How far did she go?

[68_f100]

 

Better yet, I will ask you some questions and you can answer them.

Is a stable home one where one parent cheats on the other?

Is a stable home one where the kids learn to to accept dishonesty from one member just to keep the peace? How will that affect them in their future relationships?

Is it a good example to teach the kids that marriage vows are allowed to be broken? NO

Is it good for the kids to watch one parent give up on having a properly fulfilled life so that everyone else in the family can live a life based on lies and dishonesty? NO

Is it a good example for the kids to know that being with someone is far more important than being with someone that respects them? how will this affect your daughters, if you have any?NO and I have a 10yo daughter.

 

I don't mean to be harsh, but in my line of work, I see far too many people whose lives are so screwed up because some parent made foolish decisions and said that they did it "for them, the children". Please don't hide behind your kids. If you are too afraid to leave, then own that. Don't put it on your kids. Believe me, one day you will tell them that you made these decisions for them and that is going to mess with their heads even more. Nothing like believing your crappy childhood was your fault. Sorry for being in your face, but... I am sorry for your pain, but deal with it honestly. If you love her too much to change things, just admit it. So many have been where you are and they will understand and help you. Peace.

Your questions have been answered. Now it's my turn.

 

Is it better to keep up appearances or possibly divorce?

We put aside our marital issues and co-parent. Is that better than splitting up and them possibly having a step dad or mom?

My wife has no idea how I really feel. So we get along fine. And I do love my wife and would probably continue to do so even if I found out the worst. What good will it do cause more drama over something I can't prove. Why ruin 3 lives instead of one?

 

I am curious what you are saving for later.

[atreides]

Your questions have been answered. Now it's my turn.

 

Is it better to keep up appearances or possibly divorce?

We put aside our marital issues and co-parent. Is that better than splitting up and them possibly having a step dad or mom?

My wife has no idea how I really feel. So we get along fine. And I do love my wife and would probably continue to do so even if I found out the worst. What good will it do cause more drama over something I can't prove. Why ruin 3 lives instead of one?

 

I am curious what you are saving for later.

 

Your post above was not to me, but it begs the question. Are you "staying" or "reconciling" with your WS?

[68_f100]

Your post above was not to me, but it begs the question. Are you "staying" or "reconciling" with your WS?

 

With nothing more than a hunch and no concrete prof plus two kinds involved I'm probably staying and just playing it by ear.

[atreides]

With nothing more than a hunch and no concrete prof plus two kinds involved I'm probably staying and just playing it by ear.

 

"proof" your original post outlined what she did quite clearly. For what its worth, i know quite a few divorced couples with kids that D'd in a way that the kids are indeed fine and happy vs others i know where the D was just toxic and the kids absorbed some of it. If you really lover her, which you said you did, then that should be the reason, but you need to set some boundaries no? Talk to her about it more, don't just let this bubble up, it will consume you and actually destroy what you are trying to protect. Just my 2 cents, in that don't just "stay."

[beach]

I think at this point you are forgiving no matter what she's done.

 

Loads of pretending in your home - that really sucks to live those lies so your kids can get an unrealistic idea of what M is.

 

All that torrenting may lead you you justify drinking again - be careful.

 

I hope you get honest with yourself about what's really going on... And take steps to get honest and have actions that correspond with that honesty.

 

Honesty/truth = the principle attached to step 1 in AA.

 

Without truth you really have nothing but a R built on assumptions and misunderstandings. That's not healthy to model that for marriage for your kids.

[Try]

With nothing more than a hunch and no concrete prof plus two kinds involved I'm probably staying and just playing it by ear.

Your wife knows you well. When your wife cheated, she knew that as long as she denied it and was willing to argue with you whenever you tried to discuss it, that in the end you would not leave her, and that you would just be bullied into not talking about it. And she was right. Now that this has been confirmed, she will cheat again, but next time be better at hiding it. Since studies show that most affairs go completely undetected, the odds are good that she will get away with it.

 

Cheaters logic is so consistent it is like they have a script that they all read from. Since there are cheater sites where they share advice, they may in fact have such a script. It really amazes me that they demand to set the rules for reconciliation even thought they were the ones that cheated, and they expect you to ignore logic and facts and just take them at their word. What amazes me even more is that so many spouse go along with this.

