When do Affairs start taking a turn for worse

[Blue73]

LS friends,

 

 

Sorry this is long:

Currently in a long distance A. We are both married and our arrangement is working as we are both incredibly happy. We only got here because we both care enough to support one another through those aweful A ups and down in the beginning when you end up going too deep emotionally. I would sometimes come and read these baords because there are so many of us in A's and its nice to see your not alone in the ups and downs- sometimes you pull through and work it out sometimes not:(

My questions are down below but to recap- I have been in this A for 10 months now-We are strong. He listens and comforts me as I do him. Emails, calls, IM's all day long. Even though we are long distance the effort that is made to come see me, I have never witnessed in my adult life someone doing that for another. We were very clear from the start about not leaving our Marriages and continue to feel that way. Sure we go down What If's, we actually ALLOW ourselves to go there and come back out because we are both logical people and understand it would never work. Our relationship would change, our divorces would change us. Not worth hurting our small children. We are in an alternate life- a double one if you will. Believe it or not, we have seen each other every other week for the past 10 months, at least 2-3 overnights every other week and have taken many "fun trips" together. We have just got back from a 5 day vacation. So we have a pretty good feel for one another.

We know we want this to last for a very long time..who knows about future- We are living in the now..or at least as long as our traveling jobs will allow

 

Questions:

For those OW/OM scorned- when did you start seeing a downward spiral? Were you treated same as me but then one day- BAM! You did not know who you were with? I read some of your stories and get so nervous. All of us have read them and said “nope, my MM is different” then BAM! Maybe he was not so different.

 

For those OW/OM still blissful and happy (But longer than a year), is it possible to be with such a man who is real and is not some sort of sociopath? How do you tell the difference? Or you don’t until its too late?

 

Thank you all!

**PLEASE NO JUDGEMENT**

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[eloise123]

When you realised that even though they loved you, it did not change at home.

[imperfectangel]

for me it was when nothing changed after a while even affairs go stale if nothing is changing how can you move forward?

[jwi71]

Questions:

For those OW/OM scorned- when did you start seeing a downward spiral?

You cannot love yet fear this day, this downward spiral. Over time familiarity does breed a certain complacency in lovers, spouses and friends. The A is perhaps more insulated because the moments ARE in isolation - all is good and new and secret and verboten. While delayed, the day does come. And we aren't even considering D-day.

 

Were you treated same as me but then one day- BAM! You did not know who you were with?

You've always known who you are with - he shows you in a thousand ways. Believe him. Now, is what he shows good or bad? That is something only you can decide.

 

I read some of your stories and get so nervous. All of us have read them and said “nope, my MM is different” then BAM! Maybe he was not so different.

It doesn't matter what other do and say - thought certain patterns exist.

What matters is HOW they AFFECT YOU. This fear you have...is not natural imho. One in love must trust their partner to safeguard their interests - and in such not worry about a "negative tomorrow or downward spiral". Why do you have these thoughts?

 

For those OW/OM still blissful and happy (But longer than a year), is it possible to be with such a man who is real and is not some sort of sociopath? How do you tell the difference? Or you don’t until its too late?

I think it is incredibly rare for AP's to be blissfully happy - there is always the threat of D-day...a massive creeping shadow portending a choice that may not favor the AP (namely an end to the A and a return to the M - aka, no one likes being not chosen).

 

Relationships take work, effort, honesty, vulnerability, trust and many other things I'll not spew on about. Usually, but not always, many of these are absent in an A. And for me, that is unhealthy and, almost by definition, destined for a sad end.

 

Having said that, A's DO last...they even become happy M's. It's kinda like playing the lotto though...odds of winning are NOT in your favor - and what one loses is logarithmically worse than just a dollar.

 

My advice: Walk. It is not good to go into a relationship, an A is a type of R, fearing a negative outcome. I would say this to you even if neither of you were in an A...its not a healthy mindset to pursue a relationship.

[whichwayisup]

When your husband or his wife finds out and there's a D-day, one of you will hide and the other one will chase. It's very rare that both married AP's still continue the A. Usually one (or both) throw the AP under the bus. Your A will never be as it is now if you two are caught and chances are, that is the beginning of the end.

[Scotia]

I wouldn't say that I was "scorned".... things just sort of dead-ended. We live far apart, and both have young kids. We spent a long long time trying to work through different scenarios of how this could work. But, long story short: it can't. Things went into the downward spiral when it became clear that there was just no way around it.

