Why demonize the wife?

[HermioneG]

Gently and tactfully....this post changed in four hours. It did spin into how "all" and "most" OWs hate the wives. Those posts are now gone and I think youre responding to someome who responded to one of those posts.

 

Thanks for the update, although I fail to comprehend the use/need of the word tactfully in your reply. Communication failure on my part, I am sure.

 

My point about where to support the assertion made still stands, however.

[cocorico]

Perhaps the "demonising" of the BW occurs as a direct result of the observed / experienced behaviour of the BW by whoever is allegedly "demonising"?

 

I know I have never felt the need to "demonise" my H's xW. However, nor do I feel the need to excuse her behaviour which would in any other circumstance be considered inexcusable. She doesn't get a free ride just because her xH had an A. She is accountable for her own behaviour, which include my having an opinion on it and posting about it here if I so choose.

[Lady2163]

Perhaps the "demonising" of the BW occurs as a direct result of the observed / experienced behaviour of the BW by whoever is allegedly "demonising"?

 

I know I have never felt the need to "demonise" my H's xW. However, nor do I feel the need to excuse her behaviour which would in any other circumstance be considered inexcusable. She doesn't get a free ride just because her xH had an A. She is accountable for her own behaviour, which include my having an opinion on it and posting about it here if I so choose.

 

I think people assume that I personally in my situation hate the wife. I don't.

 

My anger comes from a different place, the other side. My ex husband was terribly neglectful and emotionally abusive. I wouldn't vilify anyone in my situation who chose to have an affair, whether exit affair or not. I didn't cheat while we were together, but within six weeks of him leaving me, I'd happily had my rebound relationship. Purists will say I cheated because we were only separated. We hadn't filed or been to court yet. The marriage was over and I was through when he left.

 

Everyone is accountable for their own behavior. If a person chooses to break their wedding vows by treating the spouse poorly, own up to it. I may not have had an affair, but I would be partly responsible if my exH did. Sex wasn't happening with me, so if it happened elsewhere because he was denied at home, I am the one who denied it. I am the one who quit performing oral (actually he did that first, but that's another story), I quit making any attempt at anything other than five minute two-stroke sex.

[Got it]

I do think that some may feel that ANY negative criticism of the BS is seen as demonizing which is not the case. But there is a blanket belief that the OP and/or the WS can not say a word about the BS at all because of the fact of the affair.

 

For myself, I do not believe I have demonized my husband's ex wife. Have I said anything negative? Sure. I have spoken about her affair. I have said about her reaction to him about her affair. I have tried to only state facts based on corroborated information, came from her directly, or have couched it as "his opinion". I have clearly seen the evidence of the saying "there is his truth, her truth and then the truth" in all romantic relationships. And I don't feel a need to demonize her. I didn't dislike her, I didn't know her. If anything, what I have stated, is she really wasn't on a radar. She was a known entity but didn't factor in outside of that (which has gotten me lambasted but my thinking during the affair.)

 

At the end of the day it is everyone's opinion. But what one person feels is demonizing may not be another's or hold up to the true definition of it.

 

But why would someone do so? I think, in general, because it allows them to focus on a "safer" party than the WS. There is a thought process that if it wasn't for the BS then everything would be free and clear (which isn't always the case and is actually rarely the case as the WS is the obstacle and hindrance). But can be a scapegoat.

[Baby123]

I very much disliked/dislike my fMMs, XBS. I'm sure she doesn't like me either. I just found it quite repulsive that she would blame me (a woman half her age) for stealing her husband, all whilst being incredibly promiscuous and trying to compete with me. Her husband had an exit affair because of there relationship, I was only the trigger. I'm not being funny but me and her are two incomparable people- a woman who behaves like she does on a daily basis is no better than me, just because I made the cardinal sin of sleeping with her husband. It doesn't forever give her the moral high ground or mean that I am forever in her debt- she needs to get a grip.

 

 

I'm SO happy she has a bf now, and me and him are happy. I just hope we have very very little to do with her.

