I feel sexy, secure and powerful - until I like someone

[moodswingz]

I've been single the past few months and dating after what I would call about a year and a half of drama. I got out of a very toxic 4-5 year relationship and then it was back and forth for another year and a half of more drama trying to "work it out." That ended for good a few months ago. I took a bit of time off and then decided to try online dating to put myself out there.

 

Over the past few months I've gone on a lot of dates. Sometimes it gets old but for the most part I was just enjoying getting out and meeting new people after basically being on lockdown in a controlling relationship before, having no social life, etc.

 

Here's the thing though. When I'm single and dating, I am so confident. I feel alive, sexy, powerful. I also keep people at arm's length. Recently I met someone that made it past the first date, to date 7 or 8, we hung out two weekends in a row (every day of the weekend) - kind of a big deal for me because I have felt so drained when I think about dating someone seriously.

 

On date 8 I ended up sleeping with him. He was being super cuddly afterward and I guess it was obvious I was anxious or something afterward because he asked if I wanted him to leave. I was like yeah, I don't do sleepovers right away. I asked him the next day if he was upset about that and he said no. The next night, same thing happened. What am I, a dude? Kicking people out after sex? He wasn't happy at all and said it didn't feel great being kicked out after sex two nights in a row. Then he wouldn't respond to my texts or pick up the phone.

 

I was just kind of "whatever" at this point and let it go. But over the next week I found myself really missing this guy. I missed talking to him, he makes me laugh, we have chemistry... I was like, oh lord, I actually like this guy.

 

This past weekend (after an entire week) I texted him thinking I wouldn't hear back and amazingly, he texted me back and agreed to meet. We talked a lot about me keeping my distance because he is very hard to read (kind of sarcastic demeanor that I know is an act, but it gets annoying - when he drops it, he's amazing... but I obviously have my own act to get past as well). We ended up having an amazing, intimate (not just sex) night together. And pretty much since then, I've been freaking out. I just feel very insecure and anxious, and I don't know why this is.

 

OBVIOUSLY the guy wants more than sex if he got so upset about not being able to sleep over. Right? And obviously he likes me if he talked to me again after treating him that way. But I find myself over-analyzing all of our conversations and text messages and wondering what his deal is. Before I recognized/accepted the fact that I actually like this guy, I didn't care. Now I feel like a self-conscious mess.

 

This is probably why I just have sex with people and throw them out. It's just easier that way. But I don't want to live my life with all these walls up but I guess I'm just so afraid of being hurt again. I know I've been like this my whole life but I feel it's even worse now because of all the pain and heartbreak the past few years. With my ex, I actually opened up and let ALL my walls down... and it was a disaster.

 

I don't know how to be vulnerable without being/feeling insecure and needy and I don't know how to be secure without being cold and detached. It sucks.

 

I've pushed myself to say nice things to him and open up and maybe it's just because it's over text a lot of the time, but his responses are usually pretty short. If I say something nice and he doesn't reciprocate back I'm like, okay?? I feel like I have to drag it out of him... I would say it's because of what happened with me throwing him out, but he was like this before... that's why I was keeping my distance in the first place. Very hard to read.

 

I'm also afraid at this point that I just like a challenge and can't accept anything that is easy (my last relationship was a constant battle, but at least I knew how he felt!). I'm just so confused at this point. Dating in your 30s sucks, and this guy is 10 years older than me. Just trying to navigate each other's issues and defense mechanisms... so confusing.

[FitChick]

Sounds like you are used to drama. Stick it out with this guy and he might train you to like a peaceful, calm, contented relationship.

 

Of course, if you believe you don't deserve love and respect, you will sabotage.

[moodswingz]

Well that's what I'm worried about. But at least with my ex, I knew where he stood. He reciprocated if I said something nice, I didn't have to drag it out of him. Like just now - it's supposed to snow here and there is a risk of power outages. I texted him saying if he lost power, that he could stay at my place. Response: "Thanks!" No offer of the same to me. Isn't that weird?

