Mr.D.E.B.T. Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 There is nothing wrong with being certain about what you are or aren't attracted to. As long as you are comfortable with those feelings, its all good. Just give the next guy a little heads up first.
Erised Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 While everything else was seriously messed up (such as the nastygrams), I don't feel like the gift itself is terribly inappropriate. It was something cheap. I guess it depends how long you talked first. I haven't met most guys from online, but there's been plenty of first date small gifts... more second date small gifts, granted, but still. Often books, because I'm an avid reader and that comes out very quickly. If it's sweet and small, it's good. If it shows thought based on what we've discussed,even better. A very expensive gift would make me uncomfortable, but I would say that immediately and not accept it. I think of it generally as a positive. (I've brought small gifts to second or third dates myself on occasions where something just jumped out at me, too. Full disclosure)
OrangeParty Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 This ends the thread. It's not the fact you found this gesture was out of desperation, but the fact a woman would find this endearing is all dependant on whether or not you were attracted. Agree. Whether or not someone is a creep or is desperate many times depend on whether the woman finds the man attractice. Still doesn't excuse the web stalking and the nasty messages, though, but I think OP overreacted to some chocolates.
lino Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 A lot of this depends on the context. I've had guys that I'm not attracted to bring me gifts on first dates and it came across as just too much or smelt of desperation. A big turn off! I've also received gifts from men I was very attracted to and surprisingly thought the gift giving was charming and so was completely bowled over /Discussion
lino Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 As a side note, I'm 32 and never once had a girl give me a gift on a first date (nor 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc) randomly. Always received gifts for Xmas, birthdays, other designated times. If I ever received a gift on a first date I'd be eternally flattered and would almost feel as though I'd won a lottery! Heck even just to know what a random, out of the blue gift reception feels like would be unreal. 1
Author PinkInTheLimo Posted February 10, 2015 Author Posted February 10, 2015 This ends the thread. It's not the fact you found this gesture was out of desperation, but the fact a woman would find this endearing is all dependant on whether or not you were attracted. It has absolutely nothing to do with whether the guy is attractive or not. It had to do with the fact that the gift for me felt very much as something with which he wanted to create a good impression. It felt forced. Another guy could have done exactly the same thing and I would have felt differently about it. Also, within 5 minutes of our conversation he came up with a picture of his kids. I feel that the chocolates and the picture are part of the "act" which he pulls whenever he has a first date. It came across as unnatural. In any case I have big problems with guys who kind of use their kids to create a good impression on datingsites (I will start another thread about this). I happen to be a rather subtle person so I sometimes simply feel that something is not really genuine and just an act. And that is the feeling I had in this case. And I was apparently right because as soon as it was clear that I did not want a second date he got nasty. 1
Zapbasket Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 I think your reaction to the chocolates was really your instinct kicking in, picking up on who he really is as he subsequently made clear. I think that's the thing about instincts: on the surface, it seems a person is "overreacting," but that's because instinct is picking up on the thing that hasn't happened yet. You weren't really weirded out by the chocolates; you were weirded out by a certain obsequious overtone to his gesture, that was augmented by his showing you a picture of his kids--in short, trying too hard to ingratiate himself to you. You wanted to scream not really because the chocolates were heart-shaped, but because by the time you opened up the chocolate box lid your instinct had figured out what you were dealing with in this dude, before you figured it out consciously. This is a perfect example of how we undermine our instincts. "Oh," we say, "it's just a box of chocolates. No big deal; I don't know why it's affecting me so strongly; I must be overreacting." Meanwhile your poor instincts are crying, "No! You're not! I just have this figured out before you do! Listen to ME!" Good bullet-dodging, OP. You're doing just fine; keep on dating and don't give up. Your instincts are spot-on. 1
Diezel Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 It has absolutely nothing to do with whether the guy is attractive or not. It had to do with the fact that the gift for me felt very much as something with which he wanted to create a good impression. It felt forced. Another guy could have done exactly the same thing and I would have felt differently about it. I wonder if the guy had EXCEEDED your expectations physically, if this thread would even exist... as another poster already previously proved.
NopeNah Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 I still just want some chocolate! Whatever her reason,it's her call.
Fhsjkfjrhsdh3646 Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 I don't think she should be so concerned about receiving the gift of chocolates as she is the guy appears to be a raving lunatic/stalker....
