Question for the Men -- Why isn't he . . .?

[tombadtom]

have both of you sit down and talk about this? what is his reaction?

maybe he is too male chauvinism.

[Maleficent]

OP, you should read the 5 love languages. Before jumping to conclusions about anything, maybe he shows his love in a way you've never noticed and he could be just as frustrated as you because he doesn't care much about gift giving.

[Gloria25]

Perhaps the "wooing" is gone cuz someone is getting the milk w/o having to buy the cow?

 

When someone is being "given" stuff w/o working for it, they don't respect it - much less appreciate it.

 

Some people see moving in/shacking-up as "progression" in a RL. I don't. I see it as roommates where usually one or both people have one foot outside the door. It doesn't have the protections as a marriage - so buy what you want together and try to go to the small claims courts to see if they care to find some law that requires everything to be "divided a certain way.

 

IMO, men are usually the winners here cuz more than likely the woman's gonna cook, clean, sex, for him and even pay half of his bills. There was a time that a man couldn't even ask a father for a date with a girl if he didn't have the means to provide and protect her. But, now things are different. Men just have to have a penis and a pulse and women will do everything else.

 

I worry about the kid(s) here, cuz looks like this RL might not make it and kids suffer when the break up happens. I mean, if you are suffering - imagine how the child feels? Children thrive better with stability (i.e. moving in with parents instead of some guy).

[sm2281]

malficient.

 

I have read the love languages.

 

The only other way anything is reciprocated is half assed attempts at offering to pay (for example, he says "I think we should order pizza tonight" we look online, and find what we want. He says nothing until I close my laptop and have already paid for it then says " Well do you want some cash?" after I've already paid for it.

 

There were plenty of opportunities for him to pay for things and never took any of them until it was already done. Even then it is rare that he even offers.

 

I have not received one gift or sweet nothing out of the blue from him in the entire 8 months we have been together. Except for my birthday when I got a bouquet of grocery store wilted flowers and rushed to a restaurant where he rushed me out before I had the chance to order dessert.

 

His love language is words. I can see that. He says sweet things all the time and made a big deal of it when I left a tiny note in his gum pack one day.

 

But either way -- being cheap and selfish is different than being freugal and saving. And, if I am a person who needs gifts then I am a person who needs gifts. I dont mind saying sweet things to ease his part of it, but I havent felt like hes been sweet to me at all. Action and Gifts for me. Words and affection for him. I guess it's not a good mix huh.

[Gloria25]

malficient.

 

I have read the love languages.

 

The only other way anything is reciprocated is half assed attempts at offering to pay (for example, he says "I think we should order pizza tonight" we look online, and find what we want. He says nothing until I close my laptop and have already paid for it then says " Well do you want some cash?" after I've already paid for it.

 

There were plenty of opportunities for him to pay for things and never took any of them until it was already done. Even then it is rare that he even offers.

 

I have not received one gift or sweet nothing out of the blue from him in the entire 8 months we have been together. Except for my birthday when I got a bouquet of grocery store wilted flowers and rushed to a restaurant where he rushed me out before I had the chance to order dessert.

 

His love language is words. I can see that. He says sweet things all the time and made a big deal of it when I left a tiny note in his gum pack one day.

 

But either way -- being cheap and selfish is different than being freugal and saving. And, if I am a person who needs gifts then I am a person who needs gifts. I dont mind saying sweet things to ease his part of it, but I havent felt like hes been sweet to me at all. Action and Gifts for me. Words and affection for him. I guess it's not a good mix huh.

 

I don't know, but I believe men speak stronger by actions rather than words. We women are different.

[bachdude]

Let me just add one more thing here....

 

If you have an inkling that he might be a freeloader type, be really careful! I've had an experience with that, which is why I had the blunt reaction that I did. I ignored the red flags!

 

From what you describe, you seem very generous and he seems like a taker. At the very least he seems like he needs to be a lot more appreciative (still a red flag!).

