Honestly, why not confess?

[merrmeade]

Look. Get off your high horse. This is NOT the place to seek political asylum, absolution or even empathy. And empathy? If it goes both ways, then the WS should realize that NOTHING s/he has gone through equals the trauma done to the BS and you are making yourself more and more despicable and worthy of stoning the more you try to posit your pain aside the BS's. Drop it. You lose. You lost the day you did it and every day you pretend that your shame and self-blame can begin to match the betrayed spouse's sense of loss and devastation.

 

Listen. Learn. The ones who said they divorced and didn't look back are stronger and better able to handle absurdities. The rest of us take it as one more thrust of a sword that gets pulled in an out of a bleeding, gaping hole every time you guys get arrogant enough to compare the pain. Just remember. No matter how many ways you look at it, the WS and OW/OM are knowing perpetrators; the BS, the innocent victim. Unless the BS is a criminal sociopath or mobster, s/he is always the victim. Do you blame rape victims for spewing hatred for rapists? A perpetrator cannot be a victim. And a victim cannot be made responsible for the abuse.

 

But, yeah, I'll grant that the WS or OW/OM can disown the acts and people they were. But if they've done that, they KNOW who they are now and shouldn't have a problem with condemning the behavior and the person they were. Watch the last episode of "Downton Abbey." One of the servants, Ms. Baxter, is outed for having spent time in prison for stealing. Another servant who'd like to be romantically involved with her can't accept that there is no extenuating circumstance to justify her ethical breach. Ms. Baxter calmly explains that she just did it and nothing makes it or the person she was when she did it, any better. SHE KNOWS that she is no longer that person. She is sad that he cannot accept her past and her present, but she understands. She does not blame him and accepts that this, too, is one of the unavoidable outcomes of what she did. You are left admiring her courage and sense of self-acceptance. THIS is redemption and forgiveness. Only the individual can do it for him or herself. It does not then mean that the past did not happen. It means that s/he is now truly and completely separate from it.

 

Now, don't accuse me of spewing hatred or lack of empathy. I would love for my husband and sister-in-law/OW to be there.

Edited January 14, 2015 by merrmeade

[truncated]

My comment is more about the BS stating why a WS doesn't confess. It's all speculation, but I do know that a lot of BS's would be throwing a fit if OW's were making comments on the reason BS's stay. A bit of an unfair double standard that is very common around here.

 

 

bringng up the ow...

 

how many people would think it was okay for a mm to lie to a single woman about his marital status and tell her he was single? What if he used " she wouldn't go out with me/have sex with me/ have a relationship wth me" as an excuse? How many would find those to be valid and acceptable reasons for lying? I don't think many would.

 

How many would feel it was okay for him to continue lying, using "the truth would hurt her, and I'm scared she'll end the affair" as an excuse for continuing the deception?

 

Pretty much everyone would be up in arms, lambasting him for being a "dirtbag" etc. ( check out any threads where a mm has lied to his ow about being married for some more examples)

 

Why is it so horrendous and inexcusbale to lie to the ow, but not to his spouse? Why are people expecetd to empathize with the fear felt by the mm/mw in the marraige situation, but not the affair? After all, the spouse has even more valid reasons for needing the truth. She ( or he) may be raising children with them, combining finances with them, basing legal, financial, employment, family and all sorts of other decisions upon the status of their marraige and their trust in their spouse being honest with them.

 

When it comes right down to it, are they not just as deserving of informed choice as anyone else, or does this concept only apply to certain people?

[TrustedthenBusted]

The problem with judging cheaters too harshly is that we hold them up to the other people we know who "would never" do such a thing. The Good People.

 

Thing is... you really have no idea what anyone else has done until they get caught.

 

I'm quite sure that at some point in the last 15 years, some friends of ours have dealt with infidelity, and said " Why can't you be more like T&B's wife? She would never..."

 

Because they don't know. None of us really know. Ever.

[truncated]

You have nothing but a concept to back you up.

 

Not to mention the fact that "living a lie" is just a concept as well.

 

For me, living a lie occurs when a person is actively involved with an AP. I personally don't see past undisclosed infidelity as living a lie. The laughter shared is real, the experiences are all real. It may seem unfathomable that would be the better life than hatred, anger, selfishness, pain, and so forth.

 

Givinf your spouse the oppurtunity to choose as I chose to do may seem "right". But it carried a lot of pain for my H that keeping silent would not have done.

