I've cracked the "player" mystery!!!

[Imported]

Posers who pretend to be players might be obvious about it, but really good players aren't. That is why they are so successful.

Best,

Grumps

 

It's never what you see coming that gets you. Unless you're stupid.

[RedRobin]

How are women any better. Do you see women shunning their friends who mistreat and cheat on men? Ask most betrayed husbands on here and their wives had a cheering section with a you go girl mentality. Why is it only men who need to shun the bad apples of their sex?

 

 

There are two women on this thread who have claimed to distance women who mistreat and cheat on men.

 

 

You already know I have.

[Woggle]

There are two women on this thread who have claimed to distance women who mistreat and cheat on men.

 

 

You already know I have.

 

You two are not the usual. I have heard enough you go girl stuff when it comes to affairs to know that women are just as bad as men. Most cheating women have a cheering section.

[Babolat]

Yes... if so-called decent men give liars (ie players) cover, then yes... those guys are an accessory to the 'crime'...

 

 

You are partly at fault if you stand by and do nothing. Yep.

 

Interesting, and this is something I have thought about with some of my male friends. I have met their multiples gfs, and in the case of my married friend, I am very good friends with his wife. I have been out with him when he flirts, he gets touchy feely with other women sometimes. I think it's disgusting, yet I don't feel it's my place to "tell his wife".

 

My best female friend and I talked about just this, this weekend. He is a friend of both of ours. She feels the same.

 

So, in your opinion, it's my duty, my responsibility, to tell these woman, what I know, what I see?

 

In one case, my friend at one one point had 3 women thinking they were in a LTR with him. I met two of them, felt sorry for them, but did not feel it was my place to talk to them, to tell them what I know. It's my friends life, his choices, he has not comitted a crime per se. And who knows what the women are doing? Maybe, they are doing the same?

 

I'm not saying you are wrong...you have a good point.

[Babolat]

On some of these items, I believe you could afford to be more self aware.

 

 

Women who accuse you of being a player say so because they see a constant carousel of women rotating through your life. You have demonstrated a lack of ability to distance yourself from unhealthy women (your ex) in favor of sex. You can't be alone. You have a habit of over projecting your ability to sustain a relationship. You don't take your time getting to know a woman before jumping into bed.

 

 

I should point out that your ex didn't disgust you... at all.

 

 

You are a player in denial. I'm sure there are lots of players who don't see themselves that way. They just see themselves as misunderstood.

 

Uh, thanks, you saved me $120 in therapy!

 

I believe I am very self aware, and becoming more so, every day.

 

You know me virtually, electroncially. Get to know me, in person, and then comment.

 

My ex gf and I dated for 6+ weeks before we had sex, and she intiated it, not me. Last girl, same thing, 6+ weeks, and she initated it, not me. My ex wife, we dated for 3+ months before we had sex. My first wife, 2+ years before we had sex. Really, it's about sex for me; I'm a player?

 

My FWB, same thing, she initated it. Sure, I was ready to go, but I was not persuing them, for sex. If I was, well, I'd be a player.

 

And my carousel of women, I'm not sleeping with any of them. And, in fact I have cut a few out recently, as I see what they need and use me for: attention when they are having issues in their relationships and/or are in between relationships. So yes, slowly but surely, I am distancing myself from unhealthy woman. It's not happening overnight; it's a process; I'm growing, and quite pleased with my results. Call me a mess, call me what you like. I am on a journey, perhaps a slow one.

 

Why are you pointing out my ex? She was/is not a player. Not following you there...she has deep rooted emotional issues, that does not make her a player though.

 

Your comment "I know for damn sure I wouldn't continue dating a guy whose 'friends' were players and liars... or continued to associate with men like that once they were outed.. "

 

I understand your point, and I have removed all but one of my male friend who exhibit this behavior. I chose to accept him for who he is. We've had long talks about what he does. I have taking the time to get to know him, and I now value our friendship even though I am not a fan of what he does. Had I chosen to toss him aside too, I would not have gotten to know what a good person he is, otherwise.