BeatsByDirk Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 I kinda feel bad for the guy! I really don't think a lot of the posters see this guy the way I do, a goofy nice older dude who really doesn't understand a woman who has been beat up by life. OP sounds like she's been beat up and hurt emotionally, has a way of interacting with people she prefers and finds other ways of behaving illogical. Chocolates are a very appropriate first date gift to most guys, if it were me I'd make her split the bill on the first date but I'm not like this dude. I'd hardly call that internet harassment! She said she didn't want to go on another date again but there is a large portion of older internet daters who see it as a social club and although there isn't a love connection he did try to get to know you and may consider you a peer and as such, in his mind, it would be rude not to just say "hi, I noticed you over here too" which is what I feel a wink implies. You turning around and blocking him in my eyes to him is the equivalent as seeing you at a social event, coming to just say hi and you turning your head, rolling your eyes and yelling in public "don't you get it, I don't like you, don't talk to me!" I would have sent you a nasty text too telling you to get over yourself and stop being sooooo cold, if I were him. I could have misread everything but this is what I gleaned from OPs initial description. My impression was that she was cold, didn't like people, and expects everyone to know and follow the same cultural norms as herself. I think she should just realize now that most men are what she described, all in or all out and if she wants to date someone apathetic and indifferent she might want to try dating a woman because that's every woman I've dated until I've either impressed her or made her feel disgusted. 1
Author PinkInTheLimo Posted February 10, 2015 Author Posted February 10, 2015 Bringing a minor gift like this to a first date is just being polite. This guy was treating you with respect and you did not like it. What does that say about you? Bringing a minor gift has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with treating someone with respect. It's superficial. The guy got nasty after I turned down a second date. How respectful is that? So, you have a pleasant date with a guy who shows interest and treats you with respect. The result is that you don't want to see him anymore. I don't want to see him anymore because he is way too pushy about the whole thing. Does not give me the breathing space to actually develop feelings for him. I felt like I owed him something. I don't. It's close to Valentine's Day. Many chocolates are going to be heart shaped. It's not like the guy opened boxes of chocolates in order to find heart shaped ones so he could show his love for a girl he has yet to meet. I know the brand of the chocolates very well and how their chocolate boxes look. You can either buy a pre-filled one which will have different kinds of chocolates or you can have one filled. Since this box was filled with heart filled chocolates, it's because he asked the shop to fill it with those. This is why so many men out there are bitter these days. Treat a woman with respect by giving her a gift and she dissects the act like you are some kind of loser. Again, giving a gift has as such nothing to do with respect. There are guys who beat up their wives on a regular basis and give her flowers afterwards. The fact that you are so offended by a man treating you well is sad. He was not treating me well. He was a real jerk after I turned down a second date. 1
Author PinkInTheLimo Posted February 10, 2015 Author Posted February 10, 2015 She said she didn't want to go on another date again but there is a large portion of older internet daters who see it as a social club and although there isn't a love connection he did try to get to know you and may consider you a peer and as such, in his mind, it would be rude not to just say "hi, I noticed you over here too" which is what I feel a wink implies. You turning around and blocking him in my eyes to him is the equivalent as seeing you at a social event, coming to just say hi and you turning your head, rolling your eyes and yelling in public "don't you get it, I don't like you, don't talk to me!" If I tell someone after a first date that I don't think there will ever be deeper feelings from side, the only appropriate reaction is either not reacting or just saying "OK, thanks for letting me know, I wish you all the best." I find it stalkerish to then act as if nothing has happened and we are still pals or something. We are not. This is the same kind of guy that if you would keep some further contact with you would blame you for leading him on. I don't do that. If I have decided after a first date that you don't do it for men, that's the end of the story. If you think that is harsh, think twice. What good do I do anyone if I keep them in some kind of grey zone where we would still send an email now or then or a text. That's using someone for some attention. I don't do that.
Author PinkInTheLimo Posted February 10, 2015 Author Posted February 10, 2015 This guy brings you a gift and gives you what you described as a pleasant first date. Your response is to block all communications with him. Basically, he was a real jerk after you treated him disrespectfully. I did not treat him disrespectfully. I felt he was not the kind of guy I could fall in love with. Therefore I did not want to have another date. It would only have made him believe even more that something was possible when that was not the case. Refusing a second date is not something disrespectful. It's being honest and correct with a guy. He should have appreciated that because there are many women out there who like to take advantage of a guy who gives too much too soon. He acted as if I owe him something. He seemed to think that I still owed him a talk or a conversation or whatever despite me having explained why I did not want a second date. I repeat: it's not because a first date was pleasant to some extent that women owe a guy a second date. The same goes for men. They don't owe us a second date if for some reason they think there is no chemistry.
