the commitment phobic love of my life

[man_on_the_box]

Hi

 

This will be quite a long story but i'm basically looking for your views on my situation and any advice to salvage my relationship.

 

Me, 26 yo guy, hard working, good career, lives alone, falls in love easily.

 

Her, 28 yo girl, part time job she doesnt enjoy but has been doing for years, no future plans, lives with parents, has no intention of changing, obviously commitment phobe.

 

We sound completely different, I know, but apart from our relationship views, life targets and such we have everything in common, and whether we're "together" or not, cant help having a great time, and we agree we are best friends.

 

We started going out 2 years ago, I never knew her as a friend beforehand. We got to know eachother and we realised we were great in eachothers company. After a few months I asked whether she wanted to be official, so to speak. She said no that time and a few times over the ensuing 6 months or so, until I gave up asking and just decided we would eventually consider ourselves to be together, and I should stop asking as she obviously had a an issue there.

After about 16 months our relationship had finally went a bit more intimate and she introduced me to her parents. I knew her well by this stage, and had stopped doing things that I thought she would consider too clingy. For example, my parents live abroad and although I would have loved her to meet them I never asked as going on holiday to meet my parents would definitely scare her off. I started to tell her I loved her as she was leaving a date, and had only done this about 3 times before suddenly, a few weeks after spending xmas with her and her parents, she said she needed "to talk". Out of the blue.

 

We had a chat and she told me that even though she cared so much about me she wanted to try being friends for a while. I controlled myself and said if thats what she wanted, there was nothing I could do, and that I would try to be friends even though it might take me some time to be able to do that. She was crying the entire time, which annoyed me seen as it was her call. Also what really annoyed me about the break is that she said that normally at this stage in a relationship, couple are usually talking about moving in together - something I couldn't have wanted more, but never ask her as I knew it would just push her away. Besides, she told me in the past that she didn't really want that. I told her that if she couldnt even commit to a relationship how could she possibly commit to living together.

Anyway, they were excuses, and I figured out in the ensuing break that she was a commitment phobe.

 

I came up with a plan to get her back. I decided to ignore her for a few months, make her miss me, realise what she was missing, then get back in touch. It was the worst 2 months of my life, but eventually she called, we got together, and decided to go out together again. She said she had a horrible time without me too.

 

We carried on going out together, being intimate, but still not calling ourselves boyfriend and girlfriend, and me now being aware she is commitment phobic. I realised we really hadn't communicated properly the first time around so I expressed my honest feeling a bit more and talked about our relationship, when this happened however, it always seemed to ne me doing all the talking - one thing she did say is that the first time round she did consider us a couple, which annoyed me because, as I told her, we'd never had that conversation and things would have been different if we had. She must know by now that i'm aware of how scared she is about commitment based on things i've said. She keeps saying she wants kids and I always reply that it probably won't happen until she gets over her commitment problem. I would like nothing more. I've told her that I worry she will grow old alone and look back at us and wonder what on earth happened. It lasted about 4 months, which brings me to a few weeks ago. Everything seemed back to what it was so we went on our first short holiday away. We both had an amazing time, and I thought it was another big step in our relationship, just like when I met her parents - but similarly, she broke it off a week later and said she wanted to try being friends and see how it goes. She's running away again.

 

We've been out a few times since then, me pretending im ok with it, her getting what she claims to want.

She told me the last time that she wanted to kiss me goodbye. I told her that I knew she did, and I did too. I told her that if we both want to kiss, it makes no sense not doing it, we're both hurting eachother that way.

 

Anyway I will never get over this girl and the only reason im going out as friends is because I still hope that somewhere down the line she will change her mind and we can carry on as usual, although I havnt told her this.

 

I'm feeling inclined to start ignoring her again though, in the hope of getting her back as I did before, as pretending to be happy going out as friends is hurting me too much. I think about her all the time, so much so that after all this acting thick-skinned, I break down in tears on the bus, in front of friends, at work. It's too much.

 

I know the usual advice us to ditch commitment phobes. I know I deserve a commitment and I'm her loss. I know what i'm doing with my life and am in a secure place, she floats around making big plans which although I support, I know will never happen. I know I should ditch her, but I can't. I am madly in love and have been for 2 years. I want to spend my life with her no matter what it takes. Her happiness is more important to me than my own.

