Should I stay or should I go?

[jackslife]

So here is my story.

 

Two years ago I started an affair with a married woman. I’m married with a 12 year old son, have been with my wife for 20+ years and married for ten. But my wife and I are now more like sister and brother and the sex had stopped completely. I didn’t feel desired or attractive to her (on one occasion last year I kissed her and she said “what’s the matter with you I’ve kissed you once today?”. So I met a woman on a dating website aimed exclusively at married people looking for an affair. For 18 months (until Christmas last year) we’d meet every couple of weeks or so in a hotel, have fabulous sex, a laugh and a good chat. We’d exchange the odd email. I was pretty happy with my lot. I had amazing sex, affection and passion with a younger woman (I’m 50, she is 37) and my wife and son at home.

 

The OW moved away last august with her husband, at which point we thought the affair would stop. However, we managed to keep seeing each other despite the distance. At this point she started telling me she loved me, and I was surprised when I felt the same. You build up a lot of intimacy over 18 months and get to know each other very well.

 

After Christmas she split from her husband and started divorce proceedings. At this point it all went tits up. I started meeting her at her home and she joined me when I was working away. She’s fallen head over heels in love with me and I love her but she has decided she doesn’t want to share me with my wife. She wants all or nothing, she wants me or the relationship is over. She hasn’t directly asked me to leave my wife or given me a big dramatic ultimatum. She has behaved really decently over the whole thing. But her choice is a simple one and in all honesty the right one for her.

 

I had never considered leaving my wife before. Whilst life had got a bit boring, no sex, like brother and sister, no sex etc. the idea that I may be existing and not living, never occurred to me. Make no mistake the thought of divorce is terrifying. The damage to my son, financial damage – having to fund two lives. In the long run I’d need to change jobs and move 120 miles north – even further away from my son… Or stay as I am, and give up a beautiful woman who adores me, who has described me as the love of her life, with who I love, with whom I have brilliant sex. I can’t ever remember being this loved or lusted after.

 

If I end the affair will one day, maybe when my son leaves home will I look back on the decision to stay and think it was the worse mistake of my life to stay? Should I stay or should I go…

 

I know I’ll get plenty of flack from the faultless ones who never put a foot wrong, but answers, contributions, opinions from those who have been in this situation (on either side) or may just have good advice. I’d be happy to hear from you.

 

Thank you

[notserene]

So here is my story.

 

 

[...]

 

give up a beautiful woman who adores me, who has described me as the love of her life, with who I love, with whom I have brilliant sex. I can’t ever remember being this loved or lusted after.

 

If I end the affair will one day, maybe when my son leaves home will I look back on the decision to stay and think it was the worse mistake of my life to stay? Should I stay or should I go…

 

 

Thank you

 

 

Tell your wife. It will snap you out of it right quick. Let her make the decision.

[purplesorrow]

Free your wife. You've really already left her as you have given your heart and body to another. I wouldn't want to be married to someone who was wishing they were with someone else. Your wife deserves someone who loves her fully. She should also be given the right to make decisions for her life. Good luck.

[cozycottagelg]

I agree that you only live once, and existing isn't living..however...

 

If you do decide to divorce your wife, you need to be honest. It is completely selfish and unfair for you to list the reasons you want to leave (brother/sister, no affection, etc) and leave her feeling like SHE ruined the marriage, when your secret is the ultimate dealbreaker.

 

If you think this new woman is someone you see yourself with forever, by all means, go find love and write your story...but do not do it under the guise that your wife is why you are divorcing.

[oldshirt]

While I am generally opposed to adultry, I do not judge you for seeking love and sex elsewhere. Since your wife made it clear she does not wish to have any form of romantic/sexual relationship with you, she waives her right to your sexual exclusivity and has no right to dictate what you do with your sexuality.

 

Divorce always carries with it costs like child support, spousal support, division of property and assets, court costs, lawyer fees etc.

 

Hoowever remember your wife likely has someone on the side too and she is no longer i love with you and could file on you tomorrow and those costs would be the same whether you take initiative to move on with your life or are reacting to her moving on with hers.

 

Your son will be inconvenienced to a degree by the divorce but he is a subadult and not a baby/toddler requiring 24/7 hands on care. Children are harmed when they are in an environament of abuse, hostility, addiction, adultry, neglect or abandonment.

 

They are not harmed or damaged by being with two loving and supportive and caring parents who hapen to be in two separate houses. Children are harmed when they are used as pawns and weapons by parents who are trying to hurt each other. As you have a cordial and passionless marriage, there's no reason to believe that you won't have a cordial and passionless divorce as well.b

[oldshirt]

As far as your OW. I think the decision whether to remain in a loveless marriage vs move on with your life should be made without direct regard to her one way or another.

