Can guilty feelings fade?

[LaylaSings]

We ended our affair because we wanted to keep our friendship and avoid getting caught but also because we both had started experiencing a lot of guilt. My guilt showed up as panic attacks and stomach pain .. Constant neck and shoulder pain.. I think I was just very tense. At first I didn't even associate those things with my affair and I didn't even know I felt guilty.. But it became obvious. When the attacks would strike, and I even started having bad dreams.

 

He had always said he felt no guilt but around Christmas time shared with me the whole thing was making him feel like a bad person and we agreed to stop crossing the physical line and then agreed at the end of January the affair had to end.

 

For two months we still saw each other a few times a week. I saw his wife every day and he saw my husband every day though.. I watch their kids, our husbands work together daily on a business we own together. We had very low contact between the two of us though and absolutely nothing about the affair was spoken of at all.

 

Honestly if I'm totally honest.. And it's hard to be because I do hate the attacks sometimes.. I was almost heartbroken that he so easily stepped back. I missed him so much even when we were in the same room. But I was greatful at the same time because I feel weak.. Like I could stop myself from contacting him but I felt if he contacted me I'd fall in all over again.

 

And that's exactly what ended up happening.

 

It started much like in the very beginning. Longing looks, he would stare at me.. He started calling me a nickname he had only called me during the affair and finally started outright flirting with me again.. I was stand offish I'm sure from his point of view.. I didn't respond much other than I'm sure my face showed him I still cared.

 

Then this weekend he started texting me and it was back to full blown inappropriate conversation that we both knew we would be deleting.. Damn it! Then he asked me to meet him. I said straight out I thought this was over and I didn't want to be the reason he felt bad about himself. I wasn't even considering in that moment about my own feelings and how bad I had been feeling .. Because honestly inside I was screaming and so happy / confused about what was happening.

 

He told me he has been thinking this whole time. He doesn't feel guilty anymore he says. That he missed me and he didn't feel bad, that this is just how we are and we need each other.

 

 

Then I met with him.

 

Felt amazing. Haven't felt the crush of guilt yet but I know it's coming. We haven't seen or talked to each other since meeting.. But we will tomorrow. I'm back to being confused and unsure of what's going to happen next.

 

I really would love advice from anyone who has been in MY shoes or similar.. Maybe his shoes.. But I know exactly what I've done wrong so I don't much need to hear from betrayed spouses or saints unless you can realize that I'm very vulnerable and I do understand we need to stop this, I don't need judgment. Just some support and someone to talk to.

 

I really thought I was doing so good and I threw it away.

[LaylaSings]

I guess I'm wondering. Has his guilt subsided only because we have been on a 'break' .. The way he spoke to me and the way I feel sometimes I think we are each other's drugs.

 

He was going through withdrawal and so was I.

 

Will the guilt come back full force because we had a fix?

[Owl]

I guess I'm wondering. Has his guilt subsided only because we have been on a 'break' .. The way he spoke to me and the way I feel sometimes I think we are each other's drugs.

 

He was going through withdrawal and so was I.

 

Will the guilt come back full force because we had a fix?

 

Are you asking about HIS feelings of guilt? If so, I'd advise you not to waste your time on that. He'll only feel as much guilt as he allows himself to feel. He may feel none at all...for as long as he avoids facing the consequences of his guilt. It's called 'compartmentalization'...some folks are masters at it, some are not.

 

From my perspective...that 'guilt' remains until you end the behaviors you're 'guilty of', and confess and take actions to recompense those that you've wronged.

 

You'll likely feel guilty until you take those steps...or until you learn to ignore the feelings of guilt, like he has.

 

Personally...feeling guilt is a good sign. It shows you've still got a moral compass that aligns with the most of the rest of the world, and that you care about doing the right thing, and care about those that you are harming with your actions.

 

It's a sign of hope that you can still do the right thing.

 

When you stop feeling guilty...that's an indicator of something else.

 

My opinion at least. I'm sure that someone will be along soon to disagree with it.

[LaylaSings]

He was feeling it too because he told me so, but denied feeling it every time I asked up until Christmas when we talked about it. I think Christmas being so family oriented had both our heads spinning and we felt like crappy people.. Doing this to our friends and our family.

 

He seemed like he was even getting depressed and I thought that was because he felt guilty but he says now it's because I was pulling away from him. He says he feels no guilt because in all other aspects as are good people.

I don't even know what to think.

 

I have always been a master at compartmentalizing ... But it became very very hard because we are all extremely close.

