stillfiguringitallou Posted June 7, 2014 Posted June 7, 2014 No, insecurity is clinging to another woman's husband. I do not dislike my exes, they simply have families now and careers. I don't cling to the past. I might say hello even once in a while. But if their spouses found my messages they would not get angry at me because it would be, "Hey how's it going, gorgeous family, hope all is well! " It's not about relationships with exes anyways, I don't believe men and women are ever friends without one wanting to have sex with the other. I would not go for lunch or out for a beer with ANY married man. And if any guy is flirty with me on facebook or ANYWHERE and I see they are married, then they are BLOCKED. Scumbags. It's not insecurity, it's morals. Clinging? I'm not going to argue this point on a message board and we will have to agree to disagree. I see no issue in carrying a friendship with an ex, most people don't. My exclaimed not to - but obviously had issue with it (regardless of the fact he was friends with some of his - maybe there was some projection going on there) I'm not saying going and having an intimate lunch or dinner for two - even on a rare occasion, and most of their spouses have absolutely no issue with me whatsoever. We have all spent a lot of quality time together as adults. It's called being an adult and being responsible for your own emotions and not projecting them onto another. Being secure in the relationship you have. I will say I think most people who are jealous of exes as friends have experienced an ex/ex affair in their life time and hide the understandable insecurity that causes behind "morals" I have plenty of morals. They just don't include shutting exes out of my life because things didn't work on a romantic level between us. The only way I've ever shut someone out - male or female - is when they burn a bridge. My relationships in life don't start and stop based off new people who come into it and I am always up front about the males that ARE exes. Of course. I'm also not scared to be alone either. So, the person who works for me will not see me as some immoral harlot for maintaining decades long friendships with people I may ONCE have dated in the long long ago.
KaliLove Posted June 7, 2014 Posted June 7, 2014 Not true in the least- all due respect. I have not seen him (laid eyes on him) in 8 years we live cross country. It didn't make our friendship any less weak. It took NO TIME from his family as we did not see each other. I don't get a long with women because for the most part they are catty and back stabbing. I just am not like that. I do not enjoy discussing the latest in home decor, hairstyles, fashion, cooking or any of that stuff. I have more of a male brain. My husband does the shopping and cooking in our house. Wow. You have an extremely convoluted and cliched idea of what being a woman is. Do you realize that you yourself are actually coming across as very catty in this post? To answer the original question again, yes, it probably is goodbye forever. His marriage is more important to him than his friendship with you (as it should be), and if he is a decent person, I doubt he will want to hurt his wife any more than he already has. 9
Elle1975 Posted June 7, 2014 Posted June 7, 2014 I read the answers and I thought "if it looks like a duck and walks like a duck.." I'm not convinced that you aren't romantically interested. I see the word insecurity getting throw left and right. If it was as innocent as you make it to be, she wouldn't have flipped out. She threatened to leave him and take their kid with her, that's pretty big. Not just a simple fight. Anyway, your opinion on it, or mine, doesn't matter. Only hers and his does, as they are married. And their marriage gets the final word on it. 7
writergal Posted June 7, 2014 Posted June 7, 2014 I read the answers and I thought "if it looks like a duck and walks like a duck.." I'm not convinced that you aren't romantically interested. I see the word insecurity getting throw left and right. If it was as innocent as you make it to be, she wouldn't have flipped out. She threatened to leave him and take their kid with her, that's pretty big. Not just a simple fight. Anyway, your opinion on it, or mine, doesn't matter. Only hers and his does, as they are married. And their marriage gets the final word on it. Agree with you 100%. 2
stillafool Posted June 7, 2014 Posted June 7, 2014 Thank you, yes I think she feels betrayed because he wasn't honest, she has every right to be. I would be. No, I don't think I'm awesome, I think that we have been friends for 20 years and I think it was a zone we were comfortable in. She did give him the her or me ultimatum.. He doesn't want to lose his child. I totally agree with him there. Hmmm, Smitten4Ever does this mean you are smitten forever over this guy? I don't blame his wife one bit as you don't mean them any good. It isn't that he doesn't want to lose his child; it's that he doesn't want to lose his WIFE AND CHILD. Your crying over this man moving on with his life says everything about the way you feel about him. Unfortunately for you his wife and kid mean much more to him than you. Just move on with your life as your relationship was completely inappropriate and now it's over. 2
Author smitten4ever Posted June 7, 2014 Author Posted June 7, 2014 Hmmm, Smitten4Ever does this mean you are smitten forever over this guy? I don't blame his wife one bit as you don't mean them any good. It isn't that he doesn't want to lose his child; it's that he doesn't want to lose his WIFE AND CHILD. Your crying over this man moving on with his life says everything about the way you feel about him. Unfortunately for you his wife and kid mean much more to him than you. Just move on with your life as your relationship was completely inappropriate and now it's over. Correction: I KNOW the situation first hand. Remember- I have known him for over 20 years. He does not want to lose his CHILD. Many men and women stay in unhappy relationships for the kids sake. Everyone here makes ME out to be the bad guy. I have stood by him as a friend through everything and he has done the same for me. I don't even see the wife as the ENEMY and I don't even know her. I feel for her ALOT. What I see here is a bunch of judgemental people and thats about it. No one should judge anyone.