 

Can anyone please offer any advice here?

As I said i'm starting to feek I shoukd ignore her like I. did before, because being a pretend friend is too much, and it worked before, for a little while. I don't care how long I have to wait for her, i'm in no hurry - I just want her, committed, at some point in the future, and I'm just hoping she will change in her own time.

 

Thanks.

Edited June 12, 2014 by man_on_the_box

[Griesfootball]

I think maybe you need to stay away from her and make her miss you make it seem like an all or nothing thing because you are stuck. She is comfortable with just being friends and will continue to use that it sounds

[man_on_the_box]

I know what you mean, it's worked before and I'm really not happy pretending to be happy with being her friend. I plan to see her in 8 days. I was planning on letting her know I can't do the friends thing then, in person. At least I have plenty of time to think about it. In a way I'm not happy giving her what she wants when she's completely unwilling to change for me like I have for her. Trying the friends thing makes me angry at her rather than making us hapoy.

[Griesfootball]

I tried to be friends after my ex after 3 weeks of no contact and it turned into more arguments. You have to move on while not. If you really think this person is worth it they should come back to you on your own but you don't want to be stuck on her it's best if you keep your options open I'm sure she is doing the same

[Elle1975]

The problem with ignoring her is that you will most likely go through the same cycle again.

 

I am not sure if she is commitment phobic, or just doesn't feel the way you do. She likes you, likes to hang out and play bf and gf.. but not enough to put a label on it.

 

Labels are huge. If she introduce you as ''Bob'' then that's all that you are. You're her friend, not her bf.

 

I'd suggest to go spend your energy and love on someone who will reciprocate.

[Philomena_Pond]

I'm going through something similar.

 

Honestly….Just talk to your friends when you feel sad…journal, do whatever you need to now to figure out how to be okay without her in your life right now, but don't close any doors.

 

The only way that they will be able to figure out if you are something they want to keep is if you stay away from them. It hurts A LOT and is really hard, but just think of it like they are out of country for a while and have no means of communication. You're feelings won't change, but your life HAS to move on and be the same day to day.

 

Eventually, either you will move on or you will regain contact and get back together.

 

Just give her as much space as possible and if she questions you about it just say "you are respecting her wishes and also need some time on your own." but don't tell her you want her out of your life…nothing mean.

 

Getting an ex back will be tell tale on how you respected the others needs in the end.

 

I hate when people say you can never get back together or forgive…look at our basic friendships with people. How many times have we gotten into fights with our friends and sworn them off for good, just to meet them up for drinks and be best buds a few months later? People do move past their problems its just we don't beg and plead our friends for friendship. We give them space.

 

Just take a breath and treat it like a vacation. That's what I'm doing and it helps.

[Itspointless]

The problem with ignoring her is that you will most likely go through the same cycle again.

This^^ (ten characters)

[man_on_the_box]

Thanks everyone, do you think it's wiser to meet up with her on the weekend as I have said I might. Tbh i'm not feeling it, i'm starting to feel like im resenting her a bit, and I really dont want to so maybe I should leave it for now. I know she will be sooo disappointed if I cance.

 

Just as a quick update, I saw her out on saturday night. I said hello when I sae her around 1am but didnt cling on and got on with dancing with my friends, as she did. Shortly after, I bumped into her alone and we were about to start talking when I realized it would just ruin my evening as i'd keep on thinking about her, so I told her to leave me alone and that she should go and play with her friends. I didn't see her for the rest of the night, but at 6am (before going to bed), she texted me asking why I was "mean" to her. It obviously bothered her loads and Im glad.

I told her it had been her choice to call it a day between us and that although she used to have my undivided attention, because of her choices she had no right to have a go at me for asking her to leave me alone. Many more deep texts ensued and, keeping my options open, I told her we would have to see how I feel before spending any time together. She tells me she'd be really upset if we couldn't hang out anymore and that we habe a special bomd yada yada so on. I have some power now, which is why i'm thinking of cancelling our meet on the weekend coming. What do you think?

