elaine567 Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 He is such a honorable man that he would give up his own happiness to benefit others. In the same way, some convince the OW that he has to stay for the "sick" wife, the disabled wife, the "mentally ill" wife, the unstable wife who NEEDS him. He will not be that cad who leaves her, but he is just a feeble man, trying to do the honorable thing in intolerable circumstances but he has basic needs too. If the OW would only understand that, he would be eternally grateful to her. And often she does "understand";sometimes for years and years too. 2
Gigigirl Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 ******************************************************************* Gigigirl.....it may be just that simple...They are not looking for commitment but for a break from the kids ..spouse and everyday life...And its Da&n exciting..and wrong and from what i can see..feels like nothing else..But neither does D-DAY.. I am curious how did you hold your boundries to keep it from turning into a PA...Shirley Glass noted Infidelity author states "It is a Long Road to the first Kiss...but and quick step there after to having sex." Not asking to ridicule ...just curious... That is actually a really good question. My only answer I can come up with is I can have super strong boundaries against the things I WANT to have boundaries against like sex, intimacy etc... I choose NOT to apply those boundaries to everything else. It's a choice I make. Sex is not an issue in my relationship so that is not what I look for or want with them. I also don't attach like my APs attach to me, there is like an emotional block that only lets me go so far. And it is that simple. To be a married person and to cheat you have to have a certain mind frame at the time. And I can guarantee that the mind frame isn't what the other person would hope it to be.
Gigigirl Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 Because he is being so noble and staying for his kids. He will deal with 'the wife' as best he can. Oh yes, the noble cheater- we ALL know about those right? A MM staying with his family because of "kids and such" is not noble, it's called sucking it up and being an adult and the prize for that isn't free sex on the side. Marriage isn't perfect and no one promised it would be. But the OW already has this man on a pedestal so she has really looked past all the red flags and everything this man does is wonderful. So of course him staying for the kids when he loves her seems selfless when you are already in that mind frame. It's all about mind frame. 2
badkarma2013 Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 That is actually a really good question. My only answer I can come up with is I can have super strong boundaries against the things I WANT to have boundaries against like sex, intimacy etc... I choose NOT to apply those boundaries to everything else. It's a choice I make. Sex is not an issue in my relationship so that is not what I look for or want with them. I also don't attach like my APs attach to me, there is like an emotional block that only lets me go so far. And it is that simple. To be a married person and to cheat you have to have a certain mind frame at the time. And I can guarantee that the mind frame isn't what the other person would hope it to be. For some maybe it is just that...I Thank You for your honesty... 1
Sub Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 I don't think it's the "staying for the kids while cheating" they find noble necessarily. The nobility happened for them prior IMO, when they tolerated the "lack of intimacy" or whatever other need their Momm...er...Wife wasn't meeting. THAT is what's noble. Sucking it up, and not rocking the boat when they could have initiated the hard discussions and had a positive effect on the M. Straying but staying for kids is just them feeling entitled, a reward for their prior nobility. 2
Gigigirl Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 I do think for most MM it is about extra sex/emotional needs being met and they will tell OW whatever they need to to keep getting what they want. However every case is different, there is a BS who keeps updating that her H won't stop talking to his OW even though they never had sex, OW made it clear she wants nothing more than friendship and he still holds on to her. Most MM don't leave unless they are put out by the wife but in this case it's seems this MM only returned to his marriage because OW wouldn't give him a chance...just further proof that all affairs are not black and white text book cases. 1
jackslife Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 A similar question was asked on the other woman section of this website. I thought it might be of interest to posters on here. I thought Cali's answer (No. 11) gave a very accurate answer from the Wayward Husbands POV... http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/513003-question-mm-mw 3
autumnnight Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 Autumn....I really understand..I know I have beat this horse to death...But I have Never understood how my WW turned into an and pornstar for the OM and did things she had said for years was sick and disgusting.....but she did them with him... I never got Why...never ..The more i read here about WWs, I have never understood how such an extreme change in behavior can happen so quickly.. Evil ..i dont know.... emotionally devastating ..Absolutely ..... PS The OM was married had 2 kids made 300k a year and was from all indications was in a happy marriage...go figure.. I don't think it is wrong to want to, to NEED to understand. And I don't think WS's were always inherently evil or are doomed to be forever evil. However, during an A, the behavior, to me, definitely qualifies as evil. 2
Author gettingstronger Posted February 11, 2015 Author Posted February 11, 2015 I also don't attach like my APs attach to me, there is like an emotional block that only lets me go so far. I am T/Jing my own thread but I have to say your posts so remind me of a girl I worked with years ago in my 20's- she was pretty sure that every guy at work that she talked with, developed a friendship with was super in to her- I remember her saying numerous times " I had to cut him off because he was too in to me" and the rest of us like- oh, ok because you are a time suck that spends a lot of time talking to the guys in the office that would rather you just scoot along and allow them to work- she mistook their kindness for being in to her- End of thread jack- Anyway- so many great perspectives here and I thank you all for taking the time- 1