 

I just know this can't continue without someone getting very hurt and we were two months in to ending it and I really believed it was only going to be me hurt in the end and I had accepted that and even felt relief.

[sunburned]

We ended our affair because we wanted to keep our friendship and avoid getting caught but also because we both had started experiencing a lot of guilt. My guilt showed up as panic attacks and stomach pain .. Constant neck and shoulder pain.. I think I was just very tense. At first I didn't even associate those things with my affair and I didn't even know I felt guilty.. But it became obvious. When the attacks would strike, and I even started having bad dreams.

 

He had always said he felt no guilt but around Christmas time shared with me the whole thing was making him feel like a bad person and we agreed to stop crossing the physical line and then agreed at the end of January the affair had to end.

 

For two months we still saw each other a few times a week. I saw his wife every day and he saw my husband every day though.. I watch their kids, our husbands work together daily on a business we own together. We had very low contact between the two of us though and absolutely nothing about the affair was spoken of at all.

 

Honestly if I'm totally honest.. And it's hard to be because I do hate the attacks sometimes.. I was almost heartbroken that he so easily stepped back. I missed him so much even when we were in the same room. But I was greatful at the same time because I feel weak.. Like I could stop myself from contacting him but I felt if he contacted me I'd fall in all over again.

And that's exactly what ended up happening.

 

It started much like in the very beginning. Longing looks, he would stare at me.. He started calling me a nickname he had only called me during the affair and finally started outright flirting with me again.. I was stand offish I'm sure from his point of view.. I didn't respond much other than I'm sure my face showed him I still cared.

 

Then this weekend he started texting me and it was back to full blown inappropriate conversation that we both knew we would be deleting.. Damn it! Then he asked me to meet him. I said straight out I thought this was over and I didn't want to be the reason he felt bad about himself. I wasn't even considering in that moment about my own feelings and how bad I had been feeling .. Because honestly inside I was screaming and so happy / confused about what was happening.

 

He told me he has been thinking this whole time. He doesn't feel guilty anymore he says. That he missed me and he didn't feel bad, that this is just how we are and we need each other.

 

 

Then I met with him.

 

Felt amazing. Haven't felt the crush of guilt yet but I know it's coming. We haven't seen or talked to each other since meeting.. But we will tomorrow. I'm back to being confused and unsure of what's going to happen next.

 

I really would love advice from anyone who has been in MY shoes or similar.. Maybe his shoes.. But I know exactly what I've done wrong so I don't much need to hear from betrayed spouses or saints unless you can realize that I'm very vulnerable and I do understand we need to stop this, I don't need judgment. Just some support and someone to talk to.

 

I really thought I was doing so good and I threw it away.

 

 

 

I hope this won't come across as an attack. I had a A too and even though it's been 8 months since I've seen him and 6 mos of complete NC, I still miss him sometimes. The bold face is where the problem lies. I feel much the same. I'm confident I won't contact, but can't say 100 percent that I wouldn't reply (about 80 percent though). That is why just a/b everyone here has recommended NC because it means NO RESPONSE as well as no initiation. I get that it's hard in a sitch like yours. But you've tried doing it "your way" and it didn't work. You have proven what everyone warned you about -- you can't go back to just friends. Honestly, you have pretty much admitted you don't want to be just friends.

 

 

You have a problem since your lives are intertwined. I have no right to recommend disclosure since I did not myself. But you may need your husband's "help" to solidify NC. Could you even tell a partial truth and tell your H you have feelings for the other guy and let him help you stay away. Maybe get an outside job so you have an excuse not be caregiver to your neighbor's kids? But, I think, ideally, in your situation you should come clean with your spouses. This is really a ticking Dday double betrayal time bomb. And we've just recently heard some very heartbreaking stories on LS of APs who knew each other very well ( three and six year As) suddenly NC after dday. You don't want that.

 

 

Also, gently, because I admit I'm reading b/w the lines of your posts ... but you strike me as someone who waits for things to happen, rather than someone who takes action to make things happen ... to steer the ship. He made the first A move (as I recall) but you accepted, he made the first breakup move due to guilt and you accepted, he made the first re-engage move and you accepted.

 

 

Unless you're both open to coming clean with your spouses and filing for divorces, get your wits about you, draw the line in the sand and stay on your side.

Edited March 25, 2014 by sunburned
typos

[violet1]

I noticed with me that the guilt would come and go. Sometimes I wouldn't feel anything and other times I couldn't look at myself in the mirror without wanting to throw up.

