gotsohosed Posted April 10, 2014 Posted April 10, 2014 Stats: married 7 years together 13. I am in my 50's. I know my ww had a 2 month affair, no question have proof and all. Even called the guy and his wife. It took a lot to get her to admit then the next day she recants it. doesn't matter, I know. I also am 99% sure she has had 2 other affairs. She tells me I am crazy. So I live with this for 3 months to get the strength back in myself, (it devastated me), and told her it is a non repairable marriage and I went to a lawyer, paid them in full and am going to proceed. I explain that I cannot get the images out of my head and it just won't go away just because she wants to start over and wipe the slate clean. I went through all the stages or at least through a few and now am angry. She cries like all getout and wants to make it work and will do anything. So I say just tell me the truth. Nope! She just continues to lie against all the facts I know. I do not tell her what proof I have but I have many facets of proof. I just want to have peace and not feel like I am or have been played for a fool. I just want peace. I love her but I do not know why after what she has put me through for a couple of years and she always seems to bring it back to blaming me or the marriage or anything but her own bad decisions. Now she is blaming a co worker for telling me lies which is not the case but she thinks she knows. I don't even know who she is talking about. Amazing, that she wants a marriage after all that and is mad a person other than herself. 3
TiredFamilyGuy Posted April 10, 2014 Posted April 10, 2014 Self deception is part of the cheater's skill set. 11
Smilecharmer Posted April 10, 2014 Posted April 10, 2014 It is hard to love someone if who they presented to you is not the person they really are. The lies and deception show you that she really has no remorse for her actions, just getting caught. I am so sorry you are going through this. I hope you find peace soon. 6
drifter777 Posted April 10, 2014 Posted April 10, 2014 Lots of times tears are just an attempt to manipulate you into feeling sorry for her. Don't pay her any extra attention just for crying. It sounds like the proof you have is iron-clad - at least in your opinion. Have you showed her or told her what you know? Unless you show her proof positive she will never admit what she did because your reaction tells her that it's over if she comes clean. Denying it is the only chance she has to keep you from ending the marriage. It is common to use a polygraph - or the threat of it - to get the truth. You could also offer her amnesty - no divorce - if she comes clean right now. If she does finally admit it there is nothing holding you to your "promise" so you do what you feel you have to do. There's no such thing as lying when you are manipulating your WW to give you the truth. 2
aliveagain Posted April 10, 2014 Posted April 10, 2014 You know the truth, you know she's lying, she is choosing to protect the delusional image she has of herself over your marriage leaving you no choice but to divorce her. If you can't trust her and she continues to lie to your face there is no marriage because marriage is based on trust and honesty. You can't negotiate with a liar, the most you will get out of them are more lies and false promises. Don't waste anymore time on her, she's a serial cheater and you deserve better. 5
harrybrown Posted April 10, 2014 Posted April 10, 2014 Sorry that you are going thru this mess. It sounds like you have your head on straight. She is crying, but not remorseful, otherwise she would tell you the truth. Give her the divorce papers. Tell her to go be the OM now. 3
BetrayedH Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 She's just scrambling to do damage control. She is not in control and is used to being able to control and manipulate you with lies. She's probably losing her mind trying to figure out what you know and how you know it. In the meantime, she's shooting herself in the foot. Frankly, I like that you're not revealing your sources. Let her scramble and keep lying. That's very telling and will give you confidence as you move through a divorce. I was tempted to counsel you like Drifter has - to use some tactics to get more information/truth from her. But hell, the fact is that you know enough and she's got so much rope, she's hanging herself. If she's going to keep lying, then let her dangle. 7
bubbaganoosh Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 You said you can't continue with the marriage and sought a lawyer so IMO what I would do is file, give her the papers and present her with the proof. The you let her know that any chance of an R is now null and void and she can continue on with who ever she wants and say nothing more. She had her chance and chose to continuing lying. 3
hard2c Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 don't bother with sexual addicts anonymous it only changes one vice for the other. No ww can be forced into loving a man who she doesn't love. Women have to feel love. 1
lolablue17 Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 Yes show her some proofs, but not everything. Select the proof to show her, and warn her it's only part of the evidences you've got. Tell her you give her one last chance to come clean. (even though you dont mean to give her any chance. It's morally OK to manipulate cheaters in order to get the truth) 1
