GemmaUK Posted March 22, 2014 Posted March 22, 2014 Oh, the thing I didn't agree with was the hug. You can tell everything from how a person hugs. It's a way of communicating. Where arms are positioned, how close, how tight, and most importantly, how long. We had two really long hugs (like 30+ seconds) at the end of the night. We were tight up against each other, and she was hugging tightly with her face in my chest and head under my chin. That's a pretty intimate hug. As I pointed out earlier, that's how my XW used to hug me. So, in other words, not lightly. So many mixed signals. I have RSI. I cannot sometimes hug comfortably and raise my head up and most men's shoulders are too high for comfort. I can raise p for a while but a hug if close..eek! Too painful! Therefore I go under chin as it's not painful. I work hard at my job though.tis a symptom of that.
Author RonaldS Posted March 22, 2014 Author Posted March 22, 2014 OK, we can think of all of the obscure conditions to help us break down possibilities for the hugs, haha. Maybe she has ankylosing spondylitis? The point is, they were close, long, intimate hugs. We were holding each other, she was nuzzled in, I was running my hands through her hair, and she wasn't letting go. In other words, there was meaning to the hugs, and they were different than the initial hug we had when we first saw each other, although that one was really nice too. That's was makes the loss of interest all the more baffling.
Trimmer Posted March 22, 2014 Posted March 22, 2014 I tend to agree about interpreting the hug. C'mon - you can pretty much read whether it's a shoulder to shoulder, slap on the back, cursory "bro-hug" or a long, intimate, neither-of-us-gonna-let-go-first (I do so enjoy those...) or roughly where you are along the spectrum between. I'm with you on that one. I just wonder why that's not something we can't have a talk about. It's not like we aren't friends. Why leave it wide open and not just say, 'thanks but no thanks'? "All it takes for evil to triumph is for good men do do nothing." Ok, that may be a little overwrought, but you may need to be the one to take more assertive action to make that talk happen, if you want to have it.
Standard-Fare Posted March 23, 2014 Posted March 23, 2014 I'm invested in this now, so keep us updated. It's clear that whatever happens, she will not be putty in your hands. As a woman I can relate to this behavior. I never operate with the assumption that the other person is gaga over me; I assume the opposite. Not in a low self-esteem way... it just seems a more realistic base point to start from. And with dating, I tend to be kinda passive at first (which I'm sure reads as aloof/flakey) and let the man prove his interest. For me that's a matter of not wanting to try too hard or get invested until I'm sure the guy digs me. So I just live my own life and don't take special pains to include him in it until I have a better feeling about it. Not all woman are like this, and I'm not pretending to diagnosis this woman's behavior, just giving you one perspective.
Author RonaldS Posted March 23, 2014 Author Posted March 23, 2014 I'm invested in this now, so keep us updated. It's clear that whatever happens, she will not be putty in your hands. As a woman I can relate to this behavior. I never operate with the assumption that the other person is gaga over me; I assume the opposite. Not in a low self-esteem way... it just seems a more realistic base point to start from. And with dating, I tend to be kinda passive at first (which I'm sure reads as aloof/flakey) and let the man prove his interest. For me that's a matter of not wanting to try too hard or get invested until I'm sure the guy digs me. So I just live my own life and don't take special pains to include him in it until I have a better feeling about it. Not all woman are like this, and I'm not pretending to diagnosis this woman's behavior, just giving you one perspective. Since you're sucked in.... I asked earlier and I don't think anybody addressed it. Do you think that with the way I just got ahold of her out if nowhere, quickly got flirty with her, walked her home (maybe with the implication that I wanted to go up to her apartment), the little make out session, and then lack of follow-up to see her again.....do you think maybe she thought I was just trying to hook up with her? And that maybe I lost interest when I didn't get an easy score? She made a couple of comments that, looking back, I think she was really questioning my motives. Because we were talking a lot for that whole week after, but then after the next weekend passed and I didn't ask her out, that's when the communication shut down. Maybe she thinks I was just trying to get her in bed?
