Women- what is your take on reunion with an old friend?

[RonaldS]

Yes its very possible the ambivalence is yours, not hers.

 

Sounds like you two had a great time and someone you've known for a while and are so attracted to, those are a lot of pluses. Hope you pick up the phone and are able to connect.

 

Hmmmm....I don't know. I mean, I did say (while we were talking on the phone), 'Hey, let me know if you want to get together and watch the game tomorrow'. Now, she had told me that she had to work for a while in the morning and didn't know what time she would be done, and the game started in the early afternoon. So, it wasn't like a firm plan could be made. Then I sent her a text a little while before the game and asked if she had plans for the game, and she said she's going over to her cousin's to watch it. Then, she texted me Sunday morning with some YouTube thing, and then we went back and forth for awhile, and that's been it.

 

Maybe she has a boyfriend. She was complaining about anxiety earlier in the week. Maybe she feels guilty.

 

Didn't hear from her today, and don't know if hawking her is going to help.

[Chocolat]

Should I even bring up something along the lines of 'Look, we had a really nice moment, but we've been friends for a long time, and I truly value your friendship, so I don't want to put you into a position you're uncomfortable with. At the same time, I really liked....blah blah blah'?

 

 

Ugh - NO!!

 

Why are you making this so complicated? Ask her out or don't. From my vantage point, she's given you signs of interest. So you can either analyse it to death and let the window of opportunity close, or you can ask her out on a proper date. The worst that can happen is that she says no.

[RonaldS]

Ugh - NO!!

 

Why are you making this so complicated? Ask her out or don't. From my vantage point, she's given you signs of interest. So you can either analyse it to death and let the window of opportunity close, or you can ask her out on a proper date. The worst that can happen is that she says no.

 

Haha, yes....you're right. I know that.

 

I'm sure this situation makes me look like a total dating noob, but that's not the case. I've always been really good at that game and have always played on my terms. It's much easier with somebody you just meet and have an attraction for because, no matter how hot they are and how awesome they are and how much you like them, deep down you really don't give a crap about them.

 

This is a little different. Not really sure how.

 

Part of it, I think, is really knowing this person. That means that while I adore all if these great things about her, I also know her and know a lot of the not-so-great stuff too. I know how she is, and I know that sometimes she's not....ummmm....reliable. And her flightiness post hanging out is consistent with what I already know her to be. She's kinda high-risk. She's only known me as a guy committed to a relationship, but she also knows some other sides of me as well. That's the problem with having a history. And it all happened very fast, so it's a little confusing as well.

 

Here's the exchange that happened that maybe sheds the most light on where both of us stand: after kissing the first time, I looked at her and said 'You're trouble'. She looked at me and replied, 'No...you're trouble'.

[Chocolat]

Ok, you know her so you have reason to believe she is flighty. All I can say is that, based on what you posted in your OP, you are coming across as disinterested. Which, from what you've just written above, may be the case. But if you ARE interested, then act. Because each day you don't act is another day in which she's going through the same mental gyrations you are.

 

For the record, I see this as YOU being flighty, or wishy-washy, not her:

 

Anyway, since then, she has been real flighty. Not texting that much anymore, but then she called me a few days later (I missed the call). A little bit of texting back and forth, and then she called again on Friday and we talked....mainly about her job, nothing serious, etc. Offered to meet up with her to watch a basketball game (we both went to the same university, and we used to watch games together way back when), and then she said 'Ok', but then we never got together. Then, during the next game the next day, we texted each other a bunch during the game. No other plans to meet up have been made.

 

So she texted some, called TWICE, was open to a get together and you... failed to launch.

 

If I were her, I would assume you were not interested and I would not be contacting you at this point.

[RonaldS]

Ok, you know her so you have reason to believe she is flighty. All I can say is that, based on what you posted in your OP, you are coming across as disinterested. Which, from what you've just written above, may be the case. But if you ARE interested, then act. Because each day you don't act is another day in which she's going through the same mental gyrations you are.

 

For the record, I see this as YOU being flighty, or wishy-washy, not her:

 

 

 

So she texted some, called TWICE, was open to a get together and you... failed to launch.

 

If I were her, I would assume you were not interested and I would not be contacting you at this point.

 

Not quite on the part about the game.

 

She had to work until and undetermined time on Saturday morning, and the game was in the early afternoon. I then contacted her an hour or so before the game and asked her what had planned for it, and she said she was going to a friend's to watch it.

 

We've talked on the phone, we've chatted through text, I've lightly flirted with her through those messages, I've tried to get together with her. I don't think I've failed to launch.

 

My perception is that she's backed away for whatever reasons (see the above post where she states that she thinks I'm trouble), but likes the attention or wants something (who knows what?). It seems like she's sort of at odds with something on her end. I've been consistent, I think, in showing interest.

