Question for the Men -- Why isn't he . . .?

[sm2281]

My ex husband and I seperated at which point he chose to stalk me and abuse me to get his way because i was being cheated, lied to, dealing with his addiction, and other normal relationship issues. I chose to leave that. he couldn't accept it. We agreed on joint custody before we seperated and took it to court. At which point the severe stalking and abuse began. I moved 7 times in the first 2 years of seperation, and now have a restraining order on him and my life together. I will have my daughter back. he took her without permission of the court and is keeping her to get at me, using the restraining order as an excuse to hurt me by keeping her away as well. The first custody and divorce just dismissed and i am fighting it from 2 states. That is all about that.

 

None of this has anything to do with the current boyfriend. I have had 3 years deal and heal from that. I have no room for abuse in my life.

 

I realize I am posting about a relationship issue here, it is the first real relationship I have been in since my divorce (I have been dating off and on since) and I don't want to mess it up for something stupid because I don't know the ropes (I was married for 10 years).

Edited December 11, 2014 by sm2281

[bachdude]

My ex husband and I seperated at which point he chose to stalk me and abuse me to get his way because i was being cheated, lied to, dealing with his addiction, and other normal relationship issues. I chose to leave that. he couldn't accept it. We agreed on joint custody before we seperated and took it to court. At which point the severe stalking and abuse began. I moved 7 times in the first 2 years of seperation, and now have a restraining order on him and my life together. I will have my daughter back. he took her without permission of the court and is keeping her to get at me, using the restraining order as an excuse to hurt me by keeping her away as well. The first custody and divorce just dismissed and i am fighting it from 2 states. That is all about that.

 

None of this has anything to do with the current boyfriend. I have had 3 years deal and heal from that. I have no room for abuse in my life.

 

I realize I am posting about a relationship issue here, it is the first real relationship I have been in since my divorce (I have been dating off and on since) and I don't want to mess it up for something stupid because I don't know the ropes (I was married for 10 years).

 

Wow, you've been through a lot, and are going through a lot. So sorry you have to go through this.

 

I am guessing your current boyfriend provides you with some real emotional support from what you have described in your posts?

 

And I am guessing that this emotional support and connection you have with him is what keeps you with him?

 

You seem confused but what does your gut say? Just forget what people on this forum have said and what anyone else has said, what does your gut tell you about him and the relationship?

[sm2281]

Wow, you've been through a lot, and are going through a lot. So sorry you have to go through this.

 

I am guessing your current boyfriend provides you with some real emotional support from what you have described in your posts?

 

And I am guessing that this emotional support and connection you have with him is what keeps you with him?

 

You seem confused but what does your gut say? Just forget what people on this forum have said and what anyone else has said, what does your gut tell you about him and the relationship?

 

Yes.

 

and to be honest, my guts say he is a good guy. I know his stories too.

 

I am asking so much about these things pertaining to my current because I want to know how things REALLY go IRL (in real love) because dating I get. Really, I don't get it because real realtionships take time to forge and love is built not bought.

 

I feel like he SHOULD be doing these things with and for me, but also struggles with how to be in a healthy relationship because they are few and far between!

 

And I think that the complaints I have are questions and not see all and end all. It's not the end of the world iif I have to ask and learn the ropes, and I have truly come to "fall in love" with this guy.

 

There are alot of GOOD things about him too, that seem to be dismissed by the women here. HE IS TRYING. that is what I keep saying. And nothing is ever going to be perfect. After 10 years of marriage I have learned all these thing. Love is built, it grows. It's not bought and spoiled (even though it can be lol) and I am asking these things, not because I am angry and looking for failure, I am asking because I am not sure how these things usually go.

 

Would I like for him to spoil me and take me out all the time? Heck yea.

Is it necessary? No. Do I appreciate it when he does? Yes. Has he tried to comply with requests? YES.

 

I am just a girl trying to figure it out. Im not out looking for perfection. Just a good healthy relationship.

(as far as that goes, not looking for a relationship because I am incapable of being alone for those who are going to assume that because of abuse) But, because I am ready and because when I got married, I knew i didnt want to spend the rest of my life alone. Just didn't work the first time. Ha.

