NYSean Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 I recently met a woman who told me one of the important things she wants out of a man is that he has a good job. I understand wanting to date men WITH a job, but there are some people who feel when women say things like "I want a man with a good career" it rubs them off the wrong way. Some have gone far to call them a gold-digger. Personally I feel what I do for a living doesn't play a factor in what makes for a meaningful relationship. What are your opinions on this?
Emilia Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 Personally I feel what I do for a living doesn't play a factor in what makes for a meaningful relationship. What are your opinions on this? It matters to me. Not so much how much he gets paid (though living on a minimum wage must be a struggle) but that he does what he feels passionate about at least to a degree. That he has ambition and a drive to achieve his goals - whatever they are. It's because I'm that way myself, I'm financially independent with my property and a good career doing something I quite like and find stimulating. Can't imagine being with someone who is content turning up to a crappy job day in day out simply just to get each day over and done with. That must be soul destroying. 6
Author NYSean Posted February 10, 2014 Author Posted February 10, 2014 It matters to me. Not so much how much he gets paid (though living on a minimum wage must be a struggle) but that he does what he feels passionate about at least to a degree. That he has ambition and a drive to achieve his goals - whatever they are. It's because I'm that way myself, I'm financially independent with my property and a good career doing something I quite like and find stimulating. Can't imagine being with someone who is content turning up to a crappy job day in day out simply just to get each day over and done with. That must be soul destroying. What if his goals is to travel the world, to take classes to learn new things and his "crappy" job can sustain all of that. If his career isn't an ambition but just simply a means to finance the life he wants to live and it so happens that being a manager at McDonalds is sufficient...would that be fine?
Priv Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 Kinda depends. I understand a career woman wanting to find a man of similar ambition. But an aspiring (nearly) stay at home mother wanting someone with a great job to take of her financially is well... less reaonable I think.
oldshirt Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 I recently met a woman who told me one of the important things she wants out of a man is that he has a good job. I understand wanting to date men WITH a job, but there are some people who feel when women say things like "I want a man with a good career" it rubs them off the wrong way. Some have gone far to call them a gold-digger. Personally I feel what I do for a living doesn't play a factor in what makes for a meaningful relationship. What are your opinions on this? Flip this around and look at it from the opposite perspective. Imagine a man saying one of the important thing for him in the women he dates is for the woman to take care of herself and put pride and effort into her appearance. How would you feel about a woman who upon hearing that says, "personally I feel how I look doesn't play a factor in what makes for a meaningful relationship." 3
Emilia Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 What if his goals is to travel the world, to take classes to learn new things and his "crappy" job can sustain all of that. If his career isn't an ambition but just simply a means to finance the life he wants to live and it so happens that being a manager at McDonalds is sufficient...would that be fine? I have travelled the world, at one point I was away for almost 2 years. I still managed to set myself up so that it wouldn't ruin my work life. When there is a will, there is a way. If there isn't a will then... we are not compatible. 'Sustain' shouldn't be on anyone's list at a young age, IMO. I probably wouldn't be compatible with a guy who thought his dreams were satisfied by running a McDonald's outlet, no. Now, if he ran his own franchise or his own shop he loved very much, that would be completely different. 1
TXGuy Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 Yes, this is common. Many (most, but not all) women expect to extract resources from men in exchange for sex or the prospect of sex. The amount of money a man has or makes is a very good proxy for how much money can be funneled to her. The better the job, the more resources available to go her way. So many/most women will give a higher priority to a higher earning prospect. To be fair, men do similar things. Men (generally) will be more attracted to (and expend more resources on) women who are prettier, thinner, and younger than those who are not.
Grumpybutfun Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 We all have our values and apparently hers is that the man she is with is stable, enjoys what he does and will be a good co-provider for any future children if that is a priority to her. My wife and I are both very passionate about our careers and have ambition and drive which compliments our rapport with each other. If this is something you don't care for, find someone compatible with you. G 3
Author NYSean Posted February 10, 2014 Author Posted February 10, 2014 Flip this around and look at it from the opposite perspective. Imagine a man saying one of the important thing for him in the women he dates is for the woman to take care of herself and put pride and effort into her appearance. How would you feel about a woman who upon hearing that says, "personally I feel how I look doesn't play a factor in what makes for a meaningful relationship." I would agree but I think we all have baselines for that. Just as it is very reasonable that a woman would NEVER want to date an unemployed lazy bum, I wouldn't want someone that doesn't take care of herself and enjoyed staying morbidly obese and was a complete slob. Then again, if I'm attracted to her, I really wouldn't care if she dressed poorly.