 

That's an awfully big assumption. Suppose your om became unbalanced when the affair ended and began to harass or come after you or your husband, suppose you picked up an std, suppose someone else found out about the affair and told your husband at some point in the future, suppose he found out on his own, suppose your behvaior during teh affair was not so sterling as you would like to believe and he knew something was up, but not what is was and was hurting?

 

These are all situations beyond your control, and to say "he would have ben happier if he never knew" is a complete fallacy, as there is no way for you to know that, or to know if he would have spent the rest of his life in the dark. You are speculating, basing your opinion on varriables that may or may not have existed.

[truncated]

One last thing.

 

I was a terrible person when I had my affair.

 

I don't deny it or minimize it.

 

But while you surround yourself and your kids with people who have never screwed up. While you feel superior to these people because you don't believe people can become better. I choose to teach my children to have a heart. And not to judge someone for past behaviour but rather present.

 

Because I don't want them to turn into heartless domineering people who look down on others and judge them.

 

And should they make wrong descision in their life and screw up royally like I did, i want them to have hope that they can choose better and have a meaningful. That they are not worthless. That there is good in them. Because the other is a terrible path to go down.

 

 

Screwing up isn't so much what makes a person a bad, it's the choices they make after it. If they lie, rationalize and justify all the while saying "I made a mistake, I'm only human, don't judge me" about their behavior, if they keep on hurting the person in quetsion, if they keep engaging in the same hurtful behvior in other areas of their life that's what makes them bad.

 

Some can do soemthing wrong, learn from it and go on to never do it again and beocme a better person for it.

 

As for "judging' people...some are just sick and tired of this excuse being used to cover up all sorts of crappy and hurtful behavior. It's easy to say "don't judge me" when you ( general you,not you specifically) are not the person who's been hurt in the particular situation or something similar.

 

Someone can most certainly have a heart ad still tell someone " your actions ae eally hurtful and you need to stop acting like a jerk". It doesn't make them unkind, all it does it make them someone who won't put up with garbage behvaior any longer, and they shouldn't feel one iota of guilt for choosing not to.

 

At some point, one's sympathy and emtional energy is better spent on the person being hurt, not the perosn doing the hurting.

[truncated]

The problem with judging cheaters too harshly is that we hold them up to the other people we know who "would never" do such a thing. The Good People.

 

Thing is... you really have no idea what anyone else has done until they get caught.

 

I'm quite sure that at some point in the last 15 years, some friends of ours have dealt with infidelity, and said " Why can't you be more like T&B's wife? She would never..."

 

Because they don't know. None of us really know. Ever.

 

Then, if you judge them, judge them based upon their individual behavior. What difference does it make if others are/ are not doing it too?

[merrmeade]

Part of the character change for me IS the courage to say what they did and who they are. It's no different from an alcoholic, addict or criminal and the psychology behind the 12 steps. By saying it and disowning it as bad for whatever the reasons are for them, they separate their present from their past and allow themselves to be redefined.

 

I can understand this and admire the ones with the courage to look straight at people and say that this thing happened, I did it and I despise it now. I don't blame you for not being sure and mistrusting me. I would like a chance to prove myself in time, but if that is not possible, I do understand and do not blame you for your response. I brought it on myself. It is not your fault, and I'm sorry for these consequences.

[violet1]

The problem with judging cheaters too harshly is that we hold them up to the other people we know who "would never" do such a thing. The Good People.

 

Thing is... you really have no idea what anyone else has done until they get caught.

 

I'm quite sure that at some point in the last 15 years, some friends of ours have dealt with infidelity, and said " Why can't you be more like T&B's wife? She would never..."

 

Because they don't know. None of us really know. Ever.

Exactly!! This is a great post. You never really know. I'm willing to bet that we all have friends or family who've cheated or done something not so nice that we don't know about. That's what's so hard about life. It's a gamble. Every day we take risks. Marriage is a risk. So is divorce, reconciliation or starting a new relationship as a single person.

[violet1]

Sounds like you're headed towards a good future. I hope everything works out. Peace.

Thank you, I'm trying. It sounds like you are trying to find your way as well. That's wonderful and peace to you as well.

[TrustedthenBusted]

Then, if you judge them, judge them based upon their individual behavior. What difference does it make if others are/ are not doing it too?

 

That's the point. Why judge them at all? People screw up. And statistically speaking, MANY of the people you currently know and admire are also cheaters...or will be. And you will be none the wiser.

 

Might even me you someday.