Oberfeldwebel Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 You are correct, there can be no reconciliation without remorse. Naturally, you can't be remorseful, until you admit that you did something wrong. A person that truly loves you and wants to reconcile would be willing to confess at least in part. Blindly just sweeping this under the rug would gain you nothing. Stick to your guns and don't compromise on this point. 2
fellini Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 (edited) As long as you are certain, that the proof you have is so solid, I would not present them to her. You have told her YOU KNOW, she continues to deny. She only wants to see the proof because she does not know how much and the extent and the numbers, and even possibly with whom in particular. Why does she think a co-worker is out to hurt her, because she knows she has done something and a co-worker is out to hurt her. If you show evidence, you just get locked in a discussion about the evidence. This is not the way forward. The way forward is to move forward, show precise action and do not allow her to play a game of "show me what you know and Ill confess to THAT"... That said. I understand you position, you love your wife (she cheated, not you) and in your case, she refuses to even admit. Had she admitted, and then was not forthcoming on the details, I would say to you patience, dday was very recent and it might take a lot more time to get ALL the details out, not likely to happen in the first go. My WW took me for a 9 month run on trickle truthing her LTR with a co-worker. But your case is different, mine admitted immediately HAVING an A, she just tried unsuccessfully to hide the details I wanted to understand the scope of the betrayal. So I'd agree, for once, other posters here, that at least MOVE out or ASK her to LEAVE is the only way to move forward on this issue. I do not believe this is the end of your relationship, it's only the beginnning of finding out about her betrayal(s). You can decide when this relationship is over during any moment. Edited April 11, 2014 by fellini 2
Keenly Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 Can I ask what the proof is, and how you got it? Just so I can further soak in the juiciness of the attempted lies, deception, and white washing.
2sunny Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 Crying can be for many reasons. It serves her well to cry - manipulation at it's highest level...still selfishly controlling you with tears.
fellini Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 I just saw that this story already ran, and now you are back negotiating with what crying means, what lies, etc. Your last post was "100% correct, time to leave" at which point I assume you moved forward on the D. But now you are back asking questions about a woman you have already decided to divorce? Are you serious about D or are you just trying to use D to get her to talk so that you can find some way to keep this marriage alive? 1
BHsigh Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 As long as you are certain, that the proof you have is so solid, I would not present them to her. You have told her YOU KNOW, she continues to deny. She only wants to see the proof because she does not know how much and the extent and the numbers, and even possibly with whom in particular. Why does she think a co-worker is out to hurt her, because she knows she has done something and a co-worker is out to hurt her. If you show evidence, you just get locked in a discussion about the evidence. This is not the way forward. The way forward is to move forward, show precise action and do not allow her to play a game of "show me what you know and Ill confess to THAT"... ^^ This exactly, I fell into the same thing with my first two DDAYS, it's too easy for the WS to explain their way out of almost anything. I finally hit it on the 3rd dday, I found solid proof that I believed, but I wouldn't show her or tell her anything, I merely told her that I was done and wanted a divorce. She kept asking what was wong and I merely said "You know whats wrong", then she asked me "Is this about OM again?", I just said "I don't know, you tell me". She eventually cracked and confessed. Make up your mind and decide if you're ready to leave her over this, and then do it. 1
fellini Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 Make up your mind and decide if you're ready to leave her over this, and then do it. This seems to be the advice the OP needs the most. This is his second time round trying to figure out what is what. It seems more likely he wants help in helping him to stay and a reasonable reason for doing so. He already has the evidence he needs if infidelity is a "deal-breaker" for him, which is not for me personally (not her infidelity, my own WS!") but that is for him to decide. That he already said "100% correct - time to go" - in his first thread, and now he is asking us to help him interpret her crying binges, suggests he is not ready to let go of this relationship. I think if that is truly the case, he should try to say that and see what kind of help he can get from the LS community to make that WORK, not to hear from the LS community that he is wrong to try. 1
