probably) took the lead. No - I didn't push for sex for a few reasons. She was essentially asleep 30 minutes into the movie (~35 minutes after getting back to my condo), and based on her other behavior, she's on the reserved side (as am I), so I don't see any need to really rush it. Basically, I just was looking for positive confirmation of romantic interest...I don't really feel like trying to have sex with someone who the last time I met her literally offered an awkward side hug as a good-bye... You don't just jump from making out to sex. You just escalate your physical contact slowly and get more intimate, and if she isn't ready she'll usually stop you. Yes I'd say normally you're right - but you're at like date 5 so I don't think its weird lol. Edited February 25, 2015 by barcode88
Author fluidian Posted February 25, 2015 Author Posted February 25, 2015 You don't just jump from making out to sex. You just escalate your physical contact slowly and get more intimate, and if she isn't ready she'll usually stop you. Yes I'd say normally you're right - but you're at like date 5 so I don't think its weird lol. Yeah - kind of weird in terms of timescales, as I'd normally kiss a girl on the first date - and drive it towards sex somewhere in the date 3-5 range (but it happens when it happens). So you can look at it as date 5, but also you could think of it as 2-4 dates away from when it normally gets there if you use a first kiss as a timeline anchor. When it gets down to it, though, the timing doesn't really matter...things happen when they happen, and that's usually when they feel right and comfortable. Given that there was curious vibes for the first 3 meetings - it's not surprising that it's not quite comfortable and feeling right just yet. 1
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