Liquidated Ring

[beach]

To be honest I don't think it's reasonable to be expected to move forward until you have any and all info YOU FEEL YOU NEED from your wife.

 

How can you be expected to forgive when you don't know all of what happened?

 

If she's not giving you everything you ask for to determine if you want to stay in the M - then you have your answer.

 

She should be willing to do anything to save the M IF that's her intention. That means embarrassing herself by full disclosure.

 

If you need more info to gain her trust then she should be willing to provide you with what ever is needed.

 

 

For some - until they have all of the truth of what happened - they can't move past the pain.

 

Your therapist should not rush you along so much to the future that you don't have a full understand of what caused the pain of your past.

 

Sift through it - every last detail if need be.

 

Then and only then will it become easier to look to the future.

[dichotomy]

I kind of get were your coming from with the ring, but if she is doing everything you can - and wants to stay with you, she would view this as a big step in the wrong direction

 

but your still married or your not.

 

You wearing your ring?

 

My suggestion is this - get her something else for now - a simulated engagement ring, simple band, or something - something that says you still in the game - at some level with her - for now - while you work it out.

 

I dont know if everyone knows about this affair and your status - but the lack of ring on her finger will announce it.

Edited December 2, 2014 by dichotomy

[NateGrey]

How noble of you.

 

I saw that she is still living with him and has not been booted out, after everything she did to him. So, he does seem pretty noble. I also see that he did not rip the ring straight off her finger the second he found out she was cheating, so I again agree with you that he is noble and also has the restraint of a near godlike being in my book. It also seems like he allowed her to keep the money for a ring he paid for.

 

Just a little reminder. That isn't what her ring symbolized.

 

I am not sure what your vows were but they are usually something like this

 

GROOM, as you place the ring on BRIDE’s finger, please repeat after me:

I give you this ring to wear

As a symbol of my abiding love,

My eternal faith, and my undying devotion.

It is an outward reminder of our inner unity.

 

So the ring symbolized your love and fidelity.

 

But as you feel bothered by the ring I am glad she finally removed it. This wasn't an issue with us but I know if my husband asked me to take it off I would. I don't think it was good she never took it off when you asked her to and it took so long.

 

Have you thought of divorcing and seeing how that goes? It isn't like there is a law that says you can't get back together.

 

So instead of wearing a ring and looking at a ring that shows her love while she was with the OM, she was wearing a ring that is a symbol of how much her husband loves her..while screwing another man. It's..not much better, is it?

[NateGrey]

I kind of get were your coming from with the ring, but if she is doing everything you can - and wants to stay with you, she would view this as a big step in the wrong direction

 

but your still married or your not.

 

You wearing your ring?

 

My suggestion is this - get her something else for now - a simulated engagement ring, simple band, or something - something that says you still in the game - at some level with her - for now - while you work it out.

 

I dont know if everyone knows about this affair and your status - but the lack of ring on her finger will announce it.

 

He doesn't need to get her anything, she cheated, why does he need to give her a ring? Do they sell adultery rings? Tell her to take the money she got from selling the ring he paid for and buy herself a new piece of jewelry if she needs a ring that badly. Why is this woman so worried about fashion? She should be worried about the state of her marriage.

[beach]

"You are bigger than him"

"He has a small package"

"He was extremely needy"

"He was very feminine"

"He was expressionless when he finished"

 

Yep - every liar spits out these comparisons to attempt to make the betrayed one feel better.

 

 

In the end it's just more of their same lies!

 

IF it wasn't that good - it would not have continued.

 

So essentially they provide more evidence of their ability to lie even more.

 

 

So - we know she willingly lies. How much therapy has she done to stop being a liar?

[jm2013]

Yep - every liar spits out these comparisons to attempt to make the betrayed one feel better.

 

 

In the end it's just more of their same lies!

 

IF it wasn't that good - it would not have continued.

 

So essentially they provide more evidence of their ability to lie even more.

 

 

So - we know she willingly lies. How much therapy has she done to stop being a liar?

 

That's exactly how I feel! If she's continuing to lie what are we building? It just doesn't feel right. Sometimes I feel like she is just thankful to have one of us and not be empty handed. In a hypothetical situation this guy could have told her to get lost and he's not leaving his family for her. Then she would have been left with absolutely nothing. This COULD have happened too. She paints this in a very different picture. She claims he pursued her and wanted to be with her and he was going to divorce his wife yada yada yada. But is that true? IF this were the case I would indeed be her backup plan when A failed. She didn't want to be left with nothing because she's probably scared of being alone. She wouldn't be able to live the lifestyle she's oh so used to. Even when I was out of the house for a few months I was still sending money into her bank account lol.