 

She has shown you that there can be love, sexuality and connection out there, but that doesn't mean that she has to be "the one" or that you have to monkey-swing to her or leave your wife for her per se.

 

You can still take the higher ground here and dissolve your marriage and free yourself to move on and live again, without leaving your wife for an affair partner.

 

I don't think your OW should pressure you to leave your wife prematurely if you aren't ready. Nor do I think you should remain in a dead marriage because things aren't right with this OW.

 

In other words whatever you do, it should be done for you and what's best for you and your family without regard to the OW.

[oldshirt]

....keep in mind too that you are role-modeling for your pubescent son. While you may be remiss to show him that men leave their wives because the

poontang May not be all that, realize that right now you are role-modeling to him that father's remain in dead, loveless marriage of convenience and that they carry on affairs on the side while giving appearance of a traditional family.

 

I suspect that your wife is likely carrying on some kind outside involvements as well so you are showing him that marriage is about people raising kids as roommates and getting their lovins on the side.

[purplesorrow]

While I am generally opposed to adultry, I do not judge you for seeking love and sex elsewhere. Since your wife made it clear she does not wish to have any form of romantic/sexual relationship with you, she waives her right to your sexual exclusivity and has no right to dictate what you do with

 

 

 

b

Did she also waive her rights to honesty? Did she waive her rights from protecting her body from stds? Did she waive her rights to know about any family finances being used for an affair?

[notserene]

While I am generally opposed to adultry, I do not judge you for seeking love and sex elsewhere. Since your wife made it clear she does not wish to have any form of romantic/sexual relationship with you, she waives her right to your sexual exclusivity and has no right to dictate what you do with your sexuality.

 

 

Seems to me here that what he needs is an express waiver rather than an implied one. I doubt very much that his wife is aware that she waived exclusivity.

[oldshirt]

..

 

I suspect that your wife is likely carrying on some kind outside involvements as well so you are showing him that marriage is about people raising kids as roommates and getting their lovins on the side.

 

You have probably not considered this much or think that she's been messing around because she seems so asexual with you and also because your time and energy have been centered around your own affair and covering your own tracks.

 

I challenge you to direct your attention into finding out why she has lost so much attraction and desire for you and find out what she is doing while you are are living this alternate life with OW.

 

hack her computers/emails/facebook. Put a key logger program on her computers. Get a detailed phone bill of her txts and phone calls. Go to radio shack and get 2 or 3 voice activated recorders and place in her car, bedroom and other areas she may be talking on the phone or meeting people. Put a GPS tracker on her phone or in her car. Go through her drawers, purse, desk etc etc like a CSI agent.

 

You will likely find that she IS a sexual person.....just not with you.

 

Once you have that information, the decision to stay or go will be a lot easier.

[oldshirt]

Did she also waive her rights to honesty? Did she waive her rights from protecting her body from stds? Did she waive her rights to know about any family finances being used for an affair?

 

STDs are not a risk to her if she is not sexually active with him.

 

Everyone has a right to honesty. .....has she ever addressed or responded to his questions of their lack of intimacy? I'd bet the farm he has asked her about her lack of desire a hundred times, how honest was she in addressing that?????

 

Finances????? If you are going to be a gold digger and be with a man for money and comfort, you at least have to put out or at bare minimum make him think you like him and will put out at some point.

[oldshirt]

Seems to me her e that what he needs is an express waiver rather than an implied one. I doubt very much that his wife is aware that she waived exclusivity.

 

Proposing an open marriage or some form of "arrangement" untill the child is older could be considered as another option.

[violet1]

Does your W know you're unhappy? You should sit down with her and tell her you are considering divorce. If you just throw the papers at her, she'll feel blind sided and it could possibly make your divorce worse. No one expects you to live in a sexless marriage. Don't leave because you feel pressure from the OW. Leave because you believe you deserve love and physical intimacy. You are still young enough to find someone else even if it doesn't work out with your OW. If you are still in love with your W than give her a chance. Sometimes people don't realize how their behaviors are affecting their spouse. Do not stay because of finances or your son. Soon enough he'll be doing his own thing, and you'll be even older and it will be harder for you and your wife to move on. Best of luck!

[violet1]

Also don't leave the OW hanging. She's divorced now and she deserves a full relationship. It's only natural that she no longer wants to share you because her situation has changed. This is very common in affairs when both are married and one decides to divorce.

[purplesorrow]

STDs are not a risk to her if she is not sexually active with him.

