Daisy2013 Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 Won't repeat back story, it's on here. We've remained friends after our 2 1/2 year A and I'm fine with that. I've accepted it. He was my friend 10 years prior. He asked me to meet with him yesterday again so I did. He asked me why did I love him and what made me wait for him for 2 years, previously. I told him. He told me loved me and was in love with me. He says he thinks about me and is miserable. He wants to be with me, but is afraid he will look like a loser filing for a D (would be his 3rd). He's afraid of conflict. I told him I did love him and so much so that I wanted him to be happy and at peace with his W, if that is what he wanted. He said even with my W? I said yes. He grabbed me and said "I love you and I want you." I asked him if he loved her. (We talk openly and honestly because it's what we are and part of our intimacy he doesn't have at home. She is hard and cold and isn't intimate. I know this because I know her, generally.). He answered "I wish her no harm, that's how I feel." And again "I love you." He told his wife he's unhappy and didn't want to fight. I won't go into their R here. She told him we make people think things about us because we talk. He told her we were friends and that he'd known me almost as long as her. He doesn't want sex from me. He doesn't get it at home, that is one of his gripes. He says my friendship and the intimacy we had is much more valuable and important than sex. He laid his head on my shoulder, closed his eyes, and just stayed there. In sum, says he loves me and is in love with me. Has loved me before he hit on me from just knowing me. Fell in love later. Is adamant he is not D. He said he made this mistake and will have to pay for it. I told him I understood we'd never be together and accepted it. He asked why and how could I be his friend knowing that. Then he said he didn't know what our future held, but he felt more optimistic than me about us. He then asked me to take a ride with him on an errand whIch he has never done. Always afraid someone would see us. We always me in a single location. Next week he wants to meet for lunch as we work close by. Something else he's never done. He talked about it the 2 years we were together, but never acted. Now he says he will call me Monday to set a day. What is going on? If he doesn't want to D, why is he wanting me? He flat out said he wanted me in an R but stay M. He said he wants a real R with me, but asked me to just let him work on things. Back to the he's not D thing. I must be crazy? I'm continuing on as I have been. He says he misses me more when he keeps telling himself he has to stay M. Mathis morning he calls me (very rare on a weekend) to tell me about the talk with his W, that he wants me to still be his friend and lunch and lover, if I wanted him. What is going on with him??
MuddyRock Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 Pretty easy. He is cake eating. Its never going to stop as long as you are friends. If you both really and truly love each other SELFLESSLY you will go no contact. You both are still friends for selfish reasons as it does the other no good. His wife is cold because she senses he isn't all in the relationship. Even before you became affair partners he admitted to feelings for you. He wasn't all in and women know it. If you really care for him you will either go NC and push him into MC with her, or simply tell her that you are affair partners. That should make everything fall into place. 3
gettingstronger Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 Your last line tells it all, he wants to be your friend and lunch lover if you want, my guess is if you don't he will find someone that will. How nice for him that he can clearly tell you he will not divorce, freeing himself to continue an A with you with no expectations. It doesn't matter how or why he got himself in the position he has, the fact is he is unwilling to change it. You can continue to play by his rules or not, it's up to you. The fact remains he will stay married, what you decide to do is up to you.