 

And, I can tell you this, by spending time with me I have seen change in him. He is down to 1 woman now; he broke it off with 2 of the 3. And though he has not said it directly, it's from our talks and him "seeing how I am" and spending time with me, talking to me. That, to me is pretty cool, and what good friendships are about. He is talking about ending the last one and being alone for a while, because, as he puts it "he sees that he needs to" from our talks.

 

So, even players can change if they really want to.

[stillafool]

You two are not the usual. I have heard enough you go girl stuff when it comes to affairs to know that women are just as bad as men. Most cheating women have a cheering section.

 

Woggle I have never seen a "you go girl" response to a woman cheating on LS. They are shamed for cheating on their husbands and boyfriends. I am constantly viewing the Infidelity section and I don't see women responding to women cheating the way you have stated. I think wives who cheat are as disgusting as the men who cheat.

[Woggle]

Woggle I have never seen a "you go girl" response to a woman cheating on LS. They are shamed for cheating on their husbands and boyfriends. I am constantly viewing the Infidelity section and I don't see women responding to women cheating the way you have stated. I think wives who cheat are as disgusting as the men who cheat.

 

Not on here but in real life I see it. The response to my ex cheating is a big reason why I became so cynical towards women after my divorce.

[stillafool]

Not on here but in real life I see it. The response to my ex cheating is a big reason why I became so cynical towards women after my divorce.

 

Oh, I see. I do have to acknowledge that there seems to be far more BH than BW on the Infidelity forum. Alot of MW are cheating.

[RedRobin]

Interesting, and this is something I have thought about with some of my male friends. I have met their multiples gfs, and in the case of my married friend, I am very good friends with his wife. I have been out with him when he flirts, he gets touchy feely with other women sometimes. I think it's disgusting, yet I don't feel it's my place to "tell his wife".

 

My best female friend and I talked about just this, this weekend. He is a friend of both of ours. She feels the same.

 

So, in your opinion, it's my duty, my responsibility, to tell these woman, what I know, what I see?

 

In one case, my friend at one one point had 3 women thinking they were in a LTR with him. I met two of them, felt sorry for them, but did not feel it was my place to talk to them, to tell them what I know. It's my friends life, his choices, he has not comitted a crime per se. And who knows what the women are doing? Maybe, they are doing the same?

 

I'm not saying you are wrong...you have a good point.

 

 

In the case of the woman I knew who was cheating on her H, I was strongly compelled to tell him... since I knew him too and thought he was a really great guy. 100% faithful and devoted to her. Keep in mind that I did stay friends with her awhile to TRY and counsel her out of it... and TRY to convince her to confess on her own. When she didn't, I exited the friendship.

 

 

It was a struggle for me, but ultimately I opted to stop spending time with her. I still seem him around... he and I have a mutual guy friend that we ride motorcycles with. I've dropped a couple of hints to my guy friend why I don't hang around with her anymore. Him and my male friend are a lot closer (to each other) than I ever was to her.

 

 

There was another woman I knew years ago who was having an affair with a married man. I did the same thing with her. Tried to counsel her out of it. She refused. I exited the friendship and told her exactly why.

 

 

... which brings me to... Woggle. Has it ever occurred to you that some of the women you assume are 'cheering' the cheater on may be doing what I tried to do?? Counsel her out of it? I know that some outside observers might ASSUME I was cheering her on for that time I stayed friends with her after she disclosed it to me, but it was the opposite. When she wouldn't stop, that is when I exited. Same thing I would do if a friend of mine developed a substance abuse problem or any other self-inflicted poor behavior.

Edited March 25, 2014 by RedRobin

[RedRobin]

... and here is the other problem I have with the 'women love players' argument...

 

 

The very same qualities that many men love in women... openness, vulnerability, trusting, caring, nurturing...

 

 

Those are the qualities that liars and users (ie players) seek to exploit and use against women.

 

 

If you want more good, caring, loving, open hearted women... guys... then IT IS IN YOUR BEST INTEREST... to out the players so that they don't get a chance at doing damage to those very qualities you love so much in women...