 

I am editing this to make it stronger!

 

From what you describe it really sounds like an experience I had with a freeloader. Just a huge sense of entitlement and lack of appreciation! BIG RED FLAGS!!

 

Be really careful!

Edited December 5, 2014 by bachdude

[sm2281]

Let me just add one more thing here....

 

If you have an inkling that he might be a freeloader type, be really careful! I've had an experience with that, which is why I had the blunt reaction that I did. I ignored the red flags!

 

From what you describe, you seem very generous and he seems like a taker. At the very least he seems like he needs to be a lot more appreciative (still a red flag!).

 

I am editing this to make it stronger!

 

From what you describe it really sounds like an experience I had with a freeloader. Just a huge sense of entitlement and lack of appreciation! BIG RED FLAGS!!

 

Be really careful!

 

 

 

 

 

PROCEEDING WITH CAUTION.

 

He did not go out to the club tonight for his birthday and he brought a christmas tree and a wreath for my apartment tonight. I expected him to go to the club tonight. . . . .he did not. 1 brownie point for that.

[bachdude]

PROCEEDING WITH CAUTION.

 

He did not go out to the club tonight for his birthday and he brought a christmas tree and a wreath for my apartment tonight. I expected him to go to the club tonight. . . . .he did not. 1 brownie point for that.

 

That was a nice gesture...and not to take away from what he did...but why was he initially planning to go to the club on his Birthday instead of planning to spend it with you????

 

A CLUB?? On his Birthday???? Without you??? Seriously???

 

But it is nice he had a change of heart but you are giving him credit for having a change of heart from doing something that, quite frankly, strikes me as pretty insensitive!!

 

Why didn't he want to spend his day with you in the first place, the woman who is standing beside him???

 

Excuse my bluntness!

[sm2281]

That was a nice gesture...and not to take away from what he did...but why was he initially planning to go to the club on his Birthday instead of planning to spend it with you????

 

A CLUB?? On his Birthday???? Without you??? Seriously???

 

But it is nice he had a change of heart but you are giving him credit for having a change of heart from doing something that, quite frankly, strikes me as pretty insensitive!!

 

Why didn't he want to spend his day with you in the first place, the woman who is standing beside him???

 

Excuse my bluntness!

 

 

I like you.

 

*I am yes thinking the same thing now.

 

His bday was today, but for whatever reason he spent 4 hours trying to decide what he was going to do, and told me all week long that he was going to do this or that and didnt even invite me.

 

let alone *as stated* gives me an impossible. Like just after putting my kid to bed -- i wish we could go do somehting right now -- with no notice for a sitter or anything. And I told him all that too -- i need notice for sitter.

 

We have been doing advent calanders for christmas. The deal is we are bringing gifts for each day at the end of the week. I gave him his gifts last week. The limit was 5$ - $10 a day or "reasonable"

 

I gave him so far a set of christmas cards for his family, a written history of his surname (as he doesnt know his dad well) a movie ticket set for him and his best bud (bro dates are needed sometimes when u get in a relationship), A novelty book about penises, a new vapor for his brithday, with accessories for his advent. . . .what have i gotten? A piece for my vape that didnt fit, 4 dollar store glasses, and a small pocket knife. No gift except the tree and wreath this weekend. Oh, a stylus for my kids tablet. Also, for got aaltoids, mechanic hand stuff, a book about online dating (gave it to him as the story of how we met)

 

appx 48 women wrote on his wall for his bday. I dont event have any christmas ornaments for the tree. there is a string of lights half strung out at the middle of the tree plugged into the wall. half the tree is lit. And a broquet -- that is roses or bacon, meat balls, beefjerkey, and candy bars.

 

he went out to dinner with hsi family, invited me to it. I declined. I am almost done.

 

Sad Sad.

 

Thank You for listening.

