Am I dating a loser?

June 28, 2014

you two do not seem to know each other all that well

have you discussed what day to day life would be like if you lived with him?

he has already let you know he is not into kids too much, he upped and left which surprised you

will he help with the cleaning? have you discussed who pays for what? will he pay for his food? why should you?

if you feel bad asking him to discuss these things, then he has you right where he wants you....you mutely doing all the work...with no romantic anniversaries, beware of being treated as a mere hotelier, seen it and seen it

Edited June 28, 2014 by darkmoon

June 28, 2014

So basically what you are saying is you are obligated to raise her kids if you date her. Right ?

I love how we are twisting this to make him into a bad guy. He left at 4 am because he needed sleep, and he clearly wasn't going to get it there. Maybe he had work the next day.

Because some how his responsibility to raise her kid, and if you ever date anyone with kids you become insta-father.

I guess leaving because they are keeping you awake all night is some how selfish?

None of this makes any logical sense at all. In fact we are placing absurd demands on him.

You don't understand how serious relationships work clearly.

One doesn't need to be insta-father, but if you are in a serious relationship, especially one where you're considering moving in with someone who has a toddler or possibly marrying, how exactly do you propose it to work?

The child be one person's responsibility and the other person can just up and leave when they need sleep or can't be bothered...but it's okay because it's not their biological child??? Please explain how that could work in any kind of family or relationship. Please don't ever blend families or be with someone with a child.

No one should have to parent if they don't want to. Period. If you think it's acceptable to completely bow out and let your SO do everything when it comes on to their child but still expect to be with them, live with them and be in the child's life...you are a SELFISH person. If that is what you want, date single women...simple. It is really that simple. But in an almost 2 year relationship where you're considering moving in....not to ask your SO if you can help them or if you don't naturally feel loving feelings towards their child...you need to go.

I have dated men with children and while I wasn't expected to be their mom I knew that should we be serious or should I live with them, especially if the child is a toddler, then I cannot be completely hands off neither would I want to. I knew it was a package deal and I knew no kind of serious commitment could ever work if I simply tolerated their child but didn't develop genuine care for them too. Not everyone is cut out for that. I get it, hence again, if your attitude is like yours where it's not your job, you don't need to be insta dad, you can just leave at 4am and leave your SO and their kid distraught because you need to sleep (God forbid you lose any sleep...because parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles and sitters have never lost sleep before and the world spun off it's access because of it ), then do not date anyone where you may have to prioritize another person's needs.

This isn't even about the child only, but it could be anything else that requires getting up at 4am unexpectedly. If a pipe burst or if something happened in my home but if it's not my bf's home it's perfectly decent for him to say he's going home to get some sleep and leave me to handle it on my own and then breeze back in when all is well? Oh please. I would NEVER be with someone who thought like this and I don't think like that. If we are a couple and are serious then we are PARTNERS, what's your problem is mine and I'm not gonna leave you hanging so I can sleep. I can lose a few hours of sleep or perhaps a few minutes to make sure all is well with you and your kid, your dog, your mom or whomever....that's what GOOD PEOPLE and GOOD PARTNERS do...period.

June 28, 2014

Hey Palmbreeze,

First off, what have you and your bf discussed in terms of your relationship with him and with your child? Has he expressed wanting to marry you? Have a family? Does he express loving your son as well as you? Does he expressing wanting to play a father role to your child or be a step parent? Where exactly does he stand on this?

I think for a single mom that is the FIRST thing you need to know BEFORE you start bringing a man you're dating around your child, start having him sleep over, moving in or having particular expectations of him. Was it ever discussed frankly what you expect of him towards your child?

For some single moms, when the father is around, the bf doesn't need to play a father role but of course needs to respect the child, treat them well, care for them etc. For some men they don't really care for the child and simply see the child as someone to be tolerated so that they can see the mom and for other men they love and treat that child like their own and date a single mom because they want to be a dad and see loving the mom as a package. I think you want the latter, and heck I would too! Nothing is wrong with that and there are men out there who can do that....but you cannot expect this automatically and it's important when you're dating to figure out the man's stance on it.

