How do you define true remorse?

[jbrent890]

I agree. Sophie's story, as moving as it was, attracted a lot of BS's because she seemed to say the things we all, as BS's wanted to hear. But if you read her story carefully you might also come to another understanding.

 

She got caught out. She did a 180 and spent the rest of her days "proving" her worthiness to her hesitant husband. Much of what she did was what some here call "the heavy lifting". But in fact, one could say she simply invested the same energy that she previously invested in having an affair, into getting her husband back. They say that we BS's can become addicted to the aftermath of an affair. This can happen too to WS's: who become obsessed and addicted to their attempt to right a wrong. Her story to try to win back her husband was epic. No less epic than her attempt to cheat. If her husband was such a great man that he deserved epic attempts to win him back, why did she cut the umbilical cord so quickly in the first place.

 

The thing is, any WS writting his/her life story here in LS that gets as much confirmation/rejection can get as easily caught up in the addiction of the forum as they did in the addiction of the affair and spout out months of appropriate phrases, and genuinely, actually BELIEVE EVERY WORD THEY SAY... just like when they allowed themselves to believe they were "in love". Anyone can write a great melodrama. It's more difficult to believe it.

 

For me, now 18 months post DDay still suffering from a full blown affair and repenting WS the only story that I can genuinely related to is that of DazednConfused from 2004.

 

I remember that story perfectly and its a trend I see with a lot of WSs. It's only after they get caught do they totally recommit to their marriage. I think it's exceedingly rare for a WS to commit back to the marriage after an affair ends. I look at some of the stories like mine in which the BS found out their WS cheated years prior. Luckily for me my wife put in 110% after she strayed, but for many that isn't the case. I found that when the WSs did this, their marriages just stayed the same and the true issues that caused the affair were never addressed. It isn't until the affair comes out that people want to put the work in. Why? Because the reality of finally losing their spouse kicks in. This is why I always stress confession. Not because you feel like the walls are closing in like in Sophie's case, but because you really want your marriage to work. That to me is displaying true remorse. My story is a little different, but if I found that if my wife only wanted to put the work in after she got caught, I would definitely leave. I respect the Waywards that try to fix their marriages after getting caught, but to me it's nothing more than damage control at that point.

[Rainbowlove]

The truth is marriages, affairs, waywards, betrayed spouses and recovery is not a one size fits all scenario. There are many factors that come into play: length of marriage, how the affair came to light, honesty of both partners, recommitting to recovery by both spouses, ability to forgive self and others...and yes, remorse by the wayward spouse.

 

Remorse can be seen by one's actions, continued NC, words, eye contact, communication, transparency, and continued self-exploration and recommitment.

 

Waywards themselves are not bad ppl and not all waywards will have additional affairs. Some betrayed spouses can never forgive, some can. Some waywards can never move forward, some can. Some marriages can't be saved, some can.

 

Each of us needs to decide for ourselves who and what we want and expect from a partner, what our individual deal breakers are and if forgiveness can be given. If not, then the marriage by all means should end. If you can forgive, forgive. This does not mean forget, but work towards forgiving.

 

Remorse is a part of the wayward's lengthy process of self-forgiveness. It happens whether or not the betrayed spouse wants to work towards recovery or not. And at some point full forgiveness by both the wayward and betrayed spouse needs to happen for full healing.

[HereNorThere]

The truth is marriages, affairs, waywards, betrayed spouses and recovery is not a one size fits all scenario. There are many factors that come into play: length of marriage, how the affair came to light, honesty of both partners, recommitting to recovery by both spouses, ability to forgive self and others...and yes, remorse by the wayward spouse.

 

Remorse can be seen by one's actions, continued NC, words, eye contact, communication, transparency, and continued self-exploration and recommitment.

 

Waywards themselves are not bad ppl and not all waywards will have additional affairs. Some betrayed spouses can never forgive, some can. Some waywards can never move forward, some can. Some marriages can't be saved, some can.

 

Each of us needs to decide for ourselves who and what we want and expect from a partner, what our individual deal breakers are and if forgiveness can be given. If not, then the marriage by all means should end. If you can forgive, forgive. This does not mean forget, but work towards forgiving.

 

Remorse is a part of the wayward's lengthy process of self-forgiveness. It happens whether or not the betrayed spouse wants to work towards recovery or not. And at some point full forgiveness by both the wayward and betrayed spouse needs to happen for full healing.

 

So if continually lying to your partner, making them feel crazy and unloved, exposing them to someone else's sexual fluids, etc, etc doesn't make you a bad person, I'm curious as to what does? Where is the line on that? Do they have kill someone, kick a baby, what?