[CrystalCastles]

Yes, there are cases of misplaced anger. That misplaced anger by the OW is not dissimilar to the misplaced anger of the BW

 

Misplaced anger? Sorry, I don't get it. If you're suggesting that the BW should be angry at her WS then yeah, I agree. But I don't see why she is a bad person for hating the OW- it takes two to make an affair happen.

 

Who says all OW do this? I have no idea, I didn't demonize his ex wife.

 

Where did I say all?

 

I very much disliked/dislike my fMMs, XBS. I'm sure she doesn't like me either. I just found it quite repulsive that she would blame me (a woman half her age) for stealing her husband, all whilst being incredibly promiscuous and trying to compete with me. Her husband had an exit affair because of there relationship, I was only the trigger. I'm not being funny but me and her are two incomparable people- a woman who behaves like she does on a daily basis is no better than me, just because I made the cardinal sin of sleeping with her husband. It doesn't forever give her the moral high ground or mean that I am forever in her debt- she needs to get a grip.

 

 

I'm SO happy she has a bf now, and me and him are happy. I just hope we have very very little to do with her.

 

...but you did steal her husband. How is she blaming you? Its true.

 

Also, you make it sound like just because she was a bad person in your eyes, that somehow excuses the affair when it does not.

 

Great responses all!

[Lady2163]

Misplaced anger? Sorry, I don't get it. If you're suggesting that the BW should be angry at her WS then yeah, I agree. But I don't see why she is a bad person for hating the OW- it takes two to make an affair happen. all!

 

In my case, if my exH cheated, then it took three to make the affair happen. I own up to my part

[cocorico]

...but you did steal her husband. How is she blaming you? Its true.

 

Unless her husband was profoundly disabled such that he was unable to have, and express, his own free will ( in which case any R would be involuntary, and thus some form of rape) then he was not stolen. He consented, at the very least.

 

A person is not a thing, nor a possession - hence cannot be stolen. Husbands have their own agency. No one can steal them - they choose to transfer their affections, passions and loyalty. That is not theft but choice.

 

Perhaps if more wives recognised their husbands as being agents with their own fre will, rather than seeing them as possessions (and treating them that way) there would be less "stealing" of husbands.

[CrystalCastles]

Unless her husband was profoundly disabled such that he was unable to have, and express, his own free will ( in which case any R would be involuntary, and thus some form of rape) then he was not stolen. He consented, at the very least.

 

A person is not a thing, nor a possession - hence cannot be stolen. Husbands have their own agency. No one can steal them - they choose to transfer their affections, passions and loyalty. That is not theft but choice.

 

Perhaps if more wives recognised their husbands as being agents with their own fre will, rather than seeing them as possessions (and treating them that way) there would be less "stealing" of husbands.

 

Ok, so in that case, if husbands have such freedom to do whatever they please, never mind the marriage vows they made which apparently don't mean much because they can simply transfer their loyalty to someone else if they so choose, why not just divorce the wife first??

 

And the OWs. Why settle for half a man? Someone who is not all yours? Don't you think you deserve better than that? Not to mention, MM tend to be very talented liars and manipulators, so why be jealous of the BW, I mean, she's married to that.

[cocorico]

Ok, so in that case, if husbands have such freedom to do whatever they please, never mind the marriage vows they made which apparently don't mean much because they can simply transfer their loyalty to someone else if they so choose, why not just divorce the wife first??

 

Non sequitur. Having free will does not oblige someone to exercise it in the way you might wish them to. It's _free_ will. They have a choice how they wish to exercise it. Prescribing to them negates that.

 

And the OWs. Why settle for half a man? Someone who is not all yours? Don't you think you deserve better than that?

 

I can't speak for others, but I definitely did not "settle for half a man". I had his heart, his thoughts, his love, loyalty, passion, commitment and his essence. She had someone who sometimes happened to be in the same space as her - but not if he could help it - who was plotting his escape. So if there was any settling, it wasn't from my side.

 

Not to mention, MM tend to be very talented liars and manipulators, so why be jealous of the BW, I mean, she's married to that.

 

Again, I cannot speak for others, but my H sucks at lying and wouldn't know how to manipulate his way out of a paper bag. But that's neither here nor there. I was never jealous of his xW, because I knew where his heart lay, and she had (and was) nothing I wanted. She did try for a while to look like me, so I can't say there was no jealousy from her side, but I think she has accepted that we are just polar opposites with nothin in common except having / having had the same husband.