stillafool Posted June 7, 2014 Posted June 7, 2014 Well since he is such a good friend you were happy for him when they married, right? Did you reach out to her and tell her how happy you are for them and invite them to visit you and your husband the first chance they got? If a male friend of me and my husband got married we would rally around them with cheer and good will. Have you done any of those things. Also why are you so defensive when someone says he loves his wife? Isn't that what you want for your friend? For him to be in love and happy. 2
writergal Posted June 7, 2014 Posted June 7, 2014 (edited) Well OP how are people being judgmental exactly? You write that you feel your male friend is your soulmate and before he married his current wife, you acknowledge that you two had a sexual relationship with each other. Now that his wife of 8 years came across your emails to each other and went ballistic you're upset that he wants to focus his energy on his marriage and his family instead of you. I'd say no one here is being judgmental. If anything, posters here have given an honest opinion which doesn't jibe with what you want to hear. You want to hear that the friendship won't change between you two. Sorry but that's not realistic at all. Of course he will fade from your life now that his wife has made him choose between her and you. Of course he'll choose his wife over you. He's in love with her. He's not in love with you. You're married to another man whom you claim understands this "bond" you have with your male friend because you wrote that the three of you all had sex together at some point. So you can't deny that you still don't have sexual feelings for your friend. I mean, you had sex with him and your husband so of course you still have feelings for him. If your friendship was only platonic you wouldn't have had a three-way with him. Why isn't your husband your soul mate? Isn't that the more important question you should be asking here, rather than whether or not you should respect your male friend's boundaries and leave him and his wife alone and say goodbye to the friendship? Shouldn't your marriage be your main priority instead of obsessing over whether or not this guy friend stays in your life whom you claim you haven't even seen face to face in years? Edited June 7, 2014 by writergal 4
KaliLove Posted June 7, 2014 Posted June 7, 2014 (edited) Smitten, bottom line- he's not fighting for you. He's choosing his wife. It's time to let go. I would recommend posting in the OW section as you'll find more people who can understand and empathize with your situation than you will here. Whether you choose to admit this to yourself or not, you were having an emotional affair with this man. I wish you the best of luck in your recovery. Edited June 7, 2014 by KaliLove 7
whatatangledweb Posted June 7, 2014 Posted June 7, 2014 I can understand that from your view you believe it was an innocent friendship. In her view it is not. You don't hide a friend for 8 years if it is innocent. Married people don't keep secret friends. When others are saying you took time from his family, they are looking at all the time he spent communicating with you. I don't believe in the soul mate concept. But it is usually not used to describe an innocent friendship. No, I don't believe he will try to talk with you again. Not if he wants to be with his wife. A secret friend she did not know about means she will never believe it is innocent. 6
writergal Posted June 7, 2014 Posted June 7, 2014 I can understand that from your view you believe it was an innocent friendship. In her view it is not. You don't hide a friend for 8 years if it is innocent. Married people don't keep secret friends. When others are saying you took time from his family, they are looking at all the time he spent communicating with you. I don't believe in the soul mate concept. But it is usually not used to describe an innocent friendship. No, I don't believe he will try to talk with you again. Not if he wants to be with his wife. A secret friend she did not know about means she will never believe it is innocent. Agree 100% with the bold. 1
Scarlet2 Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 From my experience it isn't goodbye. Eventually he'll get tired of her telling him what he can and can't do and he'll be back after things cool off. I had a guy friend who was married and I had no attraction or emotional feelings for him at all. One day I had asked to hang out with him without his wife and she got insecure and demanded he never talk to me again. He obeyed and needless to say they are divorced now and I refused to be his friend when he tried to come back because he didn't have enough balls to stand up or rationalize with her. Ex's can be friends or civil, there is no need to ever tell someone who they can or can't be friends with, even when there wasn't a prior relationship. If you do, that's your own insecurity and lack of trust with your partner. 1
Ronnie33 Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 (edited) I think it depends on the situation. I am still friends with my HS sweetheart 15 years later and I have been married for 4 years and my husband is now friends with him also. There has never been any ounce of me that has ever wanted to rekindle or hook up with him since we broke up. Through the years I have met his girlfriends and he my boyfriends and there was never an issue because we were always honest with everyone. I think that is where your problem lies is that he kept you a secret and to a spouse a secret friend equals no good. I understand where his wife is coming from and I also understand why you are mourning the loss of the friendship but the fault mostly lies on him and all you can do is accept it. That being said I totally understand why you are hurt. Regardless of whether or not the friendship was innapropriate you are still mourning the loss of a twenty year friendship and it hurts like losing anyone you love would. Edited June 8, 2014 by Ronnie33 2