 

My exMM and I broke up a few times before my D Day. What I noticed with us is that the break ups would make the emotions stronger. We would say things like, "I can't imagine my life without you." Or we need each other, etc. In time the guilt and confusion would come back and then we'd break up again. It really was a never ending roller coaster ride.

 

I was on a few cheater forums and what you're going through is very common in affair. If you really want to take the risk of having an affair you have to learn how to compartmentalize. I became quite the pro towards the end. I literally lived a double life.

[violet1]

BTW when I told you in your other threads that you'd fall back into the affair it wasn't to be cruel. I went through it myself and I've read 100's of stories of the same type of thing. This affair will never stop unless you get caught or you take serious action to end it meaning going complete NC. I'm not saying that to hurt or discourage you either.

[LaylaSings]

BTW when I told you in your other threads that you'd fall back into the affair it wasn't to be cruel. I went through it myself and I've read 100's of stories of the same type of thing. This affair will never stop unless you get caught or you take serious action to end it meaning going complete NC. I'm not saying that to hurt or discourage you either.

 

Honestly anyone who warned me of falling back into it.. I've known the whole time it was very possible. I was never very confident I could stay away.

 

Although I am literally heartbroken at the thought of losing them from my life and I really really want to just be friends and I wish I didn't love him

Most people would say this isn't real love I know. I'm not saying I'm unique or special but we have been through a lot together.. Lived and worked side by side for five years and been through a few very very traumatic events as a group and also just with each other. We are not in an affair bubble. We've seen the worst of one another and it's only made the feelings stronger.

 

I want to ask him what he's thinking, today. But posted here instead because I need to talk to someone.

[AlwaysGrowing]

All of us have an ego. That is the part of you that was hurt when you felt he moved on so easily.

 

Once we recognize this part of us, we can control the messages we tell ourselves.

 

His comment about why he feels no guilt, is a compartmentalizing coping mechanism. It is used to allieviate the dissonance between the act of cheating and how it makes him feel.

[violet1]

Honestly anyone who warned me of falling back into it.. I've known the whole time it was very possible. I was never very confident I could stay away.

 

Although I am literally heartbroken at the thought of losing them from my life and I really really want to just be friends and I wish I didn't love him

Most people would say this isn't real love I know. I'm not saying I'm unique or special but we have been through a lot together.. Lived and worked side by side for five years and been through a few very very traumatic events as a group and also just with each other. We are not in an affair bubble. We've seen the worst of one another and it's only made the feelings stronger.

 

I want to ask him what he's thinking, today. But posted here instead because I need to talk to someone.

Maybe it's not an affair bubble, but honestly you won't know until you actually end the affair and stick to it. Why don't you just tell him that you just want to be friends and you can't do this. I think you are so conflicted on what you really want. You seem like a good person. I honestly don't believe you want to hurt your H or your friend. It's inevitable unless you end it sweetie. Have you thought about doing a trial seperation from your H? I think you need space from both men to really clear your head. Can you take your children and stay with family for a week or two? I thought the part time job was a good idea too. You need time away IMO. I just want you to know that I feel your pain, I've been there. You know you can't continue to fence sit. Whether you or your MM want to believe it or not, your situation is a ticking time bomb.

[whichwayisup]

I guess I'm wondering. Has his guilt subsided only because we have been on a 'break' .. The way he spoke to me and the way I feel sometimes I think we are each other's drugs.

 

He was going through withdrawal and so was I.

 

Will the guilt come back full force because we had a fix?

 

What counts is YOUR guilt, not his.

 

And yes I believe the withdrawal has clouded your better judgement. Not too long ago you were having panic and anxiety attacks, physically having symptoms throughout your body. That is not going to go away. Once withdrawal happens again and either you or him/both decide to slow it down (again), the guilt and anxiety will come back. Or maybe it won't. Maybe you will emotionally detach from your whole family and justify what you're doing to lessen the guilt, to make it go away and learn how to just separate/turn off around your family so you don't feel guilty.

 

All I can say is, you both have a lot to lose and are risking a lot for stolen moments to get a 'fix' of one another. Not judging, it's just how you described how closely knitted all of you are, it's obvious that when there is a Dday, the fallout is going to be huge and quite painful for your spouses and kids.

[fellini]

If you resolve your guilt, you continue in a timebomb affair, and what?

If you don't resolve your guilt, you continue in a timebomb affair and what?

