I made her cry.

[Peanut9330]

The ups and downs of reconciliation are indeed a roller coaster ride. After a day out with our seven year old daughter yesterday, I triggered - pretty hard. By the time my wife returned home, I was in a terribly foul mood. Things had pent up all day, and it didn't take long for them to come out.

 

After a bout of yelling and the usual outpouring of pain and anger, I asked her, "Just what the hell do you want???"

 

She turned and ran into the basement. I followed her, and then she answered me. "I just want you to leave me alone," as she burst into tears.

 

My wife typically doesn't cry. In fact, there has only been one occasion since DDay that I have seen her honestly weep (though there have been other times I haven't), and that was when I packed her suitcase after another round of trickle truth.

 

I couldn't take it. It hurt. But she deserves it! After all, look what she has done, what she has caused! But I love her, and Christ, it hurts to see her cry.

 

She tells me she feels like the most horrible person to have ever walked the face of the earth. That she doesn't have a moments peace with herself. That she is scared to death that, when she comes home, I will be angry or upset. That I might change my mind and tell her to leave anyway.

 

We stood holding each other for a while and something came to me. Maybe its common knowledge among the reconciling, but it was new to me.

 

We, the betrayed, are of right, totally wrapped up in our own pain and betrayal. We see what has been done to us and how terrible it hurts. It eats away at our thoughts and our bodies. To the point that we might be blind to the fact that a truly remorseful spouse is suffering as well.

 

Do they deserve it? Probably. But now I realize that, for this chance to reconcile to really have a chance, I have to understand her guilt, shame, pain - and be as kind and loving towards her as she has been towards me.

 

Thank you for posting this I needed such a perspective!!!

My SO hasn’t cheated but has betrayed me in another way and I've putting all this stress and pressure on him not realizing that's he's hurting as much as me.

[snappytomcat]

yes im guilty of that,i know my husband hurts also I can see it,damn I can feel it,hes the one who cheated,but I know when im angry he has no idea how to handle it,cause ive never been like that,and when I cry I can see the pain he feels that he caused,our mc always said in the beginning of our r to try to be kind to each other,and that's what we try to do

[lilmisscantbewrong]

You need more then encouragement. You need a road map to take you through recovery. Get the book Surviving An Affair by Dr Harley. It will give you the knowledge to save your marriage.

 

 

How would you feel if your WW kept banging the OM? You would feel that you are being abused by her.

 

 

Well constantly exploding about the affair is abusing your WW.

 

 

You have been here since October so your D day has been awhile. Time for explosions to be over.

 

 

First step after you get that book. You will need to schedule a polygraph for your WW. Trickle truthing is just continuing your torture.

 

 

Get the book for you and your WW to read and poly test that WW.

 

Disagree - this solves nothing. His needs her needs further down the road, but for now surviving an affair is really not the book you need.

 

Surviving an affair, IMHO, really outs the blame on the bs - needs not being met, etc. - this is not a way to being. You need to get to the bottom of the why - and it isn't just because we are all wires for affairs - it is much deeper than that.

 

Hang in there. Get a good counselor to help you navigate.

[Fluttershy]

Tell her to talk to you as she thinks of things. She probably will think of other things, or you'll have questions for her. As long as she's been honest and filled in the broad strokes (and is not intentionally hiding anything), she shouldn't stress about that.

 

If she thinks of something later, she should simply tell you then. And if you think of a question you need answered, you should ask and she should answer. The important part is that she's open and that the two of you are taking the steps needed to heal.

 

My husband did this. Some people just don't have as good memories and they need a trigger to remember certain things said or some of the "non-important" stuff done (i put it in quotes because if an affair has lasted a while some thigs aren't ingrained into the brain like grabbing a coffee that one day and kissing over the table).

[compulsivedancer]

I don't remember all of the details at this point. I have a hard time sorting out one encounter from another - they get jumbled in my head. It makes time frame a challenge. H found a transcript of our texts and I honestly didn't realize things had escalated to that point by Sept until I read them.

 

Often I find that what I think is important is not what H is fixated on. He asks questions sometimes (even a year later!) that make me think about parts of the A that I hadn't thought important enough to mention (we're talking small detail level stuff).