[Realist3]

For those OW/OM still blissful and happy (But longer than a year), is it possible to be with such a man who is real and is not some sort of sociopath?

 

Of course it is possible. As long as both people are on the same page about what they want and expect it is not a problem at all. We are as real as can be with each other.

 

 

As far as when affairs start to 'take a turn for the worse', I think that is predicated on a huge number of factors that can't be dialed down to an A, B or C.

[blue963]

If you both have small children, how you find the ability to spend so much time together and on long vacations?

[Realist3]

If you both have small children, how you find the ability to spend so much time together and on long vacations?

 

 

We don't. We have taken one three day trip together in 4 years. We see each other almost every day, but we only spend time one on one with each other 3-4 times a month. We could spend more time together during the week, but that would get very dangerous. Our focus is on not getting caught and keep our risk potential to a minimum.

[RickFox]

When your husband or his wife finds out and there's a D-day, one of you will hide and the other one will chase. It's very rare that both married AP's still continue the A. Usually one (or both) throw the AP under the bus. Your A will never be as it is now if you two are caught and chances are, that is the beginning of the end.

 

Oh yeah! For real!

[Lady2163]

LS friends,

 

 

Sorry this is long:

Currently in a long distance A. We are both married and our arrangement is working as we are both incredibly happy. We only got here because we both care enough to support one another through those aweful A ups and down in the beginning when you end up going too deep emotionally. I would sometimes come and read these baords because there are so many of us in A's and its nice to see your not alone in the ups and downs- sometimes you pull through and work it out sometimes not:(

My questions are down below but to recap- I have been in this A for 10 months now-We are strong. He listens and comforts me as I do him. Emails, calls, IM's all day long. Even though we are long distance the effort that is made to come see me, I have never witnessed in my adult life someone doing that for another. We were very clear from the start about not leaving our Marriages and continue to feel that way. Sure we go down What If's, we actually ALLOW ourselves to go there and come back out because we are both logical people and understand it would never work. Our relationship would change, our divorces would change us. Not worth hurting our small children. We are in an alternate life- a double one if you will. Believe it or not, we have seen each other every other week for the past 10 months, at least 2-3 overnights every other week and have taken many "fun trips" together. We have just got back from a 5 day vacation. So we have a pretty good feel for one another.

We know we want this to last for a very long time..who knows about future- We are living in the now..or at least as long as our traveling jobs will allow

 

Questions:

For those OW/OM scorned- when did you start seeing a downward spiral? Were you treated same as me but then one day- BAM! You did not know who you were with? I read some of your stories and get so nervous. All of us have read them and said “nope, my MM is different” then BAM! Maybe he was not so different.

 

For those OW/OM still blissful and happy (But longer than a year), is it possible to be with such a man who is real and is not some sort of sociopath? How do you tell the difference? Or you don’t until its too late?

 

Thank you all!

**PLEASE NO JUDGEMENT**

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There's a lot about your post that reminds me of my situation. I am long distance, but single. I have been with my fwb for seven years. I'm not a 'blissful happy' kind of person, but this is sort of one of the best relationships I've ever had.

 

We do Valentines, birthday and Christmas gifts. We communicate well. We never fight. Yes, there's been a couple of times that not being able to talk on his days off have helped dramatically cool me down and give me time to think.

 

It is hard to say how long it will take for things to not be so perfect for you. When we first started, we talked texted and emailed throughout the whole day. Then, his workplace put a block on personal emails. Then he forgot to delete a flirty text. Then he had to check his cell phone bill one time online and wife was practically standing over him. He kept mistyping the password until he was locked out of the system. When he did check his phone bill in private, the amount of phone calls were unnerving to him.

 

So, if your communication gets limited, you may find things cool down a lot once you get past the, "I miss your emails so much" "I miss your text in the morning" stage. I never thought it would happen, but it did. More than likely if the affair had started with the limited communication, it would have fizzled in months.

 

One thing that may contribute to your bliss is the fact that limits are set and can't be crossed. That can be very comforting and give a sense of security. You know exactly where you stand. There is no guesswork of when you will enter the next milestone of a traditional relationship.

 

I'm pretty sure I will be thrown under the bus if the affair comes to light. I think it will be desperation, not malice. If he thinks it will save his marriage, he will more than likely turn me into the aggressor. It was pretty mutual. I asked for his email, sent a bread and butter thank you and he sent a suggestively worded bread and butter response....and his phone number - and best time to call.