 

 

... don't just stand there and watch with sick glee to see if he'll 'succeed'

[Woggle]

... which brings me to... Woggle. Has it ever occurred to you that some of the women you assume are 'cheering' the cheater on may be doing what I tried to do?? Counsel her out of it? I know that some outside observers might ASSUME I was cheering her on for that time I stayed friends with her after she disclosed it to me, but it was the opposite. When she wouldn't stop, that is when I exited. Same thing I would do if a friend of mine developed a substance abuse problem or any other self-inflicted poor behavior.

 

Telling them you go girl and trying to teach her how to properly lie about abuse and telling her they are glad men are getting their just payback for how they always treated women sure doesn't sound counseling these women out of it. I knew exactly what it was.

[Woggle]

... and here is the other problem I have with the 'women love players' argument...

 

 

The very same qualities that many men love in women... openness, vulnerability, trusting, caring, nurturing...

 

 

Those are the qualities that liars and users (ie players) seek to exploit and use against women.

 

 

If you want more good, caring, loving, open hearted women... guys... then IT IS IN YOUR BEST INTEREST... to out the players so that they don't get a chance at doing damage to those very qualities you love so much in women...

 

 

... don't just stand there and watch with sick glee to see if he'll 'succeed'

 

I don't watch with sick glee. I shake me head and wonder what the hell is wrong with these women that they so attracted to this. I also wonder why when men don't treat women like this they tend to get dumped and cheated on. I am against genuine players but society creates them the same way poverty and inequality creates criminals. If women want more good men like they say they do then start rewarding these men.

[chucksagent]

RedRobin - I have advised women on COUNTLESS players, scumbags, deadbeats, druggies, etc. And one thing I have learned about women. They are DETERMINED to fall for the guy you tell them not to.

 

And they gleefully and stupidly exclaim "You can't help who you fall for." That's a stupid persons way of justifying stupid behavior. What separates us from the animals is the ability to reason and exercise will power.

[Woggle]

RedRobin - I have advised women on COUNTLESS players, scumbags, deadbeats, druggies, etc. And one thing I have learned about women. They are DETERMINED to fall for the guy you tell them not to.

 

And they gleefully and stupidly exclaim "You can't help who you fall for." That's a stupid persons way of justifying stupid behavior. What separates us from the animals is the ability to reason and exercise will power.

 

Yup. I have outright told women that a guy has cheated on every woman he has been with but it doesn't stop multiple women from throwing themselves at him. You can't help people who won't help themselves. The sad things is is that one day these women will get with a good man and take out all that rage on him.

[RedRobin]

I don't watch with sick glee. I shake me head and wonder what the hell is wrong with these women that they so attracted to this. I also wonder why when men don't treat women like this they tend to get dumped and cheated on. I am against genuine players but society creates them the same way poverty and inequality creates criminals. If women want more good men like they say they do then start rewarding these men.

 

 

I don't know where you live, oh wait... I do...

 

 

Where I come from, women don't mistreat their husbands... and lie and cheat on good, devoted husbands.

 

 

They don't even lie and cheat on bad ones. They get a divorce. Amongst all of my aunts, uncles, cousins, etc... only three women in my family are divorced. Myself and two of my female cousins. Two of us were cheated on. The third one had a husband that came close to gambling their life savings away after 15 years of marriage. I've got a male cousin who is an alcoholic and even has a girlfriend. His wife is religious and refuses to divorce him. Go figure.

 

 

You need to stop making excuses for your own behavior based on what you perceive as the behavior of others. Change starts with you, Woggle.

[Babolat]

In the case of the woman I knew who was cheating on her H, I was strongly compelled to tell him... since I knew him too and thought he was a really great guy. 100% faithful and devoted to her. Keep in mind that I did stay friends with her awhile to TRY and counsel her out of it... and TRY to convince her to confess on her own. When she didn't, I exited the friendship.

 

 

It was a struggle for me, but ultimately I opted to stop spending time with her. I still seem him around... he and I have a mutual guy friend that we ride motorcycles with. I've dropped a couple of hints to my guy friend why I don't hang around with her anymore. Him and my male friend are a lot closer (to each other) than I ever was to her.

 

 

There was another woman I knew years ago who was having an affair with a married man. I did the same thing with her. Tried to counsel her out of it. She refused. I exited the friendship and told her exactly why.