BHsigh Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 That he already said "100% correct - time to go" - in his first thread, and now he is asking us to help him interpret her crying binges, suggests he is not ready to let go of this relationship. I think if that is truly the case, he should try to say that and see what kind of help he can get from the LS community to make that WORK, not to hear from the LS community that he is wrong to try. Very true. OP, do keep in mind too, that you can prepare to leave in order to stay and rebuild. Often the very first step in reconciliation is leaving and filing for divorce, once the WS is hit with this it often forces them to look closely at their own life and what they really want as well, it can also help force them to come clean. Just be prepared to follow through should you choose this course. As drifter said "Unless you show her proof positive she will never admit what she did because your reaction tells her that it's over if she comes clean. Denying it is the only chance she has to keep you from ending the marriage.". This is very true, but another way to look at it is that if she thinks that you won't leave, she will never admit to having an affair. You need to show her that you are seious. Some of our advice can sound harsh, and it's often hard to realize that the intentions can be good. Before my last DDay, when I was on a different forum, I thought that everyone was crazy when they told me that I needed to leave her in order to successfully reconcile, but they were right. I needed to be hard, I needed to think of myself and tell myself that I couldn't continue with how our marriage was, I needed the truth from her and I needed her to decide what she wanted. Give her yourself and your WS that opportunity, particularly if you have solid evidence that she did have an affair.
Spectre Posted April 11, 2014 Posted April 11, 2014 She is crying because she got caught, because she wanted to have her cake and eat it too and shockingly discovered it just wasn't possible. They always seem to turn on the waterworks when their behavior gets exposed. Funny she wasn't crying when she first started betraying you, but now that she has to suffer the consequences she will. All I can say is do not let crocodile tears trick you into staying in a doomed marriage. 3
petee Posted April 12, 2014 Posted April 12, 2014 Its a case of holding your nerve now. Role play if you like, but you have the aces from the pack, don't play them too soon! Let her squirm and slowly draw it out of her by nodding and sucking your teeth. Its all to play for, slowly slowly!!
ChooseTruth Posted April 14, 2014 Posted April 14, 2014 My guess is she's in real pain because she knows she's losing you. Tears aren't always a deliberate manipulation...BUT I wouldn't change your course of action. Apparently her need to lie is greater than her pain. You can't live like that, not being sure of anything. Let her have her pain. Maybe it will eventually change her, but I think it definitely won't if you stay. Best to move on. The cake eating comment made earlier is right. She's crying because she can't cake eat and lie about it too. You could force her hand and make her confess by showing proof, but then of course it's meaningless and she can just go deeper underground. Stay strong.
KathyM Posted April 14, 2014 Posted April 14, 2014 She's had three affairs that you know of. She continues to lie to and manipulate you. She is playing you for a fool. It's time to step off this dysfunctional roller coaster and take your self esteem back. She's not going to change. You are not going to change her. She doesn't want to change. She doesn't want monogamy. You obviously do, so it's time to accept the fact that you are not compatible for this reason and end the relationship. 1
oldshirt Posted April 14, 2014 Posted April 14, 2014 My guess is she's in real pain because she knows she's losing you. Tears aren't always a deliberate manipulation...BUT I wouldn't change your course of action. Apparently her need to lie is greater than her pain. You can't live like that, not being sure of anything. Let her have her pain. Maybe it will eventually change her, but I think it definitely won't if you stay. Best to move on. The cake eating comment made earlier is right. She's crying because she can't cake eat and lie about it too. You could force her hand and make her confess by showing proof, but then of course it's meaningless and she can just go deeper underground. Stay strong. I agree. She may feel real pain but she's a serial cheater and a lier and a bad spouse. The damage has been done and you know you can't trust her or rely on her. Convicted murderers cry in the courtroom when they get sentenced but that doesn't mean that they arent still a threat to society and don't still need to go to jail. 4
Popsicle Posted April 15, 2014 Posted April 15, 2014 She thinks you're going to leave her if she admits it. She doesn't realize that you're going to stay with her if she admits it. 1
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