GemmaUK Posted March 23, 2014 Posted March 23, 2014 Since you're sucked in.... I asked earlier and I don't think anybody addressed it. Do you think that with the way I just got ahold of her out if nowhere, quickly got flirty with her, walked her home (maybe with the implication that I wanted to go up to her apartment), the little make out session, and then lack of follow-up to see her again.....do you think maybe she thought I was just trying to hook up with her? And that maybe I lost interest when I didn't get an easy score? She made a couple of comments that, looking back, I think she was really questioning my motives. Because we were talking a lot for that whole week after, but then after the next weekend passed and I didn't ask her out, that's when the communication shut down. Maybe she thinks I was just trying to get her in bed? Possibly. Did you say anything similar to this that you posted? Then the stupid cab showed up.
Author RonaldS Posted March 23, 2014 Author Posted March 23, 2014 Possibly. Did you say anything similar to this that you posted? About the cab? What do you mean?
GemmaUK Posted March 23, 2014 Posted March 23, 2014 Yes about the cab. Did you say something similar to 'the stupid cab turned up' (which are the words you used in your first post which I quoted below my question)?
Author RonaldS Posted March 24, 2014 Author Posted March 24, 2014 Yes about the cab. Did you say something similar to 'the stupid cab turned up' (which are the words you used in your first post which I quoted below my question)? No, I didn't really say anything about that.
Author RonaldS Posted March 24, 2014 Author Posted March 24, 2014 Sooooo.....ummmmm.....yeah.....wow. Things just got interesting, haha.
Standard-Fare Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 If a friend from eight years ago contacted me, regardless of any attraction we might have felt in the past, I wouldn't assume it was for a quick one-night stand. But let's just assume for a moment she DID think that's what you were after. That means that agreeing to go out with you meant she was down for it, right? Why else would she have said yes and then acted all flirty and affectionate? In that case, the lack of a hookup on that meeting (or soon after) might have read as "Uh oh, he might have something more serious in mind." I'm not even suggesting that's the problem here (I don't really think it is); I'm just throwing out a theory. And also pointing out that if she thought your goal was a hookup, maybe that wasn't even a turnoff for her. Let's not pretend women don't sometimes have that same motive. Again, though, just not sure what's going on in your particular situation. To me she just sounds all over the place, unsure of what she wants, and not someone you're going to win over immediately or easily.
Author RonaldS Posted March 24, 2014 Author Posted March 24, 2014 We just had a long conversation via text. I normally don't like texting for this stuff, but in this case, I'm glad that we did. First of all, it let us communicate a little more freely, but also, I am delighted that I have a transcript of the conversation to be preserved for posterity. I will into the many amazing and juicy details of the conversation, but I'm short on time, so first things first: She has a boyfriend. A serious boyfriend.
Standard-Fare Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 She has a boyfriend. A serious boyfriend. Ahhhh that's the one explanation that makes everything you've said make sense. I'm surprised no one here came up with that. Sorry, dude. But I guess if you were interested in friendship, you do have a chance at that.
Minnie09 Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 Can't believe this didn't come up during your "date" (or whatever you want to call it). Reunion of old friends? Romantic stuff, career, current relationship status (especially when there was flirting going on!!!) ALWAYS comes up! This is odd. So.....is she trash talking him in her text messages to you?
Author RonaldS Posted March 24, 2014 Author Posted March 24, 2014 Just wait until I get a few minutes to go over the details of the conversation. Wow, haha.
Author RonaldS Posted March 24, 2014 Author Posted March 24, 2014 Can't believe this didn't come up during your "date" (or whatever you want to call it). Reunion of old friends? Romantic stuff, career, current relationship status (especially when there was flirting going on!!!) ALWAYS comes up! This is odd. So.....is she trash talking him in her text messages to you? It didn't come up because if she had told me that she had a boyfriend, we wouldn't have had the same evening that we ended up having. She knew how it was going to go down. She didn't trash talk him, but she didn't say anything else about him, and didn't give any indication that she thought they had some sort of future together.