Edited May 28, 2014 by Try

[bigman1]

Please see my answers below.

 

Your questions have been answered. Now it's my turn.

 

Is it better to keep up appearances or possibly divorce? No, it is not better to keep up appearances. Living a lie is always wrong.

 

We put aside our marital issues and co-parent. Is that better than splitting up and them possibly having a step dad or mom? No. You cannot put aside marital issues and co-parent. That will lead to a toxic environment. That suggestion is like saying let's put aside the sea while we sail the ship. The ship is in the sea, your kids are in the midst of your marriage and these issues cannot be put aside for long or successfully. Seriously, have you never met someone whose parents marriage was toxic? It ruins them. Also, step parents are not inherently evil, so having one is not a death sentence. Look around. Besides, you can stil co-parent, but not in a toxic environment, assuming you divorced, which is not guaranteed.

My wife has no idea how I really feel. So we get along fine. And I do love my wife and would probably continue to do so even if I found out the worst. What good will it do cause more drama over something I can't prove. Why ruin 3 lives instead of one? Ah, now the truth comes out. You love your wife. I would hope so. Be mindful of where love ends and co-dependency starts. Just a warning and not an accusation. Loving a cheater is the curse of the betrayed. Sometimes it ends up good as in reconciliation other times it ends up bad as in rug sweeping, gas lighting, and continued heartache. I hope for the best for you. AS for drama over something you can't prove, your first post seemed fairly good in terms of proof. As for ruining three lives vs one: That presumes that confrontation, exposure, or conflict will ruin 3 lives. Define ruin. If one life is being ruined, that presupposes that betrayal is a fact and that you are just going to suck it up. That is living dishonestly, which gets back to my earlier unanswered questions.

I don't want to argue with you. You are in the midst of a lot of heavy stuff. Any aggression would probably be best spent on getting to the bottom of the story you posted here in the first place. Believe it or not, I am being supportive of you, but I will never support willful blindness or living dishonestly. At some point, like so many betrayed spouses here who did the same thing that you are doing, you will have an awakening. When that happens, as painful as it is going to be, you will be grateful to live honestly. Good luck to you.

[68_f100]

Please see my answers below.

 

 

I don't want to argue with you. You are in the midst of a lot of heavy stuff. Any aggression would probably be best spent on getting to the bottom of the story you posted here in the first place. Believe it or not, I am being supportive of you, but I will never support willful blindness or living dishonestly. At some point, like so many betrayed spouses here who did the same thing that you are doing, you will have an awakening. When that happens, as painful as it is going to be, you will be grateful to live honestly. Good luck to you.

 

 

I understand your are being supportive and I appreciate that. Thank you.

 

Everything I am going through now is my fault. I say that because when I found out I didn't say what I wanted to. i listened to her reasons and felt bad for her. I listened to her tell me it was because she felt like I didn't love her. I let her tell me she did this because she was f#*ked up and needed attention and she couldn't tell me what she needed. I apologized to her and told her I was sorry I let things get to the point they did. I told her I was sorry and would be a better husband to her. I didn't tell her that she disrespected me. I didn't tell her how mad I was that she would risk out family. I didn't tell her that I felt like we were untouchable together and she ruined that. I didn't tell her it hurt me like it did. I never told her that I might not be able to trust her again.

 

She didn't even tell me about the 2nd guy until I looked into it more. Then it was just bits and pieces the harder I pressed. She never would admit to anything other than text and talking on the phone no matter how hard I pressed. After a while she would just get mad at me for trying to find out more. I'm thinking to myself how can she get mad at me. I feel like a f*&king fool for staying with her when I have this doubt. I've done my share of bad **** but never anything like this. Why doesn't she just leave if these other guys were so much better to her. She obviously is more interested in them sexually because the things she said to them she has never said to me. All of it was about things they would like to do if they hooked up. It's pretty sad that I'm allowing myself to stay with someone who isn't attracted to me. Only interested in the money and what I can do for her. Some days I just want to go find someone else just so she can feel what I felt and go through what I did. Some days I just want to scream at her. Some days I just want to scream at myself. Most days I just wish it never happened or I didn't know anything about it.

