Did I blow my chances again with this e-mail?

January 18, 2015

I sent this message to a girl:

You look like a bad person. I wouldn't trust you. Note to self: move along!

Of course I was trying to be funny. The note to self bit was supposed to make that more clear. Here's the reply I got:

That's rude. Didn't your mom tell you to keep your negative comments to yourself. You don't even know me, and I seem like an unpleasant person why bother sending me a message.

Do you send a message to every person that seem unpleasant and not trustworthy. That seems like a waste of time!

I replied with this:

I took an "online dating prep" class at the local public library and this is what they told us to write. They told us to use reverse psychology because it's been shown to work clinically, especially in the military setting. To get women interested in us they told us to use mean comments, the more mean the better. They told us to be jerks, super jerks! They told us to be very sarcastic, which according to my class notes means "say the opposite of what you mean" or to be even more effective "say the opposite of what the other person expects you to say". Our final exam was to write down an initial e-mail in 30 minutes or less and I wrote down the message I sent you. My teacher gave me an A+ so I figured I had really good material... On second thought, I do have really good material, since you replied! That's what he said, we have to say something shocking or mean to get your attention, then we can start communicating on a human level. He told me it will work every time. I really hope it does, I payed $900 for the class. Anyway, my name is Marc! And judging by your username, your name is probably Edith? If it is, that's an awesome name! My favorite Edith was probably Edith Sedgewick (Edie Sedgewick), but I also like Edith Stein, one of my personal heroes and my all time favorite philosopher!

Kindest regards,

Marc

Obviously none of this is true, it's ridiculous, which hopefully makes it funny. And I am writing to her, which should imply that I'm interested. Is there anything that I can do to turn this into a real, genuine conversation?

As a side-question, would calling myself "Marck" make it more funny?

Edited January 18, 2015 by Eddy Street

January 18, 2015

Ummm if she has any self respect, she will not touch you with a 10 foot pole.

January 18, 2015

This would be classed as negging .......i learned that term off loveshack...or maybe even gaslighting no more like negging eddy.....

look i will have to say ....i get defensive when a guy is mean to me..or i perceive meanness...i do respond....but me defensive means the guy has actually hurt me.....or said something actually that got to me not in a good way but in away that made me feel inferior.....i dont think thats fair or right to do to me or to any other woman....i have actually been negged a fair bit...didnt know i was being negged i thought guys were just being cruel because i perceive my imperfections better than anyone can....and i believed them...

like one guy told me that in front of a close girl friend of mine......dont worry about your acne....deb is the type of girl who has big huge pimples all over her ass....really embarassed me....i walked away....later he told me that he actually was working up to asking me on a date he didnt want to date my gf at all..........that he though i had the most beautiful soft skin and he didnt believe i had pimples at all..he then insulted my friend with her acne to me.....i declined the date.............

another guy put em down all night out with a group of friends saying you think your top ****e dont you,think your so perfect ...better than everyone else.........made me feel about ten cm tall.it is th elast thing i think i am is perfect i dotn want peopel to regard em liek that ....i am just me with loads of flaws........i dont even know what perfect ro normal really is........asked me three days later on a date....and I of course.....declined the date......

i had guys chasing me when i was younger and the more i said no the nastier they got.......i didnt deserve it...i eventually went out with a guy just to get them to lay off....and this guy was getting flak from some really dumb spiteful girls so i felt empathy...it was a slight to them adn protection for me.......they were teasing him about his height and using him for money....so i said yes to a date in front of them and they shut up......a guy who treated me like a friend or so i thought......went out with him for three years i treated him like a younger brother....i still do because twenty odd years later...that guy is still in my life just nto with me.....he is like a brother i protect and ultimately support...

negging makes women vulnerable.....and i dont think lowering someone to feel insecure or less worthy of proper treatment is ever right.....dont do it again eddy...i ask this of you...not to do these sort of things...its not funny and it isnt true.....or honest

i feel guilt when i lash back at a guy for hurting me i know i shouldnt really but i do ....i dotn want to be lashing out at a guy who wants to date me or em to date him....ijust want to feel safe and secure and i have told you before beautiful inside and out.......you wont end up happy eddy...or dating someone who is really your best friend..caring and future love will always be about kindness and genuinity eddy not reverse psychology....and i know genuinely you are not that type of guy really.....you are kind...be that guy............deb

Edited January 18, 2015 by todreaminblue

January 18, 2015

Your first mistake was taking a class to better your online dating.