[TrustedthenBusted]

I went through all this ring crap too. I told my WW that her ring holds no meaning for me, and for awhile after D-Day I didn't wear mine, just to fan the flames.

 

Eventually I put mine back on, and she noticed, and asked me why. She was hoping I'd say something nice and comforting about how I still value her and our union or whatever. But all I said was " Well, I figured I haven't broken the promises that this ring implies, so why should I have a problem wearing it. "

 

Not what she wanted to hear, but it felt good to say.

 

She never sold her ring, and still wears it all the time, but I leave it to her to find meaning in it. To me, it's an overpriced fishing lure.

[beach]

What? Why the heck did YOU move out?

 

What consequences has she really suffered? You know, REAL consequences that would make her scared?

[jm2013]

T&B, I don't think I'm ever going to put my ring back on. It's done. To be honest, I didn't really like that particular ring anyways. It was tungsten carbide and extremely heavy. It would always fall off my finger when it was cold.

 

Beach, I have thought about this over and over again. I moved out because I didn't want to see her or her mother's face anymore. I needed to find sanity and I wasn't going to find it there so I willingly left. Also, I didn't want to disrupt what my daughter was used to if she decided to pack her up and bring her to her parents. If I had a mulligan I would have done it all so different. I would have demanded she leave for awhile until I found clarity. I got a lawyer on retainer and sent her multiple letters in the mail that had his address, letter head and words of a pending divorce in hopes we could settle our differences with a dissolution. She never mentioned she received these and tore them up. Now that I'm thinking about it she's always been in my face about everything every step of the way. Even when I was out of the house she was trying to track me down and know my whereabouts and what I was doing.

 

During that time I would visit my daughter and she'd try to get me to stay the night a lot. Which a lot of the time I did. I'm not going to lie, I did not want to be at my mom's house lol. No thanks. I was just trying to find my bearings during that time. The only consequences she suffered were emotional. Money flow has always been there. Though I started skimming money out when I could. I guess it's not about the money to me. I'll always make more. I just wanted to make sure my daughter's lifestyle wasn't affected because of what happened. Even if we divorce I'll try my best to minimize the financial damage that might happen. I don't want to see that. I think I'd probably just end up getting a condo with virtually no maintenance.

[beach]

Start keeping your money separate now.

 

Maybe buy a condo now and have a place to gather your sanity. You do deserve some time to process your thoughts and gain clarity.

 

If she won't respect your privacy then that tells you a lot. Every person deserves time to think on their own.

 

Since she's the one who cheated, stop thinking your money is her money.

 

Heck, I'd take the $1300 ring money out of the account and tell her it's now yours only - as payback, or I'm sorry money that she owed you.

 

No consequences for her mean she really isn't sorry she did it but just sorry she got caught. Start giving her some consequences that hurt her.

 

Maybe it's time for her to figure out how to support herself with her own money? Let her find out what that feels like and how hard it is! If your daughter wants the same old lifestyle she can move with you.

[drifter777]

I've heard my wife try to minimize this all too much to the point it just sounds ridiculous. Here are a few exact quotes from her

 

"You are bigger than him"

"He has a small package"

"He was extremely needy"

"He was very feminine"

"He was expressionless when he finished"

"Sex wasn't good"

"He was cunning"

Even if every one of these statements is true it is a ridicules attempt to make you feel better about the sex she had with him. My wife has told me the same kind of crap and it's probably something most BH's get from WW. I think they do it because there is absolutely nothing they can do or say to mitigate what they did but they just HAVE to try.

 

I suppose it is lying, but do any of us really think she's ever going to tell us the truth about the details? I hate it, but I know my wife will take it all to her grave because she believes I will freak out and we will have to start digging in to all of this again. The WW is trying to protect her BH from even more pain but that's bullsh*t - she's protecting herself.

 

Of course your MC wants you to look to the future instead of the past. Its his job to smooth things over and "save" your marriage. And your wife? Every cheater wants their BS to just get over it and never talk about it again. Bottom line is trying to move ahead without resolving this will not work in the long run.

 

The thing is, in your case, this whole ring thing is really profound. The tremendous emotional symbolism this has for you makes your actions related to it psychologically significant. By rejecting the very idea of your WW wearing it you where rejecting her and your marriage but you didn't have to end the marriage to accomplish it. Its been a tremendously effective psychological tool for you up to this point, but now that it's gone you're going to have to cope some other way. And the fact that all of this has come to a head now might mean you are ready to acknowledge all of the feelings you have about her infidelity.