[Chocolat]

Not quite on the part about the game.

 

She had to work until and undetermined time on Saturday morning, and the game was in the early afternoon. I then contacted her an hour or so before the game and asked her what had planned for it, and she said she was going to a friend's to watch it.

 

Ok.

 

 

We've talked on the phone, we've chatted through text, I've lightly flirted with her through those messages, I've tried to get together with her. I don't think I've failed to launch.

 

By "launch," I mean: clearly and unambiguously ask her out. Perhaps you don't want to, which is fine. But if you do want to, why not just go for it?

 

 

My perception is that she's backed away for whatever reasons (see the above post where she states that she thinks I'm trouble), but likes the attention or wants something (who knows what?). It seems like she's sort of at odds with something on her end. I've been consistent, I think, in showing interest.

 

 

The bit where she says you're trouble could mean a lot of things, depending on how it was said. It could mean she is attracted to you and is flirting a bit.

 

I don't read that she's backed off, but I'm not there.

 

It still seems to me that you have two choices: ask her out or don't. I think it's highly unlikely that things will ramp up via text at this point. If I were her, I'd be looking to you for some sign that you wanted to see me again.

[RonaldS]

Ok.

 

 

 

By "launch," I mean: clearly and unambiguously ask her out. Perhaps you don't want to, which is fine. But if you do want to, why not just go for it?

 

 

 

 

The bit where she says you're trouble could mean a lot of things, depending on how it was said. It could mean she is attracted to you and is flirting a bit.

 

I don't read that she's backed off, but I'm not there.

 

It still seems to me that you have two choices: ask her out or don't. I think it's highly unlikely that things will ramp up via text at this point. If I were her, I'd be looking to you for some sign that you wanted to see me again.

 

I told her she was trouble first, and my implication was that she was a girl who could get me to drop my rational ways and do stupid things, make bad decisions and put myself in bad spots, willingly, for the pleasure of sharing moments with her. And I said it in a flirty 'thinking out loud' sort of way.

 

Then she fired back with 'No, you're trouble', which inferred to mean the same thing but maybe even worse.

 

Sort of the 'I don't know how deep this pool is, but I'm going to dive in anyway' view of another person.

[Standard-Fare]

Man, I checked back in here but I shouldn't have. You're honestly making me want to pull my hair out.

 

ASK HER OUT AGAIN. RIGHT NOW.

 

You had a positive reconnection that confirmed mutual physical attraction. Then YOU blew it with that game thing by waiting until an hour before the event to check in. Of COURSE she'd made other plans -- she had no other option if she genuinely wanted to see the game. Do you think she wants to sit around waiting on your a** to call?

 

And now you're just vacillating and overthinking and self-doubting. From her viewpoint, it could easily look like YOU'RE the one pulling back. Because you are!

 

You have nothing to lose here. Don't fool yourself -- you weren't even really friends before this meetup. You were basically strangers with shared memories. And you never WILL be friends, because you're both busy grown adults and that's just not how things work.

 

So ASK HER OUT AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS.

[RonaldS]

Alright. I'm on it.

[Trimmer]

Hmmmm....I don't know. I mean, I did say (while we were talking on the phone), 'Hey, let me know if you want to get together and watch the game tomorrow'.

Any time you use "let me know if..." you are loading a conditional ("if") with an expectation that she doesn't need to take action ("Let me know...")

 

There are two increments by which you can make that request stronger and more definite.

 

"Do you want to get together tomorrow for the game?" It still makes it conditional - i.e. providing for the possibility that her answer might be "No", but it expects her to take some action and answer immediately, instead of giving her permission to do nothing. And if she does answer "yes", then she's effectively committing to a course of action.

 

Then the other increment:

"Let's get together tomorrow." This can be a little brash, but depending on the situation, that can be good. She can still always say "No thanks" or "I can't", but do you see how this formulation doesn't incorporate permission or an assumption that she will say "no"?

 

Either way, I think you can afford to be more forward. "Let me know if..." is something a high-school kid writes in a note to a crush, obviously shielding himself from the rejection that he expects is forthcoming. It invites inaction. Be more certain. She can still say no, but at least you tried, which is not really how I would describe your current status...

[RonaldS]

Any time you use "let me know if..." you are loading a conditional ("if") with an expectation that she doesn't need to take action ("Let me know...")

 

There are two increments by which you can make that request stronger and more definite.

 

"Do you want to get together tomorrow for the game?" It still makes it conditional - i.e. providing for the possibility that her answer might be "No", but it expects her to take some action and answer immediately, instead of giving her permission to do nothing. And if she does answer "yes", then she's effectively committing to a course of action.