[Got it]

Misplaced anger? Sorry, I don't get it. If you're suggesting that the BW should be angry at her WS then yeah, I agree. But I don't see why she is a bad person for hating the OW- it takes two to make an affair happen.

 

 

 

Where did I say all?

 

 

 

...but you did steal her husband. How is she blaming you? Its true.

 

Also, you make it sound like just because she was a bad person in your eyes, that somehow excuses the affair when it does not.

 

Great responses all!

 

Because you wrote " why does OW demonize the wife". So by reading that it reads, why does Other Women demonize the wife implying the majority does. You did not say qualify the number so by general reading comprehension one reads it to be majority.

 

So next time clarify or you leave it up to reader's interpretation.

[Got it]

Ok, so in that case, if husbands have such freedom to do whatever they please, never mind the marriage vows they made which apparently don't mean much because they can simply transfer their loyalty to someone else if they so choose, why not just divorce the wife first??

 

And the OWs. Why settle for half a man? Someone who is not all yours? Don't you think you deserve better than that? Not to mention, MM tend to be very talented liars and manipulators, so why be jealous of the BW, I mean, she's married to that.

 

Why do you assume things? Why do you assume that there is settling for any percentage? What does "half of a man" even mean"? You are also assuming that physical presence may be the biggest factor which doesn't make sense.

 

If you know nothing about affairs are you looking to actually learn or are you looking to push preconceived ideas? And if that is the case, why would someone who has been an OP or WS want to discuss?

[AmyBamy]

Why do OW demonize the wife? It seems a bit weird to me. You insult her yet you're the one boinking her husband? I'm not sure why OW think it is their place to hate the married guy's wife. I read an OW's post where she spoke with such hate for the wife, but has never met her.

 

I get that the OW are probably mad because the wife is married to the WS, not them, but what did you expect? He's married, so yeah, there will be a wife in the picture.

 

Not trying to sound confrontational, just want to hear what the OW reasoning is. I wouldn't know, I've never had an affair nor do I plan to, so maybe there's something I'm missing.

 

It's not demonizing if the person really is just a ****ty person. Sometimes it's just a fact of personality.

[AmyBamy]

Who says all OW do this? I have no idea, I didn't demonize his ex wife.

 

Nor did I. Anything I said was true, not opinion, she just is not a good person in the grand sense of things. She has many traits that are considered non-desirable in this society, selfishness, dramatically inclined, hysterical even at times. If she is demonized, it is not by me, and not bc of anything I've said regarding her because I don't say much. I don't have to, she flaunts her crappy personality around like she is on parade and somehow seems proud of herself while others look on in horror and take the truth from the situation - that she is just a nasty, nasty personl

[Furious]

Why do OW demonize the wife? It seems a bit weird to me. You insult her yet you're the one boinking her husband? I'm not sure why OW think it is their place to hate the married guy's wife. I read an OW's post where she spoke with such hate for the wife, but has never met her.

 

I get that the OW are probably mad because the wife is married to the WS, not them, but what did you expect? He's married, so yeah, there will be a wife in the picture.

 

Not trying to sound confrontational, just want to hear what the OW reasoning is. I wouldn't know, I've never had an affair nor do I plan to, so maybe there's something I'm missing.

 

 

A betrayed spouse may or may not be a good person....but...if someone is a crap person it doesn't justify crap behaviour in me.

 

There are plenty of couples I know who are in dysfunctional relationships and I steer clear from their drama.

 

It's not about if a spouse is crap or not. Some OW/OW have signed up for the drama and but complain bitterly about it. I guess it's easier on their conscious to be an affair partner and put the emphasis of bad character onto a betrayed spouse rather than examine their own actions.

 

It's ironic that if a spouse were so awful why is it that they don't leave unless they have a replacement in the wings. Something to think about, as it shows some flaws in the WS as to their own inability to fix it or leave without a third party involved.

