First date - he wants to split bill??

[Elle1975]

There are YOUR rules.

 

We can't be expected to abide by every person's individual rules.

Here's the problem, a lot of you expect the first date to be paid for by the man... but do you know how many times I've had a woman get all HUFFY and PUFFY and yell GIRL POWAH at the top of her lungs if I decide to pay for the round of drinks.

 

"Oh no no no no, I'm INDEPENDENTZ and I PAY MAH BILLZ."

 

So, we are stuck in an unusual limbo now.

Men were expected to pay on Date 1 in a time when men were sole breadwinners and women were homemakers. That dynamic has changed. We're supposed to guess what you are okay with and not okay with now?

 

This is why a lot of us set up inexpensive first dates.

 

But then, we're cheap, poor, broke, don't want to buy anything...

 

Can't win. No matter at what point of the dating era we are in, we can't win. Maybe we should just simplify things by going back to the 50's so that there will be absolutely no doubt and I don't have to keep guessing where I should be taking anyone and whether I'll get RAH RAH RAH or whether I'll be judged based on the venue...

 

Hey remember, when dinner and a movie used to be a first date too?

 

It can get confusing. I agree. It's a lot of "Weeding" if I may say.

[Diezel]

It can get confusing. I agree. It's a lot of "Weeding" if I may say.

 

Absolutely! It works both ways.

I use it to my advantage as well, just as women use it to their own. It's all about filtering out potentials from the scraps.

[Gaeta]

Gaeta, I believe what your saying about yourself is true. The problem is that your speaking for yourself. If I said the return invite almost never happens, I'm not just talking about one or two, I'm talking about 4 out of 5, or sometimes worse than that. And probably a universal ratio given the number of men that say the same thing. Women in general, don't ask men out, whether it be a 1st, 2nd, or 10th date.

 

 

Ok, I recognize my experience is probably different because of my age, culture and location. I have never hesitated to make the invite and paying for it and I see my single female friends doing the same.

 

That also answers Diezel.

[Smilecharmer]

I don't think it is confusing. When a guy asked me out, I asked if it was Dutch or if he would pay. This determined if I wanted to go out with him. I wasn't interested in modern guys. That was my preference. Not every girl has the same expectations, it is true but then not every guy does either. Some guys like to be the man and pay for dates while some are modern and like to go Dutch and some even prefer the woman pay if he is really hot and can get by with it and there are some women who will do that. I've seen it. It doesn't matter as long as you are clear on what you want and what you prefer. There are no wrong answers here, just preference. If the OP feels like this guy was inconsiderate, that is her opinion and she shouldn't be guilted into giving this guy a chance based on some idea that everyone should act and behave the same way.

[Gaeta]

There are YOUR rules.

 

We can't be expected to abide by every person's individual rules.

Here's the problem, a lot of you expect the first date to be paid for by the man... but do you know how many times I've had a woman get all HUFFY and PUFFY and yell GIRL POWAH at the top of her lungs if I decide to pay for the round of drinks.

 

"Oh no no no no, I'm INDEPENDENTZ and I PAY MAH BILLZ."

 

By the way these women aren't independent women, they're wannabes. A real independent woman does not need to yell it on top of the roofs she's independent and won't knock you down with it, she will show it to you with respect and consideration when her turn comes.

[SadNLonley]

I don't think it is confusing. When a guy asked me out, I asked if it was Dutch or if he would pay.

 

Hmm, now you have me thinking... Should I have asked dates prior if we were going dutch or not. My bad... I guess I never thought to expect to pay. 1st date Im talking. I have also never been asked to go dutch though either. Will keep that in mind for the future.

 

If the OP feels like this guy was inconsiderate, that is her opinion and she shouldn't be guilted into giving this guy a chance based on some idea that everyone should act and behave the same way.

Correct, its all in what the OP feels. We can all give our advice, but its all just our opinions.

[carrie_o]

I prefer to split on the first date. That way there is no feeling like I "owe" him something. Once the dates turn into a relationship, I prefer letting him pay for one date and I'll pay for the next one.

