Cheaters are BROKEN?!

December 6, 2014

Don't get me wrong here. I have a fully clear conscience.. It hit me today that if my MW came and posted on this board about her story in our A, everyone would suggest she is broken, when she is not.

I'm sure her husband would disagree. She certainly isn't the woman he married.

You may think she's not broken, that's fine, but others who know about what you've said about your affair, your dynamic together, the 'taking breaks' from one another on and off throughout your affair, certainly has shown me that parts of your A are unhealthy and game playing. How many times have did you get fed up and almost walk away, saying this time it's really over! You've opened up here and there, saying stuff about her that at least to me, shows she has some issues and some poor coping skills.

December 6, 2014

I'm sure her husband would disagree. She certainly isn't the woman he married.

You may think she's not broken, that's fine, but others who know about what you've said about your affair, your dynamic together, the 'taking breaks' from one another on and off throughout your affair, certainly has shown me that parts of your A are unhealthy and game playing. How many times have did you get fed up and almost walk away, saying this time it's really over! You've opened up here and there, saying stuff about her that at least to me, shows she has some issues and some poor coping skills.

And he wasn't the same person she married. He cheated on her for 7 years.

I won't discount a bit of game playing on both sides, but that is the same nip and tuck of any relationship. Both sides are trying to establish their footing. nothing out if the ordinary

December 6, 2014

The same way that homosexual activities have been ostracized in these same teachings throughout history. Are gays broken? I would suggest that neither the cheater or the gay is broken. Instead I would say they are both following their natural path, which society at large has deemed unacceptable for conditioned reasons. Both still exist no matter how much brainwashing we have been introduced to during our lives. They existed from the beginning of time and they exist today.

Do you really believe that being gay is hurting others? Being gay is NOT a choice. Cheating IS a choice. This is so unbelievable, you comparing being gay and having an affair.

As time goes on, people are more accepting of gay people and I'm so proud to be in CANADA where it's legal for same sex couples to marry, to have babies, adopt babies and live life the way they want. It's honest and isn't hurting anybody.

As time goes on, people are still intolerant of affairs and that's never gonna change. Ever. Affairs are cruel and ON the expense of innocent people.

December 6, 2014

And he wasn't the same person she married. He cheated on her for 7 years.

I won't discount a bit of game playing on both sides, but that is the same nip and tuck of any relationship. Both sides are trying to establish their footing. nothing out if the ordinary

So he cheated on her for 7 years, she knows about it, you know about it, why doesn't she have the courage to come clean with him about her affair now?

Most in marriages don't play games like people do in an affair.

Nah, you need to go back and re-read some of your older posts as a reminder... I seem to recall some of the bad stuff she intentionally did to try you mess you up and hurt you.

December 6, 2014

Some spouses deserve to be cheated on

I cheated on my first H, for no good reason, which made me more determined to make my second marriage work. Shortly after we had our two boys, my H became totally selfish. I was given the job of mother, nurse, nanny cook, house cleaner, etc. My husband made a little more than I, I was given a house hold allowance, and he felt it was OK, for him to spend his money, he never saw it as the families money, on his golfing and fishing trips. Deep sea fishing. Fishing and hunting in Alaska, Montana, Canada, and even Mexico. He never once taught our boys how to fish or play sports. It was all about him. As a lover he totally sucked.

If ever there was a man who deserved to be cheated on it was him. Divorce was not an option, I explored it several times. The amount of CS he would have had to pay, would mean that I would have had to move them out of the house and neighborhood and school that they loved. So I stuck it out for over 20 years, they day they left home so did I. I wasted over 20 years of the best years of my life, with a selfish rotten lover.

Edited December 6, 2014 by NYWoman

December 6, 2014

So he cheated on her for 7 years, she knows about it, you know about it, why doesn't she have the courage to come clean with him about her affair now?

Most in marriages don't play games like people do in an affair.

Nah, you need to go back and re-read some of your older posts as a reminder... I seem to recall some of the bad stuff she intentionally did to try you mess you up and hurt you.

Water under the bridge.