jellybean89 Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 From my experience it isn't goodbye. Eventually he'll get tired of her telling him what he can and can't do and he'll be back after things cool off. I had a guy friend who was married and I had no attraction or emotional feelings for him at all. One day I had asked to hang out with him without his wife and she got insecure and demanded he never talk to me again. He obeyed and needless to say they are divorced now and I refused to be his friend when he tried to come back because he didn't have enough balls to stand up or rationalize with her. Ex's can be friends or civil, there is no need to ever tell someone who they can or can't be friends with, even when there wasn't a prior relationship. If you do, that's your own insecurity and lack of trust with your partner. Why did you want to exclude his wife? 7
ConfusedMarriedOW Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 This does sound like a painful chain of events. Particularly since you have known him for so long. I suppose all you have in your arsenal is to just try to self grow during this. You cannot force a friendship with this person. He wants to please his wife and it is within his right (and his wife's right) to do that. I am certain if he could, he would still be friends with you right now, but his wife isn't comfortable with that, so he needs to respect that. I imagine this is very painful, but you WILL make more friends and you will move on. Eventually. 2
Scarlet2 Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 Why did you want to exclude his wife? Because she always dominated everything that I barely got to talk to him when we were all together and anytime we went out, we both were following her around like puppies and she didn't have anything in common with us. I was friends with him, not her. Granted she's part of the package but she wasn't in the equation when I first became friends with him. I relate it to being similar to being friends with a neighbor kid but not their sibling.
Author smitten4ever Posted June 8, 2014 Author Posted June 8, 2014 He admits he should have been honest with her so that this would have already been "out there on the table" For those of you that are curious. No, he's not in love with her but he does love her and the child of course. He has told me before that he is not sure if he has ever been in love (he's almost 60). 2 failed marriages and now this one- that I do hope works out for him. I would love to see him truly happy for a change, He asked me when he was marrying her if I thought he should, was he doing the right thing? I said YES. I believe that people can love more than one. Society tells us it's wrong but love is not wrong so I don't see it. From my experience it isn't goodbye. Eventually he'll get tired of her telling him what he can and can't do and he'll be back after things cool off. I had a guy friend who was married and I had no attraction or emotional feelings for him at all. One day I had asked to hang out with him without his wife and she got insecure and demanded he never talk to me again. He obeyed and needless to say they are divorced now and I refused to be his friend when he tried to come back because he didn't have enough balls to stand up or rationalize with her. Ex's can be friends or civil, there is no need to ever tell someone who they can or can't be friends with, even when there wasn't a prior relationship. If you do, that's your own insecurity and lack of trust with your partner.
Author smitten4ever Posted June 8, 2014 Author Posted June 8, 2014 Yes I go through some dark times, usually in the morning and again in the evening. My husband says that he will be back- that right now he just wants to do the right thing, and I am going to let him. He knows how to reach me, but I am not contacting him. I realize people think my husband and I are odd, we're really not. I had a fantasy of 2 guys when I was WAY younger- we did that and the friend and I bonded. We didn't PLAN to have any feelings. Just thought it would be fun and that's it. That's not how it worked out and yes I am in mourning and it hurts like hell but I will get through it. I think it depends on the situation. I am still friends with my HS sweetheart 15 years later and I have been married for 4 years and my husband is now friends with him also. There has never been any ounce of me that has ever wanted to rekindle or hook up with him since we broke up. Through the years I have met his girlfriends and he my boyfriends and there was never an issue because we were always honest with everyone. I think that is where your problem lies is that he kept you a secret and to a spouse a secret friend equals no good. I understand where his wife is coming from and I also understand why you are mourning the loss of the friendship but the fault mostly lies on him and all you can do is accept it. That being said I totally understand why you are hurt. Regardless of whether or not the friendship was innapropriate you are still mourning the loss of a twenty year friendship and it hurts like losing anyone you love would.