the_artist_1970 Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 I also don't attach like my APs attach to me, there is like an emotional block that only lets me go so far. I am T/Jing my own thread but I have to say your posts so remind me of a girl I worked with years ago in my 20's- she was pretty sure that every guy at work that she talked with, developed a friendship with was super in to her- I remember her saying numerous times " I had to cut him off because he was too in to me" and the rest of us like- oh, ok because you are a time suck that spends a lot of time talking to the guys in the office that would rather you just scoot along and allow them to work- she mistook their kindness for being in to her- End of thread jack- Anyway- so many great perspectives here and I thank you all for taking the time- I actually have a friend like that. She has "friends" who she crosses the line with emotionally and then she pulls away because they just get too into her. It's actually a personality disorder with some people who need a LOT of attention. It's sad really. 1
Author gettingstronger Posted February 11, 2015 Author Posted February 11, 2015 I actually have a friend like that. She has "friends" who she crosses the line with emotionally and then she pulls away because they just get too into her. It's actually a personality disorder with some people who need a LOT of attention. It's sad really. I know people like that too, except the "too in to her" is all in her head- 2
Furious Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 This is an honest question- I see so many threads about the MM staying in an unhappy marriage- For the OW, does it make it easier or harder to heal that the MM picked an unhappy marriage over a relationship with you- I am asking because it seems a question asked a lot from OW and it seems OW in particular post that they are sure their MM (or xMM) is staying in an unhappy marriage- I am wondering why that idea so important- (Background on me- BS in R- I read both boards to better understand all sides- what I have found is no one gets out of this unscathed and there is hurt all over-) Two thirds of divorces are initiated by women. This stat seems to convey that women are less inclined to stay in an unhappy marriage. It's an interesting paradox to assume MM remain trapped in an unhappy marriage when the stats do not support this line of thought. 1
Gigigirl Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 I also don't attach like my APs attach to me, there is like an emotional block that only lets me go so far. I am T/Jing my own thread but I have to say your posts so remind me of a girl I worked with years ago in my 20's- she was pretty sure that every guy at work that she talked with, developed a friendship with was super in to her- I remember her saying numerous times " I had to cut him off because he was too in to me" and the rest of us like- oh, ok because you are a time suck that spends a lot of time talking to the guys in the office that would rather you just scoot along and allow them to work- she mistook their kindness for being in to her- End of thread jack- Anyway- so many great perspectives here and I thank you all for taking the time- The person you describe sounds like an "office flirt" who assumes all the guys are into her because they chat with her, a Chatty Cathy type. I am not like this. I am very shy/reserved at first and the guy has to show a real interest in me for me to even WANT to pursue a "friendship". I have to study them first. I don't talk to just any guy...just the ones I like/want. I turn down guys all the time, I don't start EAs with just any old body. I don't cut them off because they are "too into me",that's kinda the point, where is the fun if they aren't? I like to be chased, all my APs chase me. I cut them off because they get demanding and pushy, they tire of just being friends. And I never approach guys, I let them approach me (then I know they are attracted) and I just don't correct them when they assume I'm single or if they ask I deny it. I realize my honesty makes people feel uncomfortable. There is nothing good about the things I have done, but I accept it is my ugly truth.
cocorico Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 For the OW, does it make it easier or harder to heal that the MM picked an unhappy marriage over a relationship with you- I am asking because it seems a question asked a lot from OW and it seems OW in particular post that they are sure their MM (or xMM) is staying in an unhappy marriage- I am wondering why that idea so important- I think it matters when you see the person you love (or care deeply about) being stressed and taking strain in a situation that they perceive themselves to be powerless to escape. From what I have observed, it is similar to those people whose loved ones suffer addictions or toxic dependencies, or are in abusive relationships - from the outside they can see a "simple" solution, but to the person stuck in the situation, it feels insurmountable. So the OW feels powerless to help, but wants to "rescue" the MM from a situation she sees as eroding the health and wellbeing of her lover. As a fOW who watched a loved MM struggle to leave a an unhappy M, my experience is that it does not make it "easier" knowing how toxic the M is - it makes it more frustrating. But it is only once the MM can come to terms with allowing themself to be "selfish" enough to walk away from the toxic M that resolution can really happen, so there is nothing an OW can do or should do to bring about resolution for the MM - that he has to do for himself (and his kids, if he has any). The OW must look after herself, accept that the situation feels insurmountable to the MM given his current resources, and look to her own future. 2
Gigigirl Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 I actually have a friend like that. She has "friends" who she crosses the line with emotionally and then she pulls away because they just get too into her. It's actually a personality disorder with some people who need a LOT of attention. It's sad really. I know people like that too, except the "too in to her" is all in her head- I have never said that every guy I meet is so into me. No not every guy, just all my APs. Just the ones I choose. My issues are deeper than some silly chick that thinks she's the sh*t.