[Zenstudent]

Look, we all only have two choices: Accept who they are, their limitations and weaknesses and move on....

 

Or do not accept it and divorce.

 

There is healing in emotional, angry, tearful outbursts if the utterances ring true. Harder, for me is when they start going there and then shut down, either out so shame or fear or both.

 

Another unmet need of the BS. Sometimes, they are just incapable. can YOU accept that?

 

I told my IC it began to feel like kicking a dog when it is down. Cruel almost, in my press for emotional truths from my fWS....Hey, I was ALWAYS the stronger one.

 

so yes....it is a double-edged sword in that ok, NOW we are finally getting somewhere, but damn....I hate that I made you cry.

 

Can you live with the possibility that they may never introspect or come close enough to the their truth to heal you?

 

because that is a very real possibility when you love a weaker, more fragile person.

This is what I thougt when I read the OP, thanks for clearing my thoughts and putting the finger on exactly THE one thing that I struggle with. My wife just doesn't do introspection, never did. She also doesn't express deeper thoughts about emotions either - FOO I believe. Every problem is to her just "don't worry about it"-ish.

 

It's just difficult to know for sure if you deal with a remorseful fWW or not (I saw Janes response to this, don't know if I fully agree, I think that we're all very different when it comes to these issues of expressing our selves).

 

I wish I had a waterproof formula to calculate the likelyhood of future infidelity. I sense a new thread emerging.

[road]

I don't remember all of the details at this point. I have a hard time sorting out one encounter from another - they get jumbled in my head. It makes time frame a challenge. H found a transcript of our texts and I honestly didn't realize things had escalated to that point by Sept until I read them.

 

Often I find that what I think is important is not what H is fixated on. He asks questions sometimes (even a year later!) that make me think about parts of the A that I hadn't thought important enough to mention (we're talking small detail level stuff).

 

 

 

 

 

Witting a detailed time line helps the WS to remember details.

[janedoe67]

Witting a detailed time line helps the WS to remember details.

 

This is true, and should their particular BS ask for it then I believe they should do so without hesitation.

 

I know my own motives, and my h was pretty could at knowing them too because he lived at me.

 

OP, it is probably the same for you. You know your wife. Do YOU believe she is remorseful? A group of strangers is NOT going to know the answer to that better than you do. Period.

[Timmos]

This is true, and should their particular BS ask for it then I believe they should do so without hesitation.

 

I know my own motives, and my h was pretty could at knowing them too because he lived at me.

 

OP, it is probably the same for you. You know your wife. Do YOU believe she is remorseful? A group of strangers is NOT going to know the answer to that better than you do. Period.

 

I believe she is both remorseful and introspective. She is going with me to my next IC appointment in order to make one for herself, without me asking her to.

 

Earlier in the week, as she was working, I stood outside a doorway - she did not know I was there. She was talking to herself, cursing and telling herself just how ****ing stupid she was and that she needed to figure herself out. It was rather harsh.

[peruano99]

I read your other thread and you said she broke NC? She didn't fool around with him during that time right? If she did, I see where your problem is.

[compulsivedancer]

Witting a detailed time line helps the WS to remember details.

Why would I want to? H got the details he needs. I would like the rest to fade naturally. I don't want a chart I can refer back to in order to rehearse my memories. The more you practice a memory, the more permanent it becomes.

[Timmos]

I read your other thread and you said she broke NC? She didn't fool around with him during that time right? If she did, I see where your problem is.

 

She never truly went NC on DDay. However, the conversations - strictly only via work emails after DDay - became very awkward and even "normalized." All romantic nonsense was dropped. It seemed very much just like two people catching up with each other. They slowed down and eventually came to a halt, especially when a co-worker started helping my WW see through the fog (If you see something, say something! But that's another topic!). When this happened, she admitted everything and TT'd me pretty badly. That's when my decision to contact the OM's wife became certain. My wife had seen me struggling with the idea of contacting her for a couple weeks and knew that the reason I had not was based upon lies that she had told me. When she admitted the lies, there was no reason NOT to contact OM's wife.

