Date Threatens Suicide!

January 15, 2015

There is just no reason for you to stay in any contact with her. IF she was using feeling suicidal for leverage, then she would only continue doing so if it worked at all. You have to bail all the way out on this so she can move on. I still think she basically broke it off anyway herself and the suicidal was more a confession than a threat, but she is ready to go, so by all means let her go and let others more qualified help her address her big issues that have zero to do with you. I've had some experience with people saying they're suicidal and I've found the only good response is anger to snap them out of it, not doubling down on the sympathy which only rewards them for going there.

Sycamore is nothing but an acquaintance to her and has no business staying there involving himself and doesn't want to and she ran him off anyway. Only her closest support people, family, etc. have any way of helping her, and mostly that's simply to either call police when she makes threats and have her admitted or get her to agree to be admitted. There has to be action but not by virtual strangers who have no power there to do anything legally or otherwise.

January 15, 2015

Here's the thing, IF (big if) she is actually suicidal, him being all "oh, best wishes!" isn't going to CHANGE that!

If people are ACTUALLY concerned about him being empathetic or helpful or WHATEVER, they should be suggesting he turn her message over to her family so THEY can take care of her and get her REAL help.

Do not engage further with her. She's bonkers and will use this as an opening to get her foot back in the door and again if she is ACTUALLY suicidal one "hope you're well!" message won't change that! Replying is pointless!

January 15, 2015

I am 95% convinced that going full NC on her is the best course of action. I do appreciate people presenting opposing viewpoints. Mostly. Some of the suggestions I find very off. You're feeling the vehemence of my conviction, nothing personal.

Imagine this scenario:

Said girl is sitting on the ledge of a high-rise. She's been sitting there for hours looking dolefully out over the expanse.

A concerned man haltingly approaches and by these few words, "Sycamore wishes you well" coaxes her away from the ledge and towards a rehabilitated life.

Sounds ridiculous, right?

Now I think you're thinking has become ridiculous, Sycamore. Sorry to be blunt. You wrote in your other thread about her that you were turned off by her drama, as you've wrote about here.

You also mentioned in this thread that last night you two agreed to end the connection after 3 dates. Now, it's clear she has horrible boundaries because she emailed you again today, throwing in that bit about her feeling suicidal that has nothing to do with you, yet she threw in that tidbit because she's good at pushing your buttons it would seem, just after 3 dates.

Why are you even giving her email the time of day? Why are you worrying about how you should reply to her email, when you clearly told her on the phone you didn't want to date her anymore? And moreso, why do you want to reply to her email? You know that if you do reply, you will keep the lines of communication open. No offense Sycamore, but I have no idea why you'd want to continue to date this woman based on her erratic behavior and use of poor boundaries (emailing you after you two agreed the day before to go your separate ways).

So why do you want to reply to her email if you want nothing to do with her?

January 15, 2015

Here's the thing, IF (big if) she is actually suicidal, him being all "oh, best wishes!" isn't going to CHANGE that!

If people are ACTUALLY concerned about him being empathetic or helpful or WHATEVER, they should be suggesting he turn her message over to her family so THEY can take care of her and get her REAL help.

Do not engage further with her. She's bonkers and will use this as an opening to get her foot back in the door and again if she is ACTUALLY suicidal one "hope you're well!" message won't change that! Replying is pointless!

Agree with you 100%. If Sycamore wasted five minutes sending her a "call this suicide hotline please etc" email, that won't make a bit of difference because they are complete strangers, and she will do as she pleases.

I would never waste time responding to some crazy guy's email whom I went on 3 dates with, who mentioned suicide. It's about having good boundaries. That woman has no boundaries Sycamore. You need to have strong boundaries and just block her and delete her phone # and go on with your life.

And I agree with you veggirl that she sounds completely bonkers.

Run, Forrest! Run!

January 15, 2015

Long story short:

Met a girl on OKC. I knew she had some baggage. She and I shared similar stories(live-in exes cheated). I found her attractive. I courted her for about two weeks. We never had sex. She did come over to my place one night and we made out.

By the third date I knew it was too much for me. Her insecurities were through the roof. Yesterday evening she was supposed to come over for dinner and stay the night. She sensed my distancing via text and provoked an argument. I told her that her insecurities were more than I could handle. She was angry, accused me of manipulating her. She said she "wished me well." I told her goodbye.

