Warning signs?

[HPrynne]

AP and I both feel trepidation as steps are taken to end our respective marriages. Like most situations of this nature, it's very complicated.

 

For those who have been there before, and did leave spouse for AP (and/or AP left spouse for you), or who thought it was going to happen and it didn't, what were the warning signs that you or AP was not going to go through with it? Or if you've seen it play out here (many of these stories seem to follow very similar patterns), what sorts of things did you see that indicated either the AP or the person posting about the affair were not, actually, going to separate/divorce?

 

I would like to know what to look out for both in my own actions/feelings and those of AP.

Edited March 21, 2014 by HPrynne
formatting

[Hope Shimmers]

The biggest warning sign is inaction.

 

Dragging of feet. Putting things off. Making excuses to delay it. Etc.

[jwi71]

AP and I both feel trepidation as steps are taken to end our respective marriages. Like most situations of this nature, it's very complicated.

 

What is worrying you specifically?

 

For those who have been there before, and did leave spouse for AP (and/or AP left spouse for you), or who thought it was going to happen and it didn't, what were the warning signs that you or AP was not going to go through with it?

Ah...the old "what if I file and D and he doesn't routine". Is that it?

If this is the case, then you two have TRUST issues - understandably so.

 

The answer then is: end your A and do NOT get a D.

 

Hers is why. You get a D because it is what YOU want. You end it for YOU. And when you end your M for you - it doesn't matter what anyone else on this planet thinks or does - you aren't doing it for them so they don't matter. But here, you are doing it for him and suddenly HIS action matter and influence your own. Not a good idea. Horrible actually.

 

Or if you've seen it play out here (many of these stories seem to follow very similar patterns), what sorts of things did you see that indicated either the AP or the person posting about the affair were not, actually, going to separate/divorce?

You won't like this...but posting this very question is a tremendous leading indicator of failure.

 

It shows a lack of TRUST between you and the OM - and is that really how you expect to build a stable and strong R with him? And that presumes the D process isn't nasty and drawn out - believe me, that is a HUGE stress for even the single OW! Much less an OW going through the same with her stbxh at the same time. Yikes.

 

I would like to know what to look out for both in my own actions/feelings and those of AP.

Well, instead of looking for hidden sign or clues - just ask your MOM.

Hey, when are you filing for D?

 

Actually...wouldn't it be just awesome if, when you ask him that...and he invariably asks you the same in return...that you could show him the filed paperwork for YOUR D! That you have your own place rented/purchased. That you have REAL and concrete steps to prove to him how serious you are. Nothing like making it real to encourage him.

 

Why not do that?

 

Answer: all the stuff I typed above.

 

Trust issues.

[veryhappy]

This is as very good thread.

 

It's not about trust issues, it's when you do trust but it ends the other way.

 

I'm one of it didn't work out. He backed out as soon as he mentioned divorce to the w and went to mc.

 

I would say some of the red flags: not making a plan, not wanting to tackle the plan, postponing with no real reasons, conversations based on his family now instead of the future, not talking about his plans to friends and family, contradictory statements and hesitating.

 

Add religious environment, a strong sense of duty and doing what's right, an overbearing wife who plays mommy and/or will use the kids in the process, extended family involved in the family life, complicated finances and businesses, minor kids, troubled kids, suicidal family members.

Edited March 22, 2014 by cutedragon

[Bootsie]

AP and I both feel trepidation as steps are taken to end our respective marriages. Like most situations of this nature, it's very complicated.

 

For those who have been there before, and did leave spouse for AP (and/or AP left spouse for you), or who thought it was going to happen and it didn't, what were the warning signs that you or AP was not going to go through with it? Or if you've seen it play out here (many of these stories seem to follow very similar patterns), what sorts of things did you see that indicated either the AP or the person posting about the affair were not, actually, going to separate/divorce?

 

I would like to know what to look out for both in my own actions/feelings and those of AP.

 

 

I've been there before, but as a BS.

 

 

When you imply that steps have been taken, do you mean real action that involves the BSs, or just words between the APs and things done behind the backs of the BSs, or perhaps the BS doesn't actually know that the marriage is ending so the APs can be together?