[man_on_the_box]

Oh just so y'all knoe, i've startes bettering myself straight away - doing exercise, saving money, eating healthier and stopped smoking (well it's been 5 days but that's the logest ever in 10 years). I realize I may not be in a relationship with her amymore, but I realize I have the power ober what is left, which is why i'm thinking of using that power to not give her what she wants and not stoop to being her lapdog friend. I'm surevit will drive her nuts. Even when we were happy together, she told me I was her best friend.

[OwMyEyeball]

a) You're not in love with her, you're in love with the notion of a relationship, to the point of obsession

b) Your manipulative actions are motivated by selfish desire, not any compassionate interest in her

c) She does not have commitment phobia (i.e. an irrational fear of commitment), she has an aversion to commitment to you.

d) Falsely supporting someone's dreams and ideas for their future is cruel. You can't truly support what you don't believe in.

 

Everything I see in your statements is about control, not love.

[man_on_the_box]

Ouch. I do disagree with a lot of what you say though. Yes Iike being in a relationship but not with anybody!

It may sound like I'm just being manipulative, however when I talk about power and such it's only out of anger because i'm still dealing with a recent breakup, be it badly or not, and I'm not wanting to sound soppy, desperate and pathetic like most OPs on this forum.

The reason I believe her to be commitment phobic is not only because she has told me, but because she fails to commit to anything, not just relationships. For example, she never uses her talents to pursue what she wants, she just talks about her dreams and does nothing to achieve them, making excuses for doing so. I keep saying she should, and I seem to believe in her more than she does herself.

 

I'm here for advice, not unfounded destructive criticism.

Edited June 17, 2014 by man_on_the_box

[ConfusedHumanBeing]

Ouch. I do disagree with a lot of what you say though. Yes Iike being in a relationship but not with anybody!

It may sound like I'm just being manipulative, however when I talk about power and such it's only out of anger because i'm still dealing with a recent breakup, be it badly or not, and I'm not wanting to sound soppy, desperate and pathetic like most OPs on this forum.

The reason I believe her to be commitment phobic is not only because she has told me, but because she fails to commit to anything, not just relationships. For example, she never uses her talents to pursue what she wants, she just talks about her dreams and does nothing to achieve them, making excuses for doing so. I keep saying she should, and I seem to believe in her more than she does herself.

 

I'm here for advice, not unfounded destructive criticism.

 

Its not destructive criticism. Its an opinion....of which I agree with.

 

You knew what you were doing when you saw her on the weekend. You were happy that she was bothered and now playing this silly game of "haha I dont care anymore" to try and peak interest with her. Wanting to cancel just to have power? Dude, come on. That's something out of High School.

 

What you SHOULD be doing is NOT talking to her. You cannot manipulate someone into caring about you. She was done with the relationship and thats all thats important. "Commitment phobe" "GIGS" "Cold Feet" WHATEVER you want to call it, the relationship is done. You cant do anything to get her back, but you CAN do things to push her more away. Doing what you are doing will.

 

You need to cut contact and avoid this situation. Do not call, text, message, social media chat, etc. What she does isnt your business anymore. She will throw breadcrumbs at you, but she is trying to bait you into not hating her and keeping up this hot/cold game. IF you want to just be friends, do what you're doing. If you don't, then stop.

[OwMyEyeball]

Ouch. I do disagree with a lot of what you say though. Yes Iike being in a relationship but not with anybody!

It may sound like I'm just being manipulative, however when I talk about power and such it's only out of anger because i'm still dealing with a recent breakup, be it badly or not, and I'm not wanting to sound soppy, desperate and pathetic like most OPs on this forum.

The reason I believe her to be commitment phobic is not only because she has told me, but because she fails to commit to anything, not just relationships. For example, she never uses her talents to pursue what she wants, she just talks about her dreams and does nothing to achieve them, making excuses for doing so. I keep saying she should, and I seem to believe in her more than she does herself.

 

I'm here for advice, not unfounded destructive criticism.

You don't sound soppy, desperate or pathetic.

 

You come across as vindictive, manipulative and selfish.

 

I'm calling a spade a spade. The only thing I appreciate from your posts is the candor.

