Reconciliation & Variances Of BS's - Who's Programmed for what

February 3, 2015

I read something on here that made me think deeply about reconciliation and what is a deal break and what isn't a deal breaker. Some people I think are pre-programmed that an affair is a deal breaker. These types of people I think "try" to re-program themselves but ultimately end up failing in the long run. Then there are other people who are authentically able to accept the affair and move on from it while growing their marriage in an abundance of love somehow. The truth is I think the latter is hard to come by. I'm not even sure if these people are really deep down over the affair. Perhaps they have forced themselves to believe in a forgiveness and acceptance they were deep down never really able to get over. Perhaps that's why there's people who post here who are many years out who still have internal struggles years later after their spouse's infidelity. Thoughts?

February 3, 2015

I do not believe you can predispose how you will react to a situation until you are experiencing the situation.

We may think we know how we might react....but until we are truly going through it....I don't believe we can predict....we might be able to endure much more than we imagined....or we might be much stronger than we imagined...or we might crumble with less than we imagined.

The bottom line is...I certainly cannot predict what someone else's limit might or might not be.

I would add...I don't believe it will ever be possible for my husband and I to "get over" my affair. I think we can move past it...I think we can stop letting it define us....but the scar will forever be there.

In addition....even in marriages where infidelity does not exist....there are struggles...jealousy, insecurity, selfishness, etc...rears its ugly head in many ways....and it still has to be dealt with on a daily basis. People divorce for many reasons...infidelity is only one.

Edited February 3, 2015 by Mrs. John Adams

February 3, 2015

I believe that there are people who can authentically get past their spouse's affair and move forward. I just think they're statistically rare...very rare. There are exceptions to every rule, we just tend to forget that they're the exceptions, not the rule.

The other side of the coin is the WS. This thread implies that being unable to reconcile is somehow a result of the BS's inherent personality. I somewhat disagree. It plays a role, but do do the actions of the WS after discovery. I think those have more of an impact in determining the course the BS will take than any "preprogramming" on the part of the BS.

Those who successfully reconcile have a truly remorseful WS. Those are statistically rare. Thus, so are successful reconciliations.

February 3, 2015

I believe that there are people who can authentically get past their spouse's affair and move forward. I just think they're statistically rare...very rare. There are exceptions to every rule, we just tend to forget that they're the exceptions, not the rule.

The other side of the coin is the WS. This thread implies that being unable to reconcile is somehow a result of the BS's inherent personality. I somewhat disagree. It plays a role, but do do the actions of the WS after discovery. I think those have more of an impact in determining the course the BS will take than any "preprogramming" on the part of the BS.

Those who successfully reconcile have a truly remorseful WS. Those are statistically rare. Thus, so are successful reconciliations.

I think there are some personality traits required for a successful reconciliation. When my wife cheated I left my home because cheating was my deal breaker. I felt like I was caught in a hot mess because I'm tied to my wife with our daughter and financially. Having this all dumped in your lap after d-day makes reconciliation a better option to try in my opinion. I tried and force fed it to myself and eventually realized I just can't do it. It is something that feels programmed inside of my that I'll never be able to accept who my wife was or is and be able to move on from it. I almost feel liberated because I am no longer in limbo. I have finally made up my mind definitively and feel so much relieved now without being in that stuck mode I was in so long trying to figure myself out.

February 3, 2015

If a person doesn't already know what their boundaries are when it comes to what is and is not acceptable behavior from their spouse regarding infidelity, are their boundaries really any healthier than the cheaters?

There are some things in the world that you should already have your made up on before they happen. Otherwise, you're left making decisions based on emotions instead of logic.

However, I do think this is a personality thing. Some people are able to accept it, but I'm with OP in the sense that I don't think most people are. Even the people that have reconciled still seem to be haunted by it.

February 3, 2015

I don't think it is pre programming. I think it is a function of the health of the mind of the BS.

I think to be predisposed to reconciliation a BS would have to be highly evolved. They would need to be a very compassionate person, full of loving kindness toward everyone, perhaps resulting from a very good childhood. The BS would also have to be a very secure BS, that does not feel threatened themselves by the bad behaviour of their WS and one that does not feel second best to anyone in the WS life and so can truly put this incident into perspective.

I don't know how rare or not this kind of person is. I just know I'm not one of them.