 

I'm not saying give cheaters a free pass. They need to be held accountable. But to judge and eternally condemn the entirety of someone's existence ( as is routinely done here) for an act that like half the earth's population, if not more, has been guilty of since the dawn of time....I dunno... seems excessive.

 

 

For crying out loud, they even let murderers out of prison eventually.

[sidney2718]

I've very rarely if ever seen a cheater say to their partner "you know, I cheated and I'd love if you took me back, but I recognize that the fact you would take me back for this shows you are not in the best place mentally right now, so I'm not going to take advantage of that any further, I am going to do the right thing and leave you alone."

 

You've never seen this because it is in nobody's interest to do it.

 

You've said that the betrayed spouse will never forget it. I agree. I will never forget the day I had my gall bladder taken out, which brings pack the pancreatic pain I felt. And that sort of pain is so bad that folks can and do die from the pain alone.

 

Our lives are filled with things that we will never forget, things that trigger us. It isn't just affairs.

 

In your scenario above let us assume that the betrayed spouse wants the cheater back. Who know why? Love, habit, sex, it could be anything. It happens, we all know that.

 

And let's assume that the cheater wants to come back. Why? Perhaps the vision of more perfect love has faded. Perhaps the reason for the affair has been removed. It doesn't matter, the cheater wants back.

 

Now your position is that this should not be allowed to happen? Why exactly is that? After all the pain of the affair, the two have reached an accommodation that both can live with, and you'd deny them that happiness.

 

I know that you are sincere in your feelings. The cheater must be punished forever because cheaters lie and cannot be trusted, or whatever. That is very strong.

[sidney2718]

This, times infinity. The only true cure for infidelity is divorce. Anything else? You just mask the symptoms.

 

I'm not trying to be argumentative, but how do you know that this is the only true cure for infidelity?

[sidney2718]

Okie dokie, when did I say I was everyone else? Do I need to put up a disclaimer in every post stating it is my opinion? Since that should be a given.

 

Stop saying people are spreading "hatred of cheaters". Because no, not a single thing he said was spreading hate. You also bring up the "you wouldn't keep your own child if they cheated". I surely hope you are not the SAME poster who brought up this point before, because the guy clearly addressed you and said he would not disown his kids if they cheated.

 

Saying that cheaters should never be forgiven is very strong. Every major religion I know of allows for forgiveness and redemption.

 

But hey since we are asking what the point of things are: what the heck is the point of you posting and drastically over reacting to things? You realize any point you might of had is lost in a sea of you being terribly over dramatic about things. Seriously, spreading a "hatred of cheaters"? Did someone say we should burn cheaters at the stake and I missed it? Since surely even someone saying "cheaters are bad and can't be redeemed" would never equate to spreading hatred. It is going to be hard to take you seriously if you feel a person being of the opinion cheaters shouldn't be forgiven or redeemed..means they have some hatred of cheaters. You act as if instead of saying "they shouldn't be forgiven" someone said "we should hunt then down and stone them to death".

 

In fact I suspect that you are in favor of exposing cheaters, that you would never favor any man marrying one, and would not want cheaters around you, your wife, or your children. That's not exactly the death penalty, but it is a social death penalty.

[sidney2718]

The problem with these posts is they do nothing to encourage a WS to cheat. They just show them that once the sin has been committed they are damned if they do, damned if they don't. Everything they say will be seen as excuses. The disgust and labelling and hatred seen will show them what they have a good chance of experiencing if they confess.

 

So why confess?

 

What does it gain? Everyone talk about concepts and ideas but little of reality. They talk from a BS point of view about being owed a confession so their life is not a lie. But that is selfish. So who gets to have it their way? Is it "fair" after the WS selfish behaviour to hand the selfish behaviour over to the WS and become a groveling mess. Or see their selfish actions rip their family apart?

 

Or, they choose to swallow the guilt. They choose to end the affair and work on many other good traits of a spouse.

 

Maybe the rest of the BS' life look a lie to those who read online or hear a story told to them. But that is just more over thinking and not living.

 

I was selfish, am selfish, unlike others who live in denial over their selfishness. I confessed and there was selfish motive to it. It was what I felt I should do and m choice.

 

My personal stance is for confession. Because discovery is almost always a risk. But I do not think these threads do anything to convince a WS to confess.

 

I totally agree with you. Given the attitude of society in general against cheaters, it is easy to understand why cheaters not only rarely confess, but it explains trickle truthing (TT), and fallout management. Such things may not work, but they may.