This morning she e-mailed me this:

I just want to formally apologize. I haven't been well. I'm sorry that I dragged you into the mess that I am. It's bad. I'm suicidal and probably need to be hospitalized. I'm very scared and very sorry, Sycamore. I wish you a beautiful life.

How should I deal with this? Again, we knew each other about 2 weeks. We did nothing sexual besides some fondling. We went on 3 dates, with a lot of texting between.

There's nothing you can do unfortunately.

I never want to make light of someone threatening suicide but people who suffer from BPD and other personality disorders tend to sometimes use that as a way of garnering attention when they feel ignored and out of control. I could be wrong, but it seems like that is her tactic here.

You were right to stop seeing her. I think she just wants you to engage with her further why she's saying this. I assume you don't know any of her friends but if you're worried you could call the police and tell them she's threatened to kill herself and give them her address and they can check on her.

Otherwise you just have to keep it moving because interacting with her further will not decrease her behavior, she will only continue and also try to manipulate you with her emotions and you'll never be able to have normal interactions with her.

January 15, 2015

Well, mental illness is not too funny. It is hard to tell if this woman is just trying to be a manipulator or if she's mentally ill or what.

It's tough.... I wouldn't respond to anything because it will only encourage her in all likelyhood.

On the other hand, there is the "what if" she needs help.

January 15, 2015

I agree with the notion that it was an explanation and apology, nothing more and nothing less. I think it's sort of obvious when one perceives the whole message altogether, and not just the bit about feeling suicidal. This whole thread and the premise of the original post is like she sent an email and all it said was, "I'm feeling suicidal," and that's it. If that were the case then yeah it would be a suicide threat, but that wasn't the case.

"I just want to formally apologize."

(States it outright, she is apologizing.)

"I haven't been well."

(She is acknowledging that she has problems, specifically even mental illness problems. Not being well and all. That is ballsy and humble to admit, most with mental illness have a very hard time taking this basic first step. Some people encounter the mentally ill and walk away believing they really did do something wrong. This is her owning up and taking responsibility, in case you were the type to question yourself. Which clearly you're not, but it's a just in case measure.)

"I'm sorry that I dragged you into the mess that I am."

(She even goes so far as to acknowledge that she knows her behavior was inappropriate, that she dragged you into her dysfunction and drama. That is why she is apologizing in the first place.)

"It's bad. I'm suicidal and probably need to be hospitalized. I'm very scared and very sorry, Sycamore. I wish you a beautiful life."

(Here she is explaining outright that she has severe mental illness and she knows it. Her behavior has been irrational, bred from fear and anxiety. Again she is sorry about all of this and wishes you the best.)

End of Story

You're under no obligation to reply, OP, of course not. And if you do reply, I agree to keep it short, kind and final. "I hope you get the help you need. Farewell," or whatever.

But I don't really understand a multi-page thread ripping this woman apart over how she must be crazy, when duh, she has mental health issues, owned up to it, apologized and wished you well. Good Lord.

January 15, 2015

This thread is also more proof against online dating. Yikes.

January 15, 2015

The last thing he needs is to take the bait.. which is what the whole suicide deal is, just bait.. I'll bet she has even used it before..

No, it isn't. At least it hasn't been for me.

January 16, 2015

^^ This ^^

She was looking for sympathy, granted in a morbid and possibly manipulative way -- it doesn't hurt you to show compassion. You really don't know her so there really is no telling what she's truly struggling with. Maybe she really isn't well. Maybe that was a cry for help. No one knows but kind words can go a long way. Then close the door.

It sounds to me like she was just explaining why she got so upset.

I used to be on a dating site, and removed myself when I realized that I just wasn't ready to deal with the anxiety and possible rejection involved in the whole dating scene. I've since had worse things happen in my life, that have left me basically just trying to recover, and yet I've still held out hope, at times, that I might be able to have a healthy relationship. I think that hope is now dead.

I just love all of the recommendations to block and ignore someone, where a little kindness wouldn't hurt. I'm not saying that you should marry her, and take on her life, but damn... this is supposed to be a supportive site, but it once again reminds me of why I don't feel comfortable posting about my own personal problems. I've been suicidal on-and-off over the past several years, and one thing that keeps me going is that I have good days, when I am proactive, and have nice interactions with others, when I feel calmer, and get to enjoy a mug of tea (and not be lost in a certain state of mind, and have it just go cold on me), or the sunshine coming through the window. It isn't a surprise to me that she was talking about helping out her sister, not long before this came about.