 

Basically what I have been told here is to break up with a guy who basically treats me right but doesn't wine me and dine me properly. I don't think that is a good reason to break up, and what keeps bringing me back here to question. Maybe he doesn't know how? Maybe he is insecure about his pay so he is being dishonest? I am not all up in his financial business -not married. I don't need to micromanage his time or paycheck on that note either (like some people feel the need to) the roots of my problems are quite clear, and it's mainly because dating is new, and so is forging new healthy relationships all together, especially having moved 7 times once out of state, and losing alot of friends and family throughout my divorce. This is why I am here and not on the phone with beloved girlfriends and family.

 

And I know love takes work. It's not simple and clear cut as people want it to be. After 10 years of marriage I do know that much.

 

You are a good dude bachdude. Thank You for listening.

 

I just don't know how to do this anymore, it's been so dang long I have forgotten what it feels like to fall in love!

[TigerLilly78]

Your 1st post OP....

 

What did he mean by -- when we were talking about moving in -- "but my stuff is MY stuff."

 

 

Why do I have to pay for most of everything. Hospitality is one thing, but I am a single parent on a tight budget -- no help. He doesnt bring groceries when we cook and I pay most of the time when we get take out. He rarely offers.

 

I don't understand -- I feel like I am putting alot more in than he is. In all senses. Emotionally, Financially, Everything.

 

He never initates anything.

 

 

 

real realtionships take time to forge and love is built not bought.

 

 

 

There are alot of GOOD things about him too, that seem to be dismissed by the women here. HE IS TRYING. that is what I keep saying. And nothing is ever going to be perfect.

 

I am not sure how these things usually go.

 

 

Im not out looking for perfection. Just a good healthy relationship.

 

 

Basically what I have been told here is to break up with a guy who basically treats me right but doesn't wine me and dine me properly.

 

This is why I am here and not on the phone with beloved girlfriends and family.

 

 

Ok I haven't checked in on this thread in a while but the contrasts between your 1st post and the last are smacking me in the face. So I thought I would list the important parts don't you see something wrong here OP when comparing them? this is all in your own words...you pay for EVERYTHING even the grocery's he eats when he comes to you and your child's home thats not trying and thats not being a good man im sorry.

 

You put more in emotionality financially and pretty much every way thats not real love thats one sided selfish love..im sure you can see for yourself whats wrong here OP.. Women are telling you to leave him cause hes not contributing his half to make this relationship whole and yes finical is a big deal in today's world its not that hes not "spoiling" you thats not the issue I cant believe you have convinced yourself that when the real prob is hes not pulling his own weight.

 

You have a child to think about OP and at some point this is going to affect them no matter how hard to try not to let it..if not for yourself then for them please reconsider wither or not this is a truly healthy relashionship cause real love is when two people work together to create a stable home not when one carries the other 24/7 in some way...Ide bet your here and not on the phone because your RL GFs prob said the same thing so you came here partly looking to hear this relashionship is worth staying in when in reality its prob not.

 

The women on LS have no reason to tell you to leave him if it didn't seam like that would the best option for you and your child in the long run we just have no reason to we have no personal stake in your life we have our own after all...

 

But believe what you like and continue to carry this man until you cant anymore cause it will only get better if you move in together just imagine how fun it ill be when all the bills double or triple and him not adding a dime to cover what he uses or eats but again its your life good luck with it..

[sm2281]

Your 1st post OP....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ok I haven't checked in on this thread in a while but the contrasts between your 1st post and the last are smacking me in the face. So I thought I would list the important parts don't you see something wrong here OP when comparing them? this is all in your own words...you pay for EVERYTHING even the grocery's he eats when he comes to you and your child's home thats not trying and thats not being a good man im sorry.

 

You put more in emotionality financially and pretty much every way thats not real love thats one sided selfish love..im sure you can see for yourself whats wrong here OP.. Women are telling you to leave him cause hes not contributing his half to make this relationship whole and yes finical is a big deal in today's world its not that hes not "spoiling" you thats not the issue I cant believe you have convinced yourself that when the real prob is hes not pulling his own weight.

 

You have a child to think about OP and at some point this is going to affect them no matter how hard to try not to let it..if not for yourself then for them please reconsider wither or not this is a truly healthy relashionship cause real love is when two people work together to create a stable home not when one carries the other 24/7 in some way...Ide bet your here and not on the phone because your RL GFs prob said the same thing so you came here partly looking to hear this relashionship is worth staying in when in reality its prob not.