 

I invited her boss to our house and asked him for the emails. I got the conversations, as well as her boss's assurance that he would be blocked from sending any others. I have little doubt that I missed anything.

 

Edit: Had she fooled around with him? No, she hadn't seen him in quite some time by that point. The physical side only lasted a month. Funny how quickly someone can become your soulmate.

Edited February 1, 2014 by Timmos

[jnel921]

My WH cries and gets sick to his stomach. He is truly remorseful. He wants us to work and find our way back to the calm. Until then we weather the storm together...

[aliveagain]

I still struggle with the plotting and lying, the extremities she went to in order to deceive me. How do you overcome that? How do you get over a Judas Iscariot, a Marcus Brutus, a Dona Marina(La Malinche), a Benedict Arnold a Tokyo Rose? How do you get over what her best friend tells you, "she wanted something of the Other Man she could keep forever" she intentionally had his child. You can not forgive that. No counsellor has been able to help me with that yet, I have tried several.

[Oberfeldwebel]

Making your spouse cry is not all that difficult, if that is what you want to do. However, if your objective is reconciliation and not retribution, then making her cry would be counter productive.

 

This board is an excellent area for you to yell and scream to relieve the stress that you have no other venue to release that pressure. Also they are effective for people who's spouses are cheating on them, to help them through the process. However, all we know about your spouse is what you tell us about your spouse. So what you tell us directly affects the type of advice you receive.

 

Nobody here knows your wife like you do. If your gut is telling you she is cheating, there is a very high likelihood that that she is cheating. Conversely, if your gut is telling you that she is sorry, and desires to reconcile. The key to reconciliation is honesty. The mistake of most WS is through lies of omission or TT. They believe that by being less than completely honest they are saving your feelings. This in fact comes off as just another lie and is more painful in the long run. The BS makes the mistake of lying to themselves, because they want the relationship so bad they refuse to acknowledge the reality of the situation.

 

My best advise is to learn to communicate with each other effectively and honestly. Don't get caught up in the minutia and stick to the big picture. Take time to yourself to blow off steam as necessary, but don't take it out on each other. I believe that most relationships can be fixed IF both parties work to fix the problem.

[peruano99]

She never truly went NC on DDay. However, the conversations - strictly only via work emails after DDay - became very awkward and even "normalized." All romantic nonsense was dropped. It seemed very much just like two people catching up with each other. They slowed down and eventually came to a halt, especially when a co-worker started helping my WW see through the fog (If you see something, say something! But that's another topic!). When this happened, she admitted everything and TT'd me pretty badly. That's when my decision to contact the OM's wife became certain. My wife had seen me struggling with the idea of contacting her for a couple weeks and knew that the reason I had not was based upon lies that she had told me. When she admitted the lies, there was no reason NOT to contact OM's wife.

 

I invited her boss to our house and asked him for the emails. I got the conversations, as well as her boss's assurance that he would be blocked from sending any others. I have little doubt that I missed anything.

 

Edit: Had she fooled around with him? No, she hadn't seen him in quite some time by that point. The physical side only lasted a month. Funny how quickly someone can become your soulmate.

 

 

So they only had contact by work and emails?

[road]

I don't remember all of the details at this point. I have a hard time sorting out one encounter from another - they get jumbled in my head. It makes time frame a challenge. H found a transcript of our texts and I honestly didn't realize things had escalated to that point by Sept until I read them.

 

Often I find that what I think is important is not what H is fixated on. He asks questions sometimes (even a year later!) that make me think about parts of the A that I hadn't thought important enough to mention (we're talking small detail level stuff).

 

Witting a detailed time line helps the WS to remember details.

 

Why would I want to? H got the details he needs. I would like the rest to fade naturally. I don't want a chart I can refer back to in order to rehearse my memories. The more you practice a memory, the more permanent it becomes.

 

 

 

 

 

You and all WS's would want to based on what you have written. You have a BH that is still needing to ask questions.

 

 

Because what you think is not important. The WS does not get to be the gate keeper of the facts. It is for the BS to decide what he needs to know.