January 16, 2015

Not sure if that's directed at me, but I don't feel I'm ripping her apart.

This thread, for me, is dealing with the small voice in the back of my head that I'm in a teeny-tiny way emotionally responsible to her because I gave her a brief "high." Yes, I knew that she was a little unstable going in. My fault. When I discovered that we had similar back-stories I thought "oh, here is someone who will be patient with my baggage and for whom I can exercise some of my newly acquired empathy from the trauma I just overcame."

But what I feel now is that just because I went through something terrible doesn't mean that I'm damaged and must seek out a damaged person. If anything, I should probably be more vigilant to meet someone who is thoroughly stable. That may seem like common sense. But honestly, when my BU happened, when all the ***t hit the fan, my initial instinct was to find someone, anyone, to help. That was 10+ months ago and those feelings have mostly faded but I guess there's still some residual energy. I think also I just want someone who wants to go turtle slow.

People can continue debating. The case is closed for me. Leaving it be. Thanks.

January 16, 2015

I don't understand the projection of manipulation onto her message. She didn't ask you to DO anything, just explained her reality and apologized for her behavior.

It would be entirely inappropriate for you to DO anything (try to rescue her, get further involved). But there is no risk to acknowledging her apology and wishing her well. Will it solve her problems? Of course not. It's simply the kind thing to do.

Is it required? No.

Is there any risk in extending this kindness? No.

January 16, 2015

This thread is also more proof against online dating. Yikes.

I don't think online has anything to do with it. People from online are the same people you meet elsewhere and lots of people have crazy dating stories with people they didn't meet online.

January 16, 2015

Not sure if that's directed at me, but I don't feel I'm ripping her apart.

This thread, for me, is dealing with the small voice in the back of my head that I'm in a teeny-tiny way emotionally responsible to her because I gave her a brief "high." Yes, I knew that she was a little unstable going in. My fault. When I discovered that we had similar back-stories I thought "oh, here is someone who will be patient with my baggage and for whom I can exercise some of my newly acquired empathy from the trauma I just overcame."

But what I feel now is that just because I went through something terrible doesn't mean that I'm damaged and must seek out a damaged person. If anything, I should probably be more vigilant to meet someone who is thoroughly stable. That may seem like common sense. But honestly, when my BU happened, when all the ***t hit the fan, my initial instinct was to find someone, anyone, to help. That was 10+ months ago and those feelings have mostly faded but I guess there's still some residual energy. I think also I just want someone who wants to go turtle slow.

People can continue debating. The case is closed for me. Leaving it be. Thanks.

No not directed at you personally. Most of this thread is obsessing over that one bit of email and not perceiving it as a whole message. It's just obsessing over the mention of suicidal feelings (she likely has clinical depression) and then a lot of damning her as some master manipulator.

I'm bipolar which is also a mood disorder, and I know that when people with mood disorders are having episodes, we usually know that there is something wrong with us but we're super emotionally dysregulated. There are often fleeting "moments of clarity" in which we attempt to explain or apologize to other people. This doesn't mean that suddenly our words are just loads of BS. It's just that well, we have dysregulated mood/emotion issues so our words will usually be emotionally charged. Where a neurotypical might feel kinda bad, we're more likely to be consumed by guilt. Etc.

So for the sake of perspective (including yours, so you're not wracked with anxiety or guilt about going NC, if that'd be the case, secretly or not), she probably is mentally ill (as is evidenced by all the info you've shared about her), and therefore the message itself is also a reflection of that. It's best to view it through a sort of illness-to-neurotypical translator lens. The email is basically just, "I acknowledge that I was being dramatic and irrational, it was me not you, sorry about that, wish you the best," only it came out with the intensity of a mood-disordered person having an episode.

And yes, wounded birds and such. Dysfunction attracting dysfunction. Hurt people hurt people. However you wanna word and slice it. You did ignore red flags and kept going; you only started pulling out when it got extreme enough for you to feel really uncomfortable. So yeah you probably do need to be more vigilant from now on. It's a good thing to acknowledge and work on. If that's what you take away from this experience, that's a great thing.

January 16, 2015

Not sure if that's directed at me, but I don't feel I'm ripping her apart.

This thread, for me, is dealing with the small voice in the back of my head that I'm in a teeny-tiny way emotionally responsible to her because I gave her a brief "high." Yes, I knew that she was a little unstable going in. My fault. When I discovered that we had similar back-stories I thought "oh, here is someone who will be patient with my baggage and for whom I can exercise some of my newly acquired empathy from the trauma I just overcame."

