As men, do some of us now have to settle for less?

[Buzzkill]

There's a 19 year old boy band member named Harry Styles. Go watch his candid videos where the young girls are stalking, throwing themselves at him, screaming, going crazy when he so much as breathes.

 

That guy gets that many women because he's famous and rich. His One direction band is the today's backstreet boys. I see boys like that guy everyday and they don't get that much female attention. Robert Pattinson(edward cullen) was the same. Its not so much that they're good-looking. Average German men are considered attractive in Europe. Its the fame and money and the fact that many other women also want the boy.

[verhrzn]

I think we can allow men to live in fantasy worlds. I mean, for the most part, men's unrealistic expectations are not that bad. She has to be a Victoria Secret model, can cook, has morals, is a decent human being is actually not that bad.

 

Compare that to what a woman's unrealistic expectations are.

 

The highest selling book today is Fifty Shades of Grey, with the dashing, handsome rogue Christian Grey as the romantic lead. The author made 14 million dollars a month last year on her book.

 

Jesus tap-dancing Christ, will people please stop using that book as some sort of blue print for what women want? Ya wanna know why that book was popular? 2 reasons.

 

1) It gave women a way to read sex/porn scenes without anyone else being able to tell. Imagine how popular porn would be if you no longer could get it online, and could only buy it in stores, where the covers quite clearly displayed that it was PORN. That's romance novels for women. It's very difficult to find non-niche romance online, and buying romance novels involves a lot of embarrassment for the woman. And you can never read it in public!

 

50 Shades is a sex book that doesn't directly advertise as a sex book. A lot of its sales were from online e-Book purchases, where women could discreetly read it without anyone being the wiser.

 

It sold because women want to read sex scenes without being publicly shamed for it.

 

2) The main male character of Christian is actually a direct rip off of the main male character in Twilight. 50 Shades started out as a Twilight fanfic. So trying to hold up the two of them up as examples is just sort of silly since they are clones of each other.

 

But the truth is, almost none of the traits you listed matter. Ya wanna know the one trait that, in my opinion, resonated with women to the point where you could toss all the rest out the window?

 

That the main male character needed saving.

 

There's a strong current in a lot of media aimed at women based on the idea that a woman's love can redeem or save a man. It's kind of a power fantasy for the woman... the idea that a guy loves her so much he will change his very nature to be with her. Edward resisted being a vampire and chugging Bella's delicious freescia-smelling blood because he was just that into her. Christian gets over his obsessive need for sexual dominance because Ana's vaginal has magic love healing powers.

 

I constantly see men complain about how women want bad boys. Guys, you do not get it. Women (speaking very generally) don't want bad boys. They want guys who change for them through the power of love. They want a bad boy who stops being bad because he falls for her. They want a player who becomes monogamous because he's so into her. They want a shy nerdy guy who becomes the Confident Man about Town because she's just so amazing he has to impress her.

 

It's a fantasy-a fantasy based around the idea that a woman's power comes from a guy's willingness to subject his own desires to hers.

 

Is it more unrealistic than the typical man's fantasy about desiring a Victoria Secret model who is also somehow a chef/nun? I'm gonna go with.... nope. And the reason why is because a woman's fantasies are all about the behavior of the guy. He doesn't need to change his looks, his hobbies, his job, nothing, not really.... he just needs to subjugate himself in some way. Become romantic where he wasn't before. Become tender where before he was gruff. Behave in some way that shows he's placing a particular desire of hers over a particular individualistic trait of his.

 

Compare that to the man's fantasy. There is no way, no physical way, I am ever going to be a Victoria Secret model. I will never be able to fit a man's fantasy. I can also never go back in time and correct a single sexual encounter. It doesn't matter if 28 years out of my life, I was a upstanding moral citizen... I sleep with a guy once, I am no longer a virgin, and ruined. One time is enough to brand me un-dateable/not-fantasy-fodder for some guys.

 

You could be a woman's fantasy, if you so choose to. There's no way in hell I could ever be a man's. That right there says which fantasy is unrealistic... which one could an average, normal person achieve.

[Buzzkill]

Jesus tap-dancing Christ, will people please stop using that book as some sort of blue print for what women want? Ya wanna know why that book was popular? 2 reasons.

 

1) It gave women a way to read sex/porn scenes without anyone else being able to tell. Imagine how popular porn would be if you no longer could get it online, and could only buy it in stores, where the covers quite clearly displayed that it was PORN. That's romance novels for women. It's very difficult to find non-niche romance online, and buying romance novels involves a lot of embarrassment for the woman. And you can never read it in public!

 

50 Shades is a sex book that doesn't directly advertise as a sex book. A lot of its sales were from online e-Book purchases, where women could discreetly read it without anyone being the wiser.

 

It sold because women want to read sex scenes without being publicly shamed for it.

 

2) The main male character of Christian is actually a direct rip off of the main male character in Twilight. 50 Shades started out as a Twilight fanfic. So trying to hold up the two of them up as examples is just sort of silly since they are clones of each other.

 

But the truth is, almost none of the traits you listed matter. Ya wanna know the one trait that, in my opinion, resonated with women to the point where you could toss all the rest out the window?

 

That the main male character needed saving.

 

There's a strong current in a lot of media aimed at women based on the idea that a woman's love can redeem or save a man. It's kind of a power fantasy for the woman... the idea that a guy loves her so much he will change his very nature to be with her. Edward resisted being a vampire and chugging Bella's delicious freescia-smelling blood because he was just that into her. Christian gets over his obsessive need for sexual dominance because Ana's vaginal has magic love healing powers.

 

I constantly see men complain about how women want bad boys. Guys, you do not get it. Women (speaking very generally) don't want bad boys. They want guys who change for them through the power of love. They want a bad boy who stops being bad because he falls for her. They want a player who becomes monogamous because he's so into her. They want a shy nerdy guy who becomes the Confident Man about Town because she's just so amazing he has to impress her.

 

It's a fantasy-a fantasy based around the idea that a woman's power comes from a guy's willingness to subject his own desires to hers.

 

Is it more unrealistic than the typical man's fantasy about desiring a Victoria Secret model who is also somehow a chef/nun? I'm gonna go with.... nope. And the reason why is because a woman's fantasies are all about the behavior of the guy. He doesn't need to change his looks, his hobbies, his job, nothing, not really.... he just needs to subjugate himself in some way. Become romantic where he wasn't before. Become tender where before he was gruff. Behave in some way that shows he's placing a particular desire of hers over a particular individualistic trait of his.

 

Compare that to the man's fantasy. There is no way, no physical way, I am ever going to be a Victoria Secret model. I will never be able to fit a man's fantasy. I can also never go back in time and correct a single sexual encounter. It doesn't matter if 28 years out of my life, I was a upstanding moral citizen... I sleep with a guy once, I am no longer a virgin, and ruined. One time is enough to brand me un-dateable/not-fantasy-fodder for some guys.

 

You could be a woman's fantasy, if you so choose to. There's no way in hell I could ever be a man's. That right there says which fantasy is unrealistic... which one could an average, normal person achieve.

 

Women do tend to select better-looking men for casual sex, and the women who have ONS aren't even the superficial kind, many are gamer types. Case being how I have this guy who is better-looking than me, one inch or so taller than me, and a baby-face. He's already slept with 5 of the girls from my class.

 

They don't want to date this guy. They want to date me. Am I interested in dating them? Not really. God only knows where that guy has been with his penis. I don't want a girlfriend, and porn keeps me satisfied for the majority of the time, lol.

[verhrzn]

Women do tend to select better-looking men for casual sex, and the women who have ONS aren't even the superficial kind, many are gamer types. Case being how I have this guy who is better-looking than me, one inch or so taller than me, and a baby-face. He's already slept with 5 of the girls from my class.

 

They don't want to date this guy. They want to date me. Am I interested in dating them? Not really. God only knows where that guy has been with his penis. I don't want a girlfriend, and porn keeps me satisfied for the majority of the time, lol.

 

... I have no idea what point you are trying to make here. Are you just taking the opportunity to whine about how women aren't picking you for ONS but instead want to *gasp* date you? Quelle horror.

 

(You do get that if girls didn't find you attractive, they wouldn't want to date you, right? Since dating would involve sleeping with you over and over and over again. They're picking him for a ONS because they like his looks but dislike his personality. They're picking you for a relationship because you have both looks and personality. And this is a bad thing-how?...)

[peruano99]

No we don't .

[Buzzkill]

... I have no idea what point you are trying to make here. Are you just taking the opportunity to whine about how women aren't picking you for ONS but instead want to *gasp* date you? Quelle horror.

 

(You do get that if girls didn't find you attractive, they wouldn't want to date you, right? Since dating would involve sleeping with you over and over and over again. They're picking him for a ONS because they like his looks but dislike his personality. They're picking you for a relationship because you have both looks and personality. And this is a bad thing-how?...)