[Awake]

I understand your are being supportive and I appreciate that. Thank you.

 

Everything I am going through now is my fault. I say that because when I found out I didn't say what I wanted to. i listened to her reasons and felt bad for her. I listened to her tell me it was because she felt like I didn't love her. I let her tell me she did this because she was f#*ked up and needed attention and she couldn't tell me what she needed. I apologized to her and told her I was sorry I let things get to the point they did. I told her I was sorry and would be a better husband to her. I didn't tell her that she disrespected me. I didn't tell her how mad I was that she would risk out family. I didn't tell her that I felt like we were untouchable together and she ruined that. I didn't tell her it hurt me like it did. I never told her that I might not be able to trust her again.

 

She didn't even tell me about the 2nd guy until I looked into it more. Then it was just bits and pieces the harder I pressed. She never would admit to anything other than text and talking on the phone no matter how hard I pressed. After a while she would just get mad at me for trying to find out more. I'm thinking to myself how can she get mad at me. I feel like a f*&king fool for staying with her when I have this doubt. I've done my share of bad **** but never anything like this. Why doesn't she just leave if these other guys were so much better to her. She obviously is more interested in them sexually because the things she said to them she has never said to me. All of it was about things they would like to do if they hooked up. It's pretty sad that I'm allowing myself to stay with someone who isn't attracted to me. Only interested in the money and what I can do for her. Some days I just want to go find someone else just so she can feel what I felt and go through what I did. Some days I just want to scream at her. Some days I just want to scream at myself. Most days I just wish it never happened or I didn't know anything about it.

 

It's never too late to leave, because believe me, as someone on both sides, she did much more than she admitted to. It is standard practice to deny, deny, deny. Her hiding the second guy from you proves beyond a doubt that there was much more going on.

 

If you don't have anything to hide, then you don't hide anything.

[bigman1]

68, you could have cursed her out, but outside of a temporary emotional fix, you would still feel like crap and hurt. You did not lose out on any big cathartic confrontation. it does not happen that way.

 

You can't blame yourself at all. Cheating is 100% on the cheater. bad communication, absenteeism, whatever plagued any marriage, cheating is NEVER a proper response. As a result, it is never your fault. Great marriages also are plagued by cheating. It is due to one defective person, the cheater. They are liars, manipulators, selfish, and inexcusable. That is true 100% of the time.

 

They have a script that they stick to and there is one for the betrayed to follow. It is hard to do, but it is well documented on this forum. I am not talking the kick her a$$ to the curb script, I am talking 180, exposure, conditions, etc. Look it up, study it and follow it. It is for you. It does not guarantee you will get them back, but believe me, you can't "nice" them back, you can't "reason" them back, and you can't expect them to wander back. It does get you to being whole again. It does put you in control of all that you can be in control of. It does give them consequences. it does force them to decide what they want. It also allows you to decide if you are willing to invest any more of your life and energy in a defective, lying, manipulating cheater. That is truly empowering. Good luck.

[Spectre]

I still ask if you are going to get a polygraph or not for her?

[68_f100]

I still ask if you are going to get a polygraph or not for her?

 

I'm not as I know she would refuse. If I told her it was that or divorce it would end in divorce. I'm not ready to take things to that level.

[jm2013]

Do you have access to the phone records? If so try and pull them and find a trend. Also, if you're not going to do a polygraph why don't you just bluff it? If you execute this perfectly she may have a self confession but start trickle truthing hard wondering how much you know. I knew my wife had been lying to me so I came back to the house after work one evening and acted extremely upset with her and told her I knew everything and just asked her why and to start talking. She self admitted to the affair but trickle truthed hard initially.

[beach]

Why would you want to betray yourself by denying what you know?

 

And again by knowing that she's not going to offer you her truth - she's only going to minimize it if she knows you already know.

 

You're right - that would totally suck.

[bigman1]

68, treat this situation like someone is jeopardizing your kid's lives. Are you going to dither and quiver or are you going to be definitive? You have to pull the trigger because your wife and her men are busy tying your kids to the train tracks and a train is coming.