[Selfish]

So if continually lying to your partner, making them feel crazy and unloved, exposing them to someone else's sexual fluids, etc, etc doesn't make you a bad person, I'm curious as to what does? Where is the line on that? Do they have kill someone, kick a baby, what?

 

It depends on your definition of a "bad person". When I was cheating I was being a bad wife. But there was still good in me too. Very few people are all bad and all good. For some all the good actions in the world will not wipe out even one bad action (a ONS say after 20 years of marriage). and for other the good and bad is weighed. And it is often weighed by each individual's perspective.

 

I was not a bad person before I cheated. I was not perfect but I wasn't what anyone would label bad. And I think that is why for some people it is wrong to just black and white label cheaters or people who have cheated as bad because it takes away the chance of redemption. There is no encouragement to change if you are simply a "bad person". But saying someone is being a bad person is less of a definitive. Or saying their actions are bad and hurtful and they need to change those in order to be a "good" person.

[Rainbowlove]

So if continually lying to your partner, making them feel crazy and unloved, exposing them to someone else's sexual fluids, etc, etc doesn't make you a bad person, I'm curious as to what does? Where is the line on that? Do they have kill someone, kick a baby, what?

 

Not all affairs look like yours. Not all waywards lie - some of us, like it or not, are upfront and honest about the state of our marriages and meeting someone else. Not all waywards sneak around, some of us are honest about being confused in the head and heart. Some waywards actually move out of their house to get their head together and heart. Some waywards don't physically cheat while involved in their marriage - they separate first. It takes some bravery to admit to falling for someone outside of the marriage. Marriage and relationships are not black and white.

 

This does not justify anything, but rather detail what I've stated before - not all marriages and affairs look a like. They have different people involved, they have different circumstances and situations and events.

 

To make a blank statement that waywards are bad or to compare them to killing someone or kicking a baby...that's just foolishness.

 

It took me a good year to recognize I am NOT a bad person for my affair. I struggled with that thought, but it was my spouse who has helped me see that I am good. I'm a good mother. I'm a good friend. I give to the homeless. I've worked with at risk youth. I've taken care of an ill parent. No, we are not bad. Nothing anyone else says can convince me I'm bad.

 

The behavior may be wrong and hurtful, but they are not bad people. That's your personal choice and judgement as a betrayed spouse who chooses not to forgive. That's your choice to judge as see fit and it's my choice to say NO, I'm not a bad person.

Edited December 1, 2014 by Rainbowlove

[Furious]

One of the things that stand out is that true remorse from the offending spouse is paramount to the success of the reconciliation.

 

How do you define true remorse?

 

 

I think true remorse is something more like a journey rather than an instant awakening. I think too many betrayed spouses become remorse enablers. Too often a betrayed spouse is so traumatized and in shock that they give what amounts to cheap forgiveness. It's understandable, that this happens, because most people just want to go back to what they thought they had. Truth is, it will never be that again and the "true remorse" question will haunt you if things are swept under the carpet.

 

I doubt most WS's are googling remorse, or buying remorse books on Amazon, or even gave a thought to remorse as they were cheating. Remorse is a concept that most likely never entered their mind. If anything the WS's spouse's effort and energy was invested in not getting caught. It's like a bucket of ice water when their double life is no longer viable.

 

Genuine Remorse is a personal journey, and is usually followed by consequences a WS cannot control. Some never reach true remorse, whether they stay married or divorce and some end up alone and only then feel remorse.

 

The real question should be, even if a WS is eventually remorseful, is it too little too late.

[me85]

Gosh, I don't know. When I'm really sorry about something I tell that person how sorry I am, to their face. Sadly, I've never had anyone (ex or otherwise) show true remorse for the hurt they caused me. I guess God wants me to be able to get through any and everything because that's exactly what I've been through. My life was set to be hard. That's ok because I'm one tough cookie and still a great gal despite all my heartaches. So, I was meant to be strong! That's all. It'd be nice if we received the remorse we deserve but we can't count on it. I always say "The less you expect from people, the more they can't hurt you."

[elaine567]

Having the "love"/attraction and the attention of two people at the same time is I guess empowering for any WS.

An abrupt withdrawal from that state, must be disconcerting and confusing.

Most of us dislike change and so trying to get back to the pre d-day status quo, must be a strong drive for a WS.

The AP may or may not hold any true attraction but that sense of empowerment I guess may do.

 

I think it is normal for most people to love and hanker after what they cannot have, or that denied to them.

How much of that depth of feeling encountered by many WSs after d-day is about true remorse or is it just a reaction to the fact they can no longer have it all - their bubble is now burst?