 

The point I'm trying to make is that men like Edward Cullen and Eric from True Blood and what not are real, they are pursued by women, and most women would have no problem in having 20 minutes with the dude who plays the role of Ragnar in that Vikings History channel show. Many women do expect - Not talking about Miss USA 2014 - the men to be more attractive than themelves, or more attractive than the men who are around them.

 

Of course dating them would be a bad idea. If I'm selected for a relationship, it means that they see me more as a provider rather than as a guy who makes them sexually aroused. I know guys who've been dating their girlfriends for several months and have not yet had sex with them.

 

I know one guy who's been with his girlfriend and they haven't made past 2nd base, a 24 year old guy and gal, dating for 6 months. She's not ashamed(nor she should) when she mentions the ONS she had with the guy's best friend after knowing him for a week or so, lol.

 

Of course it also depends on the woman's age. I have one girl who is cute, and tall. like 5'11'' without shoes. She's into me but wants to test me to see if I'm boyfriend material.She's 25. She expects me to charm her, and to not show sexual interest in her. I'm not going to do that. To be honest, after I realized that I would have a lot of work getting laid with her, I just went HAM on another girl right in front of the tall girl. There's thousands upon thousands of young women going to college with me. Chances are, I'm going to get laid by my looks and I won't have to pay back for the sex by being a woman's boyfriend. I have no wish in becoming a player, but some ONS, that would be lovely.

 

I find it far more logical to be a woman's best male friend, to be introduced to better-looking woman, and If I get lucky and the woman becomes attracted to me due to my looks only, and I surpress the personality that makes women want to date me, I get laid.

 

If not, I just go home and watch porn. Relationships are not my cup of tea. Too much work for very little reward. Behaviors are connected to results.

Edited April 9, 2014 by Buzzkill

[Eclypse]

No I haven't. I struggled in high school as I didn't know much about women. But since then I haven't struggled to get beautiful women. I don't understand the concept of settling. All the women I've pursued have been attractive to me (not sure if other people find them attractive, don't care what they think is attractive either). If someone chooses to be with someone because they think they can't get any better, then that's a bit sad.

[somedude81]

But since then I haven't struggled to get beautiful women.

 

I don't understand the concept of settling.

Perhaps those two sentences are connected?

[somedude81]

Sure, different people want different things. My point is that in a lot of these threads where men complain that women aren't interested in them, I suspect there isn't much to be interested in. Why should a woman want to date you? If you can't answer that question (or if your answer is something like "I'm not that bad" or (shudder) "I'm a 'nice' guy), then the problem is on you.

 

You can't control what other people want, but you have a lot of control over who you are. Instead of talking of "settling", I think it's better to think in terms of how you can make yourself a better partner.

I can easily answer that question and give 10 years whey I think I'm a good catch. And then half the women on this forum would say that none of those 10 things mean anything to them.

 

For example, some women like a man that can dance and is a good leader, some women don't give a damn about that.

 

That's why asking "What can you offer to women" is a meaningless question.

[Buzzkill]

I can easily answer that question and give 10 years whey I think I'm a good catch. And then half the women on this forum would say that none of those 10 things mean anything to them.

 

For example, some women like a man that can dance and is a good leader, some women don't give a damn about that.

 

That's why asking "What can you offer to women" is a meaningless question.

 

 

Then figure out what the women you are surrounded by are interested and go from there.

[Eclypse]

Perhaps those two sentences are connected?

 

What I meant was, I've only ever gone for girls that I thought were pretty, or had a good personality, and didn't care if they were conventionally attractive. As long as they pass my test they're for me. I don't understand how someone can actively decide to be with someone they don't find attractive or appealing to be around. If their morals are that any sex is better than no sex then... :S

 

I've been rejected heaps. Lots of girls didn't want to date me. I'd hate if they only wnet out with me from pity or because they felt any company was better than no company, even though they don't like me. I'm glad my girlfriend liked me enough to date me. Mutual attraction is so important for happiness.

[somedude81]

 

I've been rejected heaps. Lots of girls didn't want to date me. I'd hate if they only wnet out with me from pity or because they felt any company was better than no company, even though they don't like me. I'm glad my girlfriend liked me enough to date me. Mutual attraction is so important for happiness.

OK, then you have struggled.

 

Your post made you come across as somebody who has never struggled and doesn't understand why people settle.

What I meant was, I've only ever gone for girls that I thought were pretty, or had a good personality, and didn't care if they were conventionally attractive. As long as they pass my test they're for me. I don't understand how someone can actively decide to be with someone they don't find attractive or appealing to be around. If their morals are that any sex is better than no sex then... :S

I completely agree with you here.

 

Like you, I've only gone after women that I was attracted to, and thought they have a good personality.

 

Though there is a point where somebody can struggle so much, that they don't care if they are attracted to the woman at all, and just want a woman.

 

I was at that point a long time ago. Back when I was 22, I "dated" an obese girl for two weeks. She was the first girl I ever kissed. I was extremely desperate for any female contact. We didn't have sex, though I had a couple of chances to make it happen.

 

Once things were over with her, I decided never to settle again. 10 years later, I got my second kiss, and my first girlfriend.

[verhrzn]

The point I'm trying to make is that men like Edward Cullen and Eric from True Blood and what not are real, they are pursued by women, and most women would have no problem in having 20 minutes with the dude who plays the role of Ragnar in that Vikings History channel show. Many women do expect - Not talking about Miss USA 2014 - the men to be more attractive than themelves, or more attractive than the men who are around them.

 

Some women are physically attracted to some men? Holy cow, news at 6!

 

Of course dating them would be a bad idea. If I'm selected for a relationship, it means that they see me more as a provider rather than as a guy who makes them sexually aroused. I know guys who've been dating their girlfriends for several months and have not yet had sex with them.

 

Then the guys should dump them, if all the guys are looking for is sex. And no, they don't see you as a "provider," whatever the **** that means. If they want to date you, it means they see you as a guy they want to bang multiple times while also hanging out with. Most girls assume and want sex to be a regular part of their relationships. You are making some very ugly assumptions about all women.... that they have no interest in sex or are all cheaters (ie, they don't want sex from their boyfriends/husbands but want it from the 'hot ONS' guys.)

 

I know one guy who's been with his girlfriend and they haven't made past 2nd base, a 24 year old guy and gal, dating for 6 months. She's not ashamed(nor she should) when she mentions the ONS she had with the guy's best friend after knowing him for a week or so, lol.

 

And has the boyfriend talked to her about it? Could it be that there are issues in their relationship that you're unaware of.... like maybe he has trouble getting it up, or she's a rape survivor and still has a lot of sexual hang ups? (And the ONS happened before her assault.) You're sticking your nose into a relationship where you don't have the details and trying to extrapolate meaning about all women. It's ridiculous!

 

Of course it also depends on the woman's age. I have one girl who is cute, and tall. like 5'11'' without shoes. She's into me but wants to test me to see if I'm boyfriend material.She's 25. She expects me to charm her, and to not show sexual interest in her. I'm not going to do that. To be honest, after I realized that I would have a lot of work getting laid with her, I just went HAM on another girl right in front of the tall girl. There's thousands upon thousands of young women going to college with me. Chances are, I'm going to get laid by my looks and I won't have to pay back for the sex by being a woman's boyfriend. I have no wish in becoming a player, but some ONS, that would be lovely.

 

Holy hell what is wrong with you? First you complain that women don't want to f*** you, then a woman clearly wants to f*** you but expects some work on your part, and you cruelly crush her?? What, were you just expecting to lay back, without any kind of involvement or effort on your part, and have a girl land on you? And you view being someone's boyfriend as "paying them back" for sex?? Wow. Just wow. I feel egregiously sorry for any girl who finds herself sleeping with you, your attitudes about sex and dating are so messed up.

 

I find it far more logical to be a woman's best male friend, to be introduced to better-looking woman, and If I get lucky and the woman becomes attracted to me due to my looks only, and I surpress the personality that makes women want to date me, I get laid.

 

I'm sure the women you're friends with are just thrilled at the idea that you're using them to lay (not date) "better looking" women. You're just a charmer the whole way around.

[ltjg45]

Some women are physically attracted to some men? Holy cow, news at 6!

 

 

 

Then the guys should dump them, if all the guys are looking for is sex. And no, they don't see you as a "provider," whatever the **** that means. If they want to date you, it means they see you as a guy they want to bang multiple times while also hanging out with. Most girls assume and want sex to be a regular part of their relationships. You are making some very ugly assumptions about all women.... that they have no interest in sex or are all cheaters (ie, they don't want sex from their boyfriends/husbands but want it from the 'hot ONS' guys.)

 

 

 

And has the boyfriend talked to her about it? Could it be that there are issues in their relationship that you're unaware of.... like maybe he has trouble getting it up, or she's a rape survivor and still has a lot of sexual hang ups? (And the ONS happened before her assault.) You're sticking your nose into a relationship where you don't have the details and trying to extrapolate meaning about all women. It's ridiculous!