 

You don't have to threaten a FINAL divorce to get a poly. You can start filing out the paperwork, start doing an assessment on your financial status and how property will be divided and visitation will be handled and DO IT WITH HER. Sure, it ups the ante and you are scared that she will bet it all. Well, here is some news for you, she is already betting it all. The train is coming. Nothing prevents her from leaving you. Think about that.

 

This may sound crazy, but I have seen it work on this board and others. To save your marriage, you have to be willing to destroy it. She will blink, if she wants to save it. If she doesn't want to save it, then you will end up where you would have ended up in the first place.

 

Right now, she is in control and you are afraid. But I tell you, if a group of men came into your house and threatened your family, you would not be holding back. Maybe don't file for divorce, yet, but start the paperwork. Let her know that if she thinks that you are going to sit by crying until she decides to leave you and then have you wallow in grief while she takes your kids, that she has another thing coming. Either she gets on board, or she starts packing her ***** up, either way, something is gonna happen. Also, expose the other men. Don't let her or them have any secrets. Remember, to fight for your marriage you have to fight. bear in mind, I am all for cutting a cheater out of your life and never looking back, but if you want this marriage, then you have to play to win. It is go big or go home time. Read the threads on this board. The sooner you put on your big boy pants, the more likely you are to save your marriage.

 

She will blink if she believes that you won't. Trust me. If she chooses divorce, then she was going to choose it anyway. Never blink.

[68_f100]

I have told her before if things didn't get better I was out. She doesn't care. She is a stay at home mom. I don't fault her one bit for that. But she knows she will get the house car and majority custody of the kids. All I get is single and seeing my kids less. If I try and talk to her about any if this it's going to be a huge fight I don't want. If I start filing paperwork she will finish it. She has me right where she wants me and I can't do **** about it.

[bigman1]

68, that is untrue. Not that you are lying, but it is not true that she will clean you out. That is a myth.

 

As far as kids are concerned, the courts look to the best interest of the kids. You must be involved in their lives, actively, and be able to document that. Photos, PTA, extra curricular, etc. Be visible and seen. Next, you have a means of support for them.

 

She may get alimony, but a consult with a lawyer in your area is what you need. So many rumors about men getting screwed float around. Honestly, some of those guys screwed themselves. If you work all day and and are hardly in your kid's lives, of course they are going to go to the parent that does the day to day stuff.

 

It is a dog and pony show. You build a dossier on your active involvement in their lives, rapport with teachers, coaches, etc. believe me, a good divorce lawyer will tell you how to position yourself to be in the driver's seat. Sure, no one walks away clean, but you can walk away a winner.

 

As someone I met once told his wife (and I am paraphrasing and omitting the profanity), "the judge can't make me give you everything and even if you get half, which you won't, you can't live like you are right now. And if I have to get fired from my job and go on food stamps, I will do it. I am prepared to live in my car to see to it that you get nothing. We will all be miserable. The kids will survive, I will get visitation, and I will be fine. You are a woman entering your 30's with kids and I promise to be a complete jackass to whatever guy you try to bring into my kid's life, only a fool is going to pick you." Once she looked around at all of the non-existent single mom's of 3 getting married to prince charming and living the life of Riley, she found her right mind. Nothing against single moms of 3, you can find someone, too. This lady was playing the fool so hubby had to make it real for her.

[2sunny]

I have told her before if things didn't get better I was out. She doesn't care. She is a stay at home mom. I don't fault her one bit for that. But she knows she will get the house car and majority custody of the kids. All I get is single and seeing my kids less. If I try and talk to her about any if this it's going to be a huge fight I don't want. If I start filing paperwork she will finish it. She has me right where she wants me and I can't do **** about it.

 

Stop doing nothing.

 

You don't really have a wife and happy family now - so you have nothing to lose.

 

You gain your self respect and dignity if you change things.

 

Life is too short to settle for someone to not respect and honor you.

 

You will get your kids 50% if you request it! Request whatever you want! You have a chance of getting what you want when you ask the court to grant you what you ask for.

 

But living in a loveless M that's full of lies and pretending is NOT living.

 

She has stolen your peace of mind - but you have now CHOSEN that by ALLOWING her to continue stealing it every day you stay with her.