 

The women on LS have no reason to tell you to leave him if it didn't seam like that would the best option for you and your child in the long run we just have no reason to we have no personal stake in your life we have our own after all...

 

But believe what you like and continue to carry this man until you cant anymore cause it will only get better if you move in together just imagine how fun it ill be when all the bills double or triple and him not adding a dime to cover what he uses or eats but again its your life good luck with it..

 

I am in no way trying to "smack you in the face"

I think you have given great advice and I am thankful for that.

I really do appreciate that, from the bottom of my heart.

 

I don't think this is bad advice at all. I think it's great advice and I am not at all wanting to offend any of the women here. But my first instinct is never to just give up and walk away. That is not who I am.

 

I understand that the children are affected by these things, but my ability to provide for them is not. And, if it doesn't work out, they are going to have to learn that people in our lives come and go, and it is my job to help them learn to deal with that healthily.

 

 

And the last part:

I dated a guy before this for about 6 months total. He quit his job after 2 months and put himself in a place of homelessness and tried to move in with me. I let him stay but made it clear it was just until he was able to move on. I ended up kicking him out after a month. I know the kind of man who is just looking to sponge. I dont feel like the guy I am with is like that at all now. I don't think he is just trying to use me.

 

I honestly dont know what to think about all of this but I don't feel used. I don't feel obligated either. But just because I didn't call him right away and break up with him because he doesnt pay for dinner enough (because I have talked to him about this and he is putting in more effort to pay for things now) He even wanted to get my kid a tablet for xmas but I already had.

Doesnt mean I am trying to just delude myself and slap everyone in the face here.

 

All of the advice here is great, if he were truly using me. I am not so sure he is just using me.

 

But I think maybe this is a guy who has been through the ringer too and just has forgotten how to be nice because all of his relationships previous have been weird and bad too.

 

Maybe we just have to learn together. I know money is important it is the way of the world.

 

I am not at all defending men like the one I dated before who just run around trying to sponge off women when they are vulnerable. In that case I would take every word of break up advice here. But I really dont get that here. . . .I can see that he tries, but maybe just doesnt understand how, when, or why. He is not really the hopeless romantic type, and yea maybe he is a bit selfish but we all are in some ways.

[elaine567]

What did he mean by -- when we were talking about moving in -- "but my stuff is MY stuff."

 

Why doesn't he try to "woo" me like at the beginning of a normal relationship.

Why do I have to pay for most of everything. Hospitality is one thing, but I am a single parent on a tight budget -- no help. He doesnt bring groceries when we cook and I pay most of the time when we get take out. He rarely offers.

 

I don't understand -- I feel like I am putting alot more in than he is. In all senses. Emotionally, Financially, Everything.

He never initates anything. Unless it's something so completely out of reach that he knows is unattainable considering my situation. Hey, lets go party for the weekend with my friends. Hello I can't just up and leave my kid for the entire weekend with less than a days notice.

 

Why do I have to tell him exactly what I want to do and when to do it, and he just never asks me to do anything at all.v Eer. We have had 5 public dates in 6 months. 5. The rest have been at home, and I met his family for thanksgiving. I dont know what the deal is.

 

What do I do, and what am I doing wrong?

 

But my first instinct is never to just give up and walk away. That is not who I am.

I don't think he is just trying to use me.

 

I honestly dont know what to think about all of this but I don't feel used. I don't feel obligated either. But just because I didn't call him right away and break up with him because he doesnt pay for dinner enough (because I have talked to him about this and he is putting in more effort to pay for things now) He even wanted to get my kid a tablet for xmas but I already had.

Doesnt mean I am trying to just delude myself and slap everyone in the face here.

 

All of the advice here is great, if he were truly using me. I am not so sure he is just using me.

 

But I think maybe this is a guy who has been through the ringer too and just has forgotten how to be nice because all of his relationships previous have been weird and bad too.

 

Maybe we just have to learn together. I know money is important it is the way of the world.