 

 

 

Holy hell what is wrong with you? First you complain that women don't want to f*** you, then a woman clearly wants to f*** you but expects some work on your part, and you cruelly crush her?? What, were you just expecting to lay back, without any kind of involvement or effort on your part, and have a girl land on you? And you view being someone's boyfriend as "paying them back" for sex?? Wow. Just wow. I feel egregiously sorry for any girl who finds herself sleeping with you, your attitudes about sex and dating are so messed up.

 

 

 

I'm sure the women you're friends with are just thrilled at the idea that you're using them to lay (not date) "better looking" women. You're just a charmer the whole way around.

 

I am completely dumbfounded that a guy with this way of thinking is even capable of getting women. If I did even 10% of what he did, I would be labeled an ******* for life.

 

If these are the guys that I am losing decent women to, why even bother dating at all for me? Like, seriously....

[ThaWholigan]

I am completely dumbfounded that a guy with this way of thinking is even capable of getting women. If I did even 10% of what he did, I would be labeled an ******* for life.

 

If these are the guys that I am losing decent women to, why even bother dating at all for me? Like, seriously....

Its a big world my friend, you're not losing anything

 

As for me, I've never believed I had to settle for "less" than I wanted. I think men who believe they don't measure up will be more inclined to do so unless they have a shift in mindstate. In a sense, the settling starts from within.

[Buzzkill]

Some women are physically attracted to some men? Holy cow, news at 6!

 

Those men aren’t ‘’just’’ men. They are the top of the male spectrum for beauty. Women have an advantage over men in this aspect as men can find any woman worthy of sex, so the average/cute woman can aim for much better-looking men than her, but then she turns and expects the guy to date her.

 

I don’t do that. When a woman is attracted to me she makes it clear she wants to sleep with me. By sleeping with me. I always grow outraged, internally, that the women who want to be my girlfriend always do so after sleeping with a better-looking man. Its like the bank giving a free loan to someone and then demanding of me to be the perfect client. Nah. Go to any summer vacation location and you’ll see women sleep with random men while they boyfriends are sitting at home.

 

To be frank, the most success I’ve had as been with foreign women from Europe. They arrive without their boyfriends, with their girlfriends trailing behind, and are far easier to have ONS with, no questions asked. Europeans love Americans and my, aren’t they sexy little things. Finally all those years of having to endure Spanish pays off.

 

Then the guys should dump them, if all the guys are looking for is sex. And no, they don't see you as a "provider," whatever the **** that means. If they want to date you, it means they see you as a guy they want to bang multiple times while also hanging out with. Most girls assume and want sex to be a regular part of their relationships. You are making some very ugly assumptions about all women.... that they have no interest in sex or are all cheaters (ie, they don't want sex from their boyfriends/husbands but want it from the 'hot ONS' guys.)

 

Yes, they indeed do see me as a provider. A provider is a man who provides resources, money, emotions, patience, or effort. They tell me I have potential. I do. But that potential isn’t to be exploited by anyone but me. I am not husband material and truthfully, I become deeply offended when they suggest that I’m something for long term. I have 8 hours per week with the same teacher. I’m asleep half of that time because I can’t bother interacting with the same person.

 

I have a huge social group. I know many women, many women and I’m always adding women to my social group. I rarely if ever interact with the same woman for more than 2 days in a row, and that’s pushing it.

 

I’m not interested in having sex multiple times with the same woman. Unless she’s a 22 year old blonde Angelina Jolie with blue eyes, I’m not going to put up with her. On second thought, risk that. There’s this Swedish girl, married, I’ve been dealing with. She’s beautiful but even with that going for her I could never marry her. I value my freedom too much.

 

 

I’m not making any assumptions. Most of the guys I know who are in relationships complain of not having enough sex or that she added weight and doesn’t want to get rid of it. Come on, man. You’re in college, surrounded by women in their sexual prime, who are interested in adventure, danger, excitement and sex. Why would you attach yourself to someone, anyone at all? Its not natural. Not that marriage and co-habitation/children are natural, but we’ll leave that for another time.

 

Nearly every male studying with me are only interested in hook-ups. The girls tell me so. The only girls I know of with boyfriends are below average women. They know they can’t compete with the other girls, and since average and above average women are desired by the majority of the guys, you’d be in a hot mess trying to satisfy these girls in a relationship scenario. They’d be picky, demanding, problematic. They would believe themselves to be of higher value than the other girls because you wanted to date them.

 

To be truthful, I also know quite a big number of men in their 30s and much older than that and they all say their sexual life is lacking with their girlfriends/or doesn’t exist at all. I’ll take their word for it. I don’t want to be stuck living with a woman who is just there as a roommate.

 

And has the boyfriend talked to her about it? Could it be that there are issues in their relationship that you're unaware of.... like maybe he has trouble getting it up, or she's a rape survivor and still has a lot of sexual hang ups? (And the ONS happened before her assault.) You're sticking your nose into a relationship where you don't have the details and trying to extrapolate meaning about all women. It's ridiculous!

 

Trouble getting it up? He’s in his 20s. Stay a day or two without masturbation or porn and we feel like we’re 15 years ago with 18 year olds gone wild girls in front of us. Rape survivor? Nope. I don’t have the details? Really? I introduce him to her, after knowing her for a long time, and guess who was the guy’s best friend? I always make sure the women my friends deal with are worth the effort.

 

She saw me as the exciting bad boy. So she gave it up with no effort. He’s a future doctor. She has to make sure he sees her as a good girl, that is all.

 

Holy hell what is wrong with you? First you complain that women don't want to f*** you, then a woman clearly wants to f*** you but expects some work on your part, and you cruelly crush her?? What, were you just expecting to lay back, without any kind of involvement or effort on your part, and have a girl land on you? And you view being someone's boyfriend as "paying them back" for sex?? Wow. Just wow. I feel egregiously sorry for any girl who finds herself sleeping with you, your attitudes about sex and dating are so messed up.

You’re correct on that assumption. I expect the woman to sleep with me without any warrant of effort from my part. Its been working so far. Everytime I’ve had to work a little bit for the attention of a woman, she began to pull strings and try to make me dance to get that sweet vagina. Nope, I am not a monkey.

 

There are countless more women out there who are eager to have a good time. Granted, there are far better-looking men than me, but with most college students, being by far women, I’m bound to sleep with the women I’m honestly attracted to.

That girl tried to play a game that I won’t play.

 

For example. My female classmates are always touching me, rubbing against me to get my attention and so forth. European women are very touchy-feely. This girl, the girl I ‘’crushed’’ was playing a board game with me and some classmates of mine during our lunch break. One of the European girls puts her hand on my shoulder blade for me to let her pass. I don’t make a big deal of it. Euros are big on invading personal space.

 

This girl, lol. I touch her on the shoulder blades, she blushes. I touch her again, this time I touched her bra strap by mistake because she was adjusting herself, she tells me to not abuse it. What the hell?

 

Then, my closest female friend’s brother was to arrive from his trip in South Korea. I was invited to attend his return party and then to go dancing, I accepted. This girl who is so ‘’well-behaved’’ with the best grades the classroom has to offer, also accepted it. She was always blushing and laughing every time I would speak sweet words to her, and she spent the whole week asking me if I was going to the party. I mean, I wasn’t keen on going to that party and to the dance floor, but when my friend told me this girl was going I texted her when the date was, and an hour later or so the girl shows up with my friend all excited telling me I have to go with them to the dance club blablabla.

 

Fast forward and this girl is flirting with me all the time, asking me to stay longer with them, insisting on it, trying to show off by saying how x guy and x rich guy wanted to marry her and I’m just there standing.

 

The night ended and for a whole week this girl, who’d always been a loner, was now always seen with female friends, always showing up where I was at and going out of her way to talk to me, even ‘’waking’’ me up from my musical slumber for me to notice her existence. Guaranteed lay, right?

Nope. I texted my friend how much I was sexually intrigued by this tall girl(25 years old, the girl, I doubt she lacks sexual experience) and what would happen next? She’s visibly annoyed when she sees me and tells me she needs to clarifiy some stuff, then she ignores me.

 

See, this woman wasn’t interested in sleeping with me. She simply enjoyed the attention I was providing her with. That is why I always aim for the kill or figure out some other girl who is interested in me. When we were heading for the nightclub, some taller guy, 6’4’’ or so was staring at her and you should have seen how much she was blushing. I bet he could’ve banged her with a snap of his fingers.

 

I don’t complain about girls not wanting to **** me. Its that, although I look a lot like Keanu Reeves, there are better-looking men/taller men than me, and the women don’t approach me at all. They either stand there when I’m inside the train or bus staring me down as if this was some blinking contest, getting near me and then looking at me, playing with their hair, or they hang out outside of my classroom and wait for me to finish my class to take a glance at me.