December 6, 2014

Water under the bridge.

Until the next time.... Sorry couldn't help it.

December 6, 2014

Just curious. How does MW feel about your pedantry, er, intellectual discussions?

December 6, 2014

Sassy girl (post74#)

Wedding vows are just a promise.... and those promises get broken all the time... not just by infidelity, and not just by the cheating spouse... Just words.

As you look on promises as so meaningless I hope you don't ever make any - or if you do, make sure people know that you word is not worth more than a can of garbage.

December 6, 2014

Corico - post93#

I don't follow your logic.

Not all MPs promise sexual exclusivity.

That's fine if they both agree.

Some BSs simply assume over time that their spouse will forever be sexually exclusive because they have not previously taken advantage of the agreement they both made at the outset not to be bound by societal expectations such as sexual exclusivity, or gendered roles, or the pressure to procreate.

Why would they make this assumption if they both agreed on an "open" marriage?

And because they in their heads change the rules, without communicating their changed expectations, they get very upset when they discover that their spouse is still holding to the original agreements.

Why would they change the rules in their own heads over such a major issue?

December 6, 2014

NYWoman post106#

Some spouses deserve to be cheated on

No they don't. There is no excuse for cheating.

I cheated on my first H, for no good reason,

so you don't know why you did it? That doesn't bode well.

Divorce was not an option,

Divorce is always an option, it just wasn't one that suited you.

The amount of CS he would have had to pay, would mean that I would have had to move them out of the house and neighborhood and school that they loved. So I stuck it out for over 20 years, they day they left home so did I. I wasted over 20 years of the best years of my life, with a selfish rotten lover.

OK you were in a bad place and had, as I see it two choices and they were both $h!££y. But you still had a choice. You made a choice to stay in the marriage because you wanted to stay in that neighbourhood.

So you chose the neighbourhood and a lousy husband.

So how do you think that cheating would have helped you?

December 6, 2014

Sassy girl (post74#)

As you look on promises as so meaningless I hope you don't ever make any - or if you do, make sure people know that you word is not worth more than a can of garbage.

Yeah thanks for that piece of judgment right there. But I'll tell you something for nothing, before my word became garbage, my husbands became even less. He broke promises from day 1.....Day. Freaking. One... and with each broken promise came more promises which he would then go on to break... and on and on and on.

He made promises too. To me, my family and our children... He broke every. Single. One... bar the fidelity one... because in the end he could be bothered loving anyone... least of all me.

So spare me the lecture.

December 6, 2014

And he wasn't the same person she married. He cheated on her for 7 years.

I won't discount a bit of game playing on both sides, but that is the same nip and tuck of any relationship. Both sides are trying to establish their footing. nothing out if the ordinary

And she had a choice to divorce him or work to make the M healthy again... But instead she chose to seek revenge and cheat on him now. Nice tactic - not.

She took vows. And now that she's not honoring them she's made her marriage a farce as much as her H did.

Yes, she's broken. Because a healthy person talks about problems and discusses new actions that bring the possibility of changing what the issues are... But instead she decided to be mean to her husband, go behind his back and begin screwing another man. Is avoiding conflict and honesty always her way of dealing with things? Maybe... And maybe she does it to you too and is really good at it and you don't even know she's playing you for the fool too. She may be a skilled actress for you.

Don't think she's not broken. She is - you just haven't YET been on the receiving end of the damage she can cause.

My question to you - do you pay this gal money? It's a serious question.

December 6, 2014

Yeah thanks for that piece of judgment right there. But I'll tell you something for nothing, before my word became garbage, my husbands became even less. He broke promises from day 1.....Day. Freaking. One... and with each broken promise came more promises which he would then go on to break... and on and on and on.

He made promises too. To me, my family and our children... He broke every. Single. One... bar the fidelity one... because in the end he could be bothered loving anyone... least of all me.

And you stayed because.....??? I mean really, who held you at gunpoint and made you stay after the first broken promise if things were so bad?

December 6, 2014

I do think this is relevant to OPs post as it really is about rewriting history and cultural norms.