 

 

My friend is not cheating though. Will he, no idea, I doubt it as he adores his wife. My guess is something is "unsettled" in their relationship right now, he gets something from this flirting. And yes, I am now limiting the time I spend with him, at least what I do with him.

 

This weekend we were at a backyard fire pit kind of party. His wife is out of town so he showed up solo. There was a woman at the party he was talking to, I walked up, got an intro, he said to her "My friend is single, are you interested?". Which I found awkward and inappropriate. She shrugged yes. He left, came back about 10 mins later, put his arm around her, said "This speed dating does not appear to be working, lets go do a shot" and left with her for about 5 mins then they returned.

 

I, am supposed to tell his wife this?

 

And, what bothered me too, was this woman knows he is married as she made reference to his wife in a conversation. Yet she allowed him to flirt with her, she flirted back, hug her, put his arm around her, walk her outside to do a shot, etc....a total turn off to me.

 

I, am supposed to tell his wife this?

[RedRobin]

RedRobin - I have advised women on COUNTLESS players, scumbags, deadbeats, druggies, etc. And one thing I have learned about women. They are DETERMINED to fall for the guy you tell them not to.

 

And they gleefully and stupidly exclaim "You can't help who you fall for." That's a stupid persons way of justifying stupid behavior. What separates us from the animals is the ability to reason and exercise will power.

 

 

Ok, well in that case, you've done your part. I do the same thing... male or female.

 

 

I'm not one of those who believes you can't help who you fall for either. I absolutely believe you can. Just like you can put the twinkies away when you've had one too many, or say no to the extra scoop of ice cream. No matter how good it might taste at the time, there is always a price to pay.

 

 

I get it that some people are just undisciplined that way though. *shrug* If they plow forward even when given the information, then yea, they ARE stupid.

[Babolat]

... which brings me to... Woggle. Has it ever occurred to you that some of the women you assume are 'cheering' the cheater on may be doing what I tried to do?? Counsel her out of it? I know that some outside observers might ASSUME I was cheering her on for that time I stayed friends with her after she disclosed it to me, but it was the opposite. When she wouldn't stop, that is when I exited. Same thing I would do if a friend of mine developed a substance abuse problem or any other self-inflicted poor behavior.

Not judging, you, trying to understand your message.

 

You call yourself a friend, but it appears to be conditional. If they cheat, and do not "take your counsel" you exit the friendhsip? If a friend becomes addicted to a drug, starts to abuse as substance, and they do not "take your counsel" you exit the friendship?

 

I am pretty sure that is not what you mean to say, but, if it is, wow. isn't that when friends need friends, the most? And you chose to walk away?

 

That sounds like judgment to me, not friendship. Again, I'm reading your words and drawing assumptions I don't bnow you in person.

 

What about a family a member, a loved one. If they fall of the wagon, you exit?

 

If you fall in love with a man, and later find out one of his friends was a player, you would exit the relationship?

[kaylan]

Not really. Promiscuous women get called slut because of perception. Its a little weird for most men to see women treating sexuality like a man. It's has nothing to do with insecurity. Women would you date a man with feminine qualities?

Saying that women who enjoy lots of sex as them viewing "sex like a man" is all down to cultural programming. I dont see it that way. Either someone is promiscuous or they arent.

 

Realize that there exist native tribes in areas of the world where the men and women have different partners throughout their lifetime despite raising children and having "husbands" and "wives". And its accepted and the community does not frown upon it.

 

The Moso are a good example. From http://web.pdx.edu/~tblu2/Na/myths.pdf

 

The Na visit system has changed somewhat inthe face of political campaigns and cultural

integration with the Han Chinese. Previous generations often continued with multiple partners even after a child was born. Some older Na report having upwards of 30, 40, even 50 partners throughout their lifetime. Today, though, most women accept visits from their child’s father only. That said, however, discreet occasional variations are not out of question, and are not frowned upon as long as they are not discovered. Notions of exclusivity are not entrenched, and the Na language has no word for “jealously”. Since men have more mobility in seeking partners than women do, and especially since the proliferation of bicycles, motorcycles, and trucks has made distances between villages less relevant, a good numberof men may have one open relationship and some other clandestine relationships in other villages. Even for long-term relationships, visits do not necessarily occur nightly. When men are exhausted from working in the fields, or when household matters need tending to, or if the distance toa partner’s village is too great to make nightly visits, men may opt not to visit their partner.

