MM's mom divulged info and lectured me!

[Sad Flower]

Well I've never really told my story here on LS because it's too long and too much drama but I have a little something that came up and I can really use everyone's thoughts.....THOUGHTS ADVICE SOME HELP~ NOT A LECTURE and NOT EVERYONE ARGUEING AND TELLING ME WHAT AN AWFUL OW I AM...OK??!?!?!?

 

Well I have a baby from the MM I sometimes talk about, My baby is a few months old. MM went back to his wife so he was not there when baby was born MM has not seen him and MM has not bothered & I never bothered him to be there. Well months after our NC and the baby being born MM has recently showed interest in participating in my son's life. He is requesting a paternity test and when that is done he said he wants visitation and to work out a schedule.

 

I am just very leery of it all. I am scared and have alot of concerns. Concerns like how is his wife going to be with my son, how is he going to be with my son, will his wife's family be mean to my son etc...So I decided to call his mom because the guy is very hard to talk to, MM has communication issues. I felt comfortable calling her only because I know she is a very sweet lady and was always nice to me while we were dating (MM was separated during the time we dated). I just told her I want to feel comofrtable about the decison I am making.

 

I felt our conversation I felt a little more comofrtable about giving him a chance to know the baby we made together but listen to what his mom had to tell me @ the end of our conversation...

 

She said to me "just a word of advice, never get involved with a MM, it never works out in the end, she said tried to tell her son the grass isn't always greener on the otherside but he didn't listen, she said that she wanted me to know that if i decide to let her son see the baby to NOT get my hopes up about me and him getting back together, she said him and his wife are VERY HAPPY and VERY RELIGIOUS, she said she wasn't trying to be mean but wanted me to know the reality of it. She said I must understand her daughter in law's side, that I was the OW and the enemy to her, that I took her husband and that she was living life thinking her marriage was fine and then suddenly her son came home and dumped her for me. She said all that yet told me she really doesn't know what goes through her son's head and that he doesn't talk to her about things and she doesn't pry or ask him anything.

 

I am still not sure if I want him to know my son and WHY would his mom say all that to me, she made me feel like a home wrecker and like she was peeing around them to make sure I knew not to mess with that territory. I am not trying to get back with her son, yes I still care and love him I admit that but I am trying to move on and I know he is not coming back to me, my concern is my son now!

 

but WHY did she feel she needed to tell me that stuff, It made me livid and feel like ****???!!

[Teag]

She told you that b/c she wanted you to know the truth about how things are. Your MM probably told you things were SO bad blah blah blah when in fact he was the only one who thought so. Don't take offence but if you knew he was married & you still proceeded w/ the A, then you are a home wrecker. (sorry not TRYING to judge but thats how I feel) If I had a son and he was married & I found out he had an affair & had a baby w/ the OW then I would act in the same manner. If your not happy in you marriage & don't think things will work out leave THEN persue another relationship not before. I am COMPLETELY against affairs, I can understand if you didn't know this guy was married but other wise why do it. & yes I have been in the situation where a MM friend tried persue me & I refused b/c I had more respect for his wife than that & I barely knew her.(I knew him for years)

 

But if you don't trust his wife and family to accept your child then make sure his visitations are supervised but unless you have reason to believe that then I wouldn't worry about it. Hopefully his W won't take out his infidelity on the poor child who didn't ask to be put in that situation. Good Luck

[WithOrWithoutYou]

I don't know. It sounds to me a lot like MM's mom was probably the one who convinced him to "do the right and religious thing" and return to the W. I know nothing about the situaiton, but if you are genuinely trying to figure out why she said what she did, that is my opinion. And yes, I would agree with your assessment that she was "peeing" in a circle around MM and his W's reconciled relationship, "warning you off" not to try to wreck it (by trying to get back with MM). Just curious, do MM and the wife have kids? If they don't, and you know that MM's W wants them, you have the potential for serious, sick issues there.

 

All that said, whether you want him in your child's life is up to you (unless he wants to get a lawyer and force the issue). It sounds to me though, like you may be in for a lot of strife, but a father is an important part of a child's life (or should be), and I'm sure you will weigh everything and do what you think is right.