 

Everyone has a right to honesty. .....has she ever addressed or responded to his questions of their lack of intimacy? I'd bet the farm he has asked her about her lack of desire a hundred times, how honest was she in addressing that?????

 

Finances????? If you are going to be a gold digger and be with a man for money and comfort, you at least have to put out or at bare minimum make him think you like him and will put out at some point.

 

 

You have no idea what he has discussed with his wife. You have no idea if she works or what she sacrificed so he could work on his career. What we do know is he is having an affair and his wife doesn't know. Many partners cheat without ever having a discussion with their spouse.

[BetrayedH]

My personal $.02

 

While you remain married, you have an obligation to your spouse. Right now you are living the single life and we've got no reason to believe that your wife isn't keeping her end of the bargain. Why has she been trapped in keeping her end of the marital contract while you don't? This is a discrepancy that needs to be fixed. Your wife has only one life and deserves the same freedom to pursue happiness as you do.

 

Personally, I am almost always in favor of trying to restore a marriage rather than discarding it. I just never saw a marriage as a temporary agreement. If you're going to give up, I think you need to have exhausted all opportunities first.

 

My suggestion to you would be to let your OW know that you're going to need some time away from her entirely so you can make a decision about your marriage that's not influenced by her. Divorce needs to be a decision that's made because it's what is best for you, your wife, and your family and not be one that's motivated by the temptation of a younger woman. You owe that to your wife who has invested the best years of her life in you. Frankly, I suspect that your OW will respect this decision as she won't want to feel like she has stolen you from your wife. She's looking for you to man-up and make a choice. Get some space. Commit to having 'no contact' with her and let her know that when you've made your choice, it will either be to say goodbye because you've decided to stay married or that it will be that you've filed for divorce and are available to date her properly. In the meantime, ask her to respect your request for NC.

 

Once you've gone NC, then sit down with your wife and admit to your affair. Tell her that you've ended the affair and that the two of you either need to fix the unhappy marriage or divorce. If she decides to try to reconcile with you, do so with complete honesty and transparency and kindly let your OW know that you've decided to recommit 100% to the marriage and thus, cannot have any further contact with her.

 

As for your sex life, it can improve dramatically. I'm not convinced that your wife is getting it elsewhere. But I'd bet my bottom dollar that she's felt emotionally disconnected from you for a long time and that's what led to the physical distance. I'm not saying it's right (I suffered the same problem in my marriage) but that you may own some part of the marital problems, just like she does. You'd be surprised how couples manage to sexually reconnect after an affair. It can be a hell of a wake-up call that both parties were inattentive to the marriage and let it get to a place it never should have. Complacency sets in. Resentment builds. But when push comes to shove, many couples go through an intense period of "hysterical bonding" as they reclaim one another.

 

Get honest with your wife. Own your mistakes. She didn't make you cheat; you made that choice all on your own. Communicate what's been missing for you. Listen to her and what needs you may have failed to meet. Then make a decision together about whether you're going to make a renewed effort or throw in the towel and get the OW out of that equation. That's the ethical, mature, and respectful way to proceed from here and what you have failed to do so far.

[excusememister]

My personal $.02

 

While you remain married, you have an obligation to your spouse. Right now you are living the single life and we've got no reason to believe that your wife isn't keeping her end of the bargain. Why has she been trapped in keeping her end of the marital contract while you don't? This is a discrepancy that needs to be fixed. Your wife has only one life and deserves the same freedom to pursue happiness as you do.

 

Personally, I am almost always in favor of trying to restore a marriage rather than discarding it. I just never saw a marriage as a temporary agreement. If you're going to give up, I think you need to have exhausted all opportunities first.

 

My suggestion to you would be to let your OW know that you're going to need some time away from her entirely so you can make a decision about your marriage that's not influenced by her. Divorce needs to be a decision that's made because it's what is best for you, your wife, and your family and not be one that's motivated by the temptation of a younger woman. You owe that to your wife who has invested the best years of her life in you. Frankly, I suspect that your OW will respect this decision as she won't want to feel like she has stolen you from your wife. She's looking for you to man-up and make a choice. Get some space. Commit to having 'no contact' with her and let her know that when you've made your choice, it will either be to say goodbye because you've decided to stay married or that it will be that you've filed for divorce and are available to date her properly. In the meantime, ask her to respect your request for NC.

 

Once you've gone NC, then sit down with your wife and admit to your affair. Tell her that you've ended the affair and that the two of you either need to fix the unhappy marriage or divorce. If she decides to try to reconcile with you, do so with complete honesty and transparency and kindly let your OW know that you've decided to recommit 100% to the marriage and thus, cannot have any further contact with her.