 

 

The reason I mention this is because in my view, the major sign that the APs are not actually going to separate/divorce is that the BSs don't know anything about their marriage ending, or thinks there is no other party involved when there is. To me this is a major warning sign, and informing the BSs (not only that the marriage is ending but also that their spouse had found someone else) is one of the most significant steps an AP can do to show he/she is genuine.

 

 

I say this because as a BS when I finally found out, all the future faking between the APs came to nothing. My spouse and I are now reconciled, many years afterwards.

Edited March 22, 2014 by Bootsie

[dubliner]

jwi71 : Hers is why. You get a D because it is what YOU want. You end it for YOU. And when you end your M for you - it doesn't matter what anyone else on this planet thinks or does - you aren't doing it for them so they don't matter. But here, you are doing it for him and suddenly HIS action matter and influence your own. Not a good idea. Horrible actually.

 

This 100%

 

in yourself I would watch for lack of momentum

 

In my own M we (I) had been trying to resolve our issues for many years previously, once I made my mind to end the M, (nothing to do with CM) exH and I spoke about it, it started a natural progression to the end. We actively moved towards seperation, sorting out housing, financial arrangements, told family etc. Everything was done with the seperation in mind, not attending functions together, seperating our personal time etc. having our own time with the children rather than doing things as a family. it was a snowball effect, it became more and more obviously final in a relatively short period of time.

 

When I look at CM he hasn't progressed since he (apparently) told his SO he was done last year.

He still seeks attention from her, although he denies this it is clear that her lack of interest upsets him. He involves her in decisions about the future, home build plans/business plans, jumps when she calls it, lies/minimises to her and his friends and family about his prior involvement with me, basically carrying on as before whilst dangling the mouldy carrot of 'I'm getting my ducks in a row'

He isn't. And that's ok. Its his life, his choices, his lack of momentum shows me he is where he wants to be.

But I'm not single waiting for him, I have no regrets about ending my M as I did it for me and my children not anyone else. I'm not afraid of being single, after all I'm pretty awesome company!

[MorbidFever]

I think a red flag is definitely waiting and thinking up excuses why MM can’t, at the very least, retain an attorney and get the ball rolling. Here is a little background of what was my situation and at the end I will explain why I am writing all this.

 

You can check the red flags yourself as well. First time, he begged for me to let him stay when he came here. Begged and begged he was crying he did not want to go back home, that it was over, he doesn’t love wife, can’t part from me, all the other b.s. I couldn’t just move with him on a days notice, so I sent him home.

 

xMM was ready to leave again, we had everything sorted out, then he majorly pissed me off when he went on a so-called “pre-planned” night getaway to the beach with his wife. I wouldn’t have been so mad if he didn’t LIE when texting me on the drive there. He claims he was driving and had to go, even wrote this stupid text with letters all scrambled to make it look like he was one hand typing while driving. It’s funny to think about it now, but I was so mad. So I called it off. He cried and pleaded, but I ignored him. I caved and saw him about 2 weeks later, we flew out to another state to meet up. Decided again we were doing this because we can’t live without each other. Then he ran into health issues and he said he cannot leave until his health issues are in order. To this day, they still are not. We made it four months and the communications became fewer and fewer. Hours of texting, calling, dwindled to an email or two a day. I then sent him a message that we needed to go NC.

 

Before the second time we made the plans, he started to write a letter to wife explaining his actions and why he needed to move on. He texted me and said he was bawling and how hard it was and he didn’t even imagine he would feel so awful and sad. BINGO! If all the things were true, he was so unhappy and out of love, would he be so upset? Before all this, he would still update his social media that he was in love with wife and all the other things that were contrary to what he was telling me. Red flag. Oh and she knew about us and knew he wanted to leave. She kept hanging on and in hindsight, it all makes sense. I believe he was lying to me, even though I did speak with her and she knew he was in love with me, I think the reality is....he was lying to me and instead telling her that he was working on letting me go. He talked to me in front of her at first, but that changed into having to sneak off to call me. Boy was I stupid.

 

So while it may appear to you one way, we never ever know the 100% truth what is going on. You could test yourselves. You could both write a farewell letter to your spouses and see how you feel.