[lynnered]

" I felt comfortable calling her only because I know she is a very sweet lady and was always nice to me while we were dating (MM was separated during the time we dated). I just told her I want to feel comofrtable about the decison I am making. "

 

they were separted ?

 

 

"that I was the OW and the enemy to her, that I took her husband and that she was living life thinking her marriage was fine and then suddenly her son came home and dumped her for me."

 

 

i would tell his mother to mind her own business,

you do not need to understand how the wife feels ,why care? the child is your main concern .

do not give anyone the power to make you feel bad ,you are not ,

he obv cared enough to leave for a time ,

you do not need to leave the child alone with his wife if you do not feel comfortable,

stop thinking about what they think or feel, start doing what's best for you &your son.

goodluck

[midori]

A different perspective might be this: you are the mother of this woman's grandchild. She cares about her son, and she will probably care about her grandchild too. The situation is not an easy one, and I don't think you can avoid thinking about how your ex's wife is going to respond to all of this. Unfortunately you're also not going to be able to have complete control over how things go, either. If your ex pursues his legal rights as the child's father, chances are very slim that you'd be able to prevent your child from being in their home, and interacting with his wife. I think your child's grandmother was perhaps thinking ahead, and trying to prepare you. Perhaps her approach left something to be desired, but on the other hand there's not really an entry in Miss Manner's Guide to Etiquette for dealing with a situation like yours. Rather than try to read into her motives, why not ignore the unhelpful moralizing but don't overlook the good points she raises:

 

1. Her grandchild, your son, is going to have two separate homes, two sets of parents.

2. Related to #1, the more difficult your relationship with your ex and his wife is, the more difficult things will be for your son.

 

Seems to me like you're right to be concerned about how your ex's wife will respond to your son. You can't entirely control that, of course, but you can do some things to lessen the tension. I suspect your ex's mother was trying to point out that things will be infinitely more difficult if you harbor hopes of getting back together with your ex. She's right about that, of course -- they'll be more difficult for everyone, including you, and especially for your son as he gets older. You and your ex's wife will probably never be friends, but if you're active enemies your son will be the one to suffer the consequences.

[Sad Flower]

Yes LYNNERED they were separated, the mom only made that comment about him dumping her for me. it wasn't true he had already separated from her. I only called to see if the mom had something to say that would make me feel better about going ahead with the pat test and she did help a little but I just questioned why she felt she had to tell me those things. Yes MM has a child with his wife and the mom mentioned that his son was suffering through the affair and that she hated to see that! Which is understandable, I never stopped him from going back but I did chose to keep the baby we made together, it was very hard for me to chose to abort the baby.

[kkat]

First of all, you aren't a home wrecker. Their home is, apparently, not wrecked, maybe messed up a bit, but if they were separated before you were even in the picture, I'd say that chaos wasn't caused by you, was it? I'm sure his relationship with you didn't go over well with the wife, but that's not your thing, is it?

 

Now - questions:

 

Do you want this man to be in your child's life, assuming and recognizing it's not going to be as your husband or s.o.?

 

If yes, under what parameters?

 

If no, can you stop it? Do you know to what extent he is willing to pursue involvement?

 

Do you know what his motivation is for the pat test? Does he believe your child is his?

 

Would it be beneficial for you to get child support from him and if so, is that a possibility?

 

Have you contacted an attorney or any local legal aid group that might advise you?

[Pocky]

Mothers will always protect their children. She probably felt it was her duty to her son to tell you these things. It's possible that she had multiple reasons for telling you, which some have already mentioned. Unfortunately, the role of the OW is almost always frowned upon, even if the two people were separated at the time. I wouldn't let what she said get to you too much - every person is biased with these type of situations. It just depends which side of the relationship they're on.

 

As far as your son, I don't think you will be able to stop him from having a relationship with the father if he takes legal action. Personally, I'd try to be non-confrontational with them. Not because you were wrong or because you have to cater to their needs, but so as not to antagonize them. If they get angry or irritated they may play hardball and family cases like this can get so ugly. At this point, it's not about who was right or wrong or who is at fault for the affair, but how to provide the best for your son.