February 3, 2015

For me, I dislike placing the onus on the BS. The WS ruined the marriage; it's their job to make R a viable option for the BS. My attitude was that I don't owe my xWW anything, and that she will have to make me love her and want her again. She failed miserably. So I divorced with no regrets.

It's up to the WS to become the person the BS deserves if R is to be an option. Everything else is just static, including "predispositions" in the BS's personality.

February 3, 2015

I believe that there are people who can authentically get past their spouse's affair and move forward. I just think they're statistically rare...very rare. There are exceptions to every rule, we just tend to forget that they're the exceptions, not the rule.

The other side of the coin is the WS. This thread implies that being unable to reconcile is somehow a result of the BS's inherent personality. I somewhat disagree. It plays a role, but do do the actions of the WS after discovery. I think those have more of an impact in determining the course the BS will take than any "preprogramming" on the part of the BS.

Those who successfully reconcile have a truly remorseful WS. Those are statistically rare. Thus, so are successful reconciliations.

This thread was built on an assumption the WS has put forth the right efforts to try and salvage the marriage and win back the BS. I also think there are different types of remorse from the WS. Those who are deeply remorseful to the BS or those who may perhaps only be remorseful because they almost collapsed their family and tossed the kids into a needless situation.

I don't think it is pre programming. I think it is a function of the health of the mind of the BS.

I think to be predisposed to reconciliation a BS would have to be highly evolved. They would need to be a very compassionate person, full of loving kindness toward everyone, perhaps resulting from a very good childhood. The BS would also have to be a very secure BS, that does not feel threatened themselves by the bad behaviour of their WS and one that does not feel second best to anyone in the WS life and so can truly put this incident into perspective.

I don't know how rare or not this kind of person is. I just know I'm not one of them.

See, I consider myself to be compassionate and loving that spreads kindness to all I meet unless you do me wrong. I am pretty secure as well. I found for me though, I just cannot get past the infidelity. For my wife to do what she did speaks volumes of her thoughts toward me. She was reckless and stupid. She took a HUGE risk KNOWING what she was doing "could" be an end all situation and contemplated that was ok with her. The implications of an affair are you are comfortable knowing that if you marriage disintegrates you're ok with that. I firmly believe in my instance my wife was planning an exit affair and the OM was sitting on his hands making false promising. At some point I believe my wife finally figured out what the relationship really was. He was emptying his tank in her and that fulfilled his needs and that was it. It probably made her feel cheap. Oh let's see, then the "remorse" affect comes in when she felt all used up by the OM and had nobody to turn to besides the husband who stood by her side while she was deceiving him day in and out.

Here's a song I dedicate to my wife. -

February 3, 2015

There are so many factors at play here. There are true love affairs, purely sex affairs, emotional affairs, exit affairs, revenge affairs, and then there are the "why the hell am I sleeping with this person who isn't even as attractive or interesting as my spouse - WTF is wrong with me?" affairs.

And each one comes with its own set of challenges after D-Day. I don't believe that we are preprogrammed or anything, nor do I believe we should be. It's nice to think you know exactly what you'd do in every situation, and it's great when it works out the way you thought it would... but life was never meant to be lived that way 100%.

People who haven't been through marital infidelity have no idea how they will react. It's literally impossible to know. That said, statistically speaking, i believe most turn out to be wrong.

Many of us have sat in restaurants before having kids, and watched some other poor bastard struggle to herd his screaming food-slinging children around a table. We all said our kids would never be like that. Or worse, we said we're never hacing kids.

And then boom.. next thing you know, YOU'RE the poor schlub at Applebes screaming at your own kids to sit still or come out from under the table.

And that's beautiful! That's life. It's learning and growing and gaining perspective and figuring out that you don't have it all figured out, and never did, and never will.

Now I wish I didn't have to figure out that infidelity hurts like hell, and my wife wishes she didn't have to figure out that ****ed up choices have ****ed up consequences... but again, that's life. And trust me... nobody's got it completely wired.

February 3, 2015

I also think there are different types of remorse from the WS. Those who are deeply remorseful to the BS or those who may perhaps only be remorseful because they almost collapsed their family and tossed the kids into a needless situation.

I guess I'm wondering how remorse in these two situations looks different?

You must have something in your mind that your wife's remorse wasn't right or for the right reasons or you wouldn't have said it.