People will buy into any crap disguised as a class these days.

January 18, 2015

Um no this is dead in the water. I'm not sure why you thought any part of this...strategy...was a good idea.

January 18, 2015

Eesh, you do need a dating class.

Look, you're trying too hard.

-Do not approach women with riddles.

-Do not write novels to strangers.

It's OK to make a joke with a woman, but not at her expense. And it's always better to err on the side of safety than obscurity. I know you're trying to seem edgy and cool but women need to know off the bat you're mentally together.

I wrote to a woman the other night, who I knew was about to watch a documentary on Netflix, "well, I guess you've got your popcorn, blanket and purring cat, so I'll leave you to your doc. Maybe we can chat later this evening."

She gave me her number and told me she was looking forward to it.

Be safe and silly. When they've relaxed their guard and gotten to know you a little, then you can make edgier jokes.

January 18, 2015

Saying the exact opposite of what you think is not good enough.

.esrever ni kaeps osla dluohs uoY.

Then all the girls will want you.

January 18, 2015

Seriously? Didn't we just go through all this being rude in email in another thread? Didn't I just say to read each line as if it was the only thing on the page before sending? These people don't know you. Even if you are trying to be funny, that's not funny! I'm starting to think you can't help yourself from wanting to say something to bring women down a notch, and that's not good.

January 18, 2015

I've told you before that sarcasm only works with voice inflection - it NEVER works in written form.

Why do you continue these "experiments" in writing and trying to come off humorously? It doesn't work and will never work until you know and comprehend a girl's intellect and psychology; i.e. To see if she *gets* your brand of funny.

Until that is gauged, you will continue to flame out.

January 18, 2015

Ummm if she has any self respect, she will not touch you with a 10 foot pole.

But it'll sure work on chicks with low-self esteem, who are desperate or like the women in the "Joy Luck Club" movie (who didn't have a backbone, didn't know what one was like - but when they eventually got one, the guy was toast).

Last time I looked the kid who runs up to the girls and does indian burns on them and/or pulls their pigtails pretty much are the guys who don't end up with the chicks.

If insulting women was so successful, I'd gather that the person doing it would be posting here about the date he went out with her on - rather than asking people he's got a chance with her.

January 18, 2015

preraph is right, you seem to self sabotage by being nasty to women straight off.

Dating to find a relationship is a big deal, these women feel like they are bearing their souls and the last thing they need is to be taken down a peg right away.

Some find being "denigrated " by friends and family and anyone who really knows them hilarious, as they know there is no malicious intent.

BUT some strange guy off the internet... not so funny.

Six dates later they may find that type of derogatory humour amusing and may give as good as they get, but carry on as you are doing, and you will never find out.

January 18, 2015

I'm going to disagree with everyone here. I think it was a fine first email and the recipient was either:

1). too dumb to realize it was sarcasm (otherwise why would he bother sending it?) or

2). knew it was sarcasm but feigned ignorance because she didn't like him.

Either way, it doesn't sound like she's worth going out with. Here's a similar message exchange I had with a girl last week:

Her: You need to lighten up your profile a bit. Waaay too serious.

Me: Fair point. How do you think I should revise it? Maybe a lengthy, formal paragraph assuring the reader how I genuine I am topped off with an undertone of desperation? I hear chicks dig that.

Her: Yes, I think you should also mention how you're a hopeless romantic and often find yourself in the friend zone lolololol. The "lolololol" is key... Also, do you update your profile every time you shave your beard? If so, I'm pretty impressed with the real time updates!