Edited December 8, 2014 by sm2281
keep thinking of more stuff i have given as gifts

[bachdude]

I like you.

 

*I am yes thinking the same thing now.

 

His bday was today, but for whatever reason he spent 4 hours trying to decide what he was going to do, and told me all week long that he was going to do this or that and didnt even invite me.

 

let alone *as stated* gives me an impossible. Like just after putting my kid to bed -- i wish we could go do somehting right now -- with no notice for a sitter or anything. And I told him all that too -- i need notice for sitter.

 

We have been doing advent calanders for christmas. The deal is we are bringing gifts for each day at the end of the week. I gave him his gifts last week. The limit was 5$ - $10 a day or "reasonable"

 

I gave him so far a set of christmas cards for his family, a written history of his surname (as he doesnt know his dad well) a movie ticket set for him and his best bud (bro dates are needed sometimes when u get in a relationship), A novelty book about penises, a new vapor for his brithday, with accessories for his advent. . . .what have i gotten? A piece for my vape that didnt fit, 4 dollar store glasses, and a small pocket knife. No gift except the tree and wreath this weekend. Oh, a stylus for my kids tablet. Also, for got aaltoids, mechanic hand stuff, a book about online dating (gave it to him as the story of how we met)

 

appx 48 women wrote on his wall for his bday. I dont event have any christmas ornaments for the tree. there is a string of lights half strung out at the middle of the tree plugged into the wall. half the tree is lit. And a broquet -- that is roses or bacon, meat balls, beefjerkey, and candy bars.

 

he went out to dinner with hsi family, invited me to it. I declined. I am almost done.

 

Sad Sad.

 

Thank You for listening.

 

It sounds like you put a lot of thought and effort into the relationship and he puts the minimum. Your gifts were very thoughtful.

 

I guess it really comes down to what you want. A guy who is passionate about you or someone who comes off as half-hearted. Someone who gives it their all or someone who just gives 50%, or even less!

 

Must be sad, because he probably has a lot of good qualities. Maybe you already mentioned it, but have you talked about it with him, how did he respond?

[MissBee]

What did he mean by -- when we were talking about moving in -- "but my stuff is MY stuff."

 

Why doesn't he try to "woo" me like at the beginning of a normal relationship.

 

Why do I have to pay for most of everything. Hospitality is one thing, but I am a single parent on a tight budget -- no help. He doesnt bring groceries when we cook and I pay most of the time when we get take out. He rarely offers.

 

I don't understand -- I feel like I am putting alot more in than he is. In all senses. Emotionally, Financially, Everything.

 

He never initates anything. Unless it's something so completely out of reach that he knows is unattainable considering my situation. Hey, lets go party for the weekend with my friends. Hello I can't just up and leave my kid for the entire weekend with less than a days notice.

 

Why do I have to tell him exactly what I want to do and when to do it, and he just never asks me to do anything at all. Ever. We have had 5 public dates in 6 months. 5. The rest have been at home, and I met his family for thanksgiving. I dont know what the deal is.

 

What do I do, and what am I doing wrong?

 

You made a thread about this same guy in August and my advice is the same...run, don't walk!

 

If you spend more time trying to figure him out and complaining than being genuinely happy, don't stay.

 

It seems nothing has changed since August...and I don't think investing more time will help. Usually people are their nicest, most giving and most wonderful in the beginning. This guy doesn't seem like he's EVER been that way so he's never going to transform, just get worse if anything.

 

I find that when women (and men) keep saying they don't know what the deal is...it's really that they DO KNOW but are hoping that magically it will be something else as it is very clear what the deal is. What more do you need to know? Do you need to know why he treats you this way? You don't need to know...you just need to know it's been like this since the beginning, he doesn't seem like he's going to stop, you don't like it, so you don't need to stay with him. If you feel you put in more effort than him in all ways and you're unhappy...WHY even consider moving in (wtf) ?? You have a child...you need to find someone who loves you and puts in effort and loves your child too and wants what you want. Not someone you KNOW puts in less effort and you're always confused about.