[William]

Folks, let's stick to English here, end the name-calling and, generally, as Robert would write, "knock it off".

 

Edited to add that, after further review, the disruption here was caused by a reincarnation of a previously banned member so 'thank you' to the member who reported their post. We encourage this kind of response to postings which seem out of sorts or disruptive.

 

Thanks!

Edited July 2, 2014 by William
Member review complete

[ktya]

It was a $15 date for HIM ... it was a $45 date for HER, and he's the one who asked her out.

 

Ok. Lets put it this way then.

 

In a ficticious world i ask a girl out to go skiing at whistler. She says she would love to, and she has no gear but i do. Lift tickets are about $50, ski and boot and mask rentals are another $50 for her. Lunch and brews costs about $30.

 

We each pay our own lift ticket and she pays for her rental as well. I ask her to split the bill for lunch. Her cost of the outing is $115 and my cost is $65.

 

Are you suggesting that i should have covered her lunch? How about her equipment rental? Maybe her lift ticket too? Just cover everything why not seeing as i asked her out skiing. Maybe i should cover her gas or bus ticket too seeing as i asked her out in the first place.

 

Were in 2014. Women work. The internet exists, if she cant afford the rentals, lift ticket and lunch she can find out how much it costs and ask to maybe do something cheaper.

 

This whole gambit of who pays keeps coming up in thread after thread and it boils down to this very paternalistic rule:. No matter how much money the guy makes, he should pay, and if the date is terrible the woman pays so she can walk away without feeling she owes him something. Its downright rediculous.

 

Im not cheap and sure if i ask a girl out for drinks ill offer to pay, ditto for dinner because thats how the world works. Doesnt mean its right.

 

So if i ask a girl to go sailing on her boat and she agrees, am i supposed to cover the gas, moorage and insurance as well as the food and chip in for maintenance because we went out once? I know that is a straw man rediculous argument but if you take this to the Nth degree thats where it leads.

 

Then theres this banter that the one doing the asking is the one who should pay. Great, because we guys all know how often girls ask a man out and plan a date - exceedingly rare - girls will rarely ask a guy for his number let alone on a date. Which means the man should pay.

 

Sorry to rant on this but no man in his right mind would ever trip out, come on the internet, and be all concerned looking for advice as to whether a girl is relationship material because she asked him to pay his own way. This thread is not the only one either.

 

He wanted to split the bill. You wanted to go paddleboarding and had to rent the gear because you had none, but he did. Whatever, your board rental cost is irrelevant - unless you had told him that you were low on money or something.

 

Its only $15. Next date suggest to alternate paying for meals because you hate doing dutch. Problem solved.

[ktya]

When a guy asked me out, I asked if it was Dutch or if he would pay. This determined if I wanted to go out with him.

 

Good lord. Why dont you just ask him what color his credit card is instead.

[Elle1975]

We all agree then! "To each his own".

 

And beside, a first date is meant to get to know the person a little, and see if a second date is in the horizon.

[Gaeta]

Ok. Lets put it this way then.

 

In a ficticious world i ask a girl out to go skiing at whistler. She says she would love to, and she has no gear but i do. Lift tickets are about $50, ski and boot and mask rentals are another $50 for her. Lunch and brews costs about $30.

 

We each pay our own lift ticket and she pays for her rental as well. I ask her to split the bill for lunch. Her cost of the outing is $115 and my cost is $65.

 

Are you suggesting that i should have covered her lunch? How about her equipment rental? Maybe her lift ticket too? Just cover everything why not seeing as i asked her out skiing. Maybe i should cover her gas or bus ticket too seeing as i asked her out in the first place.

 

You don't surprise someone with costs like this on a first date. If the girl you've invited to sky had never done it before then she had one heck of a surprise when she got there!! You, as a skyer, had the job to inform her there were costs involved.

 

Just like this guy should have told her renting herself a paddle boat was $30. She would then have been prepared that even though this date was 'his' invite it was going to be a split bill.

[Taramere]

Ok. Lets put it this way then.

 

In a ficticious world i ask a girl out to go skiing at whistler. She says she would love to, and she has no gear but i do. Lift tickets are about $50, ski and boot and mask rentals are another $50 for her. Lunch and brews costs about $30.