 

I know your children are your number one priority and the biggest reason you are trying to reconcile. Its time to revisit the concept of divorce and co-parenting. Without having to see your WW every day you will trigger much less often and probably heal much faster. Are you really a better dad living with their mother?

[Rainbowlove]

I mean I can't complain. She does a lot and most days I'm happy.

 

What happened to this thought?

 

I'm worried that if you even want to try real recovery, you don't stand much of a chance here with all the other betrayed spouses feeding their own hurts and experiences down your throat.

 

If you can't complain and feel happy most days, then go with that feeling. Take those happy days and walk with her in them. Share those happy days with her and your daughter.

 

If it's not too late. If it's too late, decide for yourself. Find your clarity and peace somewhere...not sure you'll get it here.

[jm2013]

I've got a couple new startups I've been working on. I think a lot of people would tell me I'm a complete idiot for holding out a divorce if it were to happen. Sometimes I feel that if we do end up in a divorce I will feel comfortable letting my wife enjoy the fruits of my labor to help her through this life. Raindbow, after a year on this forum I know it is only a forum. It doesn't really affect me as much as it did when I first came here. When I initially came here I felt as if people were trying to jam things down my throat but I tried to listen as much as I could through the fog I was experiencing at the time. I am enjoying my time. That's why I made posts about an emotional timeline or similar experiences of other BS's to see if there was some sort of turning point in a time window where things emotionally changed. I know everybody is different. Even for the people who reconciled it has to be tucked away and thought about here and there. It is a weird abnormal feeling. Perhaps people just deal with that and float through life. I also wonder what the divorce rates are when the kids leave the nest. Will the couple really start enjoying each other again? Will feelings of resentment re-surface years down the road?

 

Drifter, I understand. I have resigned myself to the fact I will never get the truth. That train has come and gone and I hope my story will help some other BS make wiser decisions. I'm sure if I had access to the stuff she covered up and had more physical evidence it would have ruined the chances of a R. There's nothing like seeing texts of how happy your spouse is with another person and professing their love to somebody else and knowing they were making love to each other and it was more than just sex.

 

Beach, if I still feel offbeat within another year I will do just that. I will make it as seamless as possible. I don't want to screw her over financially. I'm not here to play those games. I will make sure we both have places to go. She sure won't be able to afford the house without me there. We'll have to sell the house if that time comes. Houses are selling left and right in our development and we have about almost 30k in equity just in that house.

[beach]

So since you plan to give it another year:

 

Sit her down in front of the therapist and tell her you need all her info. That there's no way to forgive the affair when she has with held info that you need to know.

 

Then sit silently while the therapist convinces her to provide you with info you need to move forward

[jm2013]

So since you plan to give it another year:

 

Sit her down in front of the therapist and tell her you need all her info. That there's no way to forgive the affair when she has with held info that you need to know.

 

Then sit silently while the therapist convinces her to provide you with info you need to move forward

 

I've done this in a few sessions. She's pretty hard headed and sticks to her guns about things. It is kind of amusing when she tries to tell me details of things and then looks at me for my reaction. Like "He was holding my arms down" when they first had sex. She almost painted it in a way he was raping her. Which is obviously far from true. But this is how much she's gone out of her way to paint every detail like this guy was horrific, worst decision of her life yada yada yada. It all seems fake.

[beach]

Seems she has no reason to offer her truth. She's not scared of losing anything.

 

I can see why... You intend to keep her in a comfy lifestyle whether she makes effort to improve the marriage or not.

 

Why would she be motivated to help you? She's not because you haven't given any consequences that make her UNCOMFORTABLE.

 

People don't change while they are comfortable.

 

You're being her doormat and she doesn't need to do anything different because you don't intend to allow her any discomfort.

[Rainbowlove]

I know everybody is different. Even for the people who reconciled it has to be tucked away and thought about here and there. It is a weird abnormal feeling. Perhaps people just deal with that and float through life. I also wonder what the divorce rates are when the kids leave the nest. Will the couple really start enjoying each other again? Will feelings of resentment re-surface years down the road?

 

These are questions I ask myself daily. My only answer is to live each day in the moment. If I look too far ahead, it's scary. If I look back, it's scary. Instead, I stay focused on today. I live one day at a time now. I take each day as it comes.

 

I don't know what tomorrow will bring. No one knows. I do know today I'm in recovery with my spouse and I'm working at keeping our marriage and family intact.

 

I do know that I'm a better woman for having my spouse's forgiveness and I'll never jeopardize our life together again.