 

Hopefully, his side of the family can come to terms as well and not turn this into a crucification.

[Sad Flower]

She probably felt it was her duty to her son to tell you these things

 

Pocky I think your right, because at the end of the conversation she also said something like...... "you have to remember (MM's name) is my son so ya know" I felt like saying......"Ya know what" !?!? I didn't comment back though, I just left it as it was. I guess she was again warning me to not over step any boundary

 

Unfortunately, the role of the OW is almost always frowned upon

 

Yes OW are frowned upon and it sucks. His mom made a promise to me that if the baby went with their family I had nothing to worry about, that they would love him and take care of him. From what it sounds like is MM's wife is trying hard to put the A past them and is willing to take care of my son in order to keep her husband but I'm just so scared. His mom said that she seen a picture of the baby and that MM didn't show it to her that her daughter in law did I was shocked to hear that. I just fear because during the A I learned that the wife was very manipulative and coniving, I learned that because I had a phone conversation with the wife and about an hr after the conversation MM called me yelling saying that the wife called crying saying that i called saying mean things like..LEAVE US ALONE I never said that...now I am suppose to send my son off to that woman.

[Sad Flower]

Do you want this man to be in your child's life, assuming and recognizing it's not going to be as your husband or s.o.?

 

If yes, under what parameters?

 

If no, can you stop it? Do you know to what extent he is willing to pursue involvement?

 

Do you know what his motivation is for the pat test? Does he believe your child is his?

 

Would it be beneficial for you to get child support from him and if so, is that a possibility?

 

Have you contacted an attorney or any local legal aid group that might advise you?

 

I am ok with my son knowing him, I am a little bugged that he is barely bothering but I am willing to set those gripes aside so that we can make things smooth for my son's sake. I have not contacted an attorney, if we can work things out on our own it will be fine, i guess I'm not seeking child support but he better help if he is going to be seeing his son and better expect me to want him to help. I asked why he is getting a pat test and he just said he needs to know, so exactly where that all stems from, i don't know but I think he knows deep down that this is his son I kinda feel it's a front to his wife, like maybe he said bad things about me, because he does play the victim role, like he was scorned by the OW

[WithOrWithoutYou]

You should contact an attorney. Also keep in mind, that the father has a stable, sterotypical, "good family home", and you are a single (working?) mom. If the paternity test proves he is the biological father (and I'm sure you already know he is), and he wants to press, he could petition for custody, and the courts will do whatever they deem to be "in the best interests of the child". If you are not careful, you could end up losing custody of your son, if you acknowledge he is the father, and prove it with a paternity test. I didn't like the sound of what you said about the MM's mom saying "if the baby goes with our family"... Maybe that isn't how it sounded, and maybe that isn't how she meant it, but still - something for you to think about.

 

Also, you should find out what your rights are regarding child support. If he wants to be a part of his son's life, he should be a part of supporting his son as well.

 

Go talk to that lawyer now. Good luck.

[midori]

Originally posted by Sad Flower

now I am suppose to send my son off to that woman.

 

The thing is, you might very well end up with no choice in this. Once paternity is established, your ex will have both responsibilities and rights regarding your son. If you and your ex's wife have a hateful relationship, things will be so much more difficult for you -- you'll always be worrying (rightly or wrongly) that she's out to get you (and your son), and she'll have more motive to cause trouble.

 

Obviously if she's determined to have her revenge and she pursues it in subtle ways, you aren't going to be able to completely counteract that. But you can affect the situation by not contributing to the hostility. If your ex's wife does cause trouble, you'll have to cross that bridge when you get to it.