 

I am not at all defending men like the one I dated before who just run around trying to sponge off women when they are vulnerable. In that case I would take every word of break up advice here. But I really dont get that here. . . .I can see that he tries, but maybe just doesnt understand how, when, or why. He is not really the hopeless romantic type, and yea maybe he is a bit selfish but we all are in some ways.

 

In 7 days you have reversed all the stuff you moaned about in day one. What has really changed?

[sm2281]

just trying to be objective and examine all angles.

 

wouldnt you do that for someone you cared about before just up and walking away. weigh the pros and the cons?

[bachdude]

Yes.

 

and to be honest, my guts say he is a good guy. I know his stories too.

 

I am asking so much about these things pertaining to my current because I want to know how things REALLY go IRL (in real love) because dating I get. Really, I don't get it because real realtionships take time to forge and love is built not bought.

 

I feel like he SHOULD be doing these things with and for me, but also struggles with how to be in a healthy relationship because they are few and far between!

 

And I think that the complaints I have are questions and not see all and end all. It's not the end of the world iif I have to ask and learn the ropes, and I have truly come to "fall in love" with this guy.

 

There are alot of GOOD things about him too, that seem to be dismissed by the women here. HE IS TRYING. that is what I keep saying. And nothing is ever going to be perfect. After 10 years of marriage I have learned all these thing. Love is built, it grows. It's not bought and spoiled (even though it can be lol) and I am asking these things, not because I am angry and looking for failure, I am asking because I am not sure how these things usually go.

 

Would I like for him to spoil me and take me out all the time? Heck yea.

Is it necessary? No. Do I appreciate it when he does? Yes. Has he tried to comply with requests? YES.

 

I am just a girl trying to figure it out. Im not out looking for perfection. Just a good healthy relationship.

(as far as that goes, not looking for a relationship because I am incapable of being alone for those who are going to assume that because of abuse) But, because I am ready and because when I got married, I knew i didnt want to spend the rest of my life alone. Just didn't work the first time. Ha.

 

Basically what I have been told here is to break up with a guy who basically treats me right but doesn't wine me and dine me properly. I don't think that is a good reason to break up, and what keeps bringing me back here to question. Maybe he doesn't know how? Maybe he is insecure about his pay so he is being dishonest? I am not all up in his financial business -not married. I don't need to micromanage his time or paycheck on that note either (like some people feel the need to) the roots of my problems are quite clear, and it's mainly because dating is new, and so is forging new healthy relationships all together, especially having moved 7 times once out of state, and losing alot of friends and family throughout my divorce. This is why I am here and not on the phone with beloved girlfriends and family.

 

And I know love takes work. It's not simple and clear cut as people want it to be. After 10 years of marriage I do know that much.

 

You are a good dude bachdude. Thank You for listening.

 

I just don't know how to do this anymore, it's been so dang long I have forgotten what it feels like to fall in love!

 

Thank you for the compliment!

 

I think I am getting an idea of the situation better now. So let me see if I am understanding correctly...

 

Because it has been so long for you, you are wondering how "real love goes". You "get" dating, but you are wondering how a loving, healthy relationship looks. And your gut tells you your BF is a good guy at heart, despite his imperfections, and is making efforts. And you feel that it would be hasty to up and leave him now. You seem to me to be giving him the benefit of the doubt and want to stick with it.

 

If I could give my two cents on what a healthy relationship looks like, I would say this.....

 

Consistency of showing love from both partners (not hot/cold/hot/cold). Genuine warmth, care and concern for each other, including empathy for each other. Honest and transparent communication (this includes healthy ways to handle conflict). Working to maintain closeness, intimacy and connection. And maintaining this connection is more important than being "right" or making a point. Respect, appreciation, and feeling of being accepted by the other person. Not being controlling or possessive but giving the other person room to breath and have space.

 

Those are some ideas, anyway. I definitely don't have the last word on that. Some of my relationships have been closer to this than others.

 

And I totally agree that relationships are never perfect and take time to develop. And if you feel you don't absolutely need the wining and dining, then I think that is your choice and nobody's business!

 

There was one thing that concerned me. You mentioned something about him being dishonest related to his money.