 

As for your sex life, it can improve dramatically. I'm not convinced that your wife is getting it elsewhere. But I'd bet my bottom dollar that she's felt emotionally disconnected from you for a long time and that's what led to the physical distance. I'm not saying it's right (I suffered the same problem in my marriage) but that you may own some part of the marital problems, just like she does. You'd be surprised how couples manage to sexually reconnect after an affair. It can be a hell of a wake-up call that both parties were inattentive to the marriage and let it get to a place it never should have. Complacency sets in. Resentment builds. But when push comes to shove, many couples go through an intense period of "hysterical bonding" as they reclaim one another.

 

Get honest with your wife. Own your mistakes. She didn't make you cheat; you made that choice all on your own. Communicate what's been missing for you. Listen to her and what needs you may have failed to meet. Then make a decision together about whether you're going to make a renewed effort or throw in the towel and get the OW out of that equation. That's the ethical, mature, and respectful way to proceed from here and what you have failed to do so far.

 

BetrayedH is 100% spot on!!!

[oldshirt]

My personal $.02

 

While you remain married, you have an obligation to your spouse. Right now you are living the single life and we've got no reason to believe that your wife isn't keeping her end of the bargain. Why has she been trapped in keeping her end of the marital contract while you don't? This is a discrepancy that needs to be fixed. Your wife has only one life and deserves the same freedom to pursue happiness as you do.

 

Personally, I am almost always in favor of trying to restore a marriage rather than discarding it. I just never saw a marriage as a temporary agreement. If you're going to give up, I think you need to have exhausted all opportunities first.

 

My suggestion to you would be to let your OW know that you're going to need some time away from her entirely so you can make a decision about your marriage that's not influenced by her. Divorce needs to be a decision that's made because it's what is best for you, your wife, and your family and not be one that's motivated by the temptation of a younger woman. You owe that to your wife who has invested the best years of her life in you. Frankly, I suspect that your OW will respect this decision as she won't want to feel like she has stolen you from your wife. She's looking for you to man-up and make a choice. Get some space. Commit to having 'no contact' with her and let her know that when you've made your choice, it will either be to say goodbye because you've decided to stay married or that it will be that you've filed for divorce and are available to date her properly. In the meantime, ask her to respect your request for NC.

 

Once you've gone NC, then sit down with your wife and admit to your affair. Tell her that you've ended the affair and that the two of you either need to fix the unhappy marriage or divorce. If she decides to try to reconcile with you, do so with complete honesty and transparency and kindly let your OW know that you've decided to recommit 100% to the marriage and thus, cannot have any further contact with her.

 

As for your sex life, it can improve dramatically. I'm not convinced that your wife is getting it elsewhere. But I'd bet my bottom dollar that she's felt emotionally disconnected from you for a long time and that's what led to the physical distance. I'm not saying it's right (I suffered the same problem in my marriage) but that you may own some part of the marital problems, just like she does. You'd be surprised how couples manage to sexually reconnect after an affair. It can be a hell of a wake-up call that both parties were inattentive to the marriage and let it get to a place it never should have. Complacency sets in. Resentment builds. But when push comes to shove, many couples go through an intense period of "hysterical bonding" as they reclaim one another.

 

Get honest with your wife. Own your mistakes. She didn't make you cheat; you made that choice all on your own. Communicate what's been missing for you. Listen to her and what needs you may have failed to meet. Then make a decision together about whether you're going to make a renewed effort or throw in the towel and get the OW out of that equation. That's the ethical, mature, and respectful way to proceed from here and what you have failed to do so far.

 

 

I agree with much of this but if the OP is undecided I would do some background checking into the wife before making any decisions either way.

 

If she has her own activities on the side, he may decide the marriage is dead and buried and just a matter of finishing up the paperwork... or it may trigger his competitive spirit and he decides to fight tooth and nail for her.

 

If his investigation turns up she has been faithful all along he may decide to give it another try or it may make him decide she really is a cold fish and that there would be no point to try to resurrect a dead marriage where no love or intimacy exists.

 

My point is I think it behooves him to find out her true state before exposing himself and making any decisions on whether to try to reconcile or to leave.

 

If he decides there's no point in attempting reconciliation and has no intentions of trying to make it work then nothing else matters other than making the divorce as efficient and painless as possible for all.

 

I do agree that the OW should not be a part of that decision process.