Gigigirl Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 I actually have a friend like that. She has "friends" who she crosses the line with emotionally and then she pulls away because they just get too into her. It's actually a personality disorder with some people who need a LOT of attention. It's sad really. Sad? Maybe, depends on who you ask. I don't feel sad for myself. I feel like improving myself. But I see people would rather pick me apart. Did you both mention how you were in your 20s YEARS ago? I'm not whoever you knew back then. I'm still in my 20s and I'm learning. it's not unheard that my APs were all into me more than I was into them, I am not some lonely single chick who thinks every guy wants them, I have a whole BF at home. Female players do exist and guys can get used just like girls. From reading on this board there are not too many female posters who behave like me so I don't expect many to relate. 1
elaine567 Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 My issues are deeper than some silly chick that thinks she's the sh*t. I would guess her issues are pretty deep too, if you went a-looking.
Gigigirl Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 I would guess her issues are pretty deep too, if you went a-looking. I don't know that girl from years ago. I was referring to myself. I'm not the chick chatting up every guy. My MO is different. 1
Author gettingstronger Posted February 11, 2015 Author Posted February 11, 2015 Gigi, I am thinking your self esteem issues may be better addressed in another thread. My fault for going off track.
LearningToMoveOn Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 Two thirds of divorces are initiated by women. This stat seems to convey that women are less inclined to stay in an unhappy marriage. It's an interesting paradox to assume MM remain trapped in an unhappy marriage when the stats do not support this line of thought. I'm confused. Isn't that exactly the line of thought those stats support? Women leave unhappy marriages and men don't? Or do you mean that if a marriage is "unhappy", it will lead to divorce because the woman will leave and therefore there will be no unhappy marriage left for the man to be trapped in? But back to the original question. I think it's already been answered in this thread and a hundred others on this board. It seems to be what a lot of the debates are about and people go round and round on. Neither the BS or the OW want to be thought of as second choice, plan B. If the OW thinks the WS is staying in an unhappy marriage or staying for the kids or any of those other reasons, the BS is plan B. If the WS stays with the BS, the BS convinces themselves they aren't plan B (and that the OW was plan B) and they are choosing them (and not the rest of the package). It's all about believing you are the first choice, what they really want -- the problem will always be that regardless of what they say or do, only the WS knows the truth to that question. 3
Author gettingstronger Posted February 11, 2015 Author Posted February 11, 2015 I'm not asking who is the second choice, I'm asking if it makes it easier or harder on the OW to heal if they feel like the mm stayed in a bad marriage. Does that make sense? I know it's a convoluted question, I tried to write it as clear as I could... But.... 1
LearningToMoveOn Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 (edited) I understand your question...and I still think that's what it all boils down to..feeling like you are or are not second choice. For that reason, I think it would be easier for an OW to heal if they thought the MM was staying in a less that great marriage. Because they can interpret that as the BS being second choice...thinking the MM is not really where he wants to be in his heart of hearts but is staying for x,y,z reason. Edited February 11, 2015 by LearningToMoveOn
WakingUp Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 Im going to give my POV on the original question. I actually believe that my xMM is in a pretty good marriage, he just doesn't realise it. And I truly do wish he would see that, and get on with being happy and stop thinking that his happiness lies elsewhere. To he honest, I am more comfortable knowing that his marriage isn't all that bad. I suppose that I care about him enough to just want him to be happy. So its either a case of him not realising that its not that bad, or him deluding himself (or me?) that he deserves more. Just putting my thoughts out there.
Furious Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 I'm confused. Isn't that exactly the line of thought those stats support? Women leave unhappy marriages and men don't? Or do you mean that if a marriage is "unhappy", it will lead to divorce because the woman will leave and therefore there will be no unhappy marriage left for the man to be trapped in? Think about it, a man who has another woman in the wings but still cannot get a divorce speaks volumes about how unhappy in his marriage he really is.
Gigigirl Posted February 11, 2015 Posted February 11, 2015 Gigi, I am thinking your self esteem issues may be better addressed in another thread. My fault for going off track. Yes you should keep your thread on topic instead of taking digs at me and comparing me to people you knew years ago. I'm done now, thanks.
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