 

I know that this is difficult for you and this surely isn't what you'd imagined for yourself. But if you focus on what's going to be best for your son, rather than on how you feel about your ex and his family, and what happened between you and him, I'll bet in the long run you'll be happier and more comfortable in the situation. If you decide in advance that there will be problems with his wife, you almost certainly will have problems with his wife -- and the people who will probably suffer the most as a result of those problems will be you and your son. I can imagine that in this situation you might feel the need for some validation and support, and of course you need that. But you can't look to your ex's family to provide that for you. What you should expect from them, and seek, is support for your son -- they need to demonstrate that they have his best interests at heart. They need to care about him and be ready to do their part in meeting his needs.

 

Look at it this way: if you didn't have your son, you and your ex would have no ties at all now. Your son is the only reason you're still connected to your ex. So deal with your ex, and his family, on that basis alone. Your ex's wife is going to have to let go of the past. But so are you. It sounds like that's what his mother was trying to tell you.

 

Good luck!

[goldy]

i dont think you should take what she said as a personal attack. mothers tend to take their childrens spouses on as another child. she will have loyalty to her daughter in law and probably felt for her pain when her son left her. it doesnt sound as though she was blaming you for this but i agree it does sound as though she is worried. this could be either one of two things: she may just not trust her son to do the right thing which she thinks is to be loyal to his marriage, or she may have sympathy for you and genuinely not want you to make any decisions based on hopes for you and mm for your own sake, which actually is quite good advice. in my experience older women are generally pretty wise and sharp, having lived through enough heartache of their own. on the other hand some mothers constantly try to right their childrens mistakes and if she is religious too, then who knows.

my advice is this, do get rid of any hopes for you and mm IF you have any.

people say that children need a father children need this children need that, well i happen to disagree. i know that what children need more than anything in the world is for the parent they live with to be happy. in the case where the child already knows the father, it is quite different, but if you are talking about a baby then do whatever you have to do to make sure that you are not in any circumstances that make you feel powerless or unhappy. that is number one, not feeling bad about yourself because the man you fell in love with, chose to go back to his wife, not thinking of yourself as a homewrecker, you are not, even if his home was wrecked you still never set out to wreck anybodys home. he came to you, you did not break into his home and steal him in the middle of the night. you were in love and had his child, that is no crime. he chose not to be with you and while i dont think that means he has no rights to see his child i think the most important thing is that for the love of his child he respects you as the main carer and does nothing that is going to make you unhappy.

you do not need to compromise. the law pretty much sucks on these things, but you dont need to let the child go anywhere that you are nott 100% about the people it will be around. i think that is your right as a loving mother. any law that states otherwise should be fought against. there is no reason that he cannot come and see the child under your supervision but even then that can lead if he so desires in a court case later down the road where he will have unsupervised access and will take the child to the marital home.

you need to get a good and sympathetic lawyer, preferably a woman and mother who has no history of being a BS and see what your rights are to have all you concerns taken seriously and not make any decision before that. do not just accept anything the court rules if you are unhappy with it. you are the mother and your happiness and trust and confidence that your baby is in safe hands is paramount.

[midori]

Originally posted by goldy

 

you do not need to compromise. the law pretty much sucks on these things, but you dont need to let the child go anywhere that you are nott 100% about the people it will be around. i think that is your right as a loving mother. any law that states otherwise should be fought against. there is no reason that he cannot come and see the child under your supervision but even then that can lead if he so desires in a court case later down the road where he will have unsupervised access and will take the child to the marital home.

 

you need to get a good and sympathetic lawyer, preferably a woman and mother who has no history of being a BS and see what your rights are to have all you concerns taken seriously and not make any decision before that. do not just accept anything the court rules if you are unhappy with it. you are the mother and your happiness and trust and confidence that your baby is in safe hands is paramount.

 

This situation has caught my attention because I have friends, men and women, embroiled in custody disputes. I think it's important to support SadFlower, but I think it's quite unrealistic to suggest to her that she will be able to determine if and how the father of her son will be able to interact with the child. If he has no history of mental instability or behavior that would render him unsuited to have unsupervised visitation, or even joint custody, then he has parental rights that can't be disregarded just because SadFlower feels hurt and betrayed by him. In all likelihood the choice will not be hers to make.