 

Isn't the question really about your inability to make a move based on what you WANT and not on the secondary emotions that you are generating as a result of your good and bad decisions?

 

Does it not make sense to you that you need to decide FIRST what to do, and then act on that, than to act without thinking and then reflect on how good or bad you feel about it?

 

You want to stand in a hurricane and try to find something solid to hold onto, or do you want to stand tall in the sunshine and soak up the rays of your internal happiness and take a step forward because you know where that foot is going?

 

To paraphase a wise saying I caught the other day:

 

The EGO says: When everything is in place, I will find peace

The Spirit says: Find peace, and everything will fall into its place

[pickflicker]

Guilty feelings fade when you stop doing the things that make you feel guilty.

[LaylaSings]

Nobody that's posted to this thread has attacked me and I feel less judged by you all than I'm judging myself. I'm not made of glass, I didn't expect anyone to cheer me on and I do appreciate the honesty even when it goes against what I feel I want to hear.

 

I don't know why I care so much more how he's feeling than I'm feeling. I'm trying really hard to get over that because I have kids. They need ME. And they need me fully present and feeling good.

[herself]

Layla, it will all work out. Your on the right track. Sometimes a full dead stop is excruciating. A heart to heart with him will help. You CAN be friends and not engage in that way. It will take full commitment on both ends. Your getting there.

[AlwaysGrowing]

Layla, it will all work out. Your on the right track. Sometimes a full dead stop is excruciating. A heart to heart with him will help. You CAN be friends and not engage in that way. It will take full commitment on both ends. Your getting there.

 

Until one has a head to heart talk with themselves, the other person has an "in" to sway what is best for yourself.

 

Getting to a place of commitment within oneself is what will end the external/internal conflict.

 

Whichever way you decide, your marriage or the affair, end the duality that resides within.

[violet1]

Nobody that's posted to this thread has attacked me and I feel less judged by you all than I'm judging myself. I'm not made of glass, I didn't expect anyone to cheer me on and I do appreciate the honesty even when it goes against what I feel I want to hear.

 

I don't know why I care so much more how he's feeling than I'm feeling. I'm trying really hard to get over that because I have kids. They need ME. And they need me fully present and feeling good.

I know I've been harsh to you in the past in hopes that it will help you wake up. I realize that approach isn't going to help you at all.

 

I've read every one of your threads and it honestly seems like you have no control of your life. After your break up, you posted here stating here that you weren't going to have another affair, it's over, you're done. Then as soon as he text you, back to square one you went. For some reason you are putty in this man's hands. He basically has you wrapped around his finger and he knows it. He knew that all he had to do is text and that you'd be running right back in his arms. I know this isn't easy to hear, but isn't it true?

 

This is a personal question and you don't have to answer it, but were you abused as a child? I was abused and I see a lot of signs from your posts. You seem to throw yourself into very toxic situations. You need to take control of your life before you end up losing everything. Did you ever get yourself in to see a counselor? I don't see your situation getting any better until you get professional help. This is nothing to be ashamed of either. Everyone needs help sometimes. Please continue posting here. There's a lot of people here who want you to break free from this affair and live a healthy, happy life.

[Waverly]

Layla, I'm curious, what is your end goal (if you know)? Do you think you and your AP would ever try to leave your marriages to be together? If not, it seems like the double life/guilt will eventually be too much to bear.

 

Some people are better at compartmentalizing than others (sounds like your AP is better at it than you are). Neither my xAP nor I were particularly good at it; once it became clear that the A couldn't progress, the guilt and stress of the dichotomy between the A and our actual lives became too much really quickly, and it all came tumbling down.

 

My sense from your previous posts is that you want to try and put the feelings aside though and return to being friends. If that's the case, then I would guess that the guilt of continuing the affair will never truly go away, as long as you're still in it.

[whichwayisup]

Nobody that's posted to this thread has attacked me and I feel less judged by you all than I'm judging myself. I'm not made of glass, I didn't expect anyone to cheer me on and I do appreciate the honesty even when it goes against what I feel I want to hear.

 

I don't know why I care so much more how he's feeling than I'm feeling. I'm trying really hard to get over that because I have kids. They need ME. And they need me fully present and feeling good.

 

Then do EVERYTHING you can to start putting them and your family first and yourself last. Meaning, the good feelings that your A brings to you shouldn't be more important than the well being of your kids and family unit. If you continue the affair then you are playing with fire and putting their security and safe family unit at risk. If you can't end your A on your own then go to counseling and work on yourself to get strong and build a wall around you so your MM won't have such an influence on you.