Etc. See? That's a girl who can actually dispense and appreciate sarcasm. You need some indication that she can do that before you send that email. The point being if she doesn't have a similar sense of humor, or can't read between the lines, then it's probably a non-starter from the beginning.

January 18, 2015

You guys are right, I'm negative and it comes across in my actions. I have to change my game entirely, rewrite my profile, take new pics (I look less shaggy these days), etc...

I'm sort of confused by another exchange that went straight to kingdom come despite seeming very promising. I have no idea what I did wrong, except that maybe by reply was too serious, desperate or careful-sounding?

Girl: *likes my photo*

Me: So does this mean you would consider going out with me???

Girl: I would say yes... and because you messaged me, the feeling is mutual?

Me: I suppose it is! So... what caught your attention?

Edited January 18, 2015 by Eddy Street

January 18, 2015

Your first mistake was taking a class to better your online dating.

People will buy into any crap disguised as a class these days.

That was a joke. It read like I was serious?

January 18, 2015

I'm going to disagree with everyone here. I think it was a fine first email and the recipient was either:

1). too dumb to realize it was sarcasm (otherwise why would he bother sending it?) or
2). knew it was sarcasm but feigned ignorance because she didn't like him.

Either way, it doesn't sound like she's worth going out with. Here's a similar message exchange I had with a girl last week:

Her: You need to lighten up your profile a bit. Waaay too serious.

Me: Fair point. How do you think I should revise it? Maybe a lengthy, formal paragraph assuring the reader how I genuine I am topped off with an undertone of desperation? I hear chicks dig that.

Her: Yes, I think you should also mention how you're a hopeless romantic and often find yourself in the friend zone lolololol. The "lolololol" is key... Also, do you update your profile every time you shave your beard? If so, I'm pretty impressed with the real time updates!

Etc. See? That's a girl who can actually dispense and appreciate sarcasm. You need some indication that she can do that before you send that email. The point being if she doesn't have a similar sense of humor, or can't read between the lines, then it's probably a non-starter from the beginning.

Yes, but you didn't diss her in the first sentence, you actually self-deprecated which was no threat to her and her "sarcastic" tone to you dissed your profile perhaps, (if you chose to be easily offended), but didn't actually personally diss you.

You, nor she, didn't say like Eddy did :

"You look like a bad person. I wouldn't trust you. Note to self: move along!" - did you?

January 18, 2015

I'm sort of confused by another exchange that went straight to kingdom come despite seeming very promising. I have no idea what I did wrong, except that maybe by reply was too serious, desperate or careful-sounding?

Girl: likes my photo.

Me: So does this mean you would consider going out with me???

Why use the word "consider?" Of course she's going to consider it if she liked the picture. Why 3 question marks? This reeks of desperation. Act like you've been there before. You're one sentence in and she can already tell she's got the upper hand even though she just liked your picture. She handed you an advantage and you immediately gave it back to her on bended knee with a silver platter.

A better response would be:

"Hi X, thanks for 'liking,' that's sweet. I'll bite. So (something about her profile or her OLD experience)."

- You politely, subconsciously remind her that she likes you (not the other way around), and you make her think you're doing her a favor by even acknowledging it. Don't concede that advantage. You have something she wants, not the other way around.

Me: I suppose it is! So... what caught your attention?

Why an exclamation point? It's desperate. Again, act like you've been out with a woman before. Why do you care what caught her attention? For one, it might make her uncomfortable if she has to open up and admit something specific like that. Just assume that there's something she likes and take it in stride. You know there's something she likes, don't bleed her dry already. This makes you sound like you're desperately seeking approval. Like I said twice already, act like you've been there before.

I'm well aware that this is a little coy, even backhanded, but this is how dating is done these days. It doesn't make you a bad person, it just makes you a participant in the game you have to play if you want to "win" or "get" something. Even nice people realize this and have to play along, it's a biological thing, I think.