jwi71 Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 Won't repeat back story, it's on here. We've remained friends after our 2 1/2 year A and I'm fine with that. I've accepted it. He was my friend 10 years prior. He asked me to meet with him yesterday again so I did. He asked me why did I love him and what made me wait for him for 2 years, previously. I told him. He told me loved me and was in love with me. He says he thinks about me and is miserable. He wants to be with me, but is afraid he will look like a loser filing for a D (would be his 3rd). He's afraid of conflict. I told him I did love him and so much so that I wanted him to be happy and at peace with his W, if that is what he wanted. He said even with my W? I said yes. He grabbed me and said "I love you and I want you." I asked him if he loved her. (We talk openly and honestly because it's what we are and part of our intimacy he doesn't have at home. She is hard and cold and isn't intimate. I know this because I know her, generally.). He answered "I wish her no harm, that's how I feel." And again "I love you." He told his wife he's unhappy and didn't want to fight. I won't go into their R here. She told him we make people think things about us because we talk. He told her we were friends and that he'd known me almost as long as her. He doesn't want sex from me. He doesn't get it at home, that is one of his gripes. He says my friendship and the intimacy we had is much more valuable and important than sex. He laid his head on my shoulder, closed his eyes, and just stayed there. In sum, says he loves me and is in love with me. Has loved me before he hit on me from just knowing me. Fell in love later. Is adamant he is not D. He said he made this mistake and will have to pay for it. I told him I understood we'd never be together and accepted it. He asked why and how could I be his friend knowing that. Then he said he didn't know what our future held, but he felt more optimistic than me about us. He then asked me to take a ride with him on an errand whIch he has never done. Always afraid someone would see us. We always me in a single location. Next week he wants to meet for lunch as we work close by. Something else he's never done. He talked about it the 2 years we were together, but never acted. Now he says he will call me Monday to set a day. What is going on? If he doesn't want to D, why is he wanting me? He flat out said he wanted me in an R but stay M. He said he wants a real R with me, but asked me to just let him work on things. Back to the he's not D thing. I must be crazy? I'm continuing on as I have been. He says he misses me more when he keeps telling himself he has to stay M. Mathis morning he calls me (very rare on a weekend) to tell me about the talk with his W, that he wants me to still be his friend and lunch and lover, if I wanted him. What is going on with him?? He's a conflict avoider being a conflict avoider. He may D his W. Maybe not. Who cares. He's a wreck at this point who will serve to bring you down. He's already succeeding...look where he is in your mind...are these happy thoughts he brings...or anxiety and stress and confusion? And are you M? It kind of sounds like you are. If so, he wants you part time but stay M to your H. If so...what an azzhole. He is basically saying...let me cry on your shoulder, commiserate a bit...maybe have some sex...then leave. Go back to your H until I call again. Really? An on demand, yet part time, therapist, friend and lover - all the good stuff with none of the "Bad" (I refer to the ups and downs all R's endure). And, if you aren't M...even worse! Come when I call then leave when I'm done. Blech. He's a grown man...been D a couple times already - he knows the drill. Which is maybe why he wants you there to cushion the blow. Respect. If you don't have any for yourself why should anyone else? I'd walk from this, to use his words, loser.
beach Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 He didn't say he would divorce. He's a conflict avoider, after all - they don't generally INITIATE divorce. They do stay married but complain about who they are with. Always someone else's fault... But really it's on them because they don't face the conflict head on and state what new action they will take. A victim of his own inability to change what he can...yep. Expects you to stand by idly and watch him change nothing, thinking that is good enough? That seems crazy.
wanting more Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 He's twice divorced already. But still married for a 3rd time. He dealt with the conflict the first 2 wives why not this one? And even if he did divorce her, would you really want to be #4???
2sunny Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 He wants to continue using you - and you seem resolved to allow itto continue. I wouldn't ask what's going on with him - that's obvious - what's going on with you? Don't you expect more FOR YOURSELF?