 

Further, while I agree that discovery is almost always a risk, it is my opinion that many one night stands, and a fair number of full-blown affairs are NEVER discovered. In fact even here we know of many cases in which one spouse asked for a divorce and only then did it come out that the spouse was seeing someone else.

[sidney2718]

First off let me say I am very happy for both you and your H that you have Reconciled and things are going well for you. I personally could not reconcile. I tried and It just did not work out for me.

 

I just don't agree. I think cheating is a serious thing and I think it really reflects on the kind of person the WS is.

 

I will say this it sure sounds like your trying to make your life better and I commend you for that. I wish you and your H the best in your reconciliation

 

Clay

 

I think that everyone here thinks that cheating is a serious thing. And it does reflect on the kind of person the cheater might be. But people are far more complex than that. I know of people who would never cheat on their wives but who do cheat on their taxes.

[Clay]

I think that everyone here thinks that cheating is a serious thing. And it does reflect on the kind of person the cheater might be. But people are far more complex than that. I know of people who would never cheat on their wives but who do cheat on their taxes.

 

I do agree there are people that do other things that we all might not agree with but there is things in place to help correct that behavior. If you cheat on your taxes and get caught you face what ever punishment is in place base on the degree of your crime. If you cheat on your SO there is no real punishment in place. No one has the best answer on how to stop this behavior. The one thing for sure is that the damage to the SO(BS) has been done. This damage can last for years. This does not even cover the possibility of physical harm the BS could face such as a STD or maybe some kind of a physical attack on themselves not to mention there children.

 

 

There are so many problems that come with infidelity that it just seems crazy to me how many people willing still do it.

 

 

Personally I wished more people would try to be better people and try to be more true to themselves but as you see this probably will continue to be a problem long after we are gone.

[Confused48]

I'd like to say that I (a BS) really appreciate the truly repentant WSs that are willing to be here and give us insight on their views. I see how they are continually blasted and don't like that. I don't see how you can say you think they are scum, but then, no you don't hate them. That is some wacky definition of non-hate if you ask me. Reminds me of another thread where the BSs were saying they wished their WSs would basically fry in hell for eternity, but oh no, they were not unforgiven.

 

I just wish there were more repentant WSs posting, but I can sure understand why they would not want to be here. I can't even think of the last time I saw a repentant WH here.

[astralla]

I am a cheater and I haven't confessed to my H, nor do I intend to.

 

I consider myself a good person, with strong morals, and I do understand the devastation that can be brought about if an affair is discovered. I'll try and explain why I don't feel what I am doing is terribly wrong.

 

I've been married for 7 years, and also cheating with a married friend for 18 months. My H and I have problems in our relationship, which we are working on, but in general we're happy. One part of our relationship that doesn't work is sex - we don't have it, and haven't for a long time. I don't know if we ever will again. This is what led me to seek outside my relationship for intimacy. My friend and I are very close, he is in a similar situation, and we hook up regularly, both fully understanding that the friendship is the most important thing, the sex a bonus but it won't ever go any further than that relationship wise. It works for us.

 

I see sex as a part of my relationship with my H, not the whole relationship. If my husband didn't like yoga holidays I'd go with a friend, or didn't like indian food, I'd eat out with a friend. These are all parts of the relationship and if 1 part isn't a shared passion then you do it with other people. I don't see sex as any different. And yes, I know a lot of you will probably be incensed by my attitude to it, but this is how I feel.

 

I also know my H would be upset if he found out, and if he did I would not do him the disservice of lying. I would tell him the truth and hope that he would understand why, which I believe he would, and the choice of how our marriage went from then on would be his, as I understand I am the one who has complicated our relationship. I love my H dearly, I have no wish to hurt him, but without me cheating and having a sexual relationship outside my marriage, my marriage would have ended long ago as I want sex in my life.

[Sub]

If you believe he would understand, why not discuss an open marriage?

[astralla]

We have discussed that, but he has religious beliefs which will not permit it.

[Clay]

I am a cheater and I haven't confessed to my H, nor do I intend to.

 

I consider myself a good person, with strong morals, and I do understand the devastation that can be brought about if an affair is discovered. I'll try and explain why I don't feel what I am doing is terribly wrong.

 

I've been married for 7 years, and also cheating with a married friend for 18 months. My H and I have problems in our relationship, which we are working on, but in general we're happy. One part of our relationship that doesn't work is sex - we don't have it, and haven't for a long time. I don't know if we ever will again. This is what led me to seek outside my relationship for intimacy. My friend and I are very close, he is in a similar situation, and we hook up regularly, both fully understanding that the friendship is the most important thing, the sex a bonus but it won't ever go any further than that relationship wise. It works for us.