 

You come on here openly sharing your deeds of abuse, wrap them in a frame that focuses solely on your needs, then conclude with plans for continued emotional manipulation.

 

Maybe you just haven't presented yourself well, but the behaviour displayed thus far leans far more towards sociopathy than genuine compassion.

 

So ya, expect some criticism.

[man_on_the_box]

Ok I hear you, but this isn't about revenge or anything.

This site seems to mainly spread the message to use NC but surely that's not too nice a thing to do when my ex is begging to stay friends. Only I don't feel I can at this time as it's just not what I want and will keep me down in the dumps, even though I would like to because she is also my best friend. I may not have made that clear and represented myself as vengeful and selfish, but bottom line is I just don't know what to do. I want her in my life no matter wath and she tells me she feels the same, I just can't see her as friends and put on a facade and pretend it's not killing me.

 

Emotional manipulation? I'm just trying to get over her as best I can, surely I'm the one being manipulated and abused by her sending me messages all the time? She just sent me another as Im writing this. I've told her how hard and hurtful it is to go out and be friends but she keeps pushing me.

 

Sorry to get defensive, I know you're all trying to help really, but Im going through too much pain now to deal with people calling me an abuser when all I've done is treat the one I love as just that for 2 years, just to get ditched with no explanation. I bet that did sound pathetic.

[BC1980]

Ok I hear you, but this isn't about revenge or anything.

This site seems to mainly spread the message to use NC but surely that's not too nice a thing to do when my ex is begging to stay friends. Only I don't feel I can at this time as it's just not what I want and will keep me down in the dumps, even though I would like to because she is also my best friend. I may not have made that clear and represented myself as vengeful and selfish, but bottom line is I just don't know what to do. I want her in my life no matter wath and she tells me she feels the same, I just can't see her as friends and put on a facade and pretend it's not killing me.

 

Emotional manipulation? I'm just trying to get over her as best I can, surely I'm the one being manipulated and abused by her sending me messages all the time? She just sent me another as Im writing this. I've told her how hard and hurtful it is to go out and be friends but she keeps pushing me.

 

Sorry to get defensive, I know you're all trying to help really, but Im going through too much pain now to deal with people calling me an abuser when all I've done is treat the one I love as just that for 2 years, just to get ditched with no explanation. I bet that did sound pathetic.

 

Going NC has nothing to do with not being nice. What's not nice is her begging for friendship from you when she knows you are heart broken. You should try being nice to yourself instead of putting her want for friendship ahead of your need to heal and move on. The only thing you have accomplished, so far, is digging yourself a deeper hole to crawl out of.

[Elle1975]

Ok I hear you, but this isn't about revenge or anything.

This site seems to mainly spread the message to use NC but surely that's not too nice a thing to do when my ex is begging to stay friends. Only I don't feel I can at this time as it's just not what I want and will keep me down in the dumps, even though I would like to because she is also my best friend. I may not have made that clear and represented myself as vengeful and selfish, but bottom line is I just don't know what to do. I want her in my life no matter wath and she tells me she feels the same, I just can't see her as friends and put on a facade and pretend it's not killing me.

 

Emotional manipulation? I'm just trying to get over her as best I can, surely I'm the one being manipulated and abused by her sending me messages all the time? She just sent me another as Im writing this. I've told her how hard and hurtful it is to go out and be friends but she keeps pushing me.

 

Sorry to get defensive, I know you're all trying to help really, but Im going through too much pain now to deal with people calling me an abuser when all I've done is treat the one I love as just that for 2 years, just to get ditched with no explanation. I bet that did sound pathetic.

 

NC is not about being nasty. It's about setting boundaries and getting over someone.

 

Pressuring an ex into being friends is an example of not "being nice".

 

I don't feel the need to remain friend with an ex. I have friends already. He was my boyfriend, now he's not, good bye!

 

In the end it's your decision.

[ConfusedHumanBeing]

Ok I hear you, but this isn't about revenge or anything.

This site seems to mainly spread the message to use NC but surely that's not too nice a thing to do when my ex is begging to stay friends. Only I don't feel I can at this time as it's just not what I want and will keep me down in the dumps, even though I would like to because she is also my best friend. I may not have made that clear and represented myself as vengeful and selfish, but bottom line is I just don't know what to do. I want her in my life no matter wath and she tells me she feels the same, I just can't see her as friends and put on a facade and pretend it's not killing me.