January 18, 2015

Yes, but you didn't diss her in the first sentence, you actually self-deprecated which was no threat to her and her "sarcastic" tone to you dissed your profile perhaps, (if you chose to be easily offended), but didn't actually personally diss you.

You, nor she, didn't say like Eddy did :
"You look like a bad person. I wouldn't trust you. Note to self: move along!" - did you?

True, but I think the recipient should give the sender some credit. If s/he goes out of the way to send a message then obviously they don't mean any offense and it's just a playful, different way of entering the conversation. If I got Eddy's message from a girl I'd put 2 and 2 together instantly and think "there's nothing in my profile to indicate that I'm a bad person, quite the contrary. Obviously she means the opposite and the irony in this is funny. She's interested because she took the time to engage me and can see that I'm smart enough to not take it seriously, which is flattering."

The fact that the person sends the message should negate any implied abuse. I stand by my original statement that she probably just wasn't sharp enough to pick up on this, but that's just me.

January 18, 2015

That was a joke. It read like I was serious?

Yes! That's the point I tried to make; sarcasm only works when you are TALKING to someone and can change your voice inflection. Otherwise, what people read in OLD tends to be taken seriously.

January 18, 2015

True, but I think the recipient should give the sender some credit. If s/he goes out of the way to send a message then obviously they don't mean any offense and it's just a playful, different way of entering the conversation. If I got Eddy's message from a girl I'd put 2 and 2 together instantly and think "there's nothing in my profile to indicate that I'm a bad person, quite the contrary. Obviously she means the opposite and the irony in this is funny. She's interested because she took the time to engage me and can see that I'm smart enough to not take it seriously, which is flattering."

The fact that the person sends the message should negate any implied abuse. I stand by my original statement that she probably just wasn't sharp enough to pick up on this, but that's just me.

I generally think your advice is right-on, but disagree strongly here. You're thinking like a guy using old, not a woman. Women do receive arbitrarily nasty messages, and not always from a guy who wants a date...sometimes they're just howling at the moon and some random chick is the nearest target. Women get weary of that ish.

As Elaine said there's a huge gulf between self-deprecating sarcasm and aggressive negging. The second is a bad strategy, precise because it's not incumbent on the recipient to know if you're being funny or an ass, since she doesn't know you from Adam. It's a skill to write a sarcastic but not offensive email, but a good one to have. Yes, OP, I'm afraid you flubbed it. Chalk this one up to a loss.

Edited January 18, 2015 by serial muse

January 18, 2015

That was a joke. It read like I was serious?

Sorry buddy. Yeah, it sounded like you were serious.

January 18, 2015

Did I blow my chances again with this e-mail?
I sent this message to a girl:

You look like a bad person. I wouldn't trust you. Note to self: move along!

You really can't figure out if you blew it or not?! OF COURSE you blew your chances. What you wrote isn't funny, it was rude and insulting. Which she promptly told you in a message back.

January 18, 2015

I've told you before that sarcasm only works with voice inflection - it NEVER works in written form.

Why do you continue these "experiments" in writing and trying to come off humorously? It doesn't work and will never work until you know and comprehend a girl's intellect and psychology; i.e. To see if she *gets* your brand of funny.

Until that is gauged, you will continue to flame out.

I find sarcasm in the written form work...with people who know you well enough.

If OP sent this email as a first message on OLD...it's fair to say he is NOT getting a date out of this one...

lol

January 18, 2015

I personally love Eddy Streets approach to OLD.

Notes are being taken, again, as we speak

January 18, 2015

I personally love Eddy Streets approach to OLD.

Notes are being taken, again, as we speak

Boy, you should see my pictures. It's a shame I can't post them here.

January 18, 2015

Boy, you should see my pictures. It's a shame I can't post them here.

you could if you use a photo logging website.

Others can tell you how.

I can't wait, personally, to see precisely what you look like.

Putting a face to a fool is a useful tool....

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Did I blow my chances again with this e-mail?

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