I wanted it to be like the richer guys/better-looking, where the women approach them out of nowhere, and the women are pretty hot, too. I really do dislike having to work for something some other guy probably had without having to even send a text message. Come on, the girls who are into me either stand there with their boyfriends(when they have one) staring at me from across the room(I look around to see if there are other guys near me) and just waiting. I have a name.

 

Just come up to me and say ‘’hi, what’s your name?’’ We both want the same thing. You want to sleep with charming, good-looking Americans, and I want a moment in time with them perfect Germans, French, Spanish and Portuguese women.

 

I’m not asking for much. Just that women act like equals.

 

‘’I'm sure the women you're friends with are just thrilled at the idea that you're using them to lay (not date) "better looking" women. You're just a charmer the whole way around)

I’m not using them at all. They get rewarded for what they do. They receive sporadic, sometimes frequent attention from a high-value man, whose ambition is to one day become one of the highest sexually worthy men in the world, to attain them Russian supermodels for a fair price or in exchange of my sexual looks worth, and their worth as women are increased because they are seen in the presence of an attractive man. I am quite charming. I can make any room lighter and brighter. I am endlessly enthused by how cute they become when out of the blue, after spending a long time avoiding them, I buy them gifts, take them out(of course I pay) and then I go back to being distant. It makes the other girls wonder if I'm this girl boyfriend, and they become intrigued by a guy who can show up, treat a woman like a princess, but expect nothing out of her. It makes attractive women more interested in getting to know a specimen, they've never encountered before.

 

Most men do something for a woman expecting sexual attention in return. I do it because I'm thrilled by the growing emotions the woman begins to have dwelling inside of her for the guy who ''selects'' her from the myriad waves of female presence and grace her with provisions.

 

Sometimes I pick a conversation with women who are very guarded just to see if I can make them smile. Every time. Never fails. I love to have women have crushes for me, and sometimes I pretend that I’m interested in a girl just to see how she reacts. Come on, life’s too short for me to take it seriously. Its rather funny when I finally get that one woman who is very guarded/shy/not interested, to develop an interest in me, and then I’m like. ‘’Hey, you are my best bud. Can you introduce me to Susan?’’

 

Its even more funny when Susan is in demand and you manage to make her attracted to you when her physical demands for a man to sleep wit her, you don’t have those, but you can still charm-bomb her into desiring her. College, is so incredible fun, lol.

‘

Of course the women aren't perfect-looking. I can't do the same to perfect women, like a 22 year old Brad Pitt could, but one day. One day , man.

 

 

I am completely dumbfounded that a guy with this way of thinking is even capable of getting women. If I did even 10% of what he did, I would be labeled an ******* for life.

 

Ted Bundy was a serial-killer and he still received countless love letters from women. Women are as visual as men, and if you can play your cards well you can be ugly and still be an emotional Rudolf Valentino. Look, college women aren't there in search of a boyfriend or a future husband. The women who can get sex are going to be open to a guy, he doesn't even need to be above average. Heck, there's a poster on this forum who claims to be short, skinny, and of Hispanic origin and he's banging very hot, early 20s white women for free. Women love that daredevil, doesn't give a damn about anything, bigger than life personality. You think the guys with the best grades, with the best future are getting laid? LOL. They're lucky to find the average woman, and the average woman will more than likely settle with him because she knows she can't compete with the other women.

 

Get drunk, hit a strip club. Bring your date with you! Jump from a cliff with a thin rope attached to your ankle. Any dangerous activity makes women sexually aroused. Be the most vocal in your group. don't be afraid to do anything. I've gone from looking like a prep boy, all dressed up, and women eye-banging me, to letting my beard grow, allow my hair to become greasy, look like a bum, and the same happened. Its that aura of danger that men are born with(or can develop) what attracts women. Of course I would love to look like Brad Pitt when he was 22 years old. It would make things far, far easier, but that's life.

 

You can be the guy women will think about 10 years from now while they're cooking dinner for their sons. You can be the guy women are thinking about as their husbands is on top of them. Or you can be the sucker who's dating them, marrying them, and

paying for what some other guy had, for free, when she was in her beauty prime, with no worries in her life, no expectations ,and just looking for a good dicking and for a good time, lol.

Edited April 9, 2014 by Buzzkill

[verhrzn]

Those men aren’t ‘’just’’ men. They are the top of the male spectrum for beauty. Women have an advantage over men in this aspect as men can find any woman worthy of sex, so the average/cute woman can aim for much better-looking men than her, but then she turns and expects the guy to date her.

 

I don’t do that. When a woman is attracted to me she makes it clear she wants to sleep with me. By sleeping with me. I always grow outraged, internally, that the women who want to be my girlfriend always do so after sleeping with a better-looking man. Its like the bank giving a free loan to someone and then demanding of me to be the perfect client. Nah. Go to any summer vacation location and you’ll see women sleep with random men while they boyfriends are sitting at home.

 

Your two statements here contradict each other. You just said a woman sleeps with a "hotter" guy but then turns around and wants to date you. So she isn't trying to get the hotter guy to date her (if she's looking at it in the same mercenary fashion as you are.)

 

And why the hell are you outraged when you're essentially doing the same thing? You seem to want to bang super hot chicks with no interest in dating them, so why are you so outraged that some women have the exact same compulsion? Why is it okay for you to want hot, random ONS but not women? And yeah, you know a few cheaters... I know plenty of guys who sleep with random women behind their girlfriends' backs. What's your point?

 

To be frank, the most success I’ve had as been with foreign women from Europe. They arrive without their boyfriends, with their girlfriends trailing behind, and are far easier to have ONS with, no questions asked. Europeans love Americans and my, aren’t they sexy little things. Finally all those years of having to endure Spanish pays off.

 

*Vomit*

 

Yes, they indeed do see me as a provider. A provider is a man who provides resources, money, emotions, patience, or effort. They tell me I have potential. I do. But that potential isn’t to be exploited by anyone but me. I am not husband material and truthfully, I become deeply offended when they suggest that I’m something for long term. I have 8 hours per week with the same teacher. I’m asleep half of that time because I can’t bother interacting with the same person.

 

No, they probably see you as a guy whose personality they like. And yeah, a relationship comes with emotions, patience and effort. Which, if a girl is a decent person to date, she would also provide. Anyone who views it as a one-way street is probably too immature to be dating.

 

Which seems to include you. I'm at least glad you're self-aware enough to realize you are too selfish and immature for a relationship. But getting angry at women because they don't understand the depths of your narcissism (you only want to bang them, you want them to desire banging no one but you and yet also not want a relationship with you) is just ridiculous. They are not mind readers.

 

I’m not making any assumptions. Most of the guys I know who are in relationships complain of not having enough sex or that she added weight and doesn’t want to get rid of it. Come on, man. You’re in college, surrounded by women in their sexual prime, who are interested in adventure, danger, excitement and sex. Why would you attach yourself to someone, anyone at all? Its not natural. Not that marriage and co-habitation/children are natural, but we’ll leave that for another time.

 

I don't know, why don't you frigging ask them? My guess is, they complain about those things because men are expected to complain about those things. God forbid a guy actually have a somewhat low sex drive or not care how skinny a girl is. My guess is, you dig deep down into these guys who complain about their girlfriend gaining weight or not banging them enough, you'll find guys who like/love/value their girlfriend and relationship, and actually don't really care all that much about getting sex once a day or an extra 10 pounds.

 

Some guys *gasp* actually value relationships. Some guys actually consider a loving, supportive girlfriend as far more important than a waif who sleeps with them three times a day. Stop trying to squeeze everyone into the same shallow, self-centered world view you live in. It isn't natural for you... fine. But if these guys aren't dumping their girlfriends, there's probably a reason.

 

Nearly every male studying with me are only interested in hook-ups. The girls tell me so. The only girls I know of with boyfriends are below average women. They know they can’t compete with the other girls, and since average and above average women are desired by the majority of the guys, you’d be in a hot mess trying to satisfy these girls in a relationship scenario. They’d be picky, demanding, problematic. They would believe themselves to be of higher value than the other girls because you wanted to date them.

 

And I know women from all across the spectrum. I know below-average women who get laid like mad, and I know above-average women who married their high school sweetheart, and their husband couldn't be happier.

 

But my guess is your definitions of "picky, demanding and problematic" would boil down to "they require basic relationship maintenance and attention." So pretty much any girl who isn't a hot cardboard cut-out would be too much energy and effort for you. That isn't true for every guy.... hell, I'd guess even a sizable chunk of guys. You want to believe that all men are like you, and all men view women in the same shallow, antagonistic way you do, because it makes you feel less awful and less alone.

 

To be truthful, I also know quite a big number of men in their 30s and much older than that and they all say their sexual life is lacking with their girlfriends/or doesn’t exist at all. I’ll take their word for it. I don’t want to be stuck living with a woman who is just there as a roommate.