BeatsByDirk Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 He seemed to think that I still owed him a talk or a conversation or whatever despite me having explained why I did not want a second date. Precisely, you didn't want a second date, for some, that doesn't mean you can't still be friendly but obviously it does to you... Social norms differ for everyone, it's all about perception, not everyone is concerned about the message they are sending to someone through their action but just act in a genuine manner and hope the people who appreciate genuiness notice. Fine, you think he's too pushy, he tried to be nice you cut him off(your right to do so) he was offended and let you I know it(depending on how he did it it's his right to do so) and you can continue to block his number. Maybe you are right and he's not cool but plenty of people think you handled this wrong and this is the response you got, right or wrong!
Author PinkInTheLimo Posted February 11, 2015 Author Posted February 11, 2015 Precisely, you didn't want a second date, for some, that doesn't mean you can't still be friendly but obviously it does to you... What do you mean "by still be friendly"? I send him a friendly, sensitive message saying that I did not think deeper feelings were possible from my side and I apologised if I disappointed him. How much more friendly could I get? But once I have told him that, he should know that this is the end of the contact! Why on earth would I be friends with him? I am not looking for friends, I am looking for a partner. You meet on a dating site, the first date shows that there's nothing possible, seems logical to me that all contact ends there.
Author PinkInTheLimo Posted February 11, 2015 Author Posted February 11, 2015 Yes, you told him you were not interested, but you didn't tell him everything. It would have been kind of you to let him know that not only were you not interested in him romantically, but you never wanted to hear from him again. He had no way of knowing that you would find it "stalkerish" if he were to just say hello, or wink at you on another site. Well I think it's pretty obvious that if you meet on a datingsite, that it is either going forward or going nowhere. If you've gone out for one date, you are not friends, not even acquintances.
smackie9 Posted February 12, 2015 Posted February 12, 2015 What about a nice small bouquet of flowers? Is that too much for a first date? I got flowers all the time on first dates. 1
Author PinkInTheLimo Posted February 12, 2015 Author Posted February 12, 2015 You feel this way and that's fine, but not everyone sees things the same way. I became friends with a couple of the women I met via OLD, even though I told them I was not interested. Since you feel so strongly about this, maybe you should include it in your dating profile. That way you can avoid guys trying to talk to you again after you turn them down romantically. You'll probably avoid guys who give gifts on the first date too. Everyone wins. We are talking about DATINGsites here. You are there to date. If you consider someone undateable, that's the end of it. No need to put that explicitly in my profile.
guest569 Posted February 12, 2015 Posted February 12, 2015 Oh come on, OP you dont need to explain yourself. Sometimes it just doesn't feel right. When you're not particularly thrilled about the first date and the guy is pushy, yeah i would probably feel sick by the gift, I've been there. It's not the gift so much as his behaviour.
thecrucible Posted February 12, 2015 Posted February 12, 2015 I know you feel, OP. That would put me off too. The way I think of it, with online dating, they are not your friend, even acquaintance, just a stranger, so I wouldn't expect a gift. It would also make me feel awkward that I couldn't reciprocate a gift at that time. This happened to me with a guy I was seeing recently - he gave me a Xmas card first date but said he was thinking of a gift and decided against it. I simply thanked him for the card and that was that. I wasn't offended. I was only neutral. I would say it didn't alter my opinion of him either way. But it did tell me he wasn't an online dating regular. I was once friends with a guy who really liked me and kept trying to show me by buying me gifts I never asked for because he wanted to impress me. It actually made me feel really uncomfortable because it felt like he was trying to buy my interest...it also makes you feel like there's expectation coming from the guy.
blueskyday Posted February 12, 2015 Posted February 12, 2015 (edited) According to the psychological principle of "reciprocation," we feel the need to return a favor or gift to someone who has given us one. So it's normal one might feel somewhat indebted to a man giving a gift. BUT, he acted like a controlling creep! You said No and he freaked out. Not a gentlemen. It's a dating site, not a friend site! You owe him nothing but a polite response declining further dates and contact. You gave that to him. He couldn't deal with it. He turned nasty to try to control you. In this case, I'd say his chocolate gift was a manipulation and not a sweet gesture. A true gentleman might bring chocolates or flowers but wouldn't expect a thing in return. His gift would be a simple act of humble generosity to show you he can be attentive and thoughtful. I've recieved many gifts from first dates, including flowers, chocolates, and once a CD of music we had both previously discussed. All very thoughtful, and small gifts. Nothing over the top! So it doesn't mean a thing in isolation. One must consider the context. In this case, the guy is a jerk. Your instincts are dead on! Edited February 12, 2015 by blueskyday 1
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