 

Last night I told him that I didn't let just anybody in and he said I should, so I told him that I missed talking to him that week even though we hadn't known each other that long... his response.. "Damn right!" Not "I did too" or anything.

 

I mean how can you tell someone that you aren't always being sarcastic and that I'm taking your demeanor the wrong way, and that I should open up, but then you don't have any response when I do?

[BreakOnThrough]

You are vulnerable because of your last relationship and your self-esteem is a bit low IMO. When things are good and going well, you feel that you don't deserve it and are sunconsciencly self-sabatoging. Perhaps you need more time to work on yourself and reassess? Relationships begun with security issues and doubts due to people not addressing their past issues are likely to fail.

[oldshirt]

In the movie, "Night at the Roxbury" there's a scene where these two brothers bring these chicks home from the and the chicks are planning on going to bed with them, but these guys are still using campy opening lines on them. Eventually the gals tell them that they've already picked them up and past the openers. At which point the guys don't really know what else to say because they've never gotten past the opener stage before.

 

In a way this guy is kind of doing the same thing. He's still doing the cocky-funny and the negging and the push-pull from the pick up handbook.

 

You need to tell him he's already been to bed with you and he needs to drop the pick-up game parlor tricks and interact with you on an interpersonal level like normal human beings.

 

You are needing more personal connection and comfort for this relationship to continue not more raw masculinity or sexuality. You are attracted to him, you are just not comfortable enough with him to let your guard down yet.

 

If he can't adjust his interaction with you to be more supportive and understanding and accommodating, then it isn't going to work.

[todreaminblue]

hey,

 

 

I am into over analysis too, i like challenges....not when it comes to dating though.....because if anything a guy who is playing games....eventually makes my paranoia go into overdrive and i actually get sick....especially if i care.......drama i am not a fan of.....feeds my insecurities and the hurt part inside of me

 

 

you are scared...people who play games often are......they just dont admit it

 

 

i am pretty straight up when dating...it helps for me to be with someone who is the same....i need a strong minded guy who can see through my insecurities, my illness straight to the heart of me which holds a lot of love and loyalty

 

 

 

...do i get scared when i meet a guy like that...yep.......but i move forward....with fear, with love, with all i feel.....and i hope for the best that is all you can ever do...there are no guarantees with love or life......buses don't set out to hit people...but they do.....

 

 

 

life is too short to play with hearts...yours or someone elses...jump in the deep end and swim........its the same if you start at the shallow end of nothing.......you don't know what's under you, or in front of you when you swim in the ocean.......you still have to keep swimming......if sharks lurk......stop swimming and they still get you....the fear is there that is what gets you...the possibility, the what if......thats where you have to do the faith thing..and swim regardless of knowing...same with love ...give yourself a chance be upfront...ask him to be the same and swim away........i wish you light and love and happiness in all that you do...deb

Edited February 12, 2014 by todreaminblue

[oldshirt]

 

 

...do i get scared when i meet a guy like that...yep.......but i move forward....with fear, with love, with all i feel.....and i hope for the best that is all you can ever do...there are no guarantees with love or life......buses don't set out to hit people...but they do.....

 

 

 

 

Yes ^^^^^^^

 

 

People that are successful in life and that seem to have the world by the balls don't have any less fear, any less doubt or any less insecurity than the rest of us. They just do what needs to be done in spite of it.

 

Everyone is bold and courageous around people they don't give a $hit about cause there are no states and no risks involved.

 

Once you start making an investment then the risks and stakes start going up.

 

The problem is no risk, no reward.

[moodswingz]

In a way this guy is kind of doing the same thing. He's still doing the cocky-funny and the negging and the push-pull from the pick up handbook.

 

You need to tell him he's already been to bed with you and he needs to drop the pick-up game parlor tricks and interact with you on an interpersonal level like normal human beings.

 

You are needing more personal connection and comfort for this relationship to continue not more raw masculinity or sexuality. You are attracted to him, you are just not comfortable enough with him to let your guard down yet.