 

And again, this could have nothing to do with the social pressure put on men to believe they should want sex constantly, and if they ever don't want sex, they are somehow less than real men. And that even if they are secretly satisfied with 2 times a week, they can never say it, because their bro-tastic social group would mock them endlessly for it.

 

Or it couldn't possibly be that these men married women they weren't compatible with out of pressure from their social group. Or that the men themselves might have a hand in the sex being so low. Nope. Their words must be absolutely truth, regardless of social context, and it must be all the women's fault.

 

 

Trouble getting it up? He’s in his 20s. Stay a day or two without masturbation or porn and we feel like we’re 15 years ago with 18 year olds gone wild girls in front of us. Rape survivor? Nope. I don’t have the details? Really? I introduce him to her, after knowing her for a long time, and guess who was the guy’s best friend? I always make sure the women my friends deal with are worth the effort.

 

You are not all men. I know several guys in their 20's who struggle with keeping it up. Or who actually have no interest in sex at all.

 

Just because you know a girl doesn't mean she'll tell you all her deep, dark secrets. And given your disgusting lack of empathy or understanding of women or even other guys here, I wouldn't be surprised if your guy friend was having some sexual issue that he'd never actually tell you about.

 

You’re correct on that assumption. I expect the woman to sleep with me without any warrant of effort from my part. Its been working so far. Everytime I’ve had to work a little bit for the attention of a woman, she began to pull strings and try to make me dance to get that sweet vagina. Nope, I am not a monkey.

 

Or even an active participant, it sounds like. So you have an incredibly satisfying sex life where you don't have to put in any effort whatsoever... and then turn around and complain about how women won't sleep with you (but want to date you) but will sleep with your an-inch-taller best friend. Your stories are not matching up, dude.

 

See, this woman wasn’t interested in sleeping with me. She simply enjoyed the attention I was providing her with. That is why I always aim for the kill or figure out some other girl who is interested in me. When we were heading for the nightclub, some taller guy, 6’4’’ or so was staring at her and you should have seen how much she was blushing. I bet he could’ve banged her with a snap of his fingers

 

Or maybe she just wanted to see some small amount of effort on your part that you were interested in her. Maybe she has enough self-respect that she isn't going to throw herself at a guy who seems to be not at all interested in her. No where in your story do I see you even trying to display affection for her.

 

And you are not a mind reader. Unless she told you or showed you that she'd sleep with the taller, more attractive guy, stop assuming.

 

I don’t complain about girls not wanting to **** me. Its that, although I look a lot like Keanu Reeves, there are better-looking men/taller men than me, and the women don’t approach me at all. They either stand there when I’m inside the train or bus staring me down as if this was some blinking contest, getting near me and then looking at me, playing with their hair, or they hang out outside of my classroom and wait for me to finish my class to take a glance at me.

I wanted it to be like the richer guys/better-looking, where the women approach them out of nowhere, and the women are pretty hot, too. I really do dislike having to work for something some other guy probably had without having to even send a text message. Come on, the girls who are into me either stand there with their boyfriends(when they have one) staring at me from across the room(I look around to see if there are other guys near me) and just waiting. I have a name.

 

Maybe they aren't interested in you. A girl staring at you could just be staring at you. You are trying to mind-read, and it's ridiculous. A girl playing with her hair doesn't mean she wants to sleep with her.

 

And you are making radical assumptions about hotter guys getting girls without effort. I guarantee the guy is putting in some sort of effort-you are just not noticing it because you are so consumed with jealousy, and clinging to this notion that you can somehow extract a person's thoughts and motivations just by looking at them.

 

Just come up to me and say ‘’hi, what’s your name?’’ We both want the same thing. You want to sleep with charming, good-looking Americans, and I want a moment in time with them perfect Germans, French, Spanish and Portuguese women.

 

I’m not asking for much. Just that women act like equals.

 

Acting like equals.... where they put in all the effort and pursue you, and you put in none! Yep. Totally equal.

 

Ted Bundy was a serial-killer and he still received countless love letters from women. Women are as visual as men, and if you can play your cards well you can be ugly and still be an emotional Rudolf Valentino. Look, college women aren't there in search of a boyfriend or a future husband. The women who can get sex are going to be open to a guy, he doesn't even need to be above average. Heck, there's a poster on this forum who claims to be short, skinny, and of Hispanic origin and he's banging very hot, early 20s white women for free. Women love that daredevil, doesn't give a damn about anything, bigger than life personality. You think the guys with the best grades, with the best future are getting laid? LOL. They're lucky to find the average woman, and the average woman will more than likely settle with him because she knows she can't compete with the other women.

 

Because women couldn't possibly like a smart guy. Or dislike daredevils. No, it's against our factory mandate! I should check my warranty, I think they built me wrong, since I have absolutely no interest in "dare devil" "hot" guys, and would far prefer an academically gifted nerd guy.

 

You can be the guy women will think about 10 years from now while they're cooking dinner for their sons. You can be the guy women are thinking about as their husbands is on top of them. Or you can be the sucker who's dating them, marrying them, and

paying for what some other guy had, for free, when she was in her beauty prime, with no worries in her life, no expectations ,and just looking for a good dicking and for a good time, lol.

 

Um, I'm a girl. And maybe my opinion doesn't count because I'm one of those ugly chicks you are so disdainful of, but the guy I marry is going to be the lucky one. He's going to get my emotional support, my financial support, my encouragement, my love, my heart, my body, my enthusiasm, and my devotion. I cannot truly enjoy myself in bed unless I trust and love the guy, something that no ONS is ever going to get.

 

But that doesn't matter to you. Which is fine. But stop photo-copying your own narrow view of the world onto everyone else.

[GoodOnPaper]

Now I've been single for many months and it's not easy finding a quality woman that would be worth proposing to and having kids with. I get the feeling most of the good ones are either already taken (either dated their HS sweetheart and married him later on or were simply snatched on time) or too young for me to date them. I think I'm going to just have to settle for any woman with baggages, compromise and simply only see the present. I don't want to be single for too long and do want kids. ONS wouldn't help in anything. I would still be single and lonely. I admit I'm kind of desperate at this point.

 

I think in my desperate self, I would even eat a rotten sandwich. I'm close to giving up on the searching and simply get what I can get.

 

By the end of my single days, I had a similar outlook but try not to actually go that far. Unfortunately, I think that finding someone with whom you have incredible physical chemistry AND a strong overall compatibility is only possible for those guys are good at attracting women in general. For those of us who struggle(d), getting half the package -- most likely the compatibility part -- is probably the best to expect.

 

That said, how do most relationships play out? Crazy physical chemistry at first then difficulties with compatibility-related issues. In my marriage, the compatibility part is easy while the intimacy issues are much harder work -- so while different, it's just the mirror image of what millions of couples try to navigate through every day.

 

No matter how desperate you feel, it's my opinion that one rule that you should never violate is that you LIKE a woman that you are committing to.

[Buzzkill]

Your two statements here contradict each other. You just said a woman sleeps with a "hotter" guy but then turns around and wants to date you. So she isn't trying to get the hotter guy to date her (if she's looking at it in the same mercenary fashion as you are.)

 

 

She tries to put the chains of commitment on the better-looking guy, like a novice hunter trying to game a massive lion instead of trying to begin his hunter career by hunting ducks.

 

When the woman fails to make Johnny Depp interested in more than a quickie, she is going to go for the next guy in the looks-scale. It can be either me, or some other guy. On occasion I dazzle women with a great personality that I reserve only for the hottest of women, but I do that mostly to garnish her approval as a potential lay for her better-looking friends. It will work, if I’m better-looking than the current men the women meet and deal with.

 

Its still a lot of work. It drains me and I would much prefer to rely only on looks to get what I want.

 

That’s why I prefer married women. They’re tired of having sex with the same man, want to feel desirable again and just want to feel young again. Had that one happen with a Canadian girl I met a couple of years ago. She came to the states to meet with some of her family. I couldn’t compete with her boyfriend because she was looking for marriage and $ becomes more important than looks as the shift in desire in women changes from sexual pleasure to stability and safety.

 

A month ago I saw her walking by the same coffee shop we’d go to everyday. She gave me her number. Then I asked for her email, because her husband checks her cellphone. Ever since I began to text her, and this was only one text message, a very innocent message, I began to receive several unknown calls per day. Everyday. It continued for 3 months, the time I stopped talking to the girl because she didn’t reply to my text message.

 

The unknown calls eventually stopped because I turned off my phone for a long time. But then I felt like I still had a shot with this French-speaker Canadian Goddess, with legs that went for miles, and I called her on the phone. Right the next day, I had 12 unknown calls waiting for me to look at, lol. I eventually slept with her.

 

Do I care about her husband? Nope. Men are always in competition for the best of the best and a woman like that is worth getting shot for. Although I would risk death for a sexual encounter with a woman this much similar to what Helen of Troy must’ve looked like to have 1000 ships launched for her, I am not interested in being her husband or boyfriend. A woman like that is too much of a upkeep, and men will be hounding her gates until the day of her death.