[Bootsie]

I think a red flag is definitely waiting and thinking up excuses why MM can’t, at the very least, retain an attorney and get the ball rolling. Here is a little background of what was my situation and at the end I will explain why I am writing all this.

 

You can check the red flags yourself as well. First time, he begged for me to let him stay when he came here. Begged and begged he was crying he did not want to go back home, that it was over, he doesn’t love wife, can’t part from me, all the other b.s. I couldn’t just move with him on a days notice, so I sent him home.

 

xMM was ready to leave again, we had everything sorted out, then he majorly pissed me off when he went on a so-called “pre-planned” night getaway to the beach with his wife. I wouldn’t have been so mad if he didn’t LIE when texting me on the drive there. He claims he was driving and had to go, even wrote this stupid text with letters all scrambled to make it look like he was one hand typing while driving. It’s funny to think about it now, but I was so mad. So I called it off. He cried and pleaded, but I ignored him. I caved and saw him about 2 weeks later, we flew out to another state to meet up. Decided again we were doing this because we can’t live without each other. Then he ran into health issues and he said he cannot leave until his health issues are in order. To this day, they still are not. We made it four months and the communications became fewer and fewer. Hours of texting, calling, dwindled to an email or two a day. I then sent him a message that we needed to go NC.

 

Before the second time we made the plans, he started to write a letter to wife explaining his actions and why he needed to move on. He texted me and said he was bawling and how hard it was and he didn’t even imagine he would feel so awful and sad. BINGO! If all the things were true, he was so unhappy and out of love, would he be so upset? Before all this, he would still update his social media that he was in love with wife and all the other things that were contrary to what he was telling me. Red flag. Oh and she knew about us and knew he wanted to leave. She kept hanging on and in hindsight, it all makes sense. I believe he was lying to me, even though I did speak with her and she knew he was in love with me, I think the reality is....he was lying to me and instead telling her that he was working on letting me go. He talked to me in front of her at first, but that changed into having to sneak off to call me. Boy was I stupid.

 

So while it may appear to you one way, we never ever know the 100% truth what is going on. You could test yourselves. You could both write a farewell letter to your spouses and see how you feel.

 

 

I think this just demonstrates my point, that unless the BS is on board with what's going on, it may never happen.

 

 

HPrynne how much do your BSs know about what's happening?

[FoolishOW]

This 100%

 

in yourself I would watch for lack of momentum

 

In my own M we (I) had been trying to resolve our issues for many years previously, once I made my mind to end the M, (nothing to do with CM) exH and I spoke about it, it started a natural progression to the end. We actively moved towards seperation, sorting out housing, financial arrangements, told family etc. Everything was done with the seperation in mind, not attending functions together, seperating our personal time etc. having our own time with the children rather than doing things as a family. it was a snowball effect, it became more and more obviously final in a relatively short period of time.

 

When I look at CM he hasn't progressed since he (apparently) told his SO he was done last year.

He still seeks attention from her, although he denies this it is clear that her lack of interest upsets him. He involves her in decisions about the future, home build plans/business plans, jumps when she calls it, lies/minimises to her and his friends and family about his prior involvement with me, basically carrying on as before whilst dangling the mouldy carrot of 'I'm getting my ducks in a row'

He isn't. And that's ok. Its his life, his choices, his lack of momentum shows me he is where he wants to be.

But I'm not single waiting for him, I have no regrets about ending my M as I did it for me and my children not anyone else. I'm not afraid of being single, after all I'm pretty awesome company!

 

 

 

This is one of the healthiest posts I've read. I really applaud you, and I LOVE, love, love your line about the fact that you're pretty awesome company!! I've often felt this way myself, so I can relate to your statement. There are many times I'd prefer hanging out with/by "myself" over others, and that isn't meant to sound conceited in any way at all. It's just peacefully enjoyable. Kudos to you!!

[beach]

For all the folks I've seen get divorced - when they INTENDED to get divorced - nothing got in the way of getting it done and over with as soon as possible.

 

For those that stalled and delayed - it was because no action was keeping it at a stand still.

 

Either it moving forward - or it's not INTENDING to get finalized.

 

Things that stall it:

 

Denial

Dishonesty

Sneaky behavior

More of the same crap that looks like lies.