 

This idea that men have sex one way, and women have sex another way, is largely cultural, as well as biologically influenced.

Edited March 25, 2014 by kaylan

[kaylan]

Studs and sluts have lots of casual sex. Being a player is much more than just the ability to have sex with many women or men. There are male and female players and they are the ones who lie, manipulate and use underhanded tactics to get sex. Your theory makes little sense in that context. Men and women date people who are players because they are good at pretending to be nice guys and girls. This is all about subterfuge and skill. Posers who pretend to be players might be obvious about it, but really good players aren't. That is why they are so successful.

Best,

Grumps

Good post.

 

As much as I love sex, Im not going to lie or carelessly hurt someone to get it. I always lays may cards out on the table and let my intentions be known. Its just who I am. I dont need to be dishonest to get laid.

 

It is a shame so many people are shady about how they get sex. Like this one kid that work at my gym...he brags about trying to bag chicks when he was with his ex (who works at the same gym). For co-workers and patrons to be shaking their heads and talking about how you get cheated on, is simply bad news bears. Im hoping she knew (she had to, I think), but thats on her if she puts up with bad behavior.

 

Nevermind him bragging to me about how he will tell a girl he loves her just to get the sex. Or about the time he went to the club, and after his girlfriend hard her friends take her to the bathroom to throw up after drinking to much, he brags about how he met some girl, went back to her car to have sex, and then showed up back in the club and his gf at the time was none the wiser.

 

I just looked at him and told him it was something I wouldnt do, but reserved my judgment. I wasnt going to hi5 him for it, but it seemed like he was looking for praise.

[894hjk]

it is perceived as dirty for a woman to sleep around because of the sheer fact that a woman is allowing numerous men INSIDE her body and allowing them to deposit their...

 

It is invasive.

 

Men, on the other hand...

[Grumpybutfun]

it is perceived as dirty for a woman to sleep around because of the sheer fact that a woman is allowing numerous men INSIDE her body and allowing them to deposit their...

 

It is invasive.

 

Men, on the other hand...

 

I know I'm on the internet so it can't be the 1950's.

G

[894hjk]

I'm a 30 yr old woman. It's true, that's why it is frown upon and always will be.

[Babolat]

it is perceived as dirty for a woman to sleep around because of the sheer fact that a woman is allowing numerous men INSIDE her body and allowing them to deposit their...

 

It is invasive.

 

Men, on the other hand...

 

I have heard people say this before...could be.

[Babolat]

Ok, well in that case, you've done your part. I do the same thing... male or female. .

I went out with a woman for about 4 weeks 2 years ago. I ended the relationship, she was very unhealthy and immediately got very clingy (marriage talk, where have you been all my life talk, etc) she did not want to end it, and kind of turned into a stalker.

 

She sent me pics one night of her with another man at a bar. I knew why, to make me jealous. She mentioned his name, too. I did not know him. I found him on Facebook, could tell immediately he was a player by his photos and some of his "Friends", so I cautioned her on this. I explained to her, date who you want, do what you want, be just be careful, this man appears to be a player.

 

The next day, I got a FB message from him saying something like "Stay out of my business". Seems she told him about me, and my comments.

 

I replied to him stating I was simply trying to warn her of players like him, that she in my opinion was not emotionally in a good place at the time, she was looking for a LTR, and I asked him to not make her another one of his playees. Date her, but don't play her.

 

I was surprised with his reply, he actually said thanks, I understand and I will not. And, he did not.

 

Ironcially, I later found out he is great friends with one of my male friends, who is kind of a player himself. I don't spend much time with him for that reason. He told my friend about our "encounter" and that he was impressed with what I had to say, and respected what I had to say and how I handled his "Stay out of my business" message.

 

Regarding "you can't help who you fall for", I agree and disagree. We are attracted to who we are attracted to for whatever reason. It's our "job" if you will to break a bad pattern, of falling for the wrong types for us. Easier said than done though.