 

And why the hell are you outraged when you're essentially doing the same thing?

Because I have to work for the attention I get. Women might find me attractive but they just stand there looking like some Greek Statue saluting its tourists in some dusty little island. The Depps and Pitts don’t have to do anything at all. It irks me, that is all.

 

 

You seem to want to bang super hot chicks with no interest in dating them, so why are you so outraged that some women have the exact same compulsion? Why is it okay for you to want hot, random ONS but not women? And yeah, you know a few cheaters... I know plenty of guys who sleep with random women behind their girlfriends' backs. What's your point?

I have no qualms with women wanting and pursuing the Iker A-Rods of the world. I applaud them with all my heart for being honest with their desires and for choosing to risk being outed by the other women for attempting to catch the highest men in value.

 

What makes me blow away sand is how they want to date me. Who dates anyway? I haven’t heard of a girlfriend and a boyfriend, in the true extension of the word, since 9th grade. People spend time together and bang, that is all. I have my female friends for good, quality time, and I have other women I have no interest in spending time with.

 

Vomit

Why? Did you know that the English have mini-holidays during the year? The girls team up with other girls, and the guys gather other guys and they go to the interior of the Country, or to France-Spain and have a lot of random sex with the natives? Both the girlfriends and boyfriends know of this and are perfectly ok with this.

 

This is not the century of debauchery. It’s the awareness that human beings aren’t naturally monogamous and that life is too brilliant for one guy and on gal to chain themselves to outdated expectations from their parents and from society. Oh, the birth rate is way below the replacement rates? What is it to me? LOL. I’m not Sargon of Akkad, I’m not Alexander The Great. I am not interested in becoming a father, and in the same light of becoming, more and more men and women are saying, ‘’shove it, uncle Sam´´

 

You should disit Ibiza during the summer and hit the Café del sol. So much random sex with people you’ll never see again.

 

No, they probably see you as a guy whose personality they like. And yeah, a relationship comes with emotions, patience and effort. Which, if a girl is a decent person to date, she would also provide. Anyone who views it as a one-way street is probably too immature to be dating.

 

Yes, I concur. They like my personality. I can be the Indiana Jones to provoke that rollercoaster of undying emotions and I can also be that guy they want to graduate college with and move in, so we can live in squalor for the first few years of our post-college indoctrination as the student debt crushes our backs into everlasting Chinese acupuncture treatments.

 

Thanks, but I am very much satisfied with my life as it is. I’ve been in a relationship before. To see what it was like. I was perfect. Grew quite bored of it and vowed to never have a relationship again. Just the title of girlfriend and boyfriend make me shudder. I abhor responsibilities. My ancestors didn’t toil away and bleed to throughout the centuries touch my index finger and bless me with freedom for me to join willing slavery.

 

Which seems to include you. I'm at least glad you're self-aware enough to realize you are too selfish and immature for a relationship. But getting angry at women because they don't understand the depths of your narcissism (you only want to bang them, you want them to desire banging no one but you and yet also not want a relationship with you) is just ridiculous. They are not mind readers.

Nope. I’m quite mature. I don’t lie to women. My speech on my interests(wealth, power, Russian supermodels) is always a topic when we sit to eat, and they know they can’t expect more from me than what I’m willing to give. Never hurt a woman in my life.

 

I mean, I did hurt my mother, but that’s because she’s expecting me to find a good girl to one day marry so that she can have kids. I don’t have to get married to have children. I can freeze my sperm now and in my 40’s find a surrogate mother with the qualities I envision my son to have, but my mother is a old-school woman, I forgive her for her limitations.

 

Selfish? All that I do is for myself. How am I selfish when the biological imperative in every man is to make sure he’s the number #1? Its only when a man starts doign things and being anything else that he isn’t, for female approval, that he proves to himself his own level of how to be selfish.

 

Be fair. I don’t expect them to only want to bang me. That would be boring. There’s has to be a bit of competition between men for it to be enjoyable. I’m not interestedd in the women other men don’t want, but it sure would be mesmerizing if a 22 year old natural Blonde Angelina Jolie came up to me and pushed me into the bathroom, hey, even the best-looking men sometimes go for women they aren’t attracted to to have a easy lay, I merely desire the same, but with women who are Hollywood A-list in the genetic lottery.

 

I don't know, why don't you frigging ask them? My guess is, they complain about those things because men are expected to complain about those things. God forbid a guy actually have a somewhat low sex drive or not care how skinny a girl is. My guess is, you dig deep down into these guys who complain about their girlfriend gaining weight or not banging them enough, you'll find guys who like/love/value their girlfriend and relationship, and actually don't really care all that much about getting sex once a day or an extra 10 pounds.

 

I talk to them regarding this same subject. They’re either too dominated by their own mothers or feel like they’re ugly, or at least not average enough to twist with average-looking women/below average women. It deeply saddens me when I witness young men in the prime of their lives waste away, only concerning themselves with getting good grades and becoming that great future provider… hell no

 

I know hundreds of young men. Believe me when I tell you that I’ve spend many a beer on them as they try to drown their lack of sexual lives and attraction to their own girlfriends with liquor. I know beer was considered a divine liquid, the source of life in ancient eastern Cultures, but come on. Alcohol will not make the woman they’re with more attractive. At least not in the long-term without them creating a liver problem to deal with in their 40s.

 

Nah, I doubt that. Very few of the guys who are in relationships’, the hundreds of men I know, are into the girl they’re with. At the beginning they were starving for sex. The girl provided it and now they are too lazy to try to get the women they are attracted to. I know one guy, this one is the laziest git I’ve ever met. He’s 6’6’’ exotic, fit body, decent-enough face, but he only sleeps with overweight women because the women he most wants are very demanding. He complains of not having any interest in the women he sleeps with, but sex is sex, to them.

 

Some guys *gasp* actually value relationships. Some guys actually consider a loving, supportive girlfriend as far more important than a waif who sleeps with them three times a day. Stop trying to squeeze everyone into the same shallow, self-centered world view you live in. It isn't natural for you... fine. But if these guys aren't dumping their girlfriends, there's probably a reason.

 

Men of low value, mainly. The men who have options will take them. Don’t take me wrong. I know of several guys who have girlfriends. Those girlfriends are just not the only girlfriends they maintain at any given time, lol. These guys with options don’t put much stock in relationships. The women they’re with provide something more than just sex and attention, emotion yadada. It’s the only way to penetrate the woman’s inner-circle of more attractive women which is protected like the last barrier between the Holy Grail and the random dude who wants to live forever.

 

Stop trying to squeeze everyone into the same shallow, self-centered world view you live in

What shallow world? My world is composed of many layers of light, darkness, earth and water. Its really amazing when you think about it. For tens of thousands of years most men didn’t reach the age of 30 and most died terrible deaths. Now, if a guy plays it smart, he can spend his lifetime enjoying pleasure, beauty, and leisure.

 

And I know women from all across the spectrum. I know below-average women who get laid like mad, and I know above-average women who married their high school sweetheart, and their husband couldn't be happier.

Lol, getting laid as a woman is like a children reaching for that glass of water. Its perfectly natural. Men have a much higher sex drive and most are desperate enough to sleep with women they aren’t interested in, they just have to think about the hot chick they want to secretly bang and there.

 

There is no accomplishment when a woman sleeps with a man, even if that man is much better-looking than them, so I don’t take women seriously when they try to make interested in them by saying ‘’I’ve slept with all of those guys, and I’ve had sex with a Ivy league sports team University.’’ Am I supposed to be impressed? Now, if they snatched a Tom Brady for marriage, I would clap my hands, but most If not all are not going to date extremely high-value men.

 

But my guess is your definitions of "picky, demanding and problematic" would boil down to "they require basic relationship maintenance and attention." So pretty much any girl who isn't a hot cardboard cut-out would be too much energy and effort for you. That isn't true for every guy.... hell, I'd guess even a sizable chunk of guys. You want to believe that all men are like you, and all men view women in the same shallow, antagonistic way you do, because it makes you feel less awful and less alone.

 

Oh, man. Tell me about it. Ranging from expecting me to call them on the phone (really? Don’t only 50 year olds do that?) every couple days, texting them every day – I hate texting – and waiting for me to ask them about their day, or to take them to the hospital when they are feeling sick, or taking it as a norm to use my free time getting to know their parents and brothers and dogs.

 

Nah, its not only the Katniss Evergreen women who are capable of making me interested in taking them on like a soldier has to make sure his rifle is clean and operational. I met this girl from Virginia a year ago. 6 feet tall, great natural bust, natural blonde, like a twin sister of Jessica Simpson when she was 20 years old. Perfect, right? Nope. She was annoying, needy, catty, and after only a year, after I returned to my state, I met again with her and man she had lost her looks.

 

Her teeth had gone from sparkling white and completely straight with no spaces between them, to yellow, spaced out. Her thick golden hair had lost its luster and it had became thin. Her waist had gone from tiny to wide. I didn’t recognize her at all. It was only after she called me that I realized who she was.