So again....have you simply assumed your bf would be someone who will play father to your child, love him, he wants to be a dad/stepdad or has he verbally expressed this? As a single mom especially you can't date on assumptions esp if you don't want your child to be hurt. You can't just willy nilly based on assumption have men in your son's life who've never committed to you and him in words and actions.

Have a talk with your bf if you haven't already...and if he cannot express that he loves you AND your son and wants to commit to you both and not just shack up and then leave when the child annoys him, then you have to walk away. But from the sound of it...doesn't seem like he is that invested in being any kind of father figure, which is his right, but you need to know this now and for when you date again to make sure you figure this out before investing in a man or bringing him around your kid.

Excellent post. If you have been clear that you expect him to act like a father to your son and to not leave when things get tough, then it's fair to be upset with him. But if he is unaware of what you expect of him, you need to be clear about that. He can choose if he's willing to stick it out or not.

June 28, 2014

You don't understand how serious relationships work clearly.

One doesn't need to be insta-father, but if you are in a serious relationship, especially one where you're considering moving in with someone who has a toddler or possibly marrying, how exactly do you propose it to work?

The child be one person's responsibility and the other person can just up and leave when they need sleep or can't be bothered...but it's okay because it's not their biological child??? Please explain how that could work in any kind of family or relationship. Please don't ever blend families or be with someone with a child.

No one should have to parent if they don't want to. Period. If you think it's acceptable to completely bow out and let your SO do everything when it comes on to their child but still expect to be with them, live with them and be in the child's life...you are a SELFISH person. If that is what you want, date single women...simple. It is really that simple. But in an almost 2 year relationship where you're considering moving in....not to ask your SO if you can help them or if you don't naturally feel loving feelings towards their child...you need to go.

I have dated men with children and while I wasn't expected to be their mom I knew that should we be serious or should I live with them, especially if the child is a toddler, then I cannot be completely hands off neither would I want to. I knew it was a package deal and I knew no kind of serious commitment could ever work if I simply tolerated their child but didn't develop genuine care for them too. Not everyone is cut out for that. I get it, hence again, if your attitude is like yours where it's not your job, you don't need to be insta dad, you can just leave at 4am and leave your SO and their kid distraught because you need to sleep (God forbid you lose any sleep...because parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles and sitters have never lost sleep before and the world spun off it's access because of it ), then do not date anyone where you may have to prioritize another person's needs.

This isn't even about the child only, but it could be anything else that requires getting up at 4am unexpectedly. If a pipe burst or if something happened in my home but if it's not my bf's home it's perfectly decent for him to say he's going home to get some sleep and leave me to handle it on my own and then breeze back in when all is well? Oh please. I would NEVER be with someone who thought like this and I don't think like that. If we are a couple and are serious then we are PARTNERS, what's your problem is mine and I'm not gonna leave you hanging so I can sleep. I can lose a few hours of sleep or perhaps a few minutes to make sure all is well with you and your kid, your dog, your mom or whomever....that's what GOOD PEOPLE and GOOD PARTNERS do...period.

A pipe bursting and a kid crying all night are two completely different things.

If he left at 4 am, I think its safe to assume he waited for many hours before he got frustrated and left because he wanted to sleep.

There's helping with raising your spouse's kid, and then there is a line where you have to take care of YOURSELF too. You NEED sleep. Especially if you have something important the next day.

I'm still waiting to hear what exactly he SHOULD have done, because so far the only answer we have to that question is that he SHOULD have stayed and just not slept the entire night. I highly doubt he possess the power to make the kid stop crying. So he stays. The kid crys... and crys... and crys... and crys....

Now its 10 am and there went 1 night of no sleep. Exactly how did that benefit anyone, except for the person who wanted some one to suffer with them?

I know with me, personally, sleep is extremely important to how I feel, my overall demeanor, and my health. I already have pretty bad insomnia so I barely sleep these days anyway, so when I do sleep, I NEED that sleep. It's absolutely not selfish of me to insist I get at least 5 hours of sleep in a night, its selfish of some one to insist that I don't sleep because their kid is restless.

Edited June 28, 2014 by Keenly

June 28, 2014

You might not have the same thought on parenting. Not to say you're wrong or right on how to raise your son.

He also might not see himself as part of the "family" yet. Surely he should respect your kid, and get involved if he cares for you, but again he might not see himself as a father figure.

