pizzanova Posted February 10, 2005 Posted February 10, 2005 Religion isnt important to my family (or me), so I'm free to date whoever I want/marry whoever I want. I'm in my early twenties, and I've fallen for a good guy friend that I've known for a couple years. He's Muslim, and while we're very similar (both grew up doing the same type of things, and we both go to bars, have the same values, etc.), he comes from a strict family. We're not actually dating, but I'm wondering whether this is even worth pursuing. During the course of the relationship, he would never be able to introduce me to his family, bring me home, even TELL his parents that he's dating me (oh...did I mention I'm white?). Platonic female friends aren't allowed to call his house. Anyone care to share experiences?
CurlyIam Posted February 10, 2005 Posted February 10, 2005 I'm usually very opened to new cultures and new religions. As long as both paries are tolerant. First of all, I live in France and the biggest minority here is the Muslim one. You're exposing yourself to a lot of grief here. One of my friends (classmate) comes from such a family - they spent ten years in Marocco, she speaks Arrab, etc. Also she got the best education possible, she had to marry her bf in order to move in with him, because her family wouldn't have it any other way. I think that at first it won't bother you, but trust me, on the long run, you don't want family issues. It's hard enough to deal with relationships as it is. I would like to say "hey, if you really like the guy, give it a shot", but I don't. Some people take religion very seriously.
emotionsmessmeup Posted February 10, 2005 Posted February 10, 2005 In my opinion, people get along best if they are from similar backgrounds. Keep in mind, you will have a lot of adjusting to do.
HokeyReligions Posted February 10, 2005 Posted February 10, 2005 If his family is that strict, can you imagine how he would be with his (your) children! My husband and I are of different faiths, well actually I'm not of any faith and he's Christian, and we do fine. But our religious backgrounds are very similar. Many Muslims are "Westernized" and have adopted the looser attitudes about sex and marriage and the roles the husband and wife play, but many are still very very strict and it could cause a lot of conflicts later on. If I were in your shoes, I would be very hesitant to get involved. He may seem like he is not as strict as his family, but his upbringing will come into play as he gets older and it might be very confusing for him too. That's a big stress inducer.
emotionsmessmeup Posted February 10, 2005 Posted February 10, 2005 how are vegetables and wheelchairs linked?
bluetuesday Posted February 10, 2005 Posted February 10, 2005 it's not impossible but it's very hard work. particularly if, as is the case with you, he will NEVER be able to introduce you to his family. if he is close to his family the duplicity will tear him apart. i guess it depends what you're looking for but in my experience, this would not be worth pursuing. if it gets to the stage where you're serious that he's the only man who could ever make you happy, he would have to be willing to leave his family for you and never see them again - because if islam is THAT important to the family, that would be his only choice if he was to have a proper relationship with you.
alphamale Posted February 10, 2005 Posted February 10, 2005 Originally posted by pizzanova We're not actually dating, but I'm wondering whether this is even worth pursuing. During the course of the relationship, he would never be able to introduce me to his family, bring me home, even TELL his parents that he's dating me (oh...did I mention I'm white?). Platonic female friends aren't allowed to call his house. Anyone care to share experiences? if he ended up marrying you then his family would be forced to accept you in some capacity eventually and over time. this is becuase you'd be the mother of their grand kids or an aunt or whatever. this is really a hypothetical situation cause you did state you're not even dating him.
Author pizzanova Posted February 10, 2005 Author Posted February 10, 2005 I'm assuming that if we did get serious enough, he *would* make attempts to introduce me to his family. Interestingly enough, he wouldnt even be able to introduce a nice Muslim girl to his family, until he decided he was announcing their engagement. I'm not sure how his family would react if he brought home a white girl (my family background is Christian but I wouldnt have qualms about "converting" to Islam, ie pretending that I practice it). I know other Muslims who are dating girls of different faiths (Hindu, Christian) and they seem quite serious. I don't know if they plan to ever get married to them though...although they WANT to.
bluechocolate Posted February 10, 2005 Posted February 10, 2005 ".... bring a hearty appetite, there's a lotta things to like, Pizza Nova!" Do they still use that jingle? I think this is the 2nd time I've seen your user-name & that jingle jangles through my head each time - I doubt I'll be answering many of your posts! We're not actually dating, but I'm wondering whether this is even worth pursuing. Love does not conquer all. I'm with bluetuesday -this would not be worth pursuing.