[BetrayedH]

@Oldshirt. I hear you. For whatever reason, your radar is up about her potentially having an affair and mine isn't. No biggie. Certainly the lack of sex could be a red flag. And ultimately, I wouldn't discourage anyone from checking on their spouse if they suspect infidelity. I just didn't hear any other red flags from the OP, nor any concern on his part that she may be doing the same. I suppose it could be worth finding out but it kinda sounds like a distraction to me. Probably a good case where the OP can take what works for him and leave what doesn't.

[oldshirt]

 

 

But my wife and I are now more like sister and brother and the sex had stopped completely. I didn’t feel desired or attractive to her (on one occasion last year I kissed her and she said “what’s the matter with you I’ve kissed you once today?”.

 

 

 

Betrayed Husband et all,

 

 

I admit that Jackslife has not indicated any smoking guns pointing towards his wife having an affair of her own. I am merely challenging him to consider that possibility and to investigate that avenue fully and in good faith.

 

We are just going off what little info he has provided thus far, but saying they have no sex and that she recoils if he attempts to kiss her more than his allotted one peck a day indicates to me that this is way greater than a wife who has simply become bogged down with domestic chores and hasn't got her sexy on in a while.

 

Of course it's possible that she has been the perfect dutiful wife and he has been a cheating ass. ......but I doubt it is that simple.

 

The dysfunction and destruction in this marriage goes way deeper than a bored and sexually frustrated husband who is having some naughty feelings for the Secretary at work. He intentionally signed up on Ashley Madison with malice of forethought to have an affair with an AP who also intended to step out on her spouse and they have maintained an ongoing 18 month relationship that has had its own share of hurdles and challenges to overcome.

 

-This marriage is on its last gasps of air if not already dead. The only thing that has kept him from filing and walking is his own lack of initiative due to the fact he was having his cake and eating it too. In this case the affair most likely prolonged a bad marriage rather than prematurely ended a good one.

 

I have two divergent thoughts on this. One is if Jack does make up his mind that he is going to leave regardless of what his wife is or is not doing, he should just do it and be done with it as swiftly and efficiently as possible and not even worry about is she has a lover(s) too because at that point nothing matters.

 

My other thought is if he is truly torn and not just lazy and not just cheap and doesn't want to pay lawyer bills and child support, then he should evaluate her end of this and see if she is having her cake and eating it too.

 

Whether she is or whether she isn't may tip the scales either way and give him the motivation to either file and walk, whether to try to reconcile and fix the marriage or whether to just continue to exist in a loveless marriage just to keep the peace and appearances.

Edited April 16, 2014 by oldshirt

[jackslife]

First, thank you to all of you who took time to give advice. The funny thing is how much of it I’d have said the same if I was on the outside looking in and not the inside looking out.

The update. I have thought long and hard and done the right and logical thing and ended it with the OW. To a degree it was mutual (she is now single and no longer wants to be the OW any more), but she loves me and we’d be together now if I left my wife. Our time together is wonderful but when we are apart she is alone and without me and this upsets her terribly. So rather than doing what the ****ty part of me wants to do and string her along with endless promises I’ve ended it so I can sort out my marriage.

I am seeing a counsellor to discuss my marriage and will then go to Relate (a UK marriage/relationship counselling service) with my wife and see where that takes me…

So all fine and sensible then? So why is my heart breaking? Why am I missing the texts, and chats and emails as much as I am?

And the big question should I contact the OW to see if she is okay? The ending came so suddenly if not unexpectedly and I miss her terribly.

[A.Moscote]

Why? Why do you still want to sort out your marriage rather than prepare to end it? You have a great chance to start a new life with the OW. A new marriage would be a bliss, nothing at all like brother-sister you know.

 

Buckled up a bit and confess it all, or at least this two posts you have here. It won't add much to the agony you are carrying now, and who know where the truth could lead to. Don't wrong two women at the same time, that is too sad.

[waterwoman]

So all fine and sensible then? So why is my heart breaking? Why am I missing the texts, and chats and emails as much as I am?

 

Why? Do you really need to ask? Of course you are, they made you feel good, you loved being with this woman. That isn't really surprising at all.

 

The way I read your original post is that you had a marriage that has been allowed to atrophy. Nothing in it suggested that either you or your wife did anything actively wrong, but neither of you did everything right either. The comment about 'you've already kissed me today' could easily have been a self-deprecating jokey one suggesting that she doesn't feel you care to be physical with her. So many of the comments you made about your OW were about how she made you feel, so loved and wanted and admired - if your wife doesn't make you feel that way you need to consider why that might be, and do you do the same for her?

 

If you are going to try to rescue your marriage please tell your wife what has been going on. It isn't fair to leave her in the dark.