 

What are you hoping for? You seem to already know the truth. It seems you need to find the courage to let go of this lame situation instead of asking what the deal is...because that's pretty clear: the deal is this is a lame relationship in which this guy doesn't seem all that into you and you're not thrilled with it and feel it's obvious you put in more and he's inconsiderate about your time, finances, emotions etc. So come on...there is no mystery here. You need to walk.

[sm2281]

idk.

 

I dont want to break it off.

 

but I do deserve to be treated better than this.

 

This sucks.

 

I have talked with him about everything. I almost always talk to him before I come here.

 

 

I guess how do you even come up with the words?

I have no idea what to say. When. Or How.

[bachdude]

idk.

 

I dont want to break it off.

 

but I do deserve to be treated better than this.

 

This sucks.

 

I have talked with him about everything. I almost always talk to him before I come here.

 

 

I guess how do you even come up with the words?

I have no idea what to say. When. Or How.

 

He's not changing then. You've attempted to to talk with him and he doesn't make any more effort.

 

This means he either, he takes you for granted, doesn't care how his actions effect you, or just isn't that into you. Does any of this make you mad?

[sm2281]

not really

 

I am not an angry person.

 

I am adult enough to understand that just because I dated someone doesn't mean it's going to work out.

 

sometimes people are just different.

 

=i am weird.

[sm2281]

I suppose ill give an update later. *sigh

[bachdude]

I suppose ill give an update later. *sigh

 

Ok. Sounds difficult. There are a lot of opinions on this forum but I'm sure you will make the right decision.

 

I was also wondering, how is the connection between the two of you? I mean are you two very close? Or is the relationship more superficial?

[sm2281]

we are close . . .

 

we met online and talked for a month before meeting. We talk about everything, have the same life ideals etc for the most part.

 

Moving in is just in talks at this point. It's been a thought. Not a solid offer on the table.

[mortensorchid]

I have not read every comment written by others, but he sounds like a real jerk who isn't that interested in you. He only sees you when he's bored enough or has nothing better to do than hang around with you. This is who you want to be with? I hope not. I've walked away from guys who treated me badly and have been treated badly by men. Whatever the situation is, I'd get out of this. Loneliness can propel us to do things that we wouldn't otherwise do, I've been there as well, but in the long run you will feel better about yourself.

[sm2281]

Is it a possibility that he just doesn't at all know what he is doing because he's never had or been in a healthy relationship.

 

I can see that he tries when I ask, and just wonder why it isn't initiated by him?

[bachdude]

we are close . . .

 

we met online and talked for a month before meeting. We talk about everything, have the same life ideals etc for the most part.

 

Moving in is just in talks at this point. It's been a thought. Not a solid offer on the table.

 

That is good you two are close.

 

Why do you think, since the two of you are close, that he entertained the idea of being apart from you on his Birthday? And in the end he decided to spend it with parents, not alone with you. He couldn't spend it with you and meet his parents the next day or some other time? He is talking about living together with you after all!

 

I believe you, that you feel close to him. I'm really sorry to say this, but his actions really don't seem like a guy who sees you as a big priority in his life. Maybe he will get there, I don't know. But right now he just isn't there.

 

Those of us who have posted just don't want to see you get your life really entwined with a guy who isn't serious enough about you or mature enough to handle the kind of relationship you two are discussing.

[sm2281]

First, if I am coming off as defensive, I am sorry. I am not meaning to.

 

I am trying to justify my own reactions and figure this out - because I don't have all the answers. So to all of you - thank you. I appreciate the advice and posts. I think you all are awesome for being honest and it is nice to have an outside opinion. Thank You all.

 

 

Love is a funny thing, to me. IMO I think it grows as time goes by and things do change with the situation. I dont know what I am waiting for, but I know I won't wait forever. But until then, I can try to figure it out and grow, and learn from it, and maybe have some fun.