 

If he can't adjust his interaction with you to be more supportive and understanding and accommodating, then it isn't going to work.

 

Yep, this is exactly right. He has this smarmy, almost "used car salesman" demeanor about him that I could never get past. I can't stand people like this normally, but I saw some things underneath it, and they were GREAT - that's why I kept hanging out with him and trying to see past the cocky BS.

 

Unfortunately, he can't drop the smarmy act and everything that comes out of his mouth seems so insincere. I'm very sensitive to phony people, and I don't trust them and never will. He swears I'm the ONLY person who has ever told him that, and I'm like... are you kidding? It's just so over the top and he doesn't seem like a genuine person at all. I'm pretty sure it's a defense mechanism but at the same time, you need to drop it and get real at some point.

 

I tried to talk to him about it and tell him that I needed some reciprocation and basically for him to act like a human being. He started getting worse and worse making ***hole comments like "Do you really want things to be easy" and "I think you like the challenge" and then he accused me of wanting to be "chased". I said no, I don't want to be chased, but I do want to know where I stand - whether you even like me or not, because everything that comes out of your mouth sounds so smug and fake. He said I was looking for too much too soon. Uh, I wasn't looking for a commitment, I was looking to know if you even like me in the first place. After a month, I don't think that is insane. Normally I can tell - with him I had no idea WHAT his deal was because of his cocky sarcastic BS.

 

His response was, "I don't chase women. I'm too cool for that."

 

Okay, douchebag. This is the same person who told me that his wife left him for another man and that he is constantly rejected by women. Before me, he hadn't had sex in almost a year.

 

WONDER WHY!

 

I need to stop doubting my instincts. I told him we were in different places and I actually wanted to have a healthy relationship in the future and was done playing stupid mind games. The end. Don't have the time or energy for this sh*t.

Edited February 14, 2014 by moodswingz

[oldshirt]

He might show up on your doorstep with his tail between his legs ready to be a little more since but I certainly wouldn't waste any time sitting around waiting for that.

 

If I were to play junior shrink here I'd guess that he attributes his wife leaving and his rejections from other women were due to a lack of game and masculinity on his part and they they left due to lack of sexual attraction.

 

I think he's been reading too many pick up books and articles and has lost sight of how to actually interact on a personal level with people.

 

In a way he's kind of like you in that he has his own walls and defense mechanisms to protect him from getting hurt again as well.

 

The difference is with you when you start developing feelings you freak out and send them packing. With him, he's putting on the playa/used salesman facade so no-one gets to know the real him in the first place.

 

You did dump him like he thought you would but in his mind you dumped the salesman, not the real him. His ego was protected. He can tell himself you walked cause he didn't "Chase" you or play to your rules.

 

Real relationships require some vulnerability and risk taking from both parties.

 

I'm kind of disappointed in a way because I think if he actually were a playa' he wouldnt have gone out with you 7-8 times before going to bed and don't think he would've been hurt that you were kicking him out of bed after you came.

 

He may think you are a playa' and so he's keeping his playa uniform on.

[moodswingz]

Yeah, I agree with all this. That's why I tried to be honest with him and told him that I freaked out as far as kicking him out. That I liked him a lot. I was saying nice things to him and being open and honest about how I felt, without being too heavy - I mean, we haven't known each other that long and I liked him a lot but that was it. And when all that wasn't reciprocated or was ignored, I talked to him about it like an adult - or tried to.

 

The thing is that he had this act even BEFORE I kicked him out... that is partially why I freaked out and kicked him out in the first place. So basically it's this ongoing loop between us. I tried to stop my end of it and be open and vulnerable. That's all I can do.

 

I'm disappointed too. Going out 7-8 times before sex and being hurt that I kicked him out... I thought that meant something else too. Also the first time we had sex, he had come over to my house to hang out and he didn't bring any condoms with him. He said he didn't expect sex to happen at all, so he wasn't prepared. So I didn't think he was a straight up player either. I do believe his whole thing is an act... it's just very hard to get past.