verity123 Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 I have a similar situation, think it is a process. He is scared of making more mistakes and understandably so athough he has only been married once. My MM has been married more than he has been unmarried. He is a coward. 2 d days. The situation has driven us both mad. he has started to act a bit crazy. He loves me but continues to fence sit. Maybe always will. he wants to see me and that's it. Nothing more nothing less. No sex for weeks....... just intimacy. Everyone needs that. I think he will only divorce when his bs wakes up
yellowmaverick Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 What is going on? Hmmmm....three marriages to three "horrible" wives....one common denominator....HIM. Are you really having trouble seeing the problem?? 4
Author Daisy2013 Posted March 15, 2014 Author Posted March 15, 2014 Thank you all for replying, I am at a loss and need to think through things. I will try to respond to some questions here in order not to make a lot of quote trees. He is afraid of D because he says it would be another personal failure. As well, in his 2nd, he lost everything and she put him through the ringer. He said she was emotionally abusive to him. They had 3 kids, now grown, and he wants them to see commitment, not another D. I suspect it's because his ex is remarried and doing well and he'd feel like a marriage failure again. He and this W have no kids, just each their own. She doesn't work so would make out well. He is also 58 to my 47, so probably at this stage of life, doesn't want the conflict. He hates conflict and I can see he is an avoider just through conversation through the years. He gripes about much, but changes nothing. He says women seem not to like him once he married them. Yes, I'm M, but how much longer, I don't know. I've spent 16 years waiting for my H to be initiate with me, talk to me, love me, make me a part of his importance. He has always done his thing, telling me I'm free to to live my own life. I'm lonely. I haven't D yet because I have one more that needs to graduate HS next year. I tried to talk to him about "us," but he got angry. He drinks all of the time and spends all of his time with his family. We talk of D and he will do whatever I want, he doesn't care. So 2 1/2 years ago, I found my own thing, and it was like no other. It filled my mind, soul, heart and body. I never knew or understood what it was all about, and why people enjoyed physical intimacy. I never liked sex. I do now. I guess I take breadcrumbs because I love him. I've told him I will end our friendship and walk away if he wants and he gets upset and says "no." Self respect? I need to go find it. I thought I was doing good by telling him I'm. It expecting anything and acting as if it doesn't matter. Something that sticks out. In a conversation, I mentioned something about "spoiling a woman." He said a woman should never be spoiled. I asked him yesterday if he truly believed that, and he replied "yes." I have begun working out and finding hobbies to better myself. I need to better my brain and grown some strength. I guess my fear is being alone. I don't want to be a "cat lady" all alone in my older years!
MuddyRock Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 He says he doesn't want your friendship to end, of course. You have to do it FOR him if you love him selflessly. Its like a child that wants cookies for dinner. Tastes good now but you know it isn't in his best interest long term. He can never be happy with his wife while you are there at all in any aspect. If You love him you want him to be happy. He is happy in his marriage that's why he doesn't leave, he doesn't even have any kids with her. He is conflicted with you around. Set him free so he can be happy with his wife 100% Im wondering if his marriages may have failed due to infidelity. That's usually why women take them to the cleaners. Oh and your husband says those things, to find your own life. Then no reason to lie to him. Be honest with him too.
beach Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 He is afraid of D because he says it would be another personal failure. As well, in his 2nd, he lost everything and she put him through the ringer. He said she was emotionally abusive to him. They had 3 kids, now grown, and he wants them to see commitment, not another D. I suspect it's because his ex is remarried and doing well and he'd feel like a marriage failure again. He and this W have no kids, just each their own. She doesn't work so would make out well. Soooo, staying married and cheating is better in his mind than being divorced feeling like a failure? To me - the cheater is the absolute failure. He fails by staying married and not being a loving, respectful husband. He fails by solving his issues by betraying his spouse. Sounds like you've attached your feelings to a man (?) that fails every time at his commitment to his marriages. The common denominator in his history is himself. Choose better than him.
Author Daisy2013 Posted March 15, 2014 Author Posted March 15, 2014 He says he doesn't want your friendship to end, of course. You have to do it FOR him if you love him selflessly. Its like a child that wants cookies for dinner. Tastes good now but you know it isn't in his best interest long term. He can never be happy with his wife while you are there at all in any aspect. If You love him you want him to be happy. He is happy in his marriage that's why he doesn't leave, he doesn't even have any kids with her. He is conflicted with you around. Set him free so he can be happy with his wife 100% Im wondering if his marriages may have failed due to infidelity. That's usually why women take them to the cleaners. Oh and your husband says those things, to find your own life. Then no reason to lie to him. Be honest with him too. Yes, there was infidelity in that M, but I think after things fell apart. I don't really know much, he just speaks very ugly about her. I remember terse ago when he was fighting out child support in the court with her. I do think he loves his W and wants intimacy with her. He says she's never been that way, and he made a mistake marrying her. He said her brothers tried to warn him of how she is, but he didn't listen. He needed a place to live, she had a home; he was living with his father and his father said he needed to move out. I think he loves her, but that it was convenience too. She needed a paycheck brought home. They've been M 11 years. She's mean and controlling. I've seen her in action and she scares me. If he wants that, so be it I told him. Re telling my H. I thought about it, but then he'd just laugh at me for picking an unavailable man, then run to his family. I have none here.