Author RonaldS Posted March 24, 2014 Author Posted March 24, 2014 So, the synopsis of the conversation from her end was this: - thought we really connected, has always thought we were very similar, likes that we're both different, non-conformist people - loved the time we spent together, how close we felt , how easy it was, how natural it felt - she only felt slightly guilty about kissing me - wondered if we could really just be friends - admitted that there were a lot of moments between us from previously. Wondered what I saw in my XW and why I didn't like her. Also said that she would get pissed at my XW when she would be rude to me, said she would feel defensive against my XW. Stated that she always noticed a thing between us - then we essentially pinky-swore to....I don't really know what. She said we need to be open and honest if things get crazy (?), and she was talking about those moments that we had the other night and said 'I'm sure there will be many more' (?) So, yeah....wow. But now it all makes sense.
Standard-Fare Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 Wow, she really IS trouble. Sounds pretty intriguing, but proceed with caution man! I mean, did she suggest that she has an open or non-monogamous relationship?
Chocolat Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 So, the synopsis of the conversation from her end was this: - thought we really connected, has always thought we were very similar, likes that we're both different, non-conformist people - loved the time we spent together, how close we felt , how easy it was, how natural it felt - she only felt slightly guilty about kissing me - wondered if we could really just be friends - admitted that there were a lot of moments between us from previously. Wondered what I saw in my XW and why I didn't like her. Also said that she would get pissed at my XW when she would be rude to me, said she would feel defensive against my XW. Stated that she always noticed a thing between us - then we essentially pinky-swore to....I don't really know what. She said we need to be open and honest if things get crazy (?), and she was talking about those moments that we had the other night and said 'I'm sure there will be many more' (?) So, yeah....wow. But now it all makes sense. So she's planning on cheating on her "serious boyfriend" with you? Let this one go.
Author RonaldS Posted March 24, 2014 Author Posted March 24, 2014 So she's planning on cheating on her "serious boyfriend" with you? Let this one go. Well, life is weird. You never know what's next. Maybe their relationship is on it's way out. Maybe she, like a lot of people, got to the age where the pressure to find somebody mounts to the point where she settled on somebody who was good enough. Let's face it....nobody here knows the nature of their relationship....maybe not even really her. Everything makes a lot of sense now. The immediate response back when I first contacted her, the vagueness of some of our early conversations, the instant sort of falling into each other once we were together, the hugs, the initial hesitency to kiss and then giving in, the flightiness when we got back to her place and trying to get me out if there, the flurry of communication afterward, and then her saying she was having a ton of anxiety, and then shutting down. It makes total sense now. She did like me before. I even asked her. I said I had noticed a lot of moments when we were together before that I thought she was vibing me a little, but then allowed that sometimes you see what you want to see, and asked if that was real or just my imagination. She responded that there were tons of times where she had thoughts of 'us' and wondered what I saw in my XW. I thought that took some guts to admit. I'm going to hold off any judgement for now and just see what happens. I mean, you can say it's sh*tty of her to even consider, but put yourself in her shoes. A little over 3 weeks ago, I wasn't in her life in any capacity other than as a very distant memory. All of a sudden, BOOM. Now a person comes back into your life that you looked at a certain way, that you always liked and connected with, who you understood and who understood you when few others did, but there were always barriers in the way....all of a sudden, that person is back without barriers. And then you get together and things fit like a glove. Three weeks ago, she just had the life that she had. Now, it's all different. Again, I'm not going to judge her too harshly.