 

Then the other increment:

"Let's get together tomorrow." This can be a little brash, but depending on the situation, that can be good. She can still always say "No thanks" or "I can't", but do you see how this formulation doesn't incorporate permission or an assumption that she will say "no"?

 

Either way, I think you can afford to be more forward. "Let me know if..." is something a high-school kid writes in a note to a crush, obviously shielding himself from the rejection that he expects is forthcoming. It invites inaction. Be more certain. She can still say no, but at least you tried, which is not really how I would describe your current status...

Very good points, and I often don't think of it that way.

 

To be honest, I'm very lucky when it comes to women and I usually play the oblivious/ambivalent card well so that the women always end up making everything happen. And why not? Why should the girls always get to have all the fun? So, I would always end up with, at the very least, a woman sending me a message saying 'So, I keep thinking maybe it would be a good idea for you to ask me out again', or something along those lines.

 

But I know this girl is going to be a challenge. She's too much like me. She's not going to beg.

[RonaldS]

Here's what I'll do:

 

We haven't texted each other since early Monday. The appropriate amount of intrigue and tension has been achieved. Tonight, I'm just going to call her and tell her that I'm going to take her to dinner. Not going to text her and ask her out. Not going to text her and ask if I can call her.

 

Just calling and being real and telling her I want to see her again. This is weird...I've never done this before, haha.

[RonaldS]

So....

 

Called her and got her voicemail. Left a message. She texted a little while later thanking me for the message and saying she's been busy with work. Nothing since.

[RonaldS]

Sooooo....ummmm....

 

At what point do I just drop this? The silence from her is deafening.

[Standard-Fare]

What did you say in your message? What did she say in her text?

[RonaldS]

What did you say in your message? What did she say in her text?

 

Made a joking comment and then hoped she was doing ok and then said to call me back.

 

She texted back 'Hey...thanks for the message...I'm all good...just busy with work'. I followed up with 'Sucks that you're so busy. Let me know when you have time to chat and I will give you a call'. No reply.

 

That was yesterday evening. Nothing since. Done?

[ascendotum]

Made a joking comment and then hoped she was doing ok and then said to call me back.

 

She texted back 'Hey...thanks for the message...I'm all good...just busy with work'. I followed up with 'Sucks that you're so busy. Let me know when you have time to chat and I will give you a call'. No reply.

 

That was yesterday evening. Nothing since. Done?

 

I gather then that you didn't say this like you planned : "I'm just going to call her and tell her that I'm going to take her to dinner."

It sucks that you got her voicemail and I guess not speaking to her in person threw your plans for being more decisive on her, and then she got the communication back onto texting. I get the impression that after that last round of chatting that she still does not realize you want to ask her out on a date.....not that her replies so far give you a good 'in' to jump on. I'd wait for the following week and then call again (but maybe send her some txts about anything interesting/funny that happened to you during your day in the meantime), and ask if she is still busy because you want to see her again and take her out. If you get the 'I'm still really busy' response with no indication of when she might be able to see you then I would go with your original thoughts that she got weirded out following that night with you. Certainly seemed like she has feelings for you from that night though.

[quidproquo89]

I'd definitely try again to arrange a firm-set date soon. Make sure she knows your interested and as you already (surely) know - without sounding too desperate.

 

 

I really hope this works out matey, let us know.

 

 

I'd be decisive with yourself, play things in person as you have been. In person I think everything is great its the gaps that you may be over-analysing things.

 

 

Don't get me wrong you come across as a very intelligent and experienced bloke, but I'd just go for it with her.

 

 

If it doesn't work, keep friendly I'm sure with all your history is wouldn't damage a friendship. I'd go for relationship first though, because you may regret when the time and window has past that you didn't go for it.

 

 

Hope it works out the way you want

[RonaldS]

I gather then that you didn't say this like you planned : "I'm just going to call her and tell her that I'm going to take her to dinner."

It sucks that you got her voicemail and I guess not speaking to her in person threw your plans for being more decisive on her, and then she got the communication back onto texting. I get the impression that after that last round of chatting that she still does not realize you want to ask her out on a date.....not that her replies so far give you a good 'in' to jump on. I'd wait for the following week and then call again (but maybe send her some txts about anything interesting/funny that happened to you during your day in the meantime), and ask if she is still busy because you want to see her again and take her out. If you get the 'I'm still really busy' response with no indication of when she might be able to see you then I would go with your original thoughts that she got weirded out following that night with you. Certainly seemed like she has feelings for you from that night though.

Yeah, I wasn't going to ask her out via voicemail, but I wanted to convey interest. That's why I was kinda like 'ugh' when she so generically replied via text and then didn't respond to my reply to her, as well as no replies today.