soccerrprp Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 I've thought long and hard about this. I was dumped by a woman who didn't think my job was good enough and that I didn't make enough money for her. It turns out that her perception of my job and salary were incorrect, but she realized this AFTER she decided that I was worth more than the job or the salary. Thank goodness for that. In the end, so what? It's a preference. She "prefers" to be with someone who will be financial supportive, so? So do I. Whether she is a career woman or no, financial stability is crucial and there is no arguing that. There might be a number of reasons why she is like that and none of them may have to do with being greedy or overly-materialistic. What rubs me in the wrong way is when after getting to know someone, knowing that he/she doesn't quite meet your employment/salary needs, one then dumps them. Another thing is the attitude. You want more financially sound people around you, keep it to yourself and let the chips fall as they may. Don't need to rub it in. I've read enough online profiles to know that many (mostly women) use code to indicate their need and want of qualities that allow them to be excessive, trendy, indulgent. I live in the Dallas, TX area and there are many people who value money, but having responsible expectations financially is not wrong. 2
Emilia Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 I've thought long and hard about this. I was dumped by a woman who didn't think my job was good enough and that I didn't make enough money for her. It turns out that her perception of my job and salary were incorrect, but she realized this AFTER she decided that I was worth more than the job or the salary. Thank goodness for that. That's pretty retarded to be fair.
oldshirt Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 What if his goals is to travel the world, to take classes to learn new things and his "crappy" job can sustain all of that. If his career isn't an ambition but just simply a means to finance the life he wants to live and it so happens that being a manager at McDonalds is sufficient...would that be fine? As some of the people have been trying to explain, sometimes it's not the actual position and actual dollar figure on the paycheck but rather then ambition (or lack there of) that determines attraction/nonattraction. Traits like ambition, courage, assertiveness, drive, status, influence, future planning etc etc are frequently deemed attractacive and desireable while things like laziness, lack of motivation, lack of ambition, lack of future plans etc etc are deemed unattractive. Attitude stands for a lot. Your attitude towards your own job can affect this a lot. If you see your job as 'crappy' and treat it as such and have a corresponding lack of motivation and ambition towards it, it will be seen as an unattractive trait. And just an FYI to keep things in perspective, McDonalds is often to brunt of jokes and used to demean people of lesser career options but keep in mind McDonalds is a major international corporation and that has franchises in countless countries all over the world. With the right attitude, work ethic, ambition, education and corporate training, a burger flipper at 16 years old could work his/her way up flying around the world on corporate jets and managing billions of dollars of corporate assets.
Author NYSean Posted February 10, 2014 Author Posted February 10, 2014 I've thought long and hard about this. I was dumped by a woman who didn't think my job was good enough and that I didn't make enough money for her. It turns out that her perception of my job and salary were incorrect, but she realized this AFTER she decided that I was worth more than the job or the salary. Thank goodness for that. In the end, so what? It's a preference. She "prefers" to be with someone who will be financial supportive, so? So do I. Whether she is a career woman or no, financial stability is crucial and there is no arguing that. There might be a number of reasons why she is like that and none of them may have to do with being greedy or overly-materialistic. What rubs me in the wrong way is when after getting to know someone, knowing that he/she doesn't quite meet your employment/salary needs, one then dumps them. Another thing is the attitude. You want more financially sound people around you, keep it to yourself and let the chips fall as they may. Don't need to rub it in. I've read enough online profiles to know that many (mostly women) use code to indicate their need and want of qualities that allow them to be excessive, trendy, indulgent. I live in the Dallas, TX area and there are many people who value money, but having responsible expectations financially is not wrong. So mind sharing your opinions about this? After I graduated college, I dated a woman who said she's ONLY attracted to successful men with great jobs. She had a great job, good money, and was independent but once she found her successful man, she said she wanted to stop working and have him take care of her. She told me that was a man's responsibility to a woman. I remember using her laptop and her google search would show that she has searched for her date's career and the salary that he made. She once told me " A man's happiness should come from knowing the fact that he's making me happy and if he's not happy doing that then we shouldn't be together." Granted I asked her why she's with me cause I had no job at that time, she said "I had potential and I was physically attractive to her." Is this where you draw the line between reasonable and unreasonable?