 

We each pay our own lift ticket and she pays for her rental as well. I ask her to split the bill for lunch. Her cost of the outing is $115 and my cost is $65.

 

Are you suggesting that i should have covered her lunch?

 

I think it would certainly be a thoughtful gesture, and it's certainly one I would make in that situation.

 

If it's a "some of us are going ski-ing, do you want to come along?" situation then that's completely different. On an actual date, though, your primary reason for going along is the person rather than the activity. For me, if I had selected an activity I loved and had the equipment for, and was making a romantic date of it with a guy I liked who was having to hire equipment - absolutely I would spring for his lunch if he was okay with that (some guys aren't, and if they aren't then you don't push it). I don't even understand why that's an issue for people.

 

Somebody liking you enough to accompany you to your favourite sport and to spend money hiring equipment so that they can do it with you is a big deal. It's a compliment. Why wouldn't you, in that situation, want to make that gesture of paying for their lunch?

 

I think that being a thoughtful, considerate dating partner is a better reference point than gender politics are. If the other person isn't thoughtful and considerate, or if they're using the date to make some political point about gender politics, equality etc then I guess you just get through the date with as much goodwill as you can, but avoid making a second one.

[Keenly]

I always get so amused when topics like this come up, and they always insist that its not about the money, or that they aren't trying to sound like all they care about is money, but then they ask " does this mean he is cheap ? "

 

So its not about money... but it IS about money.

 

 

Its the first date, and it doesn't seem like this guy was taught as a kid to ALWAYS pay like some guys were.

 

 

Is this really something you want to use to rule a person out completely? If so, people are faaaaar to picky these days. This guy could be the perfect boyfriend, but you'd be so quick to discard him over not paying on the first date?

[Taramere]

Is this really something you want to use to rule a person out completely?

 

If the guy seemed very nice generally, then no. However, I do think his behaviour was thoughtless and I would expect a considerate sort of person to say "look, you paid for that equipment hire even though the date was my idea - so let me pay for lunch. It's the least I can do."

 

That's the way I was brought up, that's what I would do...and I'd be looking for somebody with similar values. I've accepted selfish behaviour from a partner in the past, and resented it. It's not healthy to have those unbalanced relationships, and I wouldn't want to be in a relationship where I had to become a more selfish and thoughtless person in order to maintain a sense of equality and fairness with a partner.

 

People might get antsy about these boundaries, and define them as overly picky, but I don't think it's unacceptably picky to be looking for somebody whose values about how to treat other people roughly coincide with your own.

[ktya]

You don't surprise someone with costs like this on a first date. If the girl you've invited to sky had never done it before then she had one heck of a surprise when she got there!! You, as a skyer, had the job to inform her there were costs involved.

 

Just like this guy should have told her renting herself a paddle boat was $30. She would then have been prepared that even though this date was 'his' invite it was going to be a split bill.

 

1. Women today are educated and can read. The "interwebs" is right on their phone. Unless the girl dropped out of school in kindergarten she im sure has the faculties to figure it out herself whether its paddleboarding or skiing. Plus, she could always ask - either the guy or someone else. Women are not fickle ignorant waifs in this day and age and shouldnt be expected to be treated like one. Actually, if a guy did treat her like a fickle ignorant waif on the first date shed probably would next him immediately.

 

2. Were talking about $30 for the paddleboard rental. Not like he said "fly to paris with me on my private jet" and he asked her to split the cost.

 

My key point is that its ludicrious to determine someones suitability for partnership based on what percentage of the date they pay for. If thats the case, just put on your profile that you want a man with money who isnt afraid to spend it on you.

 

Those guys who pay all the time, throw money around like water... I work with them in investment banking. Despite high incomes they usually are in debt. They will pay for the wife, the mistress, the escorts, and the liquor. But they are ego driven and expect to receive not give when it comes to love and compromise is not an option.

[William]

Members, I thank you for your input and am chagrined to report you were trolled by a previously banned member in the starting post. Sorry! Thread closed.