 

I thought she was pretty into me, not only the night we hung out, but she was pretty communicative for that whole following week. But the way she was hugging me, holding me, etc...there seemed to be some feelings there that weren't exactly new.

 

Also, her school's spring break starts next Friday, so she might really be busy prepping for that. So, maybe she is really busy.

 

But it's hard to shake the feeling that she's now trying to send a message by not communicating. I would just hope that because we were friends that she would tell me if there was a problem and not just ice me out. Sigh.

[RonaldS]

While we were talking over wine, she did ask me, in a playfully suspiscious manner, why I decided to get in touch with her out of the blue after all those years. I jokingly played it off.

 

Do you guys think that by me walking her home, and then not following up with asking her out again, she might think that I was just trying to hook up with her? Admittedly, my own communication with her dwindled after we met up? She said she was talking to her friends about me before we met up....so chances are good she talked to them afterward.

 

Any chance that the consensus was that I was just going for the hook-up and lost interest when it didn't happen?

[Standard-Fare]

It sounds to me like she's pretty flakey and also, just like you, probably doesn't know what she wants from this. So, like you, she's not just diving in headfirst.

 

That doesn't mean you should stop trying, because I don't think she's given any clear signals of: "Back off, I don't want to see you."

 

You had the right idea with calling rather than texting. If she doesn't get back to you within a few days, try that again. As others said, now is the time to propose a very specific plan -- not "let's chat," etc. Ask her out somewhere specific, on a specific night. "Hey, I've been wanting to try out [this bar/restaurant close to her neighborhood]... do you want to go for that on Thursday night?"

 

If she doesn't pick up the phone, propose that through voicemail.

 

And yes, if she is flakey and aloof after THAT, then you should back off a bit and let her be her weird self. My guess is if that happens you guys would still end up hanging out at some point, it just might not have any clear "romantic" intent. I don't think any of this sounds like she doesn't want you in her life.

[GemmaUK]

I just think she isn't interested in dating you.

 

I think she agreed to meet out of curiosity, she hadn't seen you for years.

 

A couple of glasses of wine is quite a lot of wine!

Women have a lower tolerance to alcohol than men do don't forget.

 

Kisses can also be out of curiosity - just to see what it's like. I've certainly done that in the past.

The hug could have been that she couldn't fit comfortably without doing that.

 

Two things stick out to me - she is not communicating very much - if I missed a call and really like someone I will call them back but if I am not keen I would send a text - ust as she did.

 

The other thing that struck me was 'No, you're trouble'.

You say you remember things from her past, good and not so good.

I think she is remembering things from your past also, good and not so good.

 

She might be OK to continue being friends but I don't think she wants to date you.

[RonaldS]

I just think she isn't interested in dating you.

 

I think she agreed to meet out of curiosity, she hadn't seen you for years.

 

A couple of glasses of wine is quite a lot of wine!

Women have a lower tolerance to alcohol than men do don't forget.

 

Kisses can also be out of curiosity - just to see what it's like. I've certainly done that in the past.

The hug could have been that she couldn't fit comfortably without doing that.

 

Two things stick out to me - she is not communicating very much - if I missed a call and really like someone I will call them back but if I am not keen I would send a text - ust as she did.

 

The other thing that struck me was 'No, you're trouble'.

You say you remember things from her past, good and not so good.

I think she is remembering things from your past also, good and not so good.

 

She might be OK to continue being friends but I don't think she wants to date you.

 

I tend to agree with most of this. While she was communicating a lot the week after (called me twice, constant texts), after this last weekend, it just shut down. The text thanking me for calling and leaving a message pretty much sealed it, I think.

 

I just wonder why that's not something we can't have a talk about. It's not like we aren't friends. Why leave it wide open and not just say, 'thanks but no thanks'?

[RonaldS]

Oh, the thing I didn't agree with was the hug.

 

You can tell everything from how a person hugs. It's a way of communicating. Where arms are positioned, how close, how tight, and most importantly, how long.

 

We had two really long hugs (like 30+ seconds) at the end of the night. We were tight up against each other, and she was hugging tightly with her face in my chest and head under my chin. That's a pretty intimate hug. As I pointed out earlier, that's how my XW used to hug me. So, in other words, not lightly.

 

So many mixed signals.

[GemmaUK]

I tend to agree with most of this. While she was communicating a lot the week after (called me twice, constant texts), after this last weekend, it just shut down. The text thanking me for calling and leaving a message pretty much sealed it, I think.

 

I just wonder why that's not something we can't have a talk about. It's not like we aren't friends. Why leave it wide open and not just say, 'thanks but no thanks'?

 

Why can't you have a talk about it?

What is stopping you?