 

Can you believe that? Lucrezia Borgia had gone from being the Aphrodite of mortal men to someone who lost her looks. Ironically her annoying and antagonistic personality also dropped with her good-looks and she was freshly sympathetic and a decent human being, now, lol.

 

If the woman is stunning and makes it obvious that I’m going to get laid soon, I might stick around until she’s aroused, but I ain’t sticking around for long, and I don’t put up with Princess behavior.

 

Lol, You should go to Countries where the average men have more options than not. Visit Germany, Spain, France. Better yet, visit Italy, where every guy is a ‘’player’’. These guys aren’t shallow or are leaning against a nightclub wall looking at the hoy women and yearning for that average, next-door Kentucky girl who’s going to change him from his nefarious ways and set him right, onto the path of godly tenderness for women and for family! Ahaha.

 

And again, this could have nothing to do with the social pressure put on men to believe they should want sex constantly, and if they ever don't want sex, they are somehow less than real men. And that even if they are secretly satisfied with 2 times a week, they can never say it, because their bro-tastic social group would mock them endlessly for it.

Most men want sex constantly. All a guy has to do is to spend one day without watching adult content or indulging in carnal desires and he’s going to spend the next day with reminders of their biological desires. Especially with thousands upon thousands of attractive women who are out there with a vengeance to get male attention and affirmation of their own good-looks, by being a visual and verbal tease.

 

2 times a week? My grandpa doesn’t even go for that, let alone guys who are in their 20s. Lady, its more like 6 times a week, and that’s a weak week for many of the men who are ‘’players’’. Maybe these guys don’t want much sex because it gets tiring and unappealing to sleep with the same woman all the time?

 

The only lingerie I need on a woman is the golden hair she uses to reflect the life-giving rays of light, to make the life of men a work of art.

 

Or it couldn't possibly be that these men married women they weren't compatible with out of pressure from their social group. Or that the men themselves might have a hand in the sex being so low. Nope. Their words must be absolutely truth, regardless of social context, and it must be all the women's fault.

I wouldn’t be surprised with that one. It’s the man’s fault by not going after other women within the marriage. By being with other women, the wife is encouraged to keep fit, to want sex, and to take the man in as a sexual being instead of just being the guy who helps pay the bills, and looks like a miserable sod as I walk by him inside my rimmed truck heading for the beach and he’s loading 400dollars worth of groceries to feed his family, lol. Nah, it wouldn’t have anything to do with that.

 

My grandpa and uncles always had women on the side and they were always beloved by their wives for being desired by other women, and its man’s nature to prowl the world and go back to the sanctity of his settlement. Hunters-gatherers stuff.

 

You are not all men. I know several guys in their 20's who struggle with keeping it up. Or who actually have no interest in sex at all.

Those guys are addicted to porn, or the women they can get aren’t appealing at all, and due to the consumption of porn, they can’t get desperate enough to sport one bridge. The men who have no interest in sex are either asexuals, have sexual hang-ups or have very low levels of testosterone. There are only a handful of those guys.

 

Just because you know a girl doesn't mean she'll tell you all her deep, dark secrets. And given your disgusting lack of empathy or understanding of women or even other guys here, I wouldn't be surprised if your guy friend was having some sexual issue that he'd never actually tell you about.

Ahaha, yeah, I can’t argue with you on that one. People would assume I lack empathy, which I do not, yet I am a social chameleon, naturally gifted with the right word, the right smile, the right body language at the proper time and people trust me, without reserve, like Nick Carraway came to respect that great bootlegger in the end. It comes naturally to great men, just watch Citizen Kane for a sample.

 

Or even an active participant, it sounds like. So you have an incredibly satisfying sex life where you don't have to put in any effort whatsoever... and then turn around and complain about how women won't sleep with you (but want to date you) but will sleep with your an-inch-taller best friend. Your stories are not matching up, dude.

 

Sigh, its not that, exactly. Average college girls are attractive when you see women outside of college cities, and attractive women, are more close to Victorias secret models than not, but there’s a small segment of women, of divine goddesses who are the maximum equinox of all that is perfect and attractive in women, and I can’t attract those women without tremendous supernatural effort (I might also lose them quite quickly to a better man) because they are out of my league, in terms of looks, social background, and wealth. The better-looking the woman is, the richer the man has to be. For women belonging to the middle-upper class you just have to be hot or have charisma and to know what you are doing, but even men of tremendous social and sexual importance can fail with them.

 

I can get high-quality women. I just want a lay from Sophia Lauren-type women circa her prime, ya know?

 

Or maybe she just wanted to see some small amount of effort on your part that you were interested in her. Maybe she has enough self-respect that she isn't going to throw herself at a guy who seems to be not at all interested in her. No where in your story do I see you even trying to display affection for her.

 

Lol, I’m talking to her, I’m gifting her with one of the paintings(hey boys, pick up painting, drawing, or poetry to attract women) I made for her – how is that not effort enough? When a man pays for a $200 dinner, ain’t that effort being displayed? I took the time and the pain of sitting down and painting her In art class. I don’t go around painting random women. She should have know I cared enough to have my bros laugh at me for painting a woman.

 

Its not as if she’s a 25 year old Claudia-Schiffer, you know, I don’t think most guys are ever going to bother with paying for her dinner in a low expenses diner, let alone paint her, so of course I gave to her the knowledge that her rejection/my rejection doesn’t mean much to me, because I value myself as a man, and as a human being. Brad Pitt waits for no one, he only married the most exquisite women Hollywood had to give, and though I’m not Brad Pitt, I know what I’m worth, and I’ve banged women far better-looking than her, so trying to make me wait for her affections(she wouldn’t even let me touch her, but she’d blush and smile non-stop when around me. What the heck?).

 

Maybe they aren't interested in you. A girl staring at you could just be staring at you. You are trying to mind-read, and it's ridiculous. A girl playing with her hair doesn't mean she wants to sleep with her.

Nah. They stare. Like, they turn their head whatever degree it takes to look at me during class – I’m sitting alone back there – stare at me with this look, play with their hair always around me and while looking at me, the whole 9 yards of signals of interest, but they don’t get off their prettily Brazilian-waxed butts to approach me. Unless you’re telling me that when a girl has so much free space to move around, but always puts herself in front of you, looks you up and down and stares at you while biting her nails – She’s taking my measures, is that it? Her father is a tailor and she’s looking to find a niche market?

 

And you are making radical assumptions about hotter guys getting girls without effort. I guarantee the guy is putting in some sort of effort-you are just not noticing it because you are so consumed with jealousy, and clinging to this notion that you can somehow extract a person's thoughts and motivations just by looking at them.

No, he’s not. Go to a nightclub. See the hottest guy never approach the women, never pay for any drink. She’s going to the bathroom with him, not with the dudes who are spending money on her.

 

Acting like equals.... where they put in all the effort and pursue you, and you put in none! Yep. Totally equal.

 

I’m the one who makes it happen. I’m the one who has to approach, risk rejection. All they do is to war-paint their faces, put on the best dress daddy bought for them to go to church with, and I have to be direct, but not so direct, interested, but not eager, to desire the girl, but to not make her own desire diminish by wanting her more than she wants me. It’s a whole lot of effort, and the better-looking guys don’t have to walk this road.

 

Because women couldn't possibly like a smart guy. Or dislike daredevils. No, it's against our factory mandate! I should check my warranty, I think they built me wrong, since I have absolutely no interest in "dare devil" "hot" guys, and would far prefer an academically gifted nerd guy.

I’m smart. I have many intellectual desires.I have the best grades – which I keep from my female classmates and their friends. I want to become a well-rounded man. Its when women realize this that I go from ‘’lay’’ to ‘’relationship-cray-cray’’ I think it was what happened with the tallish girl. At first she saw me as a fun guy, maybe she would’ve banged me, but then I began to interact with her and I showed her another side of my personality, a curiosity about the world, and ambition that only great men like Obama possess inside of them. And.. I ruined my own chances in getting laid with her, lol.

 

Um, I'm a girl. And maybe my opinion doesn't count because I'm one of those ugly chicks you are so disdainful of, but the guy I marry is going to be the lucky one. He's going to get my emotional support, my financial support, my encouragement, my love, my heart, my body, my enthusiasm, and my devotion. I cannot truly enjoy myself in bed unless I trust and love the guy, something that no ONS is ever going to get.

Good for you. Hope it turns out fine. I’m going to doddle it up and enjoy my life ,and I might marry some woman if she’s got enough money for me to use as a platform to later go for better-looking women.

 

 

Hey, you think the daughters of Bill Gates are going to turn out hot?

[verhrzn]

Yeah, I think the proper future response to you is to roll my eyes and feel sorry for whatever woman is in your near vicinity. Thanks for saving me a lot of wasted time in the future.