 

Complicated or not - divorces get finalized all the time when someone intends to get 'ER done.

 

If Donald trump can get it done - anyone can.

 

No excuses - when one wants to get divorced = they do.

Edited March 23, 2014 by beach

[HPrynne]

This is all really helpful, thank you.

 

AP has initiated more than one conversation with his spouse and has discussed D with his BS. For my part, I have communicated to my BS that I am deeply unhappy in the M, that things are not working and do not seem fixable, and have tried to discuss what a split would look like. BS rejects what I say and says everything is fine or will be fine, but I am not just going along with that. I'll be consulting with a lawyer next (very soon) to get the information I need to make more concrete plans and understand what sort of timeframe is reasonable, the changes I will need to make in my life, how to prepare for D, and so on.

 

I don't think we have trust issues. I have as much or more doubt in myself - it's just too huge and overwhelming and scary to not have some doubt that I'll be able to do it, or that things will ultimately work out. So for that reason, I want to know what being cowardly looks like. I want to be able to see it in myself as well as in AP. He has so far surprised me a bit by taking the lead on moving things forward - judiciously and not thoughtlessly or recklessly, but unquestionably forward. I did not ask him to have those conversations with his spouse; he told me he needed to have them, asked my advice and then went ahead and did it even though he was anxious to do so. I would say in terms of bringing up our plans, it's about 50/50 (who brings it up). I think we've talked about it in some way every time we've been together, since we made the decision.

 

I have not heard any excuses yet about not moving forward. Fears, concerns, anxieties, yes. But no excuses whatsoever.

 

I do not need AP to get a D. Of course I'd like that to happen; I want to spend my life with him. But I don't need him to do anything to move forward with my life. I can see my life going in a number of different directions and I believe I'm capable of making the best of any of those. I don't see myself staying married unless BS fixed some of his major issues and we mutually agreed to a roommates type of arrangement (because I do not think romantic feelings can be rekindled on my side), which in some ways is what we have now anyway, but I don't think he'd actually agree to it long-term. And we might both be too unhappy with that arrangement to make it work.

 

AP has said he might wait longer, maybe a few years, but is convinced he would D regardless of me at this point. Being in an A provides an impetus to act sooner rather than later because neither of us likes being in an A and we know (in addition to how wrong so much of this is, granted & goes without saying) it is an additional wrong for our spouses to sit on the fence/draw it out.

 

The purpose of the inquiry is simply that I would like to be wary of whether we are somehow deceiving ourselves or each other (blindly, unintentionally - I'm not concerned about intentional deceit) about our ability to do what needs to be done to move our lives forward and ultimately, if things work out, be together. A number of the people here have seen many of these stories come through the forum and have a working knowledge that seems to be able to predict what's going to happen with a reasonable degree of accuracy... so I'm interested in the patterns and warning signs that have been observed to help me know where I'm at.

[veryhappy]

It sounds like both of you are in exit affairs, so it might just work out to be together.

 

I wanted to add to be careful to the language you both are using. If there's anything that means "I don't see myself following through, I can't imagine being divorced, how will she carry water from the river, how are the kids going to herd the cattle etc." it's bad news. It's impossible to do the jump if one can't mentally picture himself there.

[Bootsie]

This is all really helpful, thank you.

 

AP has initiated more than one conversation with his spouse and has discussed D with his BS. For my part, I have communicated to my BS that I am deeply unhappy in the M, that things are not working and do not seem fixable, and have tried to discuss what a split would look like. BS rejects what I say and says everything is fine or will be fine, but I am not just going along with that. I'll be consulting with a lawyer next (very soon) to get the information I need to make more concrete plans and understand what sort of timeframe is reasonable, the changes I will need to make in my life, how to prepare for D, and so on.

 

I don't think we have trust issues. I have as much or more doubt in myself - it's just too huge and overwhelming and scary to not have some doubt that I'll be able to do it, or that things will ultimately work out. So for that reason, I want to know what being cowardly looks like. I want to be able to see it in myself as well as in AP. He has so far surprised me a bit by taking the lead on moving things forward - judiciously and not thoughtlessly or recklessly, but unquestionably forward. I did not ask him to have those conversations with his spouse; he told me he needed to have them, asked my advice and then went ahead and did it even though he was anxious to do so. I would say in terms of bringing up our plans, it's about 50/50 (who brings it up). I think we've talked about it in some way every time we've been together, since we made the decision.