 

Good luck - remember to be true to yourself.

[Poppygoodwill]

I imagine that you'll be happy with this set up, until you want something different. Or he does. IN other words, perhaps all this communication and time together - despite your stated intentions - will lead to strong feelings and a restlessness with your homelife. Or his. It would only be natural.

 

Then suddenly the set up seems wrong and the balance tips toward the OM but you find he doesn't want it to go that way and starts to push you away....and then you're in an emotional quagmire.

 

Don't you find living a "double life" to be exhausting?

[Blue73]

This fear you have...is not natural imho. One in love must trust their partner to safeguard their interests - and in such not worry about a "negative tomorrow or downward spiral". Why do you have these thoughts?

 

Relationships take work, effort, honesty, vulnerability, trust and many other things I'll not spew on about. Usually, but not always, many of these are absent in an A.

 

My advice: Walk. It is not good to go into a relationship, an A is a type of R, fearing a negative outcome. I would say this to you even if neither of you were in an A...its not a healthy mindset to pursue a relationship.

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[sIZE=3][FONT=Calibri]I have fear only because I read posts here on LS and it got me wondering that many OW/OM had trust, effort, respect, vulnerability and yet still somehow got blind sided. Some posts I read there is no real communications, AP only calls for booty call, never celebrate Christmas, forgets Bdays, etc. Those are not relationships I would stay very long in. WHAT about the ones that both AP’s are over the top in being attentive to their AP? Did any of them get blind sided?[/FONT][/sIZE]

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If you both have small children, how you find the ability to spend so much time together and on long vacations?

 

We both have traveled for our jobs for years and we both travel to the same cities for work. (most of the time). We are flexible in our jobs that we can schedule when we have to go do sales calls in those cities. No additional time than normal was taken from our families than normal except the recent vacation we just took.

 

I imagine that you'll be happy with this set up, until you want something different. Or he does. IN other words, perhaps all this communication and time together - despite your stated intentions - will lead to strong feelings and a restlessness with your homelife. Or his. It would only be natural.

 

Don't you find living a "double life" to be exhausting?

 

We don’t want something different. Something different can’t happen. One of us would have to relocate across the country. (Think Nevada to Boston!). Yes sometimes a double life can be exhausting but both of us are extreme type “A” people so actually it helps us organize better.

 

Thank you for all your insight, thoughts and advice. I after reading some posts, I became nervous about being blind sided and didn’t understand if it was due to the types of relationships where the AP pretty much calls for a booty call and the OW/OM is shocked to find out they meant nothing, or when you truly trust your AP and know they would not do anything to harm you and BAM! I guess for me only time if this will happen to me. Was just curious about it all.

[proseandpassion]

It seems to me by reading this board that many OW in A's feel loved, cherished, comfortable, and safe - and still get blind sided. I'd actually say the "booty call"-ish affairs seem more rare than the other kind.

[LilGirlandOW]

you both are married which doubles your chances of a dday happening, when that does it will be humiliating and even if the A resumes it wont feel the same.

 

For those OW/OM still blissful and happy (But longer than a year), is it possible to be with such a man who is real and is not some sort of sociopath? How do you tell the difference? Or you don’t until its too late?

 

I dont understand what you mean by this? Why do you think he is a sociopath possibly? My guess is that if he is, you wouldnt know without a Ph.D given what little time you get with him.

[cocorico]

For those OW/OM still blissful and happy (But longer than a year), is it possible to be with such a man who is real and is not some sort of sociopath? How do you tell the difference? Or you don’t until its too late?

 

It is certainly possible to be with "such a man who is real and is not some sort of sociopath", if you are using "sociopath" as defined formally and not as some shorthand for "a guy who can switch off his conscience enough to sustain an A beyond a year"... Which is something else entirely. Some guys sustain As by suppressing their conscience, some don't have to because they don't consider As wrong, and some can simply separate out aspects of their lives efficiently and inhabit the bit they're in fully and put the other bits on hold while they're doing that. Just as some women do.

 

Some guys - and some women - can't, as easily, and so take strain during an A, resulting in them terminating either the A or the M when they can no longer sustain both because of the emotional cost. But that point is reached differently by different people, and "a year" seems a pretty arbitrary point to use as a standard.