Bootsie Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 He admits he should have been honest with her so that this would have already been "out there on the table" For those of you that are curious. No, he's not in love with her but he does love her and the child of course. He has told me before that he is not sure if he has ever been in love (he's almost 60). 2 failed marriages and now this one- that I do hope works out for him. I would love to see him truly happy for a change, He asked me when he was marrying her if I thought he should, was he doing the right thing? I said YES. I believe that people can love more than one. Society tells us it's wrong but love is not wrong so I don't see it. Did you get invited to their wedding and did you go? If not why not? Did you know your friendship (or the extent of it) was a secret from his wife? I don't see a problem with people having opposite sex friends however the "friendship" should not be a secret from the spouse. Any friend of one partner should make a point of being a "friend of the marriage". This doesn't mean being besties with the spouse and it doesn't even mean you have to like them. But what you do have to do is support your friend in being married to his wife. Make it clear that you refuse to be a secret, (because secret friends undermine rather than support marriage) and make it clear that intimate conversations are off limits as are conversations that are critical of the wife. By the way when the MM gives either the wife or the OW the "ILYBINILWY" (re the wife) speech that's a sure fire sign he's headed for affair territory.
MatchStick Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 Fast forward now he has been married to this wife for 8 years and they adopted a child who is now 4. The wife found our emails and went ballistic even though there was nothing "suggestive" in them. It's a bit fishy he didn't tell her about you. Not necessarily a bad thing, as some wives just don't like other females, period. I had that happen. A good friend married, met her and despite it being so obvious my friend and I would never be an item, went nutsy every time she suspected my involvement. What does matter is that she is ballistic now. You can try talking to her, talking to them, or any other kind of thing. It should be obvious to you the kind of headway you are making right away. I'm inclined to be with what someone else wrote "goodbye is goodbye." Maybe you could pull your friend aside and have a more friendly parting of ways. In my situation, my friend just disappeared after awhile. I knew what was happening, but it made it harder on me. About 18 years later, I ran across him just as he was divorcing from her. This demanding female cheated on him with several and left him for another man. We are friends again, but no where near the buddy-buddy than years past. Good luck.
Bootsie Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 ...some wives just don't like other females, period... The OP herself is the one that doesn't like other females; she described women in very unflattering terms in her earlier post. Did you read this before suggesting that it's the wife with this odd trait? It doesn't seem like it's the MM's wife that is the one that doesn't like other females. If she knew of the friendship then it's likely the content of the emails she found that set her off. She probably trusted her husband but has found emails in which she finds he's telling the OP that he doesn't really love his wife and is only staying for the sake of the child. The OP has told us they haven't actually seen each other in 8 years so my guess is he's poured out his heart to the OP and the wife has found these emails, otherwise how would the OP know all these intimate details of their marriage? 6
SunshineToday Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 It's clear that Smitten has stronger feelings then she is admitting. By her constant use of "he is choosing his child" Uh. No. He is choosing his MARRIAGE over an emotional probably ego stoking affair. You can get a divorce and still be a parent in 2014. But you are lucky, it sounds like you have a great understanding husband at home to help you forget this man. Who is obviously not as unhappy at home as you had hoped. 4
whichwayisup Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 Hi all, I'm new and I have a big problem. I have been friends with a guy for 20 years. I am now 44 he is 57. We are both married- my second and only marriage since I have known him. His 3rd since I have known him. We are like soulmates, we have always shared everything. We were intimate before (he was single and my husband knew about it and was ok with it). Fast forward now he has been married to this wife for 8 years and they adopted a child who is now 4. The wife found our emails and went ballistic even though there was nothing "suggestive" in them. I guess she has threatened to leave and take the child but he tells me he can't talk to me anymore. This happened 10 days ago. Will he really not talk to me? He was my best friend and now all I do is cry. Or is he just scared? He loves his wife and child more than he loves the friendship with you. Respect that and leave him alone, though I'm sure it's painful for you, if you truly care about him and want him to be happy do as he has asked, say goodbye. The thing you need to understand, you two may have been close for many years but his wife comes first, as it should be when couples are married. You weren't friends with his wife, only him so that makes it a selfish friendship. Just because your husband was okay with you having sex with him doesn't mean his wife is...And she isn't. 4
whichwayisup Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 Those rules belong nowhere, I'm sorry but I do not get along with women and the majority of my friendships have been with men and ONE I was intimate with. There is no reason whatsoever that two adults of opposite sex cannot be friends. That article sounded like it was written in the 1950's:o You need to try to have friendships with women. Or figure out why you can't be friends with women... Not judging you but you're missing out on something special. Why do you not get along with women? If you've answered this already, disregard my question (i've only read part of your thread so far).. 1
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