 

I have not heard any excuses yet about not moving forward. Fears, concerns, anxieties, yes. But no excuses whatsoever.

 

I do not need AP to get a D. Of course I'd like that to happen; I want to spend my life with him. But I don't need him to do anything to move forward with my life. I can see my life going in a number of different directions and I believe I'm capable of making the best of any of those. I don't see myself staying married unless BS fixed some of his major issues and we mutually agreed to a roommates type of arrangement (because I do not think romantic feelings can be rekindled on my side), which in some ways is what we have now anyway, but I don't think he'd actually agree to it long-term. And we might both be too unhappy with that arrangement to make it work.

 

AP has said he might wait longer, maybe a few years, but is convinced he would D regardless of me at this point. Being in an A provides an impetus to act sooner rather than later because neither of us likes being in an A and we know (in addition to how wrong so much of this is, granted & goes without saying) it is an additional wrong for our spouses to sit on the fence/draw it out.

 

The purpose of the inquiry is simply that I would like to be wary of whether we are somehow deceiving ourselves or each other (blindly, unintentionally - I'm not concerned about intentional deceit) about our ability to do what needs to be done to move our lives forward and ultimately, if things work out, be together. A number of the people here have seen many of these stories come through the forum and have a working knowledge that seems to be able to predict what's going to happen with a reasonable degree of accuracy... so I'm interested in the patterns and warning signs that have been observed to help me know where I'm at.

 

 

I don't see anywhere in this that your spouses know that you are already in another relationship. If so, you might like to ask yourselves why you haven't told them. It would be a major red flag in my view, that you have found all sorts of excuses not to tell them (if that's the case).

 

 

You asked about the warning signs and to me this is it. People in affairs, who are going all out to keep it secret, are in my view, least likely to actually go ahead with leaving, despite sometimes talking the talk.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Bootsie

[beach]

I don't see either one of you being totally honest with your spouses. Alluding to not happy enough in the M is not honest. It's evasive.

 

And no firm and solid action has been happening toward ending the marriages in order to be free.

 

Just looks like smoke and mirrors to pretend to end the M but no action to make it happen.

 

Just typical affair behavior.

[goodyblue]

My guy planned to leave almost from the beginning and was never upfront with his ex. He felt (right or wrong) that he'd done all he could to get things to be okay in their marriage and she refused to participate. When we decided we were going to make a go of it, he simply began planning. I guess it may seem like a terrible thing to do, but I think it was simply the right way for him. He made steady progress and that is what I looked for. Onward and upward always.

 

But I know he is not the rule. I'm kind of curious too, what men who have actually left did, and how.

[beach]

Elusive and misleading conversations is NOT the same as taking STEPS and action to end your marriages.

 

Not even anywhere near the same thing.

[txgrl]

I had many elusive conversations with my H about D when I was in the middle of my A . I was the one who R with H after all those lengthy and stressful ' conversations ' about D . even consulting with a lawyer is not the same thing . Hell I even initiated D . Till it's not finalized in court , any party can get cold feet and back out .

You two are not the first couple wanting to D your respective spouses for each other . Couples who wanted to do it , did it . I don't really believe it when you make it seem like you're not worried if you D your H and MM chickens out and stays with his W .

 

I just hope that you think this through, know your reasons for D and know that A have a way of clouding judgement and sanity . Best .

[ClemsonTigers]

 

AP has initiated more than one conversation with his spouse and has discussed D with his BS.

 

Have you confirmed this? It's highly likely he's lying to you. He even dropped a couple hints by saying he MAY want to wait a couple years. Just enough wiggle room for him to delay and delay and delay following through with anything…while still getting the good illicit stuff (sex and emotional commitment) from you. He'll even let you get divorced so he has more access to you when it suits him while keeping his marriage and family just a few more weeks, months…years. Typical cake eater. If he'll lie to his wife, a woman he committed to before God and family, what makes you any different?