Midwest guy Posted February 10, 2005 Posted February 10, 2005 Im Catholic. I wouldnt have a prob dating someone who was Luthren, ect. Anyways most people in the Stl area are Catholic.
babybear Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 My bf and I are different religions. He's Jewish and I'm Hindu, and it caused a lot of drama for awhile. My parents still have not met him (3 yrs later!) and his grandma will get up and leave the room when I come over, although his parents are wonderful. So, it's stressful, and hard work. I always get a little bit down when grandma begins to act that way, but I keep in mind that it's her and not me. I have never dated a muslim guy, so I don't know how that would be - but don't go for it if you're going to mind a lot that you can't go over to his house, or get invited to family events, etc. G-luck! Babybear
fanou22 Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Since his family is so strict, they will never accept a girl who is not muslim. For them to accept you, you would have to be a muslim virgin covering yourself from head to toe. Sorry for the bad news but been there, done that. Thankfully it wasn't serious because I would have never converted. No offense to any muslim on this board but my advice to you is stay away from this guy. With age he will turn into his parents.
alphamale Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Originally posted by fanou22 Since his family is so strict, they will never accept a girl who is not muslim. this is incorrect because according to the muslim religion or islam he has the right to marry whomever he choose as long as she is a follower of the "book" meaning the old testament. he is free to marry a jew or christian from a religious standpoint. i believe the only combo that would not work is hindu-muslim. this is strictly verboten due to the cultural history of S.E. asia.
Hund1976 Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 My cousin was married to a Muslim guy for a while and it didn't work out too well. They both had very different beliefs in what the man and womans roles in a relationship are. Not to say your relationship couldn't work but its going to be a lot harder. I think people from different religions can get along as long as neither party is to serious about their religion. For example if I was with a girl who told me every day that I was going to burn in hell for eternity unless I converted to her religion I don't think I could take that. But if you both accept eachothers differences then you could probably get along.
alphamale Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Originally posted by Hund1976 I think people from different religions can get along as long as neither party is to serious about their religion. religion and the minor differences between the religions cause more problems than they solve when look at from a global perspective. I think religion is good for an individual but not for a group. It is just one more thing that seperates the human race.
Beth Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Originally posted by pizzanova but I wouldnt have qualms about "converting" to Islam, ie pretending that I practice it This is what caught my eye. If you are only going to 'pretend' to practice the faith you would be dishonest/lying to him and his family, and to yourself. If you want to convert to his religion, then you need to really convert, not just pretend. That could really destroy you later on. You have to be honest with yourself and with him. You don't want to live a lie -- especially if it is a lie of faith. Think of having children with him. If you do not fully embrace his faith and convert you will have some qualms about which faith in which to raise your own children. Your family and friends will be able to influence you too, as will his. I've seen that happen. It's all well and good to think of some compromises now or how you will handle it, but if and when it actually comes to pass, all bets are out the window. Religion is a serious thing, even if it's not taken seriously in youth, and there are very few compromises between such differing religious practices.
alphamale Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Originally posted by Beth This is what caught my eye. If you are only going to 'pretend' to practice the faith you would be dishonest/lying to him and his family, and to yourself. sorry BETH but most people "pretend" to practice their faith. if people were really practicing their faiths the way they were supposed to then the world would be a much better place.
bluechocolate Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Originally posted by alphamale sorry BETH but most people "pretend" to practice their faith. if people were really practicing their faiths the way they were supposed to then the world would be a much better place. sad but true
Israfil Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 I think in general, trying to make a relationship work with someone of another religion is an effort in impending futility. One of the most important aspects of a relationship is that your partner shares the same values and world-views as you. Religion immediately comes in the way of this, causing the two world-views to be contradictory and possibly opposed. This is where the problems first start – where the parties try to reconcile their world-view. Ultimately, they can never be reconciled. At the same time, what started as respect for the other party’s beliefs turn into questioning and then resentment, and ultimately a complete loss of that original respect. In the most extreme example, it is impossible for an atheist to be with anyone other than another atheist (pizzanova – it sounds like this is you, or perhaps you are religiously apathetic?) The atheist, being convinced of the non-existence of God, can never respect anyone who has a belief IN a God. They will, over time, find their partners delusional and have little or no tolerance of their beliefs.
alphamale Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Originally posted by Israfil Religion immediately comes in the way of this, causing the two world-views to be contradictory and possibly opposed. This is where the problems first start – where the parties try to reconcile their world-view. Ultimately, they can never be reconciled. Right ISRAFIL....so then please explain if GOD is so smart then why did he/it/she send down all these religions that conflict with one another. only a doofus would do that. religion is the opiate of the masses.