 

Emotional manipulation? I'm just trying to get over her as best I can, surely I'm the one being manipulated and abused by her sending me messages all the time? She just sent me another as Im writing this. I've told her how hard and hurtful it is to go out and be friends but she keeps pushing me.

 

Sorry to get defensive, I know you're all trying to help really, but Im going through too much pain now to deal with people calling me an abuser when all I've done is treat the one I love as just that for 2 years, just to get ditched with no explanation. I bet that did sound pathetic.

 

I understand you are heartbroken and probably pretty short with emotions, but you have got to think rationally.

 

First, NC isnt for someone else. Not to get them back. Not to use it as a tool for them to miss you. Not use for anything but TO MOVE ON. The relationship is over. Finished. Complete. There is NOTHING you can do to get her back. Your head is spinning 1000 MPH because you dont know where to go. There is only one way you can go, so it makes it easier. There are LOADS you can do to lose your respect and dignity and fudge things up worse than they are now though. Just keep that in mind.

 

Second, you REALLY want to be her friend huh? So you are cool with her dating other people? You are cool with her telling you about her dates? About how she does "things" with the other guy? Thats cool with you? Because thats what friends do. You want her around as friends because the thought of not being with her scares the crap out of you. Its been two years...you have grown accustomed to being with her. It's normal. Having her around is a TERRIBLE idea and will only make you suffer. She wants to be friends so she doesnt feel like the bad person AND to keep you around as a backup option. If something doesnt go right, then you will always be there. You've been demoted HARD and she will never respect you again if you come crawling back.

 

I dont know the reasons she left. Only she knows....sad thing is, she will never tell you the truth. The real truth is that she has been detaching from you (quietly) for a while now. She emotionally detached quite the time ago. You got hit with this crazy and fast, but this wanst crazy for her. She is wanting you to be around (friend) because its familiar, but it wont be the way you want it. It will be SO much worse. You will suffer for SEVERAL months.

 

There is really ONLY one way you can go with this, and that is straight forward. It sucks, but such is life.

[stillfiguringitallou]

I see a lot on this board about "emotional manipulation" and how you can't manipulate someone into wanting to be with you - and it reminds me SO MUCH of crap my ex said to me.

 

Being open and honest about how you feel, and how someones actions have impacted YOU - particularly when this person has a notion that you should still want to be their very best friend and supportive of them - is NOT emotional manipulation - it is honesty.

 

Something this world is severely lacking in.

 

Shutting someone out that you have spent years of your life with in at attempt to "better yourself" that is really just code for "punish them for having the audacity to walk out" IS emotional manipulation.

 

Yes NC is for YOU to protect YOU and when you look at it from that perspective it really does work.

 

But you know what I see a lot of on here.

 

"Why do you want to talk to someone like that"

"they don't deserve to have you in their life"

"let them miss you for once"

 

THAT - THAT is emotional manipulation. Holding someone accountable for their actions and the impact of those actions - and expecting them to take responsibility for them in order to maintain a friendship (that THEY want to maintain) is not.

 

Jesus.

[stillfiguringitallou]

And furthermore - remaining friends with you exes isn't always the end of the world.

 

Believe it or not there are people willing to be accountable and responsible for their part in the relationship not working and still value the friendship. I have decades long friendships that resulted from this.

 

Some people you need to leave behind - this is one of them.

[ConfusedHumanBeing]

I see a lot on this board about "emotional manipulation" and how you can't manipulate someone into wanting to be with you - and it reminds me SO MUCH of crap my ex said to me.

 

Being open and honest about how you feel, and how someones actions have impacted YOU - particularly when this person has a notion that you should still want to be their very best friend and supportive of them - is NOT emotional manipulation - it is honesty.

 

Something this world is severely lacking in.

 

Shutting someone out that you have spent years of your life with in at attempt to "better yourself" that is really just code for "punish them for having the audacity to walk out" IS emotional manipulation.

 

Yes NC is for YOU to protect YOU and when you look at it from that perspective it really does work.