 

SadFlower, I agree with the folks who have suggested getting a good lawyer. One person I know who's fighting for joint custody of his son (while going through a divorce from the mother) has tried to hold off going to court, to avoid legal expenses. He & his wife have no assets to speak of, so the only need for lawyers is to determine custody of their son; the divorce would have been quick & relatively painless otherwise. And even though they're negotiating among themselves to settle custody, a lawyer is absolutely essential. Your ex may very well have consulted a lawyer about this already -- he's not obliged to tell you if he has. Asking for a paternity test may have been the advice of a lawyer.

 

To seek full custody of your son but not ask for child support is kind of nuts, don't you think? You're making things much more difficult for yourself trying to shoulder the expenses all on your own (you say you expect your ex to pitch in but w/o a formal settlement, how would you be able to rely on this?) And if you're worried about how his wife will influence him, an informal agreement would give her a lot more room to maneuver. If he's looking to villify you, you don't want to leave these things to an informal agreement.

 

I realize you're in a painful place right now, because a relationship you believed in has disintegrated. But as I said before, if you didn't have a child with your ex right now, you wouldn't be interacting with him at all. As much as you might want to make him aware of, or even pay the price for, your hurt about how things worked out, you'll just be shooting yourself in the foot by not getting real about settling things so that there's a positive, or at least neutral, relationship between the two sets of parents, and so that if you have full custody, your son's father will be legally obliged to contribute financially to the cost of raising him.

[Mr Spock]

Watch out. They may even try to steal your baby rather than pay child support to you. It'd be ultimate revenge on you (for her). Shudder.

 

 

Tread like they're the enemy that you have to have over for dinner but can't get away with poisoning.

 

 

Get a lawyer.

[Teag]

They were seperated?! Ok I didn't get that part so I apologize for the comments I made before. Do you want this man in you childs life? If he actually wants to be in this childs life I would let him. A child does need a father BUT if you don't think his family would "abuse" him or recent him/her I would do everything to protect him against that. If I was in that situation & I would treat the child w/ love b/c like I said before he didn't ask to be put in that situation. I would resent the mother however even if we were seperated but I'm sure you understand that. Well I hope things work out for you.

[goldy]

what i meant by that midori is that she should appeal against any decision made by the courts that she doesnt like. i too have friends and the courts have awarded the fathers with parental rights, the mothers in these cases, my friends took it as set in stone and did not appeal when they should have done. you dont have to agree in court, and my friends wished they hadnt.

[goldy]

......oh and this is only if HE takes it to court. just get a good lawyer and all the legal advice you can and be ready for anything he throws at you.

[Breathe]

I think you are making a selfish decision on the "unknown" out of fear, anger and resentment. You don't know that anyone would hurt that child. You just don't want him to be with the child or anyone he loves to be with that child - because thats the only "power" you have left to hurt him with.

 

Put yourself in you son's shoes. How would you feel if your dad fought to see you and your mom never allowed it. Your mom kept you from having any type of relationship with him, and not just him - but his other children - your half siblings?

 

Put yourself in MM's shoes. How would you feel if you had a child you were denied to have a relationship with?

 

Just because you are the mother, you don't have the right to decide how things will go down. As a father, like it or not, he does have rights and the LAW will decide how much visitation he will get. I understand the pain and worrying that comes with wanting to protect your child. However, I feel that your reason behind it all is selfish. Honestly, if MM never went back to his wife and stayed with you, he would be a part of that child's life. Funny how now that he chose to not be with you, you are choosing for him not to see your son. It sounds more like a revenge tactic at the use of a child.

[goldy]

i dont think so breathe

[midori]

Originally posted by goldy

what i meant by that midori is that she should appeal against any decision made by the courts that she doesnt like. i too have friends and the courts have awarded the fathers with parental rights, the mothers in these cases, my friends took it as set in stone and did not appeal when they should have done. you dont have to agree in court, and my friends wished they hadnt.

 

While it's true that you can appeal court decisions, and shouldn't hesitate to do so if you think the judge didn't fully consider the facts, or was biased for some reason, it still sounds like you're suggesting to SadFlower that things should turn out the way that she wants them to, and if it doesn't happen the first time she can just keep insisting until it does. I think that's misleading to say the least.