Author NYSean Posted February 10, 2014 Author Posted February 10, 2014 As some of the people have been trying to explain, sometimes it's not the actual position and actual dollar figure on the paycheck but rather then ambition (or lack there of) that determines attraction/nonattraction. Traits like ambition, courage, assertiveness, drive, status, influence, future planning etc etc are frequently deemed attractacive and desireable while things like laziness, lack of motivation, lack of ambition, lack of future plans etc etc are deemed unattractive. Attitude stands for a lot. Your attitude towards your own job can affect this a lot. If you see your job as 'crappy' and treat it as such and have a corresponding lack of motivation and ambition towards it, it will be seen as an unattractive trait. And just an FYI to keep things in perspective, McDonalds is often to brunt of jokes and used to demean people of lesser career options but keep in mind McDonalds is a major international corporation and that has franchises in countless countries all over the world. With the right attitude, work ethic, ambition, education and corporate training, a burger flipper at 16 years old could work his/her way up flying around the world on corporate jets and managing billions of dollars of corporate assets. Okay I understand that, so I have a friend who's an investment banker making 250,000 k a year and he loathes his job. He just does it for the money and always goes in completely unenthusiastic. He goes to work, goes home and plays videogames. Same with some of my attorney friends who are unenthusiastic about their jobs, just stick to being a lawyer and not aim any higher. Would it be right to say they exhibit unattractive qualities?
Emilia Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 Okay I understand that, so I have a friend who's an investment banker making 250,000 k a year and he loathes his job. He just does it for the money and always goes in completely unenthusiastic. He goes to work, goes home and plays videogames. Same with some of my attorney friends who are unenthusiastic about their jobs, just stick to being a lawyer and not aim any higher. Would it be right to say they exhibit unattractive qualities? They will likely find what they are looking for eventually. Most people don't go through life loving every single job but many will strive to achieve something. Your friends will either find a better company to work for or a slight change in direction. A good education and solid work experience are a good place to start for them, they have already won half the battle.
carhill Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 I recently met a woman who told me one of the important things she wants out of a man is that he has a good job. Reasonable requirement? Absolutely. That said, without specifying what 'good' means, it could trend to the unreasonable depending upon the specification. Also, be aware that 'secure job' is, or can be, an equally reasonable and exigent requirement. I bumped into this requirement a lot in my younger years due to not having a quantifiable job, being self-employed. I imagine a net worth statement and P&L would have sufficed but I didn't feel it appropriate to share such financial information with a stranger to 'date' them. When women ask me what I 'do' for a living, and they definitely still do, I answer 'I fix things'. If the response is, 'no, I mean what is your job?', I answer 'I fix things'. Accurate and true and every nickel which enters the coffers orginates from that exact process. Now, if a lady is sincerely interested into what goes into engineering and repair and inventing things, I'll certainly share that with her. To date, no takers, and I find this to be unremarkable. They're not interested in the process, rather the results. That's valid and reasonable.
fortyninethousand322 Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 Look, people have all kinds of preferences. We can call them good or bad, whatever. Some people will duck out if their guy travels too much for work, some will duck out if he's an inexperienced virgin, some will duck out if he lives 15 miles away instead of 10, etc. You can't really talk people out of their preferences so it makes no sense to worry about it. If their preferences make them happy, good for them. If not, maybe they should re-examine them. The end. 1
soccerrprp Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 That's pretty retarded to be fair. I felt the same way at the time. But then I learned about her past and the way every guy took advantage of her financially. She still hasn't fully recovered from the damage. But, she had her reasonable and legitimate reasons for feeling what she did. She couldn't risk being with someone (again) that was going to coast in her financial wake at her expense. She learned that having such stringent preconditions was going to make it very difficult to find someone really good. 1
soccerrprp Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 That's pretty retarded to be fair. So mind sharing your opinions about this? After I graduated college, I dated a woman who said she's ONLY attracted to successful men with great jobs. She had a great job, good money, and was independent but once she found her successful man, she said she wanted to stop working and have him take care of her. She told me that was a man's responsibility to a woman. I remember using her laptop and her google search would show that she has searched for her date's career and the salary that he made. She once told me " A man's happiness should come from knowing the fact that he's making me happy and if he's not happy doing that then we shouldn't be together." Granted I asked her why she's with me cause I had no job at that time, she said "I had potential and I was physically attractive to her." Is this where you draw the line between reasonable and unreasonable? Heck yeah. I would never date someone who had such an attitude, but those are her wants, needs and if you don't like it, you move on. We simply don't have the same values and it sounds like it would certainly go beyond just finances. Notice she was attracted to you. Ha, people can be funny as to how their preconditions suddenly change. If she was serious, I suspect that she would have left you eventually if your potential didn't become solid, performing ambition. 1
Emilia Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 I felt the same way at the time. But then I learned about her past and the way every guy took advantage of her financially. She still hasn't fully recovered from the damage. But, she had her reasonable and legitimate reasons for feeling what she did. She couldn't risk being with someone (again) that was going to coast in her financial wake at her expense. She learned that having such stringent preconditions was going to make it very difficult to find someone really good. I can completely understand her point of view but it sounds like she had a knee-jerk reaction. Perhaps more indicative of relationship-readiness, or lack of. Anyway, that's for another thread I suppose.