 

And one other comment, and I may be totally off base. I am just wondering if perhaps you are the type of person to give people the benefit of the doubt so much you turn a blind eye to significant faults, especially in romantic relationships? Do you think you have that tendency? I will admit, honestly, I've had this tendency...so I am not pointing fingers at all. And I'm not saying it is applying to your current situation necessarily. If you have had that tendency, it may be something to keep in mind. If my friends and family are all seeing the same thing, and warning me, I need to step back and take an honest look. It can be really tough to see objectively sometimes. So I also understand your struggle. Friends can be a great help here! So I only mention it because I have a bit of an inkling it may be true!

 

And I want to say I do admire you for what you have gone through, while maintaining a good head on your shoulders and not getting bitter, but still being willing to open up to someone. Those are all great qualities we all here can learn from, and I think the others would agree as well.

Edited December 11, 2014 by bachdude

[sm2281]

My weakness is that I am a very generous person in a very selfish world.

 

About the dishonesty with money - I am trying to decide if he is just cheap and not very romantic - or a home body so to speak. Or, if he is being dishonest because he is in a bad spot financially. some men are insecure about what they make and he feels as though he should be "further" in life. I don't care about his job, and sometimes wonder if he is exagerating what he makes to make him self look better. I have no idea really what he makes and how much he earns. I have an idea, but not a solid number. But that doesnt even matter as long as he can contribute his half - and he has been trying more since I talked with him.

 

Someone mentioned in a comment above that said if he would move in then it would allow him to save money, and not me. I hear that loud and clearly, but I have only been in a relationship with him for 8 months now -- I am not his financial consultant and while I would appreciate more in that area -- I am not out to control his pocket book -- if he moves in and pays his half I'll be happy. If not than he will have to go.

 

I do not turn a blind eye - but I do wait to make any assumptions until after I have put thought into them and dont make rash decisions until I talk to s/o and see if he tries.

 

And thank you (all of you) for the advice on how things should "look" because really that is what I need.

 

 

Again - thank you all for your responses. They are all TRULY appreciated. I am not trying to offend anyone or disregard any of this. The advice will stick with me while I make this decision. Thank You.

[TigerLilly78]

My weakness is that I am a very generous person in a very selfish world.

 

About the dishonesty with money - I am trying to decide if he is just cheap and not very romantic - or a home body so to speak. Or, if he is being dishonest because he is in a bad spot financially. some men are insecure about what they make and he feels as though he should be "further" in life. I don't care about his job, and sometimes wonder if he is exagerating what he makes to make him self look better. I have no idea really what he makes and how much he earns. I have an idea, but not a solid number. But that doesnt even matter as long as he can contribute his half - and he has been trying more since I talked with him.

 

Someone mentioned in a comment above that said if he would move in then it would allow him to save money, and not me. I hear that loud and clearly, but I have only been in a relationship with him for 8 months now -- I am not his financial consultant and while I would appreciate more in that area -- I am not out to control his pocket book -- if he moves in and pays his half I'll be happy. If not than he will have to go.

 

I do not turn a blind eye - but I do wait to make any assumptions until after I have put thought into them and dont make rash decisions until I talk to s/o and see if he tries.

 

And thank you (all of you) for the advice on how things should "look" because really that is what I need.

 

 

Again - thank you all for your responses. They are all TRULY appreciated. I am not trying to offend anyone or disregard any of this. The advice will stick with me while I make this decision. Thank You.

 

I ment the sharp contrasts from your opening post to the last one I had quoted was "smacking me in the face" I didn't mean you were LOL..no worries there OP..

 

Of course you don't want to have to play banker for this dude no women in their right mind dose. You spoke to him and hes been honestly trying? then thats a good sign. Ide wait and see if its genuine or just a show for the holidays I wouldn't move this guy in before hes really shown hes changed and is willing to pull his own weight..

 

He lied about his finiaces tho? thats a really bad sighn op there is no excuses for lieing in a relashionship to me anyways if he will lie about that he lie about other things it would be a deal breaker for me anyways..

[bachdude]

My weakness is that I am a very generous person in a very selfish world.

 

About the dishonesty with money - I am trying to decide if he is just cheap and not very romantic - or a home body so to speak. Or, if he is being dishonest because he is in a bad spot financially. some men are insecure about what they make and he feels as though he should be "further" in life. I don't care about his job, and sometimes wonder if he is exagerating what he makes to make him self look better. I have no idea really what he makes and how much he earns. I have an idea, but not a solid number. But that doesnt even matter as long as he can contribute his half - and he has been trying more since I talked with him.