It's something you should both discuss calmly; one of the big trilogy *kids, money, sex* that you should agree on.

June 28, 2014

What should a loving guy have done in this situation? Well, he would have asked what was wrong with the child, probably got up to see too. If he was supposed to be working in the morning and you weren't, then it might have been appropriate to say 'will you be ok tonight if I go back to my place to sleep?'. That's what a thoughtful guy would have done. It really makes no difference that he wasn't the child's father. It's got to be clear to any guy that if he wants a long-term relationship with a single mum, he's going to also be an important part of the child's life and will need to take on care at times. Any guy who thinks it's acceptable to date (move in with in this case?) a single parent and not get remotely involved with the children, is deluded.

June 29, 2014

Any adult staying at your home would assist you, or at least offer to and remain ready to, if a problem occurred that woke everyone up. It’s basic manners and caring. This is a bad sign regarding his character.

June 29, 2014

This thread is nuts. Seriously. First off, the boyfriend is not, and I repeat, NOT this kids father. Sure, every guy in his position knows that dating a single mom is package deal, and if he didn't know, then he soon learned that when he had a screaming kid keeping him up till 4am, and not his girlfriend giving him crazy monkey sex. The fact that he left at 4am is telling also. This means he probably sat there through a lot of it, and finally, just couldn't take it any longer. Lastly, and this ties int my first point, since the boyfriend is not the father, while he should be expected to help with kid related things, he should not be expected to take over. If I am dating a single mom, I would expect her to take care of the child in this situation, not me.

It's threads like this that remind me why I no longer date single moms. The baby daddy is no longer in the picture for whatever reason, and new guy is expected to become daddy all of a sudden. As a disclaimer, I will say that not all single moms are this way, but most I've met are.

Wow. OK.

If the guy isn't willing to be a supportive, helpful, understanding, empathic partner after A YEAR AND A HALF, and helping the situation when there is a problem, then he just should not be in that relationship.

If he is going to be spending time at her house, again, after A YEAR AND A HALF, then he is part of the household while he's there, which means taking the bad with the good.

Oh, but wait....he clearly has a gigantic Care Bears heart: 'Awwww, honey....sorry you're having a tough time right now. Yeah, little Johnny is really upset. Man...poor kid. And wow, you just look overwhelmed. I bet you're so tired. Alright.....welp, see ya later!'

The old saying is that if you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

June 29, 2014

Upon sitting down he compared my reaction to his whining dog to my crying son. His dog was scratching his bedroom door when I slept over, crying and whining. I tried to wake him up, but he wouldn't wake up. So, I let the dog in the bedroom and they continued to spoon each other...still not waking up. So, I got irritated and left. So, him up and leaving when my son started to cry and me getting mad is a double standard.

When I talked to him about what would he do if he lived here. He can't just up and leave...he informed me that he would just go sleep on the couch.

He raised step kids...one of which is still in touch with him, but he has no kids of his own. He claims he loves my son and he wants to be a father figure to him. He even said he would have a child with me. He's been making an effort to get to know my son better...but I just feel like something is missing. My son means the world to me and I'm not about to let anyone hurt his little heart. Maybe I'm being overprotective? Paranoid?

He said I told him before that if my son started crying he could up and leave. I really don't remember that....and maybe it was before we became "serious". I just thought we were at a higher level in our relationship.

June 29, 2014

Upon sitting down he compared my reaction to his whining dog to my crying son. His dog was scratching his bedroom door when I slept over, crying and whining. I tried to wake him up, but he wouldn't wake up. So, I let the dog in the bedroom and they continued to spoon each other...still not waking up. So, I got irritated and left. So, him up and leaving when my son started to cry and me getting mad is a double standard.

When I talked to him about what would he do if he lived here. He can't just up and leave...he informed me that he would just go sleep on the couch.

He raised step kids...one of which is still in touch with him, but he has no kids of his own. He claims he loves my son and he wants to be a father figure to him. He even said he would have a child with me. He's been making an effort to get to know my son better...but I just feel like something is missing. My son means the world to me and I'm not about to let anyone hurt his little heart. Maybe I'm being overprotective? Paranoid?

He said I told him before that if my son started crying he could up and leave. I really don't remember that....and maybe it was before we became "serious". I just thought we were at a higher level in our relationship.