 

 

Yes talking about the affair will keep you from forgetting it. You BH having unanswered questions will keep him from forgetting the affair.

 

 

Though based again on what you have written is that you only care about your ability to forget the affair but will not do what is necessary to fill in the missing pieces so your BH will have no more unanswered questions. So your BH can forget the affair.

 

 

Now a BH once all has heard all about the affair. Then needs to not talk about the affair ever again. For he will be keeping the affair alive for the WW and himself.

[sidney2718]

At this point, I honestly don't have any questions left to ask. I can't think of anything else that hasn't been answered (and confirmed in one way or another). My problem at the moment is doubting the answers I have been given, simply because I am wary to accept very much as true. Takes time, I guess.

 

Timmos: I'm not clear about what you mean. You first say that everything has been answered and confirmed and then you say that you are wary about accepting those answers. Am I reading you correctly?

 

I do understand how both statements can be true at the same time. You don't really want answers, you want the questions to go away and you want the events to go away as well. That won't happen.

 

What has happened is that your old relationship is gone. But you can have a new one with a person for whom you still have feelings -- a better starting place than most. Of course you have to choose to follow this path. That's up to you, nobody can decide for you. My only advice would be to judge by actions as well as answers.

[Timmos]

So they only had contact by work and emails?

 

The SOB OM was fired about a month after their affair began. He saw WW a week later. I came back home from out of state soon after. We then went out of country for a few weeks. There was only a small window of time between these events where they could have seen each other. I was very vigilant, however, and I am certain that they had not seen each other in quite some time. After DDay, their only means of contact was via her work email. It took several weeks for the fog to clear. At that time, she confessed that she had still been in contact with him, but that she had stopped the conversations several weeks before. She "didn't want to tell me, as things were going so well."

[Timmos]

Timmos: I'm not clear about what you mean. You first say that everything has been answered and confirmed and then you say that you are wary about accepting those answers. Am I reading you correctly?

 

I do understand how both statements can be true at the same time. You don't really want answers, you want the questions to go away and you want the events to go away as well. That won't happen.

 

What has happened is that your old relationship is gone. But you can have a new one with a person for whom you still have feelings -- a better starting place than most. Of course you have to choose to follow this path. That's up to you, nobody can decide for you. My only advice would be to judge by actions as well as answers.

 

It is an odd state of affairs when I trust so little that I am even skeptical of what is certain, isn't it? lol

 

I have always had trust issues. I had a rather rough childhood and convinced myself early on that most people were *******s and not to be trusted, as they would all hurt you in the end. Its something I have worked on for years, and until recently, I felt I had made huge improvements.

 

Then the one person I have ever truly trusted stabbed me in the back. Years of work has been undone. Even if I confirm something - well, I have been hurt beyond measure, and am wary of it happening again.

 

If that makes any sense.

[Fluttershy]

I still struggle with the plotting and lying, the extremities she went to in order to deceive me. How do you overcome that? How do you get over a Judas Iscariot, a Marcus Brutus, a Dona Marina(La Malinche), a Benedict Arnold a Tokyo Rose? How do you get over what her best friend tells you, "she wanted something of the Other Man she could keep forever" she intentionally had his child. You can not forgive that. No counsellor has been able to help me with that yet, I have tried several.

 

Your story is one of those particularly distrbing stories. I am sorry you went through that. I am sorry for her child and all the innocent people he sabatoges eith her inability to grow up.

[xAkulax]

I will never under stand why any one would put them self throw so much emotional agony by reconciling

[Fluttershy]

I will never under stand why any one would put them self throw so much emotional agony by reconciling

 

Love, history, selflessness, children, hope, forgiveness, desire,

 

Or

 

Fear, weakness, worthlessness, brutes for punishment,

 

Though the latter doesn't usually work out for real reconciliaion.

[xAkulax]

To each his own then I don't believe it's a matter of fear more of a matter of self respect but like I sad to each his own

Edited February 2, 2014 by xAkulax

[Fluttershy]

To each his own then I don't believe it's a matter of fear more of a matter of self respect but like I sad to each his own

 

Not every person or situation can be painted with a broad brush... So yes to each their own.