GemmaUK Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 She has put you through an awful lot of wasted energy analysing all of this. She omitted to tell the truth to you for several weeks from the sound of it? She has also lied to her current partner and sounds prepared to cheat. Plus, you said that she was always flakey in the past. I would give her a very wide berth. 1
Chocolat Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 I'm going to hold off any judgement for now and just see what happens. I mean, you can say it's sh*tty of her to even consider, but put yourself in her shoes. A little over 3 weeks ago, I wasn't in her life in any capacity other than as a very distant memory. All of a sudden, BOOM. Now a person comes back into your life that you looked at a certain way, that you always liked and connected with, who you understood and who understood you when few others did, but there were always barriers in the way....all of a sudden, that person is back without barriers. And then you get together and things fit like a glove. Hmmmm. I think that if it were me, I would let you know I had a bf and I don't think I'd have kissed you. Assuming I truly felt you were my destiny and all that jazz (based on our previous interactions), I'd end things with my bf and then pursue you. Three weeks ago, she just had the life that she had. Now, it's all different. Again, I'm not going to judge her too harshly. What I see is that she didn't tell you she has a boyfriend and, odds are, she has not told her boyfriend about you. No matter what's different about her life, it strikes me that she is playing both ends against the middle. She's not being fair to either you or her bf. 1
Standard-Fare Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 I don't have a great sense of how legitimately "close" you were in the past. Getting the vibe that you were certainly friendly, had some sexual tension, etc., but never really that tight. NOT getting the sense that you two were "star-crossed lovers" who never had your chance to connect, and have been pining for each other since. It sounds like both of you just went your own way. I'm also guessing that either one of you could have initiated this reunion a lot sooner if you'd wanted to. I'm saying this because you might be giving yourself far too much credit to assume that you're this major curveball in her life that's throwing everything off balance. Sure, you may be stirring up some new questions and doubts, but don't immediately assume you're going to be a big game-changer for her. I think you gotta keep a (friendly) distance here. 2
Author RonaldS Posted March 24, 2014 Author Posted March 24, 2014 I don't have a great sense of how legitimately "close" you were in the past. Getting the vibe that you were certainly friendly, had some sexual tension, etc., but never really that tight. NOT getting the sense that you two were "star-crossed lovers" who never had your chance to connect, and have been pining for each other since. It sounds like both of you just went your own way. I'm also guessing that either one of you could have initiated this reunion a lot sooner if you'd wanted to. I'm saying this because you might be giving yourself far too much credit to assume that you're this major curveball in her life that's throwing everything off balance. Sure, you may be stirring up some new questions and doubts, but don't immediately assume you're going to be a big game-changer for her. I think you gotta keep a (friendly) distance here. Don't get me wrong. I'm not building this into some big destiny thing or anything like that. I only barely believe in 'true love' and all of that hokey, romantic jazz. That being said, I do believe in certain people fitting together well, and sometimes really well. And that good things can come from that. Our lives were fairly tightly entwined for a long time. She was really good friends with my Xw's brother, who was essentially my brother. Then, my BiL met a woman who hated this girl, they got married and then this girl was pushed out for good. That was when we 'stopped' being friends. My XW would have had a sh*t fit had I contacted her for any reason (she was very threatened by her, I think). So, that's how it all ended. She never contacted me because as far as she knew, I was still married (she had no idea I was divorced when we met up). I thought about contacting her dozens of times since my XW and I separated almost 4 years ago, but I never did. It's just one of those things: not a huge deal, but not insignificant either. We resolved to just be friends yesterday, although it seems as if a lot of doors were explicitly left open. I'm not going to pursue anything, but I'm not yet going to just write it off. That's why I'm reserving judgement and giving a lot of slack in this instance, because it is far more complicated than if it were the same framework between two people that just met each other. Great connections are so rare.
Trimmer Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 I'm going to hold off any judgement for now and just see what happens. I mean, you can say it's sh*tty of her to even consider, but put yourself in her shoes. A little over 3 weeks ago, I wasn't in her life in any capacity other than as a very distant memory. All of a sudden, BOOM. Now a person comes back into your life that you looked at a certain way, that you always liked and connected with, who you understood and who understood you when few others did, but there were always barriers in the way....all of a sudden, that person is back without barriers. And then you get together and things fit like a glove. Ahhh, are you saying that boyfriend ≠ barrier?
Recommended Posts