I mean, don't you find it the least bit ironic that you are denying things that you've clearly documented in your previous posts? It's documented that you were still seeing your AP even after your husband thought the affair was over. Is that not lying or crazy making behavior? I mean, you really yo-yo'd your husband for a really long period of time and the proof is a few clicks away.

You seem like a rational person and obviously different than OP, but there are certain truths that you can't deny. I simply do not understand how you could deny things that are so easily provable.

I do think we agree on a lot of stuff though. Yay for atheism and cats! Maybe we should just stick to discussing those things! I also applaud your effort at saving your marriage and rebuilding your husbands trust. Plus, I'm sure your posts have helped a lot people. It does seem like you've come a long way.

You are putting words into my mouth re my earlier post. I never said I did not lie or that what I did was not "crazy making". I said I have not tried to justify my affair and I stand by that.

As for cats and atheism. My cats remind me that they are gods every day, no other deities allowed in their opinion

December 6, 2014

Sassygirl - 113#

(just posted at the same time as LH)

before my word became garbage, my husbands became even less. He broke promises from day 1.....Day. Freaking. One... and with each broken promise came more promises which he would then go on to break... and on and on and on.

but you chose to stay with him didn't you?

Why drop down onto his level, surely you are worth more that that?

December 6, 2014

Wow, this has turned out to be such a great thread. I think it should be pinned at the top and labeled "Things every betrayed spouse should know." Rarely do you ever get a glimpse into the wayward's mind like this one. And not one wayward, but several. It's just awesome to actually see the thought process documented so well. The level of rationalization is just astounding! Everything from - they deserved it, I was rescuing them, this is how god made me, it's monogamy's fault, everyone does it, divorce isn't an option, it's a safety issue, it's natural, it's societal norms that are wrong, people change their mind about wedding vows, promises are just words, etc. etc.

I guess I knew about this sort of justifying as a result of cognitive dissonance, but this is the cheater's bible of excuses. The similarities blow my mind!

Great thread and...

Don't mind me, please, do continue!

December 6, 2014

And you stayed because.....??? I mean really, who held you at gunpoint and made you stay after the first broken promise if things were so bad?

As I said pages back... because THAT girl... the one who accepted that she was not worth better, that she deserved so little....THAT girl was broken... and by the time she realised it, she was a mother

December 6, 2014

My first post failed so will have to break it up

NYWoman: Good on you.

I totally agree, Divorce is not always an option

You were so smart to not move your children away from the environment they were used to. You will never know, but it might mean that you were able to save your sons lives.

December 6, 2014

Wow, this has turned out to be such a great thread. I think it should be pinned at the top and labeled "Things every betrayed spouse should know." Rarely do you ever get a glimpse into the wayward's mind like this one. And not one wayward, but several. It's just awesome to actually see the thought process documented so well. The level of rationalization is just astounding! Everything from - they deserved it, I was rescuing them, this is how god made me, it's monogamy's fault, everyone does it, divorce isn't an option, it's a safety issue, it's natural, it's societal norms that are wrong, people change their mind about wedding vows, promises are just words, etc. etc.

I guess I knew about this sort of justifying as a result of cognitive dissonance, but this is the cheater's bible of excuses. The similarities blow my mind!

Great thread and...
Don't mind me, please, do continue!

If you're going to quote, me at least get the context right.

My comment that vows are just promises and promises are just words was reflecting on the fact that MANY wedding vows are broken, often by both parties... not just the one about fidelity. My husband broke his vows easily and readily. He did not love and cherish me... to HIM those marriage vows were just words with no weight.

December 6, 2014

Unlike NYWoman, I was a SAHM, with a high school education. My alcoholic, emotional abuser husband of 15 years held all of the power, the money.

When I finally moved out, my daughter had just graduated from the 8th grade and my son the 5th grade, where they both made great grades and loved school. I had to move them into a two bedroom apartment in a lesser part of town.