 

But you know what I see a lot of on here.

 

"Why do you want to talk to someone like that"

"they don't deserve to have you in their life"

"let them miss you for once"

 

THAT - THAT is emotional manipulation. Holding someone accountable for their actions and the impact of those actions - and expecting them to take responsibility for them in order to maintain a friendship (that THEY want to maintain) is not.

 

Jesus.

 

I think everyone gets the notion of what you're saying. It's not "emotional manipulation" or whatever you want to call it. It's called moving on.

 

This person has CHOSE to not be with you. They think their lives are better without dating you. They chose to demote you. You were in the big leagues and they think it's better to send you down to the minors while someone takes your place.

 

When it first happens, its SO raw. You are SO confused and wanting it back that you'd probably chop your ear off for another chance. The depression reeks and is not a good look for anyone. The dumper throws out the olive branch of "friendship" right after because they feel bad. They know what its like and how the other person feels because.....well, they've thought about it for a long time.

 

The dumpee obviously has feelings still. Friendship is WAY out of the question. Why? Because you still love them! The dumper dont want that anymore.

 

Is friendship possible with an ex? Yes of course. I had a GF that I dated for awhile, and it didnt work out. If I was to try and be friends after, it would have taken me FOREVER to get over the situation. Seeing her everyday, talking to her...realizing that she doesnt want me like that was hard. WHY keep yourself around that? I waited a good amount of time to heal and realize that the relationship was something I didnt want. We talk about a year later when both of us had moved on, and now were good friends. She sometimes talks to me about her BF's and her sex life. Imagine what I would feel like if she told me this stuff when we first broke up? I'd be done.

 

For the OP, since he still has SO many feelings for the ex, its going to be impossible for him to have a friendship right now. Maybe a couple years down the road perhaps when the feelings are not there anymore....but right now, it's just disaster.

 

NC is for you. To heal, protect, save image...all of that.

[stillfiguringitallou]

Meh - that's the other thing

 

"saving your image"

 

something else that is wrong with society. Allowing other peoples image of you to effect your image of yourself.

 

For me I suppose honestly is always the best policy - that includes being honest about why you won't be friends and why you don't want contact. Someones opinion of me and my motivations for doing so - or their perception of those motivations - just doesn't register on my radar.

 

I am who I am. Being upset over a LTR doesn't change who I am. Showing those emotions - doesn't change who I am. Allowing myself time to grieve the relationship in a healthy fashion - doesn't change who I am. In truth NOT doing those things - changes who I am.

 

I don't have an image to protect honestly - because my image is exactly who I am.

 

I guess I'm lucky - aside from self improvement - changing those things I personally don't find appealing about myself - I've not changed too much over the years. Probably because I'm a stubborn ass. But because of that I have no "image" to protect. I am human - I feel things - other peoples actions impact me - I react - both positively and negatively to those things - and as long as I am recognizing my negative reactions and trying consistently to improve on them - I'm okay.

[jphcbpa]

does she have a pattern of being avoidant/commitment phobic in her previous relationships?

 

one is fluke, twice is a coincidence, three times is a pattern.

[man_on_the_box]

jphcbpa, she is 29 and has only had 1 relationship, of 3 months, before this one. She was also a virg in when I met her.So not really a relationship kinda girl. Even her mum and friends have a go at her for being odd with relations. However these are not the things that make me think she is commitment phobic, but the fact she doesn't commit to anything, not just relationships. She keeps starting projects and not seeing them through to the end. Jobs, life plans, even decorating!

[ConfusedHumanBeing]

jphcbpa, she is 29 and has only had 1 relationship, of 3 months, before this one. She was also a virg in when I met her.So not really a relationship kinda girl. Even her mum and friends have a go at her for being odd with relations. However these are not the things that make me think she is commitment phobic, but the fact she doesn't commit to anything, not just relationships. She keeps starting projects and not seeing them through to the end. Jobs, life plans, even decorating!

 

At this stage, it really doesnt matter what she is or isnt. The fact remains she doesnt want to be with you. Thats the only important part.

 

You cannot change anyone or make them feel a certain way. All you can and should focus on is you.