 

Oh well. I tried. He took it to a really ******* level, so I'm done. Not to mention that he met a friend of mine before all this happened, and she was very obviously put off by his smarmy demeanor as well. I don't want to be embarrassed of the person I'm with because they act like a used car salesman. I had actually warned her of it ahead of time, so it's just something that has bothered me from day one. Even if he could drop it with me, which he couldn't - it was embarassing when other people were around.

[oldshirt]

Yes you did try and you were straight with him, that's all fair enough.

Chalk this up to a near-miss. There's a lot of those in life.

 

Besides, for all you know maybe he really IS a jerk and the Times that he was nice and normal was the act and the facade.

[Tetley]

I think the responses would be alot different if a man and had kicked a woman out of bed.

 

Tough situation OP. You messed up when you kicked him out of bed. Then did it again. Most people would take it as being used for sex. No wonder he maintaing his fake persona. Just like you, he doesn't want to get hurt, he's only human. You need to show more empathy next time. Best of luck.

[moodswingz]

So I hadn't talked to this guy in a week and never expected to hear from him again. I get a text last night saying he is "Checking in" and asking how I am. I responded saying I was good, and asked him the same. He said, "I'm doing well. Just want to make sure you are OK... you are pretty great in my book and I worry way too much."

 

HUH?

 

I couldn't figure this guy out before we had sex, after we had sex, basically the whole way through... that is what led to me a) not allowing him to sleep over in the first place and b) calling it quits entirely. I told him before that he's like talking to a magic eight-ball. Nothing makes sense and he gives weird vague answers and I just never know where I stand.

 

I asked him why he was worried, and he dodged the question. So I don't get it. I mean, is he so arrogant and narcissistic that he thinks I was devastated by us not working out, like I'm sitting around suicidal? Because I most definitely was not (we only dated a few weeks!!), nor did I ever give him that impression. The only thing that I told him during our last conversation was that I am either clearly not ready to date, or that we just have a personality/communication conflict.

 

Or, is this the most arrogant possible way of re-establishing contact without him admitting that he actually likes me underneath all his BS?

 

He comes across as so arrogant that I truly didn't expect to hear from him again. Even if it is just to play mind games. I would assume he has better things to do than that, but who knows. Maybe he's just bored.

[jefermelesyeux]

OP, in reading through all these comments, it does seem like you dodged a bullet by ending things. regardless of what he meant by "i think you are great in my book and i worry way too much," he's not consistent enough. he screws with your head and dodges the important questions. that may have been a single ray of fleeting light shed on how he really feels, but he's obviously not ready to commit with the attitude he has. OR, he really doesn't feel like he's doing anything but being playful with you, in which case he's still an idiot because from what i gathered he could never be serious when it mattered. the problem is most certainly him- not you at all.

 

a little something i kind of taught myself about reciprocation (or lack thereof); it isn't always necessary and doesn't mean he doesn't feel the same. in this case, i understand, a little recip would have been nice since he never seemed to be clear with you.

 

there have been a few occasions where, on the phone with my potential interest, i'd said things like "it's nice to hear your voice" and instead of saying the same back, he'd say "mhmm." this got to me at first. but i decided to not let it bother me anymore, because 1.) way more often than not, he did reciprocate, 2.) it can be implied in other ways rather than by explicit statement, and 3.) personally i think it's less about the cutesy exchanges and more about the connection two people foster via conversation, common interests, time spent together, etc. though i do understand it's nice to hear, i don't think it is necessary all the time. and this took me a while to realize and to believe. i still sometimes struggle with it. maybe this doesn't fit your situation exactly, but it may be a bit of advice to keep in mind in the future.

 

i hope this helps, even if only a little.

[moodswingz]

That's a very good point. I dated someone for almost five years who was kind of OVER-expressive... he was like the girl in the relationship and I was like the guy. So now that I'm back into the dating world, it's been an adjustment dealing with guys who act like guys. I think a lot of the issues that I had with my last real boyfriend (who was the first person I dated AFTER the "over-expressive" guy) had to do with communication issues and expecting him to be like the one before - and when he wasn't, I interpreted it as him not caring about me.