[still_an_Angel]

Is your question aimed at your guilty feelings or HIS guilty feelings?

 

If its yours, i think your guilty feeling wont entirely fade. But if the A stops, and you maintain that status, you will eventually find the peace in yourself because you know you have done the right thing. You must find the strength to stop the A first.

 

If its his guilty feeling, i think he has found a way to reinforce the walls of his compartments. He already had guilty feelings but he was able to overcome them and he has become bolder and thus, more ready to take risks. You cant control his but you can focus on yours. At the end of the day, YOUR peace is more important than his.

 

I feel for you Layla, having an A is never easy and always, people get hurt. You can make yours stop...

[LaylaSings]

I can't even explain how I feel about him.

 

I just want him to be happy and whenever I have the chance to make that happen I jump at it.

 

People saying I have no control over my life.. I've always put everyone else before myself. Always have. I've never been selfish in any aspect of life until this started and even then.. I was putting his needs over mine the entire time. I don't know how to focus on me.

 

I've been telling myself.. Focusing on me .. Is really in the best interest of my kids and friends but still.. I have a really hard time.

[Fluttershy]

Early on I asked my H if he ever felt guilty. And he said at times it was so overpowering but he never told her. She is a narc and so guilt isn't on the table but it was for my H.

 

He said it was waves. A little bit. Then ignore and forget and be fine. And then a huge almost mind numbing wave of "how can I be this douche bag?" and so he would stop and time would pass and then they wouldn't be caught, I'd be happy and so who was really being hurt? And he would start up again.

[Darren Steez]

I can't even explain how I feel about him.

 

I just want him to be happy and whenever I have the chance to make that happen I jump at it.

 

People saying I have no control over my life.. I've always put everyone else before myself. Always have. I've never been selfish in any aspect of life until this started and even then.. I was putting his needs over mine the entire time. I don't know how to focus on me.

 

I've been telling myself.. Focusing on me .. Is really in the best interest of my kids and friends but still.. I have a really hard time.

 

Husband? I see no husband anywhere in this paragraph. By your own words your actions bear consequences that could rip your kids world apart. Your focus seem to be doing right by them and not your husband by extension you and OM are also potentially destroying the lives of his kids.

JMO

[LaylaSings]

Husband? I see no husband anywhere in this paragraph. By your own words your actions bear consequences that could rip your kids world apart. Your focus seem to be doing right by them and not your husband by extension you and OM are also potentially destroying the lives of his kids.

JMO

 

I don't mention a whole lot of my husband in these post for many reasons and I don't wish to get into all of them right now. It's not that I'm not thinking of him and not that I don't love him because I do. But our relationship may or may not go the distance and for a lot of reasons that where there long before there was any affair.

When I discuss it now, especially if I tried on a forum about affair it would just come across as my justification for cheating. And I don't want to do that at all. I love that man more than he could ever know but the things we have been through the last five years have made my heart hard towards him. I've already accepted that I have resentment towards him and that the affair was a huge slap in his face and I do feel very guilty about it.

 

When I say anything about that best interest of my family she friends I'm obviously including him in that.

 

I June what it feel like to be betrayed. We've been through that as a couple too. It's not lost on me how bad this would affect my husband but it's my choice how and what I want to talk about here.

[violet1]

I don't mention a whole lot of my husband in these post for many reasons and I don't wish to get into all of them right now. It's not that I'm not thinking of him and not that I don't love him because I do. But our relationship may or may not go the distance and for a lot of reasons that where there long before there was any affair.

When I discuss it now, especially if I tried on a forum about affair it would just come across as my justification for cheating. And I don't want to do that at all. I love that man more than he could ever know but the things we have been through the last five years have made my heart hard towards him. I've already accepted that I have resentment towards him and that the affair was a huge slap in his face and I do feel very guilty about it.

 

When I say anything about that best interest of my family she friends I'm obviously including him in that.

 

I June what it feel like to be betrayed. We've been through that as a couple too. It's not lost on me how bad this would affect my husband but it's my choice how and what I want to talk about here.

You're last paragraph speaks volumes. Unless your H screwed your best friend, I doubt you'll understand his pain if you're discovered. Double betrayals are different. He trusts your MM, he actually thinks this man is his friend. Bottom line you don't screw your best friend's SO. I'm not trying to hurt you, but you and your MM have a morbid view of friendship.