 

She's not going to improve because she knows you're not going to lay down any consequences.

 

I vote to change it all! You're not super happy now - at least if you get rid of the source (the cheater and liar) of your unhappiness - you have a chance to be happy again.

[Spectre]

I'm not as I know she would refuse. If I told her it was that or divorce it would end in divorce. I'm not ready to take things to that level.

 

I can't see your marriage surviving unless she proves she is being truthful. If you feel she would choose to divorce you over taking a simple test..doesn't that tell you all you need to know? Again, read what you just said: you feel your wife would rather divorce you as opposed to giving you peace of mind. Cheater or no cheater, do you want a woman like that? I know I would not.

 

If this woman can't take a test due to problems that she brought on..well, that tells you everything, doesn't it?

[snappytomcat]

I have told her before if things didn't get better I was out. She doesn't care. She is a stay at home mom. I don't fault her one bit for that. But she knows she will get the house car and majority custody of the kids. All I get is single and seeing my kids less. If I try and talk to her about any if this it's going to be a huge fight I don't want. If I start filing paperwork she will finish it. She has me right where she wants me and I can't do **** about it.

yeah and if you get a divorce she will have to get of her azz,and get a job,im not saying being a stay at home mom is easy,believe me I was one,but its kinda of luxury too.and she wont have that luxury anymore

you deserve better

[Spectre]

Dude this woman has you buy the balls it seems. Just leave her. If you are the one who works and she is a stay at home mom..why would she be given the house and car? She didn't work for it, she did not earn it. You did. I am not trying to say being a stay at home mother is easy, but I don't see why they'd give this woman your house and car unless she had a way to pay for it. Surely they do not expect you to pay for a house you do not live in, for a car you do not drive?

[beach]

I have told her before if things didn't get better I was out. She doesn't care. She is a stay at home mom. I don't fault her one bit for that. But she knows she will get the house car and majority custody of the kids. All I get is single and seeing my kids less. If I try and talk to her about any if this it's going to be a huge fight I don't want. If I start filing paperwork she will finish it. She has me right where she wants me and I can't do **** about it.

 

So it looks like things aren't getting better - so based on your boundary and what you've told her - it's now time to impose that boundary by taking action.

 

Especially since she's not improving things by participating differently and giving an idea that she plans to change.

 

It's up to you to take action now.

 

Anything different and she just views your words as idle threats.

 

No wonder she isn't motivated to change.

 

Serve those D papers and see how she may get more motivated... If she cares that little - then you didn't have much of a M anyway.

[drifter777]

I have told her before if things didn't get better I was out. She doesn't care. She is a stay at home mom. I don't fault her one bit for that. But she knows she will get the house car and majority custody of the kids. All I get is single and seeing my kids less. If I try and talk to her about any if this it's going to be a huge fight I don't want. If I start filing paperwork she will finish it. She has me right where she wants me and I can't do **** about it.

You are allowing her to hold you hostage and you seem to be ok with that. You are uncomfortable enough to post here but not enough to do anything about it. You've been given a ton of advice from people who have been betrayed and humiliated just like you. Do something about this or just accept that your wife is in an open marriage and will boff anyone she wants anytime she wants to. There's nothing wrong with this if it is your choice to accept it.

[68_f100]

So just a quick update. Went and took a poly Friday. They asked a bunch of pointless questions but the one that mattered, Has she had any type of sexual contact with anyone after she had sex with me. She said no and the guy said it was 99.2% chance she was telling the truth. She didn't say much after that or at all this weekend. Then I get a call from her today at lunch. She tells me that she was sorry for what happened and she understood my trust issues. But says I should have believed her. Then tells me that she thinks our marriage has quite a few issues and is to far gone to save at this point. I asked her what next and she said she was going to go to her moms until she could get a job and get on her feet and wants to see a mediator about dissolving the marriage. All I said was ok. At least I know the truth now. Guess I can start planning to move on myself.

[Clay]

The truth is something so few of us ever really get. Good for you for working to get it. I hope things go as peaceful as possible for you.

 

On a side note I kept my kids in the divorce. So that is a option if you are interested in that.

 

Clay