[CrystalCastles]

Because you wrote " why does OW demonize the wife". So by reading that it reads, why does Other Women demonize the wife implying the majority does. You did not say qualify the number so by general reading comprehension one reads it to be majority.

 

So next time clarify or you leave it up to reader's interpretation.

 

Next time, don't put words in my mouth. I never said all/most/majority/what have you. Until I say the word "all" explicitly, don't assume I am talking about "all". Understood?

 

Why do you assume things? Why do you assume that there is settling for any percentage? What does "half of a man" even mean"? You are also assuming that physical presence may be the biggest factor which doesn't make sense.

 

If you know nothing about affairs are you looking to actually learn or are you looking to push preconceived ideas? And if that is the case, why would someone who has been an OP or WS want to discuss?

 

Why do YOU assume things? Half a man I have already clarified: someone who is married to another woman. You can't have all of him if he's legally bound to someone else. It is a figurative phrase.

 

I am asking questions. These are things I have understood from reading threads in the OW/OM section. I would like to know more about them. I am not stating things that are known fact- I am stating things I have read. If that bothers you, you are free to take your high and mighty opinions elsewhere. Thanks.

[CrystalCastles]

Non sequitur. Having free will does not oblige someone to exercise it in the way you might wish them to. It's _free_ will. They have a choice how they wish to exercise it. Prescribing to them negates that.

 

In that case, why bother being married? The way I understand, marriage removes at least some free will. When you're bound to someone else, you can't just do anything you want, because at least some of your actions will impact the person you are bound to. Its the same thing as living in a country with laws. You don't have free will to go murder someone, or, well, you do, but then you pay the consequences.

 

If a guy is open to an affair, why can't he just dump his wife first? That is free will- divorcing the person you don't want to be married to anymore.

[still_an_Angel]

In that case, why bother being married? The way I understand, marriage removes at least some free will. When you're bound to someone else, you can't just do anything you want, because at least some of your actions will impact the person you are bound to. Its the same thing as living in a country with laws. You don't have free will to go murder someone, or, well, you do, but then you pay the consequences.

 

If a guy is open to an affair, why can't he just dump his wife first? That is free will- divorcing the person you don't want to be married to anymore.

 

Marriage doesn't take anyone's free will away. You said it yourself, one's actions will result in consequences of all those involved in the marriage. You need to look at the bigger picture, when one is thinking of D, one has to consider kids, finances, assets, the extended family, careers and all that. It's not clear-cut in any way. In effect, this is where one's free will comes in - free to stay or go, and live with the consequences either way.

 

When you're bound to someone else (I'm quoting you here), you have responsibilities, obligations and all, you are free to decide on which consequences you think you can live with. For some WS, it's not the BS why they stay, its the kids and/or the finances. Each case is different.

[BurnedAndLost]

Marriage doesn't take anyone's free will away. You said it yourself, one's actions will result in consequences of all those involved in the marriage. You need to look at the bigger picture, when one is thinking of D, one has to consider kids, finances, assets, the extended family, careers and all that. It's not clear-cut in any way. In effect, this is where one's free will comes in - free to stay or go, and live with the consequences either way.

 

When you're bound to someone else (I'm quoting you here), you have responsibilities, obligations and all, you are free to decide on which consequences you think you can live with. For some WS, it's not the BS why they stay, its the kids and/or the finances. Each case is different.

 

I always find it funny when APs claim ( the only people is see using this excuse are APs and very, rarely WS's ) the WS are only staying for the kids and finances. You'd think that if the WS REALLY cared about that, he wouldn't be doing something that would be a sure fire way to mess that up...

 

It's all just an excuse.

[BurnedAndLost]

In that case, why bother being married? The way I understand, marriage removes at least some free will. When you're bound to someone else, you can't just do anything you want, because at least some of your actions will impact the person you are bound to. Its the same thing as living in a country with laws. You don't have free will to go murder someone, or, well, you do, but then you pay the consequences.

 

If a guy is open to an affair, why can't he just dump his wife first? That is free will- divorcing the person you don't want to be married to anymore.

 

There is no point. These people will go to any length to justify affairs while at the same time, claiming they don't care what anyone thinks about it.