 

I wish you much peace in your heart.

[drifter777]

Seems she has no reason to offer her truth. She's not scared of losing anything.

 

I can see why... You intend to keep her in a comfy lifestyle whether she makes effort to improve the marriage or not.

 

Why would she be motivated to help you? She's not because you haven't given any consequences that make her UNCOMFORTABLE.

 

People don't change while they are comfortable.

 

You're being her doormat and she doesn't need to do anything different because you don't intend to allow her any discomfort.

This is a bit harsh. Its only been a year since d-day and he's still trying to make sense out of his world. I think things like the ring issue are causing her a measure of discomfort.

 

jm2013: I don't think there's anything you can do this side of water-boarding her to get her to give you the nitty gritty details. You seem to understand that and accept it as a crappy fact.

 

You should be in IC so you have someone who can help you work on your own recovery. It might be the most important thing to do whether you continue reconciliation or not. Also, I will never stop warning you about waiting to see "how you feel next year". Time goes by fast and you can get used to being unhappily married. An IC can really help you focus on progress rather than just floating in the same place.

[jm2013]

Seems she has no reason to offer her truth. She's not scared of losing anything.

 

I can see why... You intend to keep her in a comfy lifestyle whether she makes effort to improve the marriage or not.

 

Why would she be motivated to help you? She's not because you haven't given any consequences that make her UNCOMFORTABLE.

 

People don't change while they are comfortable.

 

You're being her doormat and she doesn't need to do anything different because you don't intend to allow her any discomfort.

 

Here's a list of the consequences apart from divorce she's received. I personally don't feel I was a doormat. I wasn't a betrayed spouse who chased her down, begged her to stay with me or come home. I told her we were done, thought we were done and just up and left without knowing where my life was going. I was completely shell shocked to say the least. I can't say she isn't doing anything different because she is. I just think she distorts and hides the truth. But can I really prove that? All I have to work with is her words right now.

 

I demanded the following

 

STD Test - This was done a few months after dday and came back clean

 

Counseling - She came with me to the first counselor and felt as if she was attacked. She came in almost prepared to go into battle. It sounded like she stuck with a canned script and she did.

 

Transparency - There was a point where she took the locks off her phone and tried to leave her stuff open for me. In the first couple months I caught her in a couple lies. There was some turning point that happened when she finally 100% decided to re-engage the marriage. I'm not sure to this day what happened to turn this around.

 

As more information came out and the fallout with her parents is when I left the house. During that time I tried to figure out what I was going to do. I just felt like a complete mess. During the time I was gone she tried to always be with me. I gave her ample time to be with him. To be honest, a lot of that was a test to give her an open environment for them to be together. Instead, it appeared she was playing PI on me and at one point thought I had another woman.

[Buckeye2]

Here's a list of the consequences apart from divorce she's received.

 

OP, were you ever able to confirm that the OM’s wife knows about the affair?

[jm2013]

OP, were you ever able to confirm that the OM’s wife knows about the affair?

 

Nah. I sent the FB message, paid the dollar but it never got read. I was going to do the letter but have been swamped with other stuff to think about it. I'm sure when I get all riled up again about it I'll revisit. I do still wonder though if she does really know.

[jackslife]

I had gastroenteritis a couple of weeks ago and I ended up with a 'liquidated ring'. I'm okay now though

[beach]

Looks like her "consequences" weren't really anything that caused her discomfort.

 

How about telling his wife to her face? How about exposing to all family?

 

How about telling at work if it was someone she worked with? Or quitting the job after getting honest with them about what she's done?

 

How about her moving out and you not giving her money?

 

And transparency? She didn't go along with your request... She doesn't respect you.

 

And counseling? That only helps if she's willing to get forthcoming by being honest. Being honest is uncomfortable and she should be willing to expose real details of her affair, not minimize it to try and make you feel better about his sexual performance or lack of.

 

Without her exposing her deepest feelings you have nothing to work with.

 

Maybe when you file for divorce she will get willing to give you info that helps to heal the marriage instead of covering her own butt and her OM.

[jm2013]

Looks like her "consequences" weren't really anything that caused her discomfort.

 

How about telling his wife to her face? How about exposing to all family?

 

How about telling at work if it was someone she worked with? Or quitting the job after getting honest with them about what she's done?

 

How about her moving out and you not giving her money?

 

And transparency? She didn't go along with your request... She doesn't respect you.

 

And counseling? That only helps if she's willing to get forthcoming by being honest. Being honest is uncomfortable and she should be willing to expose real details of her affair, not minimize it to try and make you feel better about his sexual performance or lack of.