 

I see sex as a part of my relationship with my H, not the whole relationship. If my husband didn't like yoga holidays I'd go with a friend, or didn't like indian food, I'd eat out with a friend. These are all parts of the relationship and if 1 part isn't a shared passion then you do it with other people. I don't see sex as any different. And yes, I know a lot of you will probably be incensed by my attitude to it, but this is how I feel.

 

I also know my H would be upset if he found out, and if he did I would not do him the disservice of lying. I would tell him the truth and hope that he would understand why, which I believe he would, and the choice of how our marriage went from then on would be his, as I understand I am the one who has complicated our relationship. I love my H dearly, I have no wish to hurt him, but without me cheating and having a sexual relationship outside my marriage, my marriage would have ended long ago as I want sex in my life.

 

Most cheaters never consider themselves as bad people. They feel they just missed a step along the way. If your marriage was not working out then you should have stood up for yourself and demanded your needs be met or you would leave. The cheating now is all on you. If he ever finds out you will never have any valid legitimate reason for your cheating. You will have taken away any healthy choices you could have made in your life and replaced them with a very few select horrible ones. Not to mention if you have children you will have permanently scared them for the rest of there lives.

 

The reason why I support confessing because its a chance to fix the issues. Its a chance to work towards making yourself whole again and your marriage if that is what you want. Redemption has to start with you and you owning up to your mistakes is what its all about.

 

Clay

[jbrent890]

I am a cheater and I haven't confessed to my H, nor do I intend to.

 

I consider myself a good person, with strong morals, and I do understand the devastation that can be brought about if an affair is discovered. I'll try and explain why I don't feel what I am doing is terribly wrong.

 

I've been married for 7 years, and also cheating with a married friend for 18 months. My H and I have problems in our relationship, which we are working on, but in general we're happy. One part of our relationship that doesn't work is sex - we don't have it, and haven't for a long time. I don't know if we ever will again. This is what led me to seek outside my relationship for intimacy. My friend and I are very close, he is in a similar situation, and we hook up regularly, both fully understanding that the friendship is the most important thing, the sex a bonus but it won't ever go any further than that relationship wise. It works for us.

 

I see sex as a part of my relationship with my H, not the whole relationship. If my husband didn't like yoga holidays I'd go with a friend, or didn't like indian food, I'd eat out with a friend. These are all parts of the relationship and if 1 part isn't a shared passion then you do it with other people. I don't see sex as any different. And yes, I know a lot of you will probably be incensed by my attitude to it, but this is how I feel.

 

I also know my H would be upset if he found out, and if he did I would not do him the disservice of lying. I would tell him the truth and hope that he would understand why, which I believe he would, and the choice of how our marriage went from then on would be his, as I understand I am the one who has complicated our relationship. I love my H dearly, I have no wish to hurt him, but without me cheating and having a sexual relationship outside my marriage, my marriage would have ended long ago as I want sex in my life.

 

The issues with your marriage is that there really doesn't appear to be clear communication. I'm almost positive if you told husband you would leave or start sleeping with someone else, that problem might have fixed itself. If not, then yes, you should have left. I feel for you, but at the same time, what you are doing is so wrong.

[TrustedthenBusted]

Cheaters aren't bad people. They are just selfish people. There's a difference.

[Clay]

Cheaters aren't bad people. They are just selfish people. There's a difference.

 

I am sorry I just do not see it that way. I know in my heart some people do learn and change and become good people but for me the word selfish just doesn't describe it.

 

I am glad to see there are middle of the road people to help keep me in check.

 

 

Clay

[astralla]

JBrent - You're right, our communication is not clear. We can talk, but do not seem to be coming at issues from the same place. My husband is quite old fashioned in his views, and very religious, and we struggle to see things from the same angle. Over the years I have begged him to go for counselling, either separately or together, and he flat out refuses, and that is when he acknowledges there are problems, other times he is in complete denial and doesn't believe there are any problems. And on the whole there aren't many issues, and we get along well.

 

Clay, I understand the cheating is completely on me - it was and is my choice, and I accept full responsibility for it. The thing is, I have no wish to leave my marriage or give an ultimatums. I love my husband, we are (mostly) good together, and by getting this 1 need met outside my marriage it eases an issue inside the marriage and puts less strain on our relationship. I know its all the wrong way round for most people, but it seems to work.