GoreSP Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 I recently met a woman who told me one of the important things she wants out of a man is that he has a good job. I understand wanting to date men WITH a job, but there are some people who feel when women say things like "I want a man with a good career" it rubs them off the wrong way. Some have gone far to call them a gold-digger. Personally I feel what I do for a living doesn't play a factor in what makes for a meaningful relationship. What are your opinions on this? As with everything else, she has a right to her own 'requirements' in a partner. Personally I feel she may pass up on good opportunities. What does she mean by 'good' job though? Big salary? Ok salary with tons of advantages? etc etc
oldshirt Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 Okay I understand that, so I have a friend who's an investment banker making 250,000 k a year and he loathes his job. He just does it for the money and always goes in completely unenthusiastic. He goes to work, goes home and plays videogames. Same with some of my attorney friends who are unenthusiastic about their jobs, just stick to being a lawyer and not aim any higher. Would it be right to say they exhibit unattractive qualities? If they are whining and moaning and complaining about all their aches and pains and boo boos all the time, yes. it's unattractive. Does that mean they aren't good people or unworthy as mates? of course not. It just means they are displaying behaviors that aren't attractive. You need to understand the difference between attraction/desire and comfort/security. Things like status, power, ambition, influence, drive, assertiveness, competitiveness, physical strength/good looks etc are things that stimulate attraction, desire, sexual response and make people want to have sex with you. (known in the manosphere as "Alpha" traits) Things like actual dollars, responsibility, kindness, compassion, generosity etc are things that stimulate comfort, security, stability etc and make people comfortable in having a relationship with you and being with you. (known in the manosphere as "beta" traits. To be in a romantic/sexual relationship with someone there needs to be a balance of both the alpha and the beta. Some people need more alpha to be with someone and some people need more beta but everyone needs both to one degree or another. Someone with a high income can provide a lot of beta but if they are too much of a whiner and pussy, their partner may lose attraction and desire for them. They may stay for the comforts they provide but they may be at risk for getting their sexual/excitement needs met elsewhere. Someone that is very bold and adventurous and living on the edge may be very exciting and attractive but if they don't have the actual income and job security, they may not be able to provide the comfort and security that someone needs for a sustained relationship. Your chick that was seeing you because you were attractive was getting her excitement/sexual needs met, but was wanting more comfort and security that a high income provides. Basically all women want a certain level of comfort, security and stability from the men they are with. A "gold digger" is someone who is wanting a man to support and provide for her but doesn't really have much actual desire or attraction to him. It's also somewhat in the eye of the beholder. Some men are perfectly happy providing for a woman as long as she treats him somewhat pleasantly and puts out periodically whether she truly loves him and desires him or not. Other guys want nothing to do with a woman that doesn't innately love and desire him for real. 2
soccerrprp Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 I can completely understand her point of view but it sounds like she had a knee-jerk reaction. Perhaps more indicative of relationship-readiness, or lack of. Anyway, that's for another thread I suppose. Oh, boy, if you knew how close you were to the truth.... 1
Author NYSean Posted February 10, 2014 Author Posted February 10, 2014 As with everything else, she has a right to her own 'requirements' in a partner. Personally I feel she may pass up on good opportunities. What does she mean by 'good' job though? Big salary? Ok salary with tons of advantages? etc etc She ended up being with a banker that made 1 mil / year. Not very physically attracted to him though. Last she told me she was training him to pamper her like a princess.
sugarpea Posted February 10, 2014 Posted February 10, 2014 For me it doesn't matter that much but I do want him to have a job at least. Then I wouldn't feel so awkward and bad when he insists on paying his share for things or treating me. Makes me feel really awkward when they don't have the money to do so, but they want to. I think men in general would feel a bit emasculated from a girl paying for things all the time, speaking from experience from the men I know.
Recommended Posts