Regardless, I'm glad you've come to peace with your decision to end your marriage. It's never an easy decision regardless of the circumstances.

February 3, 2015

I was raised that cheating itself is never the deal breaker. That there is always a bigger reason, wether it's the problems in the marriage or within the person that cheated , the issues that led to the cheating are what you/the couple should be focused on. It's worked for my family on both sides, no divorce, everyone extremely close & happy.Cheating is always a symptom of a bigger problem & most people once they hear cheating, that's all they focus on & never deal with the issues that lead to it & in my opionion that's why you see so many couples divorce ,neither one of them really ever get over it & go on to make the same mistakes in future relationships & marriages. No matter what, any problem always had a root, just like a weed, it will never go away unless the root is taken care of.

February 3, 2015

See, I consider myself to be compassionate and loving that spreads kindness to all I meet unless you do me wrong.

At some point I believe my wife finally figured out what the relationship really was. He was emptying his tank in her and that fulfilled his needs and that was it. It probably made her feel cheap.

Here's a song I dedicate to my wife. -

So I guess where we are different is that even though WS did me wrong, I still felt sorry for WS. It is such a sh*tty position to be in, as you so very well describe. I know they did it to themselves but still, I can't help but feel sorry for WS. It is just so awful. Made your WS feel cheap? I'm sure that does not begin to describe it. Made her feel lower than dirt, a degenerate, foolish, lost, crushed, desperate, and on and on. Feeling cheap would be the least of the issues. I'd not wish this on an enemy, much less someone I spent years with and more good times than bad.

Nice song.

February 3, 2015

I guess I'm wondering how remorse in these two situations looks different?

You must have something in your mind that your wife's remorse wasn't right or for the right reasons or you wouldn't have said it.

Regardless, I'm glad you've come to peace with your decision to end your marriage. It's never an easy decision regardless of the circumstances.

Well, I went back in my memory and there were a few times I caught my wife balling her eyes out holding our daughter. I think the remorse came from "wow I am ruining my family" - Meaning she was setting our daughter up with an every other weekend father deliberately and it hurt her to think about it. The remorse was triggered by that I believe and not me. Thank you as well . It is such a better feeling knowing which path to take rather living in a limbo full of uncertainty. I was there far too long at it is incredibly unhealthy.

February 3, 2015

I don't think it is pre programming. I think it is a function of the health of the mind of the BS.
I think to be predisposed to reconciliation a BS would have to be highly evolved. They would need to be a very compassionate person, full of loving kindness toward everyone, perhaps resulting from a very good childhood. The BS would also have to be a very secure BS, that does not feel threatened themselves by the bad behaviour of their WS and one that does not feel second best to anyone in the WS life and so can truly put this incident into perspective.
I don't know how rare or not this kind of person is. I just know I'm not one of them.

This is complete garbage. The people who try to work things out with a WS are the same type of people who can't seem to summon the courage to leave a spouse that punches them in the face every day. Physical abusers have the same pathology as emotional abusers.

I can have compassion for my xWife, but that doesn't mean I have to continue the marriage. Good people surround themselves with good people.

February 3, 2015

So I guess where we are different is that even though WS did me wrong, I still felt sorry for WS. It is such a sh*tty position to be in, as you so very well describe. I know they did it to themselves but still, I can't help but feel sorry for WS. It is just so awful. Made your WS feel cheap? I'm sure that does not begin to describe it. Made her feel lower than dirt, a degenerate, foolish, lost, crushed, desperate, and on and on. Feeling cheap would be the least of the issues. I'd not wish this on an enemy, much less someone I spent years with and more good times than bad.

Nice song.

I'm not really sure if I felt sorry for my WS. She had an LTA so it was extremely pre-meditated and coordinated. I agree that it is a crappy situation for the WS as well. With that being said, the reason I don't feel bad for my ws it because she dug her own hole. All she did was minimize the affair this whole time. Oh well. I just hope we both can move on from this marriage peacefully without stirring up the hornets nest and drag our daughter through un-needed bs.

February 3, 2015

The people who try to work things out with a WS are the same type of people who can't seem to summon the courage to leave a spouse that punches them in the face every day. Physical abusers have the same pathology as emotional abusers.

You are entitled to your opinion, however, I think it's BS.