 

That said, I still always felt like something was off with this guy who is the subject of the thread - and I just didn't know where I stood. I felt like he was either playing games or just so burned in the past that he couldn't function in a real relationship. I've dated a lot of guys over the years and he's the only one that acted like this. I know it may be a defense mechanism and that's fine. Moving on.

Edited February 21, 2014 by moodswingz

[Never Again]

"Do you really want things to be easy"

 

"I think you like the challenge"

 

His response was, "I don't chase women. I'm too cool for that."

 

I'm glad you've chosen to move on.

 

This guy is, nearly word for word, pulling pick-up and relationship advice from shady dating "gurus" (David DeAngelo and Doc Love come to mind). Those douchebags basically preach the idea that guys have to be distant and mean to "keep 'em keen".

 

A lot of men are basically conditioned to act like this - we're told that if we act OVER-expressive, even for a moment...if we let a woman know that we have insecurities or weaknesses, they'll lose romantic interest, see the guy as a "wussy", and walk away. It's not a defense mechanism, it's a learned behavior that he thinks will keep you interested.

[Phantom888]

That's too much drama for an early relationship. You have sex, and you throw him out. Maybe you are just not ready for this kind of relationship. If you are not on the same page, then it's not gonna work. Please, you question yourself if you actually like him after 8 dates and a night of sex???? Shouldn't you be sure of that like a few dates ago before you plunge in? I think there is a little problem with the order of things. Maybe you all should slow down, step back and reconsider? I mean, you just came out of a long-term toxic relationship. So why would you subject yourself to all this self-created drama again? IMHO.

[Noproblem]

I think everything is going well

Keep on dating and don't think too much about the text messages.

some guys hate texting and they don't like writing while they are totally different in person.

Edited February 21, 2014 by Noproblem

[Never Again]

I think everything is going well

Keep on dating and don't think too much about the text messages.

some guys hate texting and they don't like writing while they are totally different in person.

 

I don't think it's the texts she's worried about...it's the arrogant, overly-masculine, "alpha-wannabe", cocky comedy shtick this guy's got going on.

 

To quote Holden Caulfield, "I hate phonies".

[moodswingz]

Haha! Catcher in the Rye was my favorite book in high school. And yes... I hate phonies. I'm very sensitive to it and find it very hard to trust people like that. I've known several people like him throughout my life and I'm always suspicious while other people think they are great. Maybe I'm overly paranoid or maybe I'm just intuitive - I truly don't know.

 

This guy has a lot of superficial charm and it just seems fake to me. Not to mention, the superficial, disingenuous charm makes me wonder if he could be a sociopath.

 

Having sex with him was a mistake and then unfortunately I tried to give it another chance and make a relationship out of it... because I guess then, I'm not a complete idiot who had sex with someone I feel off about. Seriously, I thought I had better judgment now that I'm in my 30s!!

[Hopeful30]

 

I don't know how to be vulnerable without being/feeling insecure and needy and I don't know how to be secure without being cold and detached. It sucks.

 

I'm in the exact same boat. Everything my current man does that i'm unhappy about really bothers me, yet when i'm detached and 'on my own' without giving in to a man, nothing can harm me and I'm happy and confident.

 

I honestly don't know what to tell you because I'm having a similar dilemma. Ever since I detached a bit, I've been less affected by the things he does and it's easier to go about my day when we may have a problem or he does something I'm unhappy about.

 

I don't think your' insecure when you're vulnerable, I just think it becomes scary because now you know you can get hurt, and seeing as how no person or relation is perfect, chances are you will get hurt and that sucks.

 

All I can tell you is just go with the flow but keep your walls up. It's up to him to try and knock them down to get to the core of you. If he doesn't work to get there, then why become vulnerable for him? It's not default to become vulnerable just because things are going well. He needs to work to get you there, just like how you need to work to prove you are trustworthy and won't hurt him when he's vulnerable too.