I could not afford an attorney, so my husband held all of the cards. It took almost 6 months before he filed for D and I was allowed a pittance in child support. And even then it took another 6 months before I could get the state to force him to pay. In the mean time I was forced to work 2 and sometimes a third, weekend job to keep our heads above water. Which meant that I was leaving for work at 3 in the morning and not returning until after 5. In the mean time my children made new friends of the wrong kind. Read DRUGS. My manipulative daughter got my Ex to drop her out of high school and it was a month before I found out, by then it was too late. She never went back.

It has been over 6 years since I communicated with my druggie daughter. We haven't talked since the state took away, my granddaughter. She had just started the 7th grade, and only this summer after turning 18 and graduating from high school was she once again able to contact me. I can not tell you the torment I went thru not knowing where my grand daughter was, and missing her graduating from grade school and high school. After awhile I no longer knew what she looked like.

This New Years day will be the 15 year anniversary of my sons suicide.

Arieswoman: I repeat! Divorce is not always an option.

December 6, 2014

Wow, this has turned out to be such a great thread. I think it should be pinned at the top and labeled "Things every betrayed spouse should know." Rarely do you ever get a glimpse into the wayward's mind like this one. And not one wayward, but several. It's just awesome to actually see the thought process documented so well. The level of rationalization is just astounding! Everything from - they deserved it, I was rescuing them, this is how god made me, it's monogamy's fault, everyone does it, divorce isn't an option, it's a safety issue, it's natural, it's societal norms that are wrong, people change their mind about wedding vows, promises are just words, etc. etc.

I guess I knew about this sort of justifying as a result of cognitive dissonance, but this is the cheater's bible of excuses. The similarities blow my mind!

Great thread and...
Don't mind me, please, do continue!

Yet again you are generalising. The above is true for SOME WS but NOT all. I never used any of the above lines. I knew there was no justification for what I did even in the middle of it all. I knew it was me being selfish, weak, needing validation and yes broken. I never bad mouthed my husband or my marriage to the exOM. My H did not deserve what I did to him and even the exOM did not deserve what I did to him (to an extent).

December 6, 2014

Unlike NYWoman, I was a SAHM, with a high school education. My alcoholic, emotional abuser husband of 15 years held all of the power, the money.

When I finally moved out, my daughter had just graduated from the 8th grade and my son the 5th grade, where they both made great grades and loved school. I had to move them into a two bedroom apartment in a lesser part of town.

I could not afford an attorney, so my husband held all of the cards. It took almost 6 months before he filed for D and I was allowed a pittance in child support. And even then it took another 6 months before I could get the state to force him to pay. In the mean time I was forced to work 2 and sometimes a third, weekend job to keep our heads above water. Which meant that I was leaving for work at 3 in the morning and not returning until after 5. In the mean time my children made new friends of the wrong kind. Read DRUGS. My manipulative daughter got my Ex to drop her out of high school and it was a month before I found out, by then it was too late. She never went back.

It has been over 6 years since I communicated with my druggie daughter. We haven't talked since the state took away, my granddaughter. She had just started the 7th grade, and only this summer after turning 18 and graduating from high school was she once again able to contact me. I can not tell you the torment I went thru not knowing where my grand daughter was, and missing her graduating from grade school and high school. After awhile I no longer knew what she looked like.

This New Years day will be the 15 year anniversary of my sons suicide.

Arieswoman: I repeat! Divorce is not always an option.

First off, I'm really sorry to hear about the problems with your family. I can't imagine how hard that must be for you.

I think that point you are missing here is that if for whatever reason, divorce is not an option (financial, children, etc) cheating would equally be off the table as well. Cheating and causing a divorce would definitely hurt your financial situation and children more than an amicable divorce.

December 6, 2014

Yet again you are generalising. The above is true for SOME WS but NOT all. I never used any of the above lines. I knew there was no justification for what I did even in the middle of it all. I knew it was me being selfish, weak, needing validation and yes broken. I never bad mouthed my husband or my marriage to the exOM. My H did not deserve what I did to him and even the exOM did not deserve what I did to him (to an extent).

Anne, How's your cat?

December 6, 2014

Anne, How's your cat?

Good response

I have three and they're all good thank you

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