 

Without her exposing her deepest feelings you have nothing to work with.

 

Maybe when you file for divorce she will get willing to give you info that helps to heal the marriage instead of covering her own butt and her OM.

 

Well, when I first found out I told her mom about it. Then her parents turned on me. I thought I had a good relationship with her parents but quickly found out how fast parents can turn on you to protect their kid. I think that was so much BS. In the end they gave my wife an ultimatum. It was either them or me. She surprisingly had chosen me and cut contact. I think I was pretty surprised she did this since she had a really close relationship with her parents. We rarely hear from them anymore. Haven't even seen her dad in over a year now.

 

She did leave her job as well. She was looking for a job before I found out which was kind of interesting. I am not really sure if it was to get away from him or some sort of alternative motive to that. Perhaps she wanted something that paid more money thinking a divorce may have been in her future. I don't see his wife. I would have had to drive all the way there one day. The only reason I did not drive to his house is I had thought that was the last thing I needed. I don't think I could have a civil conversation with him in person. I don't think I could see him. I don't want to go to jail or catch a charge. I also think they would have called the cops if I showed up. I was hoping to do this remotely.

 

Ironically I found out that my wife's cousin is friends with her AP's wife lol. I was thinking about exposing this crap ball to her and asking her if she knew about it. Maybe she can leak it out to her if she doesn't already know. The money thing was tricky. I'm attached to the mortgage as well. I also didn't want to see my daughter get affected by what happened. If I could go back I would have asked her to stay at her parents for clarity.

[Selfish]

Well, when I first found out I told her mom about it. Then her parents turned on me. I thought I had a good relationship with her parents but quickly found out how fast parents can turn on you to protect their kid. I think that was so much BS. In the end they gave my wife an ultimatum. It was either them or me. She surprisingly had chosen me and cut contact. I think I was pretty surprised she did this since she had a really close relationship with her parents. We rarely hear from them anymore. Haven't even seen her dad in over a year now.

 

She did leave her job as well. She was looking for a job before I found out which was kind of interesting. I am not really sure if it was to get away from him or some sort of alternative motive to that. Perhaps she wanted something that paid more money thinking a divorce may have been in her future. I don't see his wife. I would have had to drive all the way there one day. The only reason I did not drive to his house is I had thought that was the last thing I needed. I don't think I could have a civil conversation with him in person. I don't think I could see him. I don't want to go to jail or catch a charge. I also think they would have called the cops if I showed up. I was hoping to do this remotely.

 

Ironically I found out that my wife's cousin is friends with her AP's wife lol. I was thinking about exposing this crap ball to her and asking her if she knew about it. Maybe she can leak it out to her if she doesn't already know. The money thing was tricky. I'm attached to the mortgage as well. I also didn't want to see my daughter get affected by what happened. If I could go back I would have asked her to stay at her parents for clarity.

 

You talk about your wife holding back about her Affair and you obsess over that even though you have no proof she did. You don't understand the mind of a cheater so you project onto her what you think must be her motives and what must have happened and why she must be saying these things. But then you talk about what an amazing wife she is being in the now. How she has done x,y, and z right. cutting of her family, getting a new job, ect. You list more good things than bad about her and yet you still, after all this time question her every action and motive.

 

What if she has told you all? What if how an affair played out for her is different than how you view them? How can she be more honest if in fact she isn't hiding anything? How could she ever prove to you she isn't lying if she can't just say what you want to hear because that might be a lie? I told my spouse everything. EVERYTHING. And let me tell you there was a lot that sounded like me going lite and others that were pretty bad. And some just weird. Like that my AP never had an orgasm. Or that we were together, alone so often and yet only had sex three times.

 

Maybe there is more. But she cut off her family for you. A family you claim she was close to. That is huge. Really huge. She chose you. I would have had a hell of a time doing that and hope that if my family had been terrible like hers I would have. But I can only hope that because I don't know! That is really big for someone who close to their family.

 

Now here is the thing. Maybe this isn't something she can do or fix. Maybe, if she is all in and telling completely honest. Doing everything right for your marriage, this is about you. It takes two to reconcile. Maybe you are unable to forgive and reconcile. It might be time for you to take control of your own life. You gave it a shot but if you can't forgive and are constantly back and forth on this, maybe instead of looking for her to do something more, it is time for you to do something. Many, many, many people divorce. And have good lives afterwards. She cheated, you gave reconciliation a shot for your family, maybe it is time to try something else if it isn't working for you.