Author Daisy2013 Posted March 15, 2014 Author Posted March 15, 2014 Also, maybe he just does want to be friends and I'm thinking too much. Last weekend he asked me to meet him someplace he was going to be with his sons and father and then he could run into me accidentally there. We would have been doing an activity. But plans fell through because one son had to work. He's never asked me to meet him anywhere near anyone before. Maybe he just wants to be friends and is trying to be one if I say no to the rest of it. Men are simple, he's told me his thoughts, and I'm over-thinking. This morning he was running errands and just wanted to drive by on his way and say hi.
RickFox Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 Sorry, if he was your "friend", he wouldn't be doing this to you. And telling you he doesn't want sex, pffft, pure player.
MuddyRock Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 Well, maybe you should tell his wife then. Afterall most infidelity results in hyperbonding. Then he will get his intimacy and a chance for her to see just how bad she let things get. My bet is that the wife has to be that way because its the only interaction he responds to. He seems like an overgrown baby. She has probably had to take on a more mother like role with him because he wont do anything for himself. In turn she probably resents the hell out of him. Who would want to sleep with a husband like that?
beach Posted March 16, 2014 Posted March 16, 2014 You know exactly what's going on with him. He's cheating. He complains yet changes nothing. You don't expect much - so it's a perfect match. 2
Ruffian1 Posted March 16, 2014 Posted March 16, 2014 And telling you he doesn't want sex, pffft, pure player. Yep, what Rickfox said. He is grooming you, to be his side dish. And it seems to be working. I bet he has this down to a routine. Will you be ok being his side piece because he lOVES you so much? Think long and hard about what you are doing with this guy.
Author Daisy2013 Posted March 16, 2014 Author Posted March 16, 2014 Thanks again everyone. It was a sleepless night. It seems I'm in a M where I've waited for affection and attention and never seemed important to him. It seems this R is the same way. I love you, but I don't want you. It's time to get some help and find out why I fight to keep the emotionally unavailable. While I'm not innocent in this and accept my blame and fault, I find myself in great pain realizing my friend knows what's is happening in my M, knows I'm vulnerable and want to give and receive love, yet is playing this game with me. I don't think a friend would do this to me. He would love me as a friend and support me without the emotional games he knows is killing me. He says he wishes he could just run away from everything because it would be easier. I feel like packing up and running away.
2sunny Posted March 16, 2014 Posted March 16, 2014 Thanks again everyone. It was a sleepless night. It seems I'm in a M where I've waited for affection and attention and never seemed important to him. It seems this R is the same way. I love you, but I don't want you. It's time to get some help and find out why I fight to keep the emotionally unavailable. While I'm not innocent in this and accept my blame and fault, I find myself in great pain realizing my friend knows what's is happening in my M, knows I'm vulnerable and want to give and receive love, yet is playing this game with me. I don't think a friend would do this to me. He would love me as a friend and support me without the emotional games he knows is killing me. He says he wishes he could just run away from everything because it would be easier. I feel like packing up and running away. Read this again. You need x y and z. You don't get it from your H, yet you've stayed. Then you look for it from another unavailable man knowing he doesn't offer what you think you need. Yet you wonder why things aren't working out? These men aren't to blame. You're looking for something that's not there.
Author Daisy2013 Posted March 16, 2014 Author Posted March 16, 2014 Read this again. You need x y and z. You don't get it from your H, yet you've stayed. Then you look for it from another unavailable man knowing he doesn't offer what you think you need. Yet you wonder why things aren't working out? These men aren't to blame. You're looking for something that's not there. Yes, I understand. I need to figure out why I do this, thank you.
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