My wife, has chosen to forgive me. She's strong, smart, educated and beautiful. She chose to try to save our marriage. She believes in me. She believed in us when I didn't.

There is nothing weak about my wife. She's courageous for fighting for our love, for fighting for our marriage and for fighting for our family.

It takes courage to stay, if that's what someone chooses and it takes courage to leave, if that's what someone chooses.

There are people on this forum who have chosen the path of forgiveness. Getting there hasn't been easy, but I'm sure to those who have found it in their heart, they'll tell you it was worth the work.

I am grateful for my wife's courageous heart and her ability to find forgiveness and move forward with me.

Edited February 3, 2015 by Rainbowlove

February 3, 2015

There are people on this forum who have chosen the path of forgiveness.

Forgiveness =/= reconciliation. The two are not mutually exclusive.

I forgave my xWW years ago. I even told her I forgave her. But she plays no role in my life and there is no room for her in my life. None.

You can forgive the person who stole your car, but you won't give them the keys anymore. You can forgive the person who punched you in the face, but you still get a restraining order.

EDIT: We're glad you were able to reconcile, and we're not judging you for it. I'm actually quite happy that you were able to overcome. But my xWW has no redeeming qualities whatsoever; none that would make R a viable option. Kicking her out of my life has improved it dramatically.

Your BS is not indicative of every BS.

Edited February 3, 2015 by toolforgrowth

February 3, 2015

Forgiveness =/= reconciliation. The two are not mutually exclusive.

I forgave my xWW years ago. I even told her I forgave her. But she plays no role in my life and there is no room for her in my life. None.

You can forgive the person who stole your car, but you won't give them the keys anymore. You can forgive the person who punched you in the face, but you still get a restraining order.

EDIT: We're glad you were able to reconcile, and we're not judging you for it. I'm actually quite happy that you were able to overcome. But my xWW has no redeeming qualities whatsoever; none that would make R a viable option. Kicking her out of my life has improved it dramatically.

Your BS is not indicative of every BS.

My point was it's not weakness to choose recovery if you are a BS. It's just the opposite.

February 3, 2015

My point was it's not weakness to choose recovery if you are a BS. It's just the opposite.

I think it depends on the quality of the WS that determines that. If the WS doesn't do everything to prove to the BS that they're going to be better (walking the walk, not just talking the talk), then I would agree with you.

BS's who rug sweep the affair and hope everything goes back to normal and still reconcile, however, are a different story. I believe they ARE weak.

The devil is in the details.

February 3, 2015

My point was it's not weakness to choose recovery if you are a BS. It's just the opposite.

In my opinion I don't think weakness is shown either way. Though I think it takes certain people to give true forgiveness for an affair. That taste of hell will forever be burned on my taste buds. In your situation at least I think your honesty salvaged your marriage. Mine was complete opposite.

February 3, 2015

I read something on here that made me think deeply about reconciliation and what is a deal break and what isn't a deal breaker. Some people I think are pre-programmed that an affair is a deal breaker. These types of people I think "try" to re-program themselves but ultimately end up failing in the long run. Then there are other people who are authentically able to accept the affair and move on from it while growing their marriage in an abundance of love somehow. The truth is I think the latter is hard to come by. I'm not even sure if these people are really deep down over the affair. Perhaps they have forced themselves to believe in a forgiveness and acceptance they were deep down never really able to get over. Perhaps that's why there's people who post here who are many years out who still have internal struggles years later after their spouse's infidelity. Thoughts?

The hypothetical response for most people in the general population is that cheating is a deal-breaker.

But....when it sadly, for some, becomes a reality, there is a lot more to consider. Unless there are no children, I believe most would choose to divorce. To divorce when there is no infidelity is difficult and traumatic, infidelity just makes it even more traumatic.

I think some remain married and go on to a stronger and healthier relationship, I think this is because the marriage was good, but their spouse made poor choices and is truly remorseful. Those are the marriage that can survive. It will never be the same marriage again, the innocence is lost, but I believe innocence is overrated. I think that for these folks the cost of pride overrides the cost of what is gained in saving their love and family unit.

Sometimes, even if a WS is remorseful, for some people it is too little too late. I think that for these folks, they try to divorce as amicably as possible and invest in being there for their children in a double home environment as best as possible. This comes with many issues and can be stressful.