 

Your husband may have issues he needs to work on but you aren't free of your own issues. Adultery is extremely selfish and abusive behavior. There is certainly nothing he has ever done to you that compares to what you are currently doing to him. Consider this…if you put half the energy into your marriage that you are putting into this adulterous dead end relationship, you could certainly fix a lot of the problems in your marriage. Heck, confess your affair and just see whether your husband is willing to step it up and work with you to save your marriage|family OR, just maybe just hand you the freedom you seem so eager and convinced you want. He's at least entitled to the truth about his life, isn't he???

 

I truly wish you and your husband well. You can rediscover your feelings for him. I know it seems impossible now but all it takes is consistent effort directed in the right direction. Your feelings will then follow your behavior. 17 years ago my wife cheated on me and thought her feelings for me were gone forever. After her OM dumped her it took us about a year to really rebuild things and she's been crazy about me since. Women tend to love one guy at a time so your feelings for your MM are merely clouding your feelings for your husband. You loved him once…you can do it again. Consider also that thousands of people remarry their x spouses every month. In fact, it's MUCH more likely you'll divorce and remarry your husband than end up married to your MM.

 

As a point of reference, check out Mrs. Scarlett's thread on this forum. Her MM dumped her after they moved in together and she's now wishing she could reconcile with her husband. She struggled over choosing what to do too and acknowledges now she clearly made the wrong choice. Sophie is kind of experiencing the same thing. I empathize greatly with you right now. You are at a crossroads in your life and trying to base these important decision upon your feelings rather than your brain. I know based upon experience talking and advising 100's of persons such as yourself that the road you appear to be considering is wrought with danger, loneliness and despair. Very seldom do affairs lead to marriage. In real life, outside of forums where you can't verify the truth of anything someone types on a keypad, I know not one single happily married affair marriage. Relationships built upon betrayal are tenuous. If you divorce it's quite likely you'll end up alone (which is probably a tad better than ending up with MM). I suggest you consider doing, what in my opinion is the right thing (which would be giving your husband the truth and figuring things out with him from that point without interference from your MM). Nobody ever regrets doing the right thing. You may just end up divorced anyway and, heck, so will MM someday (he appears to be a liar and a cheater so it's quite likely). You MAY decide to risk taking up with him again at that point when you are both single and available. Then again…you'll be single and might find a more decent honest guy to date…marry, God willing.

 

Please reconsider carefully.

[HPrynne]

Thanks to all for the input.

[Scott Thomas]

There was a thread on the marriage builder's forum. A bit similar to yours. The BH and WW went on to reconcile and have a wonderful marriage. I'll message the links if you want to read them.

 

Are you willing to give your marriage one last go? Any last rolls if the dice?

[HPrynne]

There was a thread on the marriage builder's forum. A bit similar to yours. The BH and WW went on to reconcile and have a wonderful marriage. I'll message the links if you want to read them.

 

Are you willing to give your marriage one last go? Any last rolls if the dice?

 

As I said above, not unless he were to do something very significant to address his issues, such as enter treatment for substance abuse. That is extremely unlikely, given the history.

 

I do not believe that after so many years of broken promises and excuses, and from time to time outright mistreatment while he was using, that it is possible or that anyone could expect that I should stay and try to help him again. I have already given it many "last chances." I was a faithful and devoted partner until my spirit was finally broken and I gave up (at some point in the past year). That is not an excuse; it is merely a description. It is at that point that I should have recognized that it was over for me and told him I wanted a divorce; however, I was still figuring all of that out when I met AP. It was wrong to choose to have an affair.

 

He has contributed very little for quite a number of years and I have lost respect for him as a partner. I do not feel romantic love or trust for him nor do I believe it can be rekindled, nor do I think I particularly owe it to him to try to manifest those feelings after years of bad and selfish behavior on his part, the root problem of which he still is unwilling to admit or change in a significant way.