Israfil Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Originally posted by alphamale so then please explain if GOD is so smart then why did he/it/she send down all these religions that conflict with one another. only a doofus would do that. religion is the opiate of the masses. Thank you, ALPHA, for proving my point. This view would never be able to be reconciled with someone who has a faith in God / Jesus / Allah etc. The atheist is ultimately going to think that the religious person is an idiot.
alphamale Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Originally posted by Israfil The atheist is ultimately going to think that the religious person is an idiot. well the religous person IS an idiot. i mean how can they believe in something that is: - not proven - probably started by humans to fill the holes of our knowledge - egocentric - conflicts with other beliefs - has cost untold human suffering, wars, conflict and pain - is not based in reality - keeps corrupt religious leaders in power - is all about money and converting others - makes some feel better or superior to others religion is a crock of bullshyt.
Hund1976 Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 I guess people try to console themselves that at least when their crappy lives are over everything will be better. The people who get on my nerves are the people who feel its their duty to convert everyone to their beliefs. I cringe whenever I hear someone say stuff like "don't you want to save your soul?" What people do with their own lives is up to them but when they go out preaching to people who aren't interested it gets pretty annoying.
bluetuesday Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Originally posted by alphamale well the religous person IS an idiot. i mean how can they believe in something that is: - not proven - probably started by humans to fill the holes of our knowledge - egocentric - conflicts with other beliefs - has cost untold human suffering, wars, conflict and pain - is not based in reality - keeps corrupt religious leaders in power - is all about money and converting others - makes some feel better or superior to others religion is a crock of bullshyt. i am going to go to town on your ass because what you know about religion could be written on a flea's toenail. but i'll cut you some slack because for all i know, some religious bigot could have f*cked you over. 1. not proven. correct. neither is the alternative. so how can someone believe the alternative when it is not proven? you do, which by your own rationale makes you an idiot. 2. probably started by humans to fill the holes in our knowledge. so? you're confusing the existence of a deity with the reality of a deity. you also appear to be saying that religious validity can only come from something outside humanity. come on. if you're going to attack a belief system you have to have more than that. what does it matter how or why something was started if it's a positive action? and which religions are you familiar enough with to state they purposely perpetuate negativity? 3. egocentric. huh? do you mean that religious people think they're right? or do you mean the religion makes the person put themselves at the centre of their world? if it's the former, well, you think you're right. if it's the latter you know nothing about religion. 4. conflicts with other beliefs. you're about a third right on this one. all major religions preach tolerance, understanding and love as their central message. the details differ, but then people differ. god's message is love. do you really think he only has one way to tell it? 5. has cost untold human suffering, wars, conflict and pain. a classic. religion has not caused these things, man has. greed has. hate has. bigotry has. fear has. no religion preaches any of these things. 6. is not based in reality? whose? see 1. 7. keeps corrupt religious leaders in power. religion doesn't perpetuate corruption. corruption does. see 5. 8. is all about money and converting others. you don't believe in god but you believe this myth? religion is not about money, money is. but religious institutions also live in the real world. they need money to pay their staff. the catholic church is rich because lots of people want to give it lots of money. but don't confuse religion and institution. 9. makes some feel better or superior to others. YOU feel superior to others, you call religious people idiots. which also makes you a hypocrite. some religious people are w*ankers. just don't assume we're all the same. i have a lot of time for atheists when it's an informed position but your viewpoint seems to be based on bigotry and guesswork. don't sully the very valid atheist argument by reducing it to that.
blind_otter Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 yeeeeeeah. I think it's possible if you have enough moral and intellectual common ground. Similar beliefs about what a person needs to do, ultimately, to be a good person in life. My parents are completely different religions, different ethnic backgrounds, my mother was raised on a different hemisphere. Yet they've been married over 35 years. She was disowned by her family for marrying my dad. Then again my sister's husband was disowned because "if God meant for the races to mix he would have made them so" - in the end if the person you are involved with has enough strength and personal conviction then it can be successful.
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