The stats on divorce for first marriage are at a 50% divorce rate, the stats on divorce for second marriages are in the vicinity of 70%, and even higher for third marriages.

The marriage and family breakdown in society, which is the backbone of society has many long and lingering affects for the future society that our children will inherit.

February 3, 2015

This is complete garbage. The people who try to work things out with a WS are the same type of people who can't seem to summon the courage to leave a spouse that punches them in the face every day. Physical abusers have the same pathology as emotional abusers.

I can have compassion for my xWife, but that doesn't mean I have to continue the marriage. Good people surround themselves with good people.

So in other words, once someone cgeats they never again good people

February 3, 2015

There are so many factors at play here. There are true love affairs, purely sex affairs, emotional affairs, exit affairs, revenge affairs, and then there are the "why the hell am I sleeping with this person who isn't even as attractive or interesting as my spouse - WTF is wrong with me?" affairs.

And each one comes with its own set of challenges after D-Day. I don't believe that we are preprogrammed or anything, nor do I believe we should be. It's nice to think you know exactly what you'd do in every situation, and it's great when it works out the way you thought it would... but life was never meant to be lived that way 100%.

People who haven't been through marital infidelity have no idea how they will react. It's literally impossible to know. That said, statistically speaking, i believe most turn out to be wrong.

Many of us have sat in restaurants before having kids, and watched some other poor bastard struggle to herd his screaming food-slinging children around a table. We all said our kids would never be like that. Or worse, we said we're never hacing kids.

And then boom.. next thing you know, YOU'RE the poor schlub at Applebes screaming at your own kids to sit still or come out from under the table.

And that's beautiful! That's life. It's learning and growing and gaining perspective and figuring out that you don't have it all figured out, and never did, and never will.

Now I wish I didn't have to figure out that infidelity hurts like hell, and my wife wishes she didn't have to figure out that ****ed up choices have ****ed up consequences... but again, that's life. And trust me... nobody's got it completely wired.

Reminds me of a tag/sig I used here for a while

"Everyone has a plan - until they're punched in the face"

February 3, 2015

I read something on here that made me think deeply about reconciliation and what is a deal break and what isn't a deal breaker. Some people I think are pre-programmed that an affair is a deal breaker. These types of people I think "try" to re-program themselves but ultimately end up failing in the long run. Then there are other people who are authentically able to accept the affair and move on from it while growing their marriage in an abundance of love somehow. The truth is I think the latter is hard to come by. I'm not even sure if these people are really deep down over the affair. Perhaps they have forced themselves to believe in a forgiveness and acceptance they were deep down never really able to get over. Perhaps that's why there's people who post here who are many years out who still have internal struggles years later after their spouse's infidelity. Thoughts?

I do think reconciliation has a lot to do with the individuals, their disposition, life experiences, deal breakers (which are influenced by their life experiences), current situation, if they take it to heart that marriage is "forever" or not, and a host of other factors. I don't know if it's as simple as some people are programmed to accept and forgive and others aren't.

For me, I can say that having had a serial cheater for a father and knowing how much that affected my own outlook on relationships and having also been an OW once, my tolerance for cheating is low. It's not just a hypothetical type of low but an intolerance that comes from having that in my life and seeing how damaging it is. Granted, my dad is a serial cheater so his mentality is different than someone who say has an affair once, but nevertheless my experience with seeing my mom put up with it has made me very resentful of her choice and fearful of becoming like her, someone who accepts being cheated on. My fear of not being like that influences me a lot and I think I'd be very unlikely to be able to forgive cheating, even if I wanted to. Like you said, depending on the circumstances I might try to "re-program" myself but I think I'd probably fail as a stronger part of me would be so fearful that I was "becoming my mother" so I'd probably feel like I cannot ever reconcile for fear that it becomes a habit. So I'm honest with myself about those feelings.

I do hope never to have to experience that and I do understand that we grow and change so who knows, but as of who I am today and my influences, disposition, experiences, beliefs etc. I know I would have a difficult time reconciling, even if I wanted to, because of my family of origin issues surrounding cheating.

Edited February 3, 2015 by MissBee

February 3, 2015

So in other words, once someone cgeats they never again good people

A bank robber will always be a felon. They cannot un-do their crime, they can only work to change their ways if they don't want to go to prison. My wife will always be a cheater & she can't un-do her crime. And has had to change her ways in order to keep me paying the bills.

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