Personally I'd have to rethink the whole situation if I were you. He compared your son to his dog?

That's messed up right there and the only reason he sees them the same is because he has no kids of his own. His dog is his main responsibility.

Which is fine...it's his choice to not go around spreading his seed...but he should at least have the good sense to know that owning a dog is minuscule compared to raising a man.

Really it is in your and more importantly your son's best interest to only date sensible men.

Edited June 29, 2014 by amaysngrace

June 29, 2014

It's a tough one really. I have kids too and an ex partner that wasn't too supportive. There were times when I had to rush my kid of to hospital during the early morning hours because she couldn't breathe, and he would carry on sleeping. I'm talking 2-3am and this happened often especially during winter, as she's asthmatic. I always put it down to 'this was my kid and my responsibilty'. Thinking back, he should have been more supportive. (Btw, 2 years together at this time)

Again, we don't know for how long you both were awake. Did he start crying from 11 till 4, or was it only for an hour? If it was continuous, I would have just gone and slept with him to calm him down. Clearly he wasn't happy about something and during those times the only person who can help is the parent and not the partner. If he stuck it out for a couple of hours then I wouldn't be concerned. Look at the relationship he has with your son, rather than basing it on this one incident.

And before you do move in together, it's probably best you discuss all these issues and make sure he understands his expected role in this relationship.

June 29, 2014

Package deal, guy.

If he is going to be in a serious relationship with a woman who has a child, that's just part of it. If it's too much for him, he should have thought about that a year and a half ago.

He signed up to do the right thing, and the right thing is to care for the woman, care for the child, and be part of the solution, not bolt when the room gets a little hot. Oh, you need sleep? Tough effing crap, dude. If you want sleep, stay single or date women with no kids, or at least older kids.

To me, it's a dick move. No other way to frame it.

She chose to have a child.

He did not choose to have a child so why should he share 50% of the responsibility of raising a child he never wanted?

Sure, I would personally expect that a kind hearted and generous man would at least help out some of the time and do some helpful things for the little one. However it is NOT his job or responsibility to raise someone else's child.

There is no need to have made this man stay up all night just because the child SHE chose to bring into the world is throwing a tantrum. He is NOT her husband yet.

I expect a partner to be accepting and accommodating with a child ; expecting him to raise it with your is another thing entirely.

June 29, 2014

I think that it would be nice of this man to occasionally bare the burden of this toddler staying awake all night. I would expect a nice guy to help the mother deal with 4 am wake up tantrums. SOME of the time.

It shouldn't be a given though. That's unreasonable. It's not fair by most people's standards to EXPECT men to just jump in and share 50% of the parenting responsibilities before they are even married.

I'd expect my own boyfriend to stay awake and help out because he's truly a selfless and wonderful man when it comes to all things leigh 87... But I wouldn't let him get up everytime my child we up at 4 am.

It's selfish of the OP to expect that from him everytime.

My partner and I got a cat together. She came into bed with poor stuck to her bottom. My bf automatically got up at 3 am to wash our kittens little bottom. I thought it was so nice of him and I was grateful. I didn't expect it though simply because we both love the cat.

June 29, 2014

First, I think the title of your thread is very deceiving. Loser? I was fully expecting a pot smokin', jobless deadbeat which does not seem to be the case at all.

Second, I'm going to have to side with the guy on this one and let you know that I think you're over reacting.

According to your introduction, up until this very particular situation he was by all accounts a wonderful partner and father-figure to your son.

I don't think it's very fair to write him off as a "loser" or as someone who doesn't really care about you or your son over this ONE incident.

Could he have handled it a bit better? Probably but maybe so could have you.

I agree with one of the posters who said that when you're woken up in the middle of the night like that you're not always thinking or reacting in a way that is indicative of who you really are especially if you're someone who needs sleep.

So he bailed in the middle of the night because he needed sleep. Does that really erase all the great things about him up to that point?

I think you need to look at the BIG picture rather than singling out one incident and judging him for it. Unless you're not telling us the whole story he sounds like a pretty good guy for both you and your son. He may not be perfect but then again no one is including you.

Raising children is bloody hard work at the best of times never mind raising them when their not biologically your own.

My advice? Cut this guy some slack for heaven's sake.

June 29, 2014