But what I feel now is that just because I went through something terrible doesn't mean that I'm damaged and must seek out a damaged person. If anything, I should probably be more vigilant to meet someone who is thoroughly stable. That may seem like common sense. But honestly, when my BU happened, when all the ***t hit the fan, my initial instinct was to find someone, anyone, to help. That was 10+ months ago and those feelings have mostly faded but I guess there's still some residual energy. I think also I just want someone who wants to go turtle slow.

People can continue debating. The case is closed for me. Leaving it be. Thanks.

I understand. This is about your healing process and navigating your own healthy boundaries. That's good.

I did sense that you were feeling defensive on this thread, as if she were blaming you for her troubles. I don't think that's the case. She was troubled before you, and is troubled now. That has nothing to do with you. You can feel empathy for her without lowering your boundaries and allowing her to mistreat you. Kind but firm.

January 16, 2015

I guess I don't understand why I'm being criticized for my view that Sycamore is right to just leave this woman alone and not respond to her email. Why is his obligated to respond just because she mentioned "suicide" even though it was in the context of an explanation, rather than a declaration or cry for help?

There was no reason for her to send a follow up email for closure after their phone call the night before, except that she wanted Sycamore's attention. The advice that Sycamore owed her a response email because she mentioned feeling suicidal seemed misguided, sorry. She may be mentally ill or not at all; just someone who is manipulative (there's plenty of mentally sane people who are just vile individuals who like to antagonize, gaslight, and manipulate because they can and think it's fun). It shows poor boundaries on her part, having sent Sycamore a follow up closure "good bye" email.

And while LoveShack is a forum meant for people to come to for support and advice, the email this woman sent to Sycamore has nothing to do with LoveShack so that makes zero sense.

Just because you have 3 dates with someone doesn't mean you owe them your soul. It doesn't tie you to that person, nor does it require an emotionally supportive or kind response email from Sycamore to wish her well and comment on her suicide comment.

I mean, there's online etiquette expected with friends, family, and coworkers. But a complete stranger doesn't require the same treatment. I mean, that is just seems like ridiculous logic, and I respect everyone's opinion (I always do) who has posted in this thread (even though I can come across harsh and blunt sometimes when I feel strongly about something -- character flaw of mine perhaps).

Sycamore I didn't mean to call you ridiculous either so my apologies, since you have made the smart choice not to email her. I just meant it seemed ridiculous that you would even consider responding to her email based on what rollercoaster ride you've been on with her.

January 16, 2015

I agree with a lot of the other posters about not contacting here directly anymore.... BUT it wouldn't hurt to have a welfare check done on her by contacting the local police department's non emergency number. It is not that uncommon and they are usually very happy to do it (I once had one done on my father when no one was hearing back from him while he was alone - it was not like him not to call anyone back for so long and I live like 2000 miles away). You could ask the police to remain anonymous and just say you are a "concerned friend" or something. She does not need to know it was you who asked so you don't have to interact with her any longer.... they are probably a lot more equipped to tell if she is 100% bluffing or not than we average citizens anyway. Just guess that is what I would do.

Edited January 16, 2015 by Tina747

January 16, 2015

I agree with a lot of the other posters about not contacting here directly anymore.... BUT it wouldn't hurt to have a welfare check done on her by contacting the local police department's non emergency number. It is not that uncommon and they are usually very happy to do it (I once had one done on my father when no one was hearing back from him while he was alone - it was not like him not to call anyone back for so long). You could ask the police to remain anonymous and just say you are a "concerned friend" or something. She does not need to know it was you who asked so you don't have to interact with her any longer.... they are probably a lot more equipped if she is 100% bluffing or not than we average citizens anyway. Just guess that is what I would do.

Your situation is different because you're talking about your own father, whom you had a lifelong relationship with (or still do). This woman Sycamore met is a complete stranger. Maybe I'm different, as I would never contact police to do a welfare check on a guy I met via online dating and only went out with 3 times. The only people I would ever pursue a welfare check on would be people I knew well (friends or family). But a complete stranger? Nope. Not my problem.

January 16, 2015

The case is closed for me. Leaving it be. Thanks.

With that, I think we will close this one up. Thanks for all who participated, I'm sure the thread starter has enough advice on this.

If in the future he would like it re-opened to post an update then alert on this post and we will do so.

Edited January 16, 2015 by Robert

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