 

I was very deeply in love with him and devoted to him for many years, despite all of the problems. I tried everything I could to help him be a functional person, and I was very clear with him about my concerns, the effect on me/the family and my level of unhappiness. And I'm sure I didn't get everything right and there is a measure of culpability that falls on my shoulders as well. However, eventually, all the failures and the effect it had on me and the rest of the family became too much and my feelings for him changed. Even if he were to fix the problem, get into treatment and never use again (and why would I think that would be the case?), I don't think I could fall back in love with him, or respect or trust him again the way I once did. I think that him being clean/sober could make a roommates type arrangement possible, though I don't know that's what either of us would really want if it came down to it.

 

Adultery is extremely selfish and abusive behavior. There is certainly nothing he has ever done to you that compares to what you are currently doing to him. Consider this…if you put half the energy into your marriage that you are putting into this adulterous dead end relationship, you could certainly fix a lot of the problems in your marriage.

ClemsonTigers, you seem very certain of things you could not possibly know. The question of "who has done worse things to whom" is, I think, completely pointless and I will certainly not go into some litany of wrongs that have been perpetrated upon me by my H. However, I put tremendous effort into my relationship with my H for many years while he took me and my contributions for granted. The A has required very little effort or energy by comparison. My M, supporting my family and trying to help my H become a functional person has been an extremely hard and draining effort that was more than I could maintain, but still I tried to do everything for many years. The A is wrong, and yes, it's selfish. I do not feel right about it. But that does not mean that if I put the energy going to the relationship with AP into my M that it would improve anything. I have many years of attempts and failures to make me certain enough of that.

Edited March 24, 2014 by HPrynne

[Spark1111]

But HPrynne, if your marriage was so terrible why did you stay so long?

 

Why did it take meeting an AP to really cement the marriage is dead mantra?

 

And, if the marriage is as dead as you say it is and the love long gone, why not divorce already? No matter what your AP is up to, doing, or not doing?

 

No matter what, you can't stay in a draining loveless marriage with a substance abuser you no longer love.

 

So WHY are you still there?

[Scott Thomas]

I'll msg the links. I agree with Spark-why stay until an A?

Btw never say never.

[HPrynne]

But HPrynne, if your marriage was so terrible why did you stay so long?

 

 

I never said it was terrible. Some parts were great. I stayed because I wanted to try everything I possibly could. I was committed to and in love with my spouse. There have been many people, friends and family, who did not understand why I stayed or why I defended him. But I loved him and saw (still do see) the good. I wanted things to get better and to work out. I wanted to be happy with him. I wanted him to fix his problems and I was willing to do just about anything to be part of the solution and help him do that. I focused on the good times and tried to compensate for all the problems. However, I couldn't do it forever. It took a long time before I was worn down enough to give up, and then some amount of time to recognize that I had given up and that it meant it was over. I no longer want the things I wanted before and I no longer feel the way I once did.

 

Why did it take meeting an AP to really cement the marriage is dead mantra?

 

 

I had a turning point conversation with a friend well prior to meeting the AP that provided the first significant realization in terms of how I felt. The things I was saying to family and friends about my M, too, around that time - in retrospect, it is pretty clear what had happened and that the M, for me, was dead. I don't know whether the A was a trigger, but it certainly prodded me to introspect more concretely.

 

And, if the marriage is as dead as you say it is and the love long gone, why not divorce already? No matter what your AP is up to, doing, or not doing?

 

 

I am divorcing. I do not need AP to do or not do something. I asked the original question because knowledge and understanding are useful. It does not mean that seeing hesitation on the part of the AP would change my decision to end my marriage. I feel trepidation at the major changes coming but have so far not backed away from them.

 

No matter what, you can't stay in a draining loveless marriage with a substance abuser you no longer love.

 

 

Right. That is why I am moving forward with getting a divorce.

 

So WHY are you still there?

 

 

Because I am not impulsive, planning is wise and prudent, and divorce is not instantaneous (though I'm hardly dragging my heels). I've contacted an attorney and am doing what needs to be done.

 

 

And why stay until an A? Obviously, it was the wrong thing to do. If I had been more self-aware at the time I would have made a different choice, as I've said, and told my spouse the marriage was over before choosing to have an A. But I didn't. I can't change that because it has already occurred.

[Scott Thomas]

Can you give your marriage a shot without the AP in the picture?

I'm assuming your H isn't aware that you're so unhappy or had an A.

How, if I may inquire, is the divorce proceeding eg have you two had a discussion etc?