[Radu]

Jesus tap-dancing Christ, will people please stop using that book as some sort of blue print for what women want? Ya wanna know why that book was popular? 2 reasons.

 

1) It gave women a way to read sex/porn scenes without anyone else being able to tell. Imagine how popular porn would be if you no longer could get it online, and could only buy it in stores, where the covers quite clearly displayed that it was PORN. That's romance novels for women. It's very difficult to find non-niche romance online, and buying romance novels involves a lot of embarrassment for the woman. And you can never read it in public!

 

50 Shades is a sex book that doesn't directly advertise as a sex book. A lot of its sales were from online e-Book purchases, where women could discreetly read it without anyone being the wiser.

 

It sold because women want to read sex scenes without being publicly shamed for it.

 

2) The main male character of Christian is actually a direct rip off of the main male character in Twilight. 50 Shades started out as a Twilight fanfic. So trying to hold up the two of them up as examples is just sort of silly since they are clones of each other.

 

But the truth is, almost none of the traits you listed matter. Ya wanna know the one trait that, in my opinion, resonated with women to the point where you could toss all the rest out the window?

 

That the main male character needed saving.

 

There's a strong current in a lot of media aimed at women based on the idea that a woman's love can redeem or save a man. It's kind of a power fantasy for the woman... the idea that a guy loves her so much he will change his very nature to be with her. Edward resisted being a vampire and chugging Bella's delicious freescia-smelling blood because he was just that into her. Christian gets over his obsessive need for sexual dominance because Ana's vaginal has magic love healing powers.

 

I constantly see men complain about how women want bad boys. Guys, you do not get it. Women (speaking very generally) don't want bad boys. They want guys who change for them through the power of love. They want a bad boy who stops being bad because he falls for her. They want a player who becomes monogamous because he's so into her. They want a shy nerdy guy who becomes the Confident Man about Town because she's just so amazing he has to impress her.

 

It's a fantasy-a fantasy based around the idea that a woman's power comes from a guy's willingness to subject his own desires to hers.

 

Is it more unrealistic than the typical man's fantasy about desiring a Victoria Secret model who is also somehow a chef/nun? I'm gonna go with.... nope. And the reason why is because a woman's fantasies are all about the behavior of the guy. He doesn't need to change his looks, his hobbies, his job, nothing, not really.... he just needs to subjugate himself in some way. Become romantic where he wasn't before. Become tender where before he was gruff. Behave in some way that shows he's placing a particular desire of hers over a particular individualistic trait of his.

Just wanted to say that i really like your post and that you took the time to explain it, never looked that close to why 50 Shades was so popular.

[verhrzn]

Just wanted to say that i really like your post and that you took the time to explain it, never looked that close to why 50 Shades was so popular.

 

Thanks. I just get really sick of people who have never read the book, or even the background around the book (ie not even knowing it started out as Twilight fan fic) trying to use it as the Truth-teller for What All Women Want. It's like someone claiming they're a hard core Christian without ever reading a page of the Bible.

 

Now, granted, it's a horrible, horrible, awful book, so I completely understand people not wanting to read it! But don't make assumptions about something ya haven't even researched, ya know?

[man_in_the_box]

*huge load of crap*

 

Stop stereotyping Europeans

[taiko]

Wow this is a long thread for a simple question. Except for the few rock stars in the world yes most of us settle. Would I be with my wife if a Maxim model who would do anything I wanted would have me. no I settled for the best I could get. It is the Tom Lykis joke/social commentary "look at your spouse. that is the best you can do"

[topaMAXX]

Your two statements here contradict each other. You just said a woman sleeps with a "hotter" guy but then turns around and wants to date you. So she isn't trying to get the hotter guy to date her (if she's looking at it in the same mercenary fashion as you are.)

 

And why the hell are you outraged when you're essentially doing the same thing? You seem to want to bang super hot chicks with no interest in dating them, so why are you so outraged that some women have the exact same compulsion? Why is it okay for you to want hot, random ONS but not women? And yeah, you know a few cheaters... I know plenty of guys who sleep with random women behind their girlfriends' backs. What's your point?

 

 

 

*Vomit*

 

 

 

No, they probably see you as a guy whose personality they like. And yeah, a relationship comes with emotions, patience and effort. Which, if a girl is a decent person to date, she would also provide. Anyone who views it as a one-way street is probably too immature to be dating.

 

Which seems to include you. I'm at least glad you're self-aware enough to realize you are too selfish and immature for a relationship. But getting angry at women because they don't understand the depths of your narcissism (you only want to bang them, you want them to desire banging no one but you and yet also not want a relationship with you) is just ridiculous. They are not mind readers.

 

 

 

I don't know, why don't you frigging ask them? My guess is, they complain about those things because men are expected to complain about those things. God forbid a guy actually have a somewhat low sex drive or not care how skinny a girl is. My guess is, you dig deep down into these guys who complain about their girlfriend gaining weight or not banging them enough, you'll find guys who like/love/value their girlfriend and relationship, and actually don't really care all that much about getting sex once a day or an extra 10 pounds.

 

Some guys *gasp* actually value relationships. Some guys actually consider a loving, supportive girlfriend as far more important than a waif who sleeps with them three times a day. Stop trying to squeeze everyone into the same shallow, self-centered world view you live in. It isn't natural for you... fine. But if these guys aren't dumping their girlfriends, there's probably a reason.

 

 

 

And I know women from all across the spectrum. I know below-average women who get laid like mad, and I know above-average women who married their high school sweetheart, and their husband couldn't be happier.

 

But my guess is your definitions of "picky, demanding and problematic" would boil down to "they require basic relationship maintenance and attention." So pretty much any girl who isn't a hot cardboard cut-out would be too much energy and effort for you. That isn't true for every guy.... hell, I'd guess even a sizable chunk of guys. You want to believe that all men are like you, and all men view women in the same shallow, antagonistic way you do, because it makes you feel less awful and less alone.

 

 

 

And again, this could have nothing to do with the social pressure put on men to believe they should want sex constantly, and if they ever don't want sex, they are somehow less than real men. And that even if they are secretly satisfied with 2 times a week, they can never say it, because their bro-tastic social group would mock them endlessly for it.

 

Or it couldn't possibly be that these men married women they weren't compatible with out of pressure from their social group. Or that the men themselves might have a hand in the sex being so low. Nope. Their words must be absolutely truth, regardless of social context, and it must be all the women's fault.

 

 

 

 

You are not all men. I know several guys in their 20's who struggle with keeping it up. Or who actually have no interest in sex at all.

 

Just because you know a girl doesn't mean she'll tell you all her deep, dark secrets. And given your disgusting lack of empathy or understanding of women or even other guys here, I wouldn't be surprised if your guy friend was having some sexual issue that he'd never actually tell you about.

 

 

 

Or even an active participant, it sounds like. So you have an incredibly satisfying sex life where you don't have to put in any effort whatsoever... and then turn around and complain about how women won't sleep with you (but want to date you) but will sleep with your an-inch-taller best friend. Your stories are not matching up, dude.

 

 

 

Or maybe she just wanted to see some small amount of effort on your part that you were interested in her. Maybe she has enough self-respect that she isn't going to throw herself at a guy who seems to be not at all interested in her. No where in your story do I see you even trying to display affection for her.

 

And you are not a mind reader. Unless she told you or showed you that she'd sleep with the taller, more attractive guy, stop assuming.

 

 

 

Maybe they aren't interested in you. A girl staring at you could just be staring at you. You are trying to mind-read, and it's ridiculous. A girl playing with her hair doesn't mean she wants to sleep with her.

 

And you are making radical assumptions about hotter guys getting girls without effort. I guarantee the guy is putting in some sort of effort-you are just not noticing it because you are so consumed with jealousy, and clinging to this notion that you can somehow extract a person's thoughts and motivations just by looking at them.

 

 

 

Acting like equals.... where they put in all the effort and pursue you, and you put in none! Yep. Totally equal.

 

 

 

Because women couldn't possibly like a smart guy. Or dislike daredevils. No, it's against our factory mandate! I should check my warranty, I think they built me wrong, since I have absolutely no interest in "dare devil" "hot" guys, and would far prefer an academically gifted nerd guy.

 

 

 

Um, I'm a girl. And maybe my opinion doesn't count because I'm one of those ugly chicks you are so disdainful of, but the guy I marry is going to be the lucky one. He's going to get my emotional support, my financial support, my encouragement, my love, my heart, my body, my enthusiasm, and my devotion. I cannot truly enjoy myself in bed unless I trust and love the guy, something that no ONS is ever going to get.

 

But that doesn't matter to you. Which is fine. But stop photo-copying your own narrow view of the world onto everyone else.

 

Personally, I would like to get married and I actively choose not to play the field right now (even though I could if I wanted to). So I am different than the poster that you are responding to.

 

However, I support him in his journey. Sometimes, I really don't understand women. You created guys like that with your movement and then you get mad at him for acting accordingly. Makes no sense.