 

I take it all with a grain of salt. Him, everything said here, and things other people have said.

 

He did ultimately end up spending the day with me for his birthday and went out with family the next day, at which point I declined because I was exhausted with trying to figure this out.

 

For those who think I am mistreating my child because I am dating this guy - I am not, and how you can judge that by the fact that I am having issues with my boyfriend, is beyond me. My son is and always will be the first and foremost man in my life, and there is nothing that can change that. Yes, I am on a budget. Just because I said I have spent more than I want to on my boyfriend doesnt mean my sons needs are not getting taken care of. That is a massive amount of untrue assumption. hrmph. My son is always taken care of first. That will never be an issue, and I am not out looking to have any man support me or my son, and I am not looking for a baby daddy. I am looking for a companion for ME, not for him. My son. I take care of him. Everything else is extra. If this guy moves in, everything will come through me before ever making it back to him. I wouldnt allow it. My son has a daddy. He may be a **** pot, but he has one. And unless I get married and someone adopts my son, that is how it will stay. I support myself. I support my son. Everything else is extra.

[Rejected Rosebud]

For those who think I am mistreating my child because I am dating this guy - I am not, and how you can judge that by the fact that I am having issues with my boyfriend, is beyond me. My son is and always will be the first and foremost man in my life, and there is nothing that can change that. Yes, I am on a budget. Just because I said I have spent more than I want to on my boyfriend doesnt mean my sons needs are not getting taken care of. That is a massive amount of untrue assumption. hrmph. My son is always taken care of first.

Where were people saying that? Not on this thread right, because I don't see it anywhere?? But you did say you have a daughter, your only kid, and that your ex had custody of her, so I am super confused!!! Anyway, this guy - you have nothing but complaints about him and you don't have much positive to say besides "we are close" so I am not even understanding what your conflict is, why are you with him?

[Danda]

I have played therapist for so many female friends over the years, probably why I am often so quick to go into pseudo-therapist mode on forums like this one lol, but I really have learned some stuff over the years as a result of always be 'that' friend.

 

And on of those things is that as time goes by, the details matter less and less.

 

What will eventually emerge is that regardless of who did what and who said that and who is the bad guy in that situation and on and on forever, the bottom line is that if a relationship is making you confused, fretful, anxious, irritated, etc on a regular basis, if you feel like you're walking on eggshells, if you just can't figure the person out (the hot/cold phenomenon), etc..

 

Then it's not a good relationship. And you can waste a lot of time and emotional energy (among other things) analyzing it all to death, but ultimately how you feel is what matters. There doesn't always have to be an official bad guy, or a clear-cut list of pros and cons somehow weighed and measured like units, and you don't always have to be able to logically articulate your reasoning down to the last specific detail.

 

If you don't feel good, it's time to end it.

If you only feel good half the time, it's time to end it.

If you feel good most of the time but just have the occasional small bump in the road, then it's probably worth hanging onto.

[sm2281]

Where were people saying that? Not on this thread right, because I don't see it anywhere?? But you did say you have a daughter, your only kid, and that your ex had custody of her, so I am super confused!!! Anyway, this guy - you have nothing but complaints about him and you don't have much positive to say besides "we are close" so I am not even understanding what your conflict is, why are you with him?

i have 2 children, one living with me.

 

I have a legal battle going on with that, which he is going to lose.

I am not going to talk about that here.

 

this is not about my kids.

 

This is about me trying to learn the ropes and date healthily with purpose.

[bachdude]

i have 2 children, one living with me.

 

I have a legal battle going on with that, which he is going to lose.

I am not going to talk about that here.

 

this is not about my kids.

 

This is about me trying to learn the ropes and date healthily with purpose.

 

Why not get it all out? I feel you are holding back. Lay it out there what the real struggle is inside of you regarding this relationship.