[Got it]

Next time, don't put words in my mouth. I never said all/most/majority/what have you. Until I say the word "all" explicitly, don't assume I am talking about "all". Understood?

 

 

 

Why do YOU assume things? Half a man I have already clarified: someone who is married to another woman. You can't have all of him if he's legally bound to someone else. It is a figurative phrase.

 

I am asking questions. These are things I have understood from reading threads in the OW/OM section. I would like to know more about them. I am not stating things that are known fact- I am stating things I have read. If that bothers you, you are free to take your high and mighty opinions elsewhere. Thanks.

 

Good lord, anger much? Chill.

 

You asked question. People are answering them regardless of what your assumptions or premise may be. And "half of a man" still doesn't make sense even with your clarification. It just doesn't. Figurative or not.

 

Since you aren't an OP or a BS, why do you want to know? What is the reasoning behind the questions?

 

It isn't like there is a script or handbook one gets that says, "Welcome to OPhood, here is what is expected of you." So it isn't like we can all speak for each other, there are many different reasons, actions, justifications, etc.

[Got it]

I always find it funny when APs claim ( the only people is see using this excuse are APs and very, rarely WS's ) the WS are only staying for the kids and finances. You'd think that if the WS REALLY cared about that, he wouldn't be doing something that would be a sure fire way to mess that up...

 

It's all just an excuse.

 

My father stayed in his marriage (no affair) for the kids and finances. People do not link the other parent tied directly and irrevocably to the kids so one goes with the other. The emotions, loyalties, and expectations are different.

[RedRobin]

I used to wonder this myself but I've come to find So, so, SO very many reasons.

 

The first (and most important IMO) being demonize and dehumanize are practically the same thing. That said, dehumanization is central to warfare. And let's be real here, for OW looking to "win" the heart of her MM, the situation is basically warfare. Because of this, a lot of OW fixed their minds to viewing the BW as the enemy. SHE is the sole impediment to their own happiness. SHE is the thing that is "in their way" (meaning, OW and MM being together fully) and therefore she is a bitch, inattentive, evil, mean, crazy, etc.

 

Then, MM are notorious for painting their wives in a bad light and throwing them completely under the bus. Because of this, OW view her as horrible people who treat someone they love (the MM) poorly, unfairly or even outright cruelly. If your boyfriend (as a single woman dating a single man) told you his mother was awful, mean, uncaring, etc, you would begin to hate her too. Because he is your BF and someone you care about, you believe him. You hate her because she is painted as hateful.

 

It's also so much easier to do the things it takes to be an OW if you convince yourself she is a bad person and/or "deserves" to be cheated on. It just is.

 

 

You hit the nail on the head. The other person becomes the cheating partner's enabler. The one who goes along and willingly believes whatever... so that they can have their little fantasy.

 

 

I've had more than a few married guys try to feed me some BS about how horrible their marriages are... I just tell them to get a divorce if it is that horrible. That, and, it's a broken record I've heard before and they all sound the same.

 

 

When propositioned directly, I've asked them to put the wife on the phone and we'll have a nice chat about it.

[CrystalCastles]

Good lord, anger much? Chill.

 

Hm, I'd say the same to you. You're the one who showed up acting all rude and confrontational.

 

You asked question. People are answering them regardless of what your assumptions or premise may be. And "half of a man" still doesn't make sense even with your clarification. It just doesn't. Figurative or not.

 

Yeah, and in case you haven't noticed, nobody else is bashing me or accusing me of having "preconceived notions" or some such crap. Half a man makes sense. Why, you think, as OW, that a married man is all yours? He just happens to have that little inconvenient wifey back home and a ring on his finger?

 

Since you aren't an OP or a BS, why do you want to know? What is the reasoning behind the questions?

 

Why do you care? Lets just say, its none of your business. I may or may not know some cheaters. Otherwise, everything else isn't something you need to know.

[CrystalCastles]

For some WS, it's not the BS why they stay, its the kids and/or the finances. Each case is different.

 

For the kids? Really? I cannot imagine anything more unhealthy than raising a kid in a home where one parent is having an affair. From what I've read in the OW/OM forum, many times the affair ends in a DDay that then hurts the kids even more.