 

Someone mentioned in a comment above that said if he would move in then it would allow him to save money, and not me. I hear that loud and clearly, but I have only been in a relationship with him for 8 months now -- I am not his financial consultant and while I would appreciate more in that area -- I am not out to control his pocket book -- if he moves in and pays his half I'll be happy. If not than he will have to go.

 

I do not turn a blind eye - but I do wait to make any assumptions until after I have put thought into them and dont make rash decisions until I talk to s/o and see if he tries.

 

And thank you (all of you) for the advice on how things should "look" because really that is what I need.

 

 

Again - thank you all for your responses. They are all TRULY appreciated. I am not trying to offend anyone or disregard any of this. The advice will stick with me while I make this decision. Thank You.

 

I can tell you are very generous! Because you can see by the comments of most of the women what they would have done by now! So you are more generous by giving him the benefit of the doubt and giving him points for trying. And I think this is a really good quality you have and it is a part of your personality, who you are. I think that would make a man feel quite secure with you and not afraid you will get spooked and dump him if things aren't perfect! A generous spirit is a great trait to have in relationships, I think.

 

As you mentioned, though, not everybody is that generous!

 

Be well!

[Rejected Rosebud]

You made him out to be a complete selfish useless loser, and now you are saying he's lovely??? If the stuff you said in your first post is the truth, your relationship is a sick one the sooner it's over the better and if what you posted is not true, why'd you post it then??

[sm2281]

You made him out to be a complete selfish useless loser, and now you are saying he's lovely??? If the stuff you said in your first post is the truth, your relationship is a sick one the sooner it's over the better and if what you posted is not true, why'd you post it then??

 

I just meant there are some positive things too, but all these things are true.

 

. . .

 

I still dunno what to do.

 

I am trying to decide carefully because I go no contact, and do not ever keep in touch with exes. There won't be a second chance if I break it off. . . so still trying to decide what to do.

 

Over christmas I dropped over $500 on him and his stuff (family gifts etc) and he probably barely spent $300 - and really its not even about the cost of things - its about the value. I got him a lot of really nice and thoughtful gifts and he got me socks and dish towels and crap like that.

 

I declined his invitation to christmas with his family, but still sent the gift I got for that (as I was instructed there would be a gift for me there)

 

I texted him how I felt and alot of the things mentioned here tonight because I was extremely disappointed - and he hasn't texted back yet.

 

we will see what he has to say.

[sm2281]

We'll he finally texted back.

 

After his Aunt texted me a thank you for the gift I sent.

 

I texted him back this:

 

Look, I don't want to talk to your Aunt, I sent the gift becuase they are nice people.

 

But I didn't want to go and have been avoiding telling you that your gifts were thoughtless and I didn't want to have to tell them I got socks after I spent over $400 on your christmas and got you a really nice watch among other really nice gifts. You are thoughtless and I am embarrassed.

 

Then I went on and explained how people spend time and money on people they care about and that I could see exactly what my worth is in his life, and yada yada.

 

And thanked him for the gifts, that they were nice but of course I was gonig to be disappointed - and i even asked him several times what he was going to do and how much to spend so it was equal and all that

 

And he never wrote back until he said he was asleep and then all he really had to say was that yea it was pretty ****ty and that he had no excuses.

 

That he chokes and pulls back when he feels like it's weird, that it's his "fault" because he is pulling back becuase I am getting creeped out.

 

Then I told him I am out, that I love and care about him but I don't deserve to give it my everything and then get very little in return (hence the take out, groceries over the weekend, and not to mention I have been keeping his dog too and paying for all that stuff too)

 

And then he said he don't want me to go - and I said what would you do?

 

 

So I guess we are breaking up

 

I like him alot.

 

He is really a good guy, outside of this cheapness and I can't deal with that.

[sm2281]

where it stands now is that I need strength to find the words to let him go. . .

[sm2281]

I didn't mean hard asses either - - I just meant that sometimes you weigh the pros and cons and that maybe some of the good things should be considered.

 

I am not a woman hater. I appreciate advice of other women. Always.

[sm2281]

Sorry if it came out like that . . .