 

SadFlower, I think Mr.Spock's advice is probably the best you're going to get: as distasteful and hurtful as it is to you personally, you are going to have to deal with these people.

[goldy]

i'm sorry sad flower if thats how it sounds. i didnt really mean it that way entirely but alot of people feel powerless in court. i was just trying to ensure that you didn't make the mistakes that my friends made.

then again midori is correct that it is out of your hands to a large extent and i didnt mean it to soundas though you get to make the rules yourself, just make sure YOU know your legal facts first, is what i was trying to say. so that YOU know what your rights are because sometimes you have more rights than you realise when in the courtroom, ok. JUST KNOW ALL YOUR LEGAL STUFF. MAKE IT YOUR BUSINESS TO STUDY IT YOURSELF.

the thing to do is to make sure you are fully informed of all possible decisions and to realise that if you accept supervised access it will likely lead to unsupervised access at some point.

it all depends on what this man is actually like, how well do you know him etc, does he have other children?

if he is to have visitation rights then it is only fair that you get to meet his wife first.

[Breathe]

You CAN NOT get "supervised" visits unless you have proof that the child has been harmed or will be harmed if left alone with the father.

[StillHurtin]

When my H and I were going through our D (we are back together) he was having an A w/ a co-worker. Even though he had filed for a D he made it clear to the OW he was having doubts about wanting the D, he thought he moved too fast (the OW told me this during a phone conversation w/ her). Anyhow, this was one of my greatest fears, her being around my children. I told my lawyer that I did not want my children being around the OW b/c I was scared for them. When the OW was pg w/ her H's baby she found out he was cheating on her (b4 they got married) and tried committing suicide in front of him. She jumped through his LR window (he wouldn't answer the door) and proceeded to cut herself across the wrist. She was also drunk. If he wouldn't of called the ambulance she would of died (heard this story not only from my own H from hers as well). I thought if she could do this being pg w/ her own child what would she do w/ mine? Anyhow, my lawyer told me that he can't stop my H from having my children around the OW but he could make it possible that they would not be allowed to spend the night w/ him at the OW's house. But, he said if I pushed for this I wasn't allowed to have any man I was seeing spend the night while my children were present. I told my lawyer I didn't care, I didn't want them around her. And thankfully they never where b/c when they did go spend the weekend w/ him (my kids and I moved away) they spent it w/ his parent's, he never took them to the OW's and she was never w/ them either.

 

TG my H didn't get the OW pg. I honestly don't think I would of taken him back if he had a child w/ her b/c she would always be part of my H's life. I am sure the OW is thankful she didn't get pg either, b/c I am sure she wouldn't of wanted to share a child w/ H after he left her to come back to me.

I am sorry you are going through all this right now. I agree that you need to get a good lawyer. Get the child support that is rightly for yours and your ds. I don't know what the lawyer can do about the mm and his W having supervised visits. I think the only way that can happen if it's there is proof they are not fit to have visitations unsupervised. I hope you get this all worked out.

[Sad Flower]

I s/w MM I decided to do the paternity test but I have that awful bad gut feeling because I am just scared!!! I will have to definately seek an attorney and I pray that I don't run into problems with his wife and him. They have a son together and I asked him to take care of my son the way he would take care of his other son....

 

You know what he told me..he said " you know the person that I am I would never neglect or abuse him"

 

Do I know the person he is??????? The MM who left me in the end was very harsh cruel mean and came off to me as very cold hearted, I was shocked about the way he was acting, his true colors shined through and I thought to my self "dang did I really know this guy" ????? So how can he say that I know him! I brought up a concern w/ his wife on how she was very manipulative and coniving and I asked him that he expect me to send my son off to her?? His reply was " I understand your concern about that but it has no merit" !!!!

 

WTF NO MERIT MY A$$!!!

 

I just want to thank you all for your insight and advice it is very very helpful for me right now and keep the advice coming if you have anymore to give, thanks everyone