Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Here is a question for all you women who look for "nice, deep guys". Which method do you think will get me more phone numbers, if I am sitting in a bar or a club reading Plato, or if I have tossed back a few beers and am out there hootin and hollerin and making a spectacle of myself?
Mustard Bomb Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Well, if you're reading Plato, I would find you attractive, but would not want to disturb you. Also, if the guy next to you is reading Aristotle, he is clearly your intellectual superior, so I would have to respect his privacy instead.
Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Mustard Bomb Well, if you're reading Plato, I would find you attractive, but would not want to disturb you. Also, if the guy next to you is reading Aristotle, he is clearly your intellectual superior, so I would have to respect his privacy instead. Okay, so what if I was refining a paper I wrote about my theory that Socrates was a construct of Plato's imagination and never existed?
Merin Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Devildog Here is a question for all you women who look for "nice, deep guys". Which method do you think will get me more phone numbers, if I am sitting in a bar or a club reading Plato, or if I have tossed back a few beers and am out there hootin and hollerin and making a spectacle of myself? Nice, deep guys NEVER toss back a few beers and hoot and holler with thier friends at a club? I would wonder why you were in a club reading ANYTHING.. Oh hell Devildog.. YOU would still get a lot of the ladies phone numbers regardless.. Marines.. I would hate to think that you wouldn't be considered a "nice deep guy" because you go out and have some fun even if it's hootin and hollerin with your friends.. there is a difference between having a good time and being an idiot.. we've all seen it regardless of gender.. it's either the drunkass guy who's idea of a good pick up line slurring out "Nice hooters" OR it's the drunkass girl who thinks she's still got it going on with puke in her hair..
Mustard Bomb Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Devildog Okay, so what if I was refining a paper I wrote about my theory that Socrates was a construct of Plato's imagination and never existed? Wow - then I would buy you drinks until you could no longer focus on text.
Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Merin Nice, deep guys NEVER toss back a few beers and hoot and holler with thier friends at a club? Of course they do. My point of the question was when faced with an obvious opportunity of meeting a deep, intellectual type guy, and meeting a loud, drunken crass type guy, how many phone numbers do you think each would get? I guarantee the drunk gets 5 - 10 times as many numbers on any day. Because he looks like fun, a good time. But "most" women want a nice deep guy. Sure they do I would hate to think that you wouldn't be considered a "nice deep guy" because you go out and have some fun even if it's hootin and hollerin with your friends.. there is a difference between having a good time and being an idiot.. And I have seen far to many instances where the idiot who is always drunk, and hootin and hollerin and making a total "assclown" of himself gets a lot more attention from the "nice girls".
Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Mustard Bomb Wow - then I would buy you drinks until you could no longer focus on text. I did actually write a paper on that subject for a Philosophy class I took. Got an A for originality if nothing else.
Mustard Bomb Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 I would agree that some girls go for easy-access, drunken, guys. I have heard them called ATM machines - lovely for constant withdrawals and occasional deposits. That's it. The rule of the club jungle from my end is that if a guy is a jerk, or a wannabe jerk, it's ok to use him. I would not do it; I'm a nerd; but I feel so sorry watching the guys puffing out like they think they are players and getting impoverished by women who have also read "How to Get Women" and laughed, a lot.
Merin Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Devildog Of course they do. My point of the question was when faced with an obvious opportunity of meeting a deep, intellectual type guy, and meeting a loud, drunken crass type guy, how many phone numbers do you think each would get? I guarantee the drunk gets 5 - 10 times as many numbers on any day. Because he looks like fun, a good time. But "most" women want a nice deep guy. Sure they do And I have seen far to many instances where the idiot who is always drunk, and hootin and hollerin and making a total "assclown" of himself gets a lot more attention from the "nice girls". So could the same be said when roles are reversed then... Is the girl who is wearing less and having a few drinks and dancing on the table going to get hit on by more guys because she looks like "fun" OR is the girl who is the intellectual type and not as "fun" going to have the guys lined up to get her number.. But "most" guys want a nice, intellectual type.. sure they do. I have also seen often it's the girl who looks like a "good time" dancing on the table get the attention over the "nice girl" so IMO it works both ways.
Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Merin So could the same be said when roles are reversed then... Is the girl who is wearing less and having a few drinks and dancing on the table going to get hit on by more guys because she looks like "fun" OR is the girl who is the intellectual type and not as "fun" going to have the guys lined up to get her number.. But "most" guys want a nice, intellectual type.. sure they do. Oh trust me, I never said that most guys want a nice intellectual type. A few of us actually do though. I know I had quite a few "sparks" with a number of women that I had sat down with and had a deep, intellectual conversation with, irregardless of looks. One of them was a very straight laced, conservative type. But as I was in a relationship with my STBXW, I never pursued anything further than those initial conversations. I have also seen often it's the girl who looks like a "good time" dancing on the table get the attention over the "nice girl" so IMO it works both ways. I agree it works both ways. My point is that if men and women want a more meaningful relationship with a nice person, why do they go out of their way to avoid the deep, meaningful, intellectual types? It is just stupid in my opinion. But if you want to play the game you have to go by the rules, and the rules seem to be "jerks get alot further ahead than nice people".
moimeme Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 why do they go out of their way to avoid the deep, meaningful, intellectual types? And who does that? You seem to be assuming that (a) they can somehow divine that you are such a fellow from the ether and/or (b) that the women going for the party animals actually are seeking intellectual types and making do with the others. Where, exactly, does one find oneself a 'deep intellectual type' man? Where are you hiding that those of us who'd want one can't find you?
Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by moimeme And who does that? You seem to be assuming that (a) they can somehow divine that you are such a fellow from the ether and/or (b) that the women going for the party animals actually are seeking intellectual types and making do with the others. Where, exactly, does one find oneself a 'deep intellectual type' man? Where are you hiding that those of us who'd want one can't find you? They don't hide. They are usually right there in front of you. You know, the guys you call "friends" because they are everything you say you want in a man but you wouldn't want to be physical with them. I've never actually heard a woman state "I want an alcoholic, high-school drop out with out a job" but how many of those types do you see going around asking why they got dumped or rejected? All the unemployed, drunk drop-outs here raise your hands....... anyone.... anyone...?
moimeme Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 They are usually right there in front of you. You know, the guys you call "friends" because they are everything you say you want in a man but you wouldn't want to be physical with them. Wrongo. The guys in front of me I call 'pals' because they are not that swift of wit; not that they're dolts but they can't keep up. I'm happy to know them and have coffee with them but that's it. Anybody I've ever met that was 'everything I say I want in a man', I have taken up with. There just are not that many people who fill the bill. My enthusiasm overcame my sense on a couple of occasions and the people were not what I initially thought they were. I still want the 'nice guy'. Many, many women do not look for the 'bad guy'. However, as I said earlier, people who insist on believing in generalizations which are by their very nature inaccurate are already putting the lie to the idea that they are 'intelligent'. So believe what you wish; if you enjoy being bitter and creating a fake persona to get laid, so be it.
Zoot Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 It seems to me there are quite a few women on here who need a REAL Semper Fi date. Bet it would ease all that stress.
Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Many, many women do not look for the 'bad guy'. Then how do you account for the huge majority of women who end up with that type of guy even when there is a "good guy" right under their nose doing everything to get noticed? I have known alot of women who had a good guy and left for the bad boy. I have known alot of good guys who got dumped for the bad boy. I have known alot of bad boys that stole women away from good guys. I can't think of any good guys where a woman left a bad boy for them. However, as I said earlier, people who insist on believing in generalizations which are by their very nature inaccurate are already putting the lie to the idea that they are 'intelligent'. We are on an annonymous message board. And we are talking about people in general. Hard not to create generalizations. Are these generalizations absolute fact about everyone? Of course not. But it fits the majority. If you are willing to wait until you are 80 years old to finally find that "perfect" person for you, great. But if you want to have a chance at finding someone who might not be "perfect" but is a pretty close fit, you will most likely have to adjust yourself to survive the game. So believe what you wish; if you enjoy being bitter and creating a fake persona to get laid, so be it. I wouldn't say I am bitter, just being realistic given my observations, and those observations match alot of other peoples observations. I'm not going to create a fake persona for any reason. I don't think this is what Virginia Bob originally meant with this thread. How does a nice guy go to being a mega jerk? It doesn't happen usually. Few people have the ability to be one way and go to an extreme opposite like that. But for a nice guy to not call a girl back when he said he would, that is a huge shift to the dark side for him. He would feel he was being a jerk, even if it wouldn't even register on most people's jerkometers.
Zoot Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Why does not calling a woman back make a guy a bad guy? Perhaps he did the date and realised it wasn't a match. Isn't that what dating is about? You check out someone to determine if there maybe a furture. If you see there isn't -then you would move on.
Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 In reality it doesn't zoot, but to a nice guy, he would feel a certain degree of guilt by not calling her back. This would make him feel like a jerk.
moimeme Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 As long as you assert that your conclusions, which IMHO are based on flawed analysis of your admittedly anecdotal evidence, are correct, there's really nothing to discuss. I dispute your assumptions and your analysis, which renders your conclusions invalid. For instance: the huge majority of women who end up with that type of guy What 'huge majority'? Where are these women? And what type of guy is it? Do you know these men all intimately? Or have you ever considered that they may act one way when you're around to keep up a macho image - all part of male posturing - but are not that bad at all? I have known alot of good guys who got dumped for the bad boy You have no idea what your 'good guys' are like in relationships. You make your judgement based on male relationships which have totally different dynamics from male-female relationships. And based on the stories the men tell about their relationships which inevitably paint themselves as saints. And actually, if birds of a feather flock together, I'm picturing a whole bunch of embittered men ready to draw fallacious conclusions based on little evidence moaning and whining together about how they're not appreciated and I'd not be all that surprised that none of them are finding happy partners.
Zoot Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Devildog In reality it doesn't zoot, but to a nice guy, he would feel a certain degree of guilt by not calling her back. This would make him feel like a jerk. I agree. But what would he say? You are a really nice girl but you don't float my boat? Sometimes there isn't anything 'nice' to say. You just make it worse by building hope.
Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 I dispute your assumptions and your analysis, which renders your conclusions invalid. My deepest apologies for thinking something the wise and all knowing moimeme doesn't agree with. Forgive me for stating my opinion based on my observations on what is obviously your area of expertise. Based on your heated denial of the existence of the possibility or that it ever happens, I have to wonder if you feel some degree of guilt for having crushed a few nice guys yourself.
Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Originally posted by Zoot I agree. But what would he say? You are a really nice girl but you don't float my boat? Sometimes there isn't anything 'nice' to say. You just make it worse by building hope. Personally, I think it is less damaging to be honest if possible. Otherwise the person is left with no answers, only questions.
Zoot Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Honesty can be very painful. Try telling someone , as this thread suggested, that she was ugly but you boned her anyway. It's not one of life's better moments. I hate to laugh because I'm sure it's not funny. But I am because it is. Generally, nice girls aren't in that position. An ugly one might be.
Devildog Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Point well taken Zoot. But in my opinion (did you catch that moimeme?) a real nice guy wouldn't bone a chick he felt nothing for. If I wasn't attracted to the woman in any meaningful way that a relationship could be built on, I wouldn't be able to jump in the sack unless it was specifically what she wanted as well.
Author VirginiaBob Posted January 14, 2005 Author Posted January 14, 2005 "And based on the stories the men tell about their relationships which inevitably paint themselves as saints." Ever think that just possibly only the nice guys are the only ones telling thier relationships stories on here so that they can learn from the experience, because the jerks just don't really care?
Zoot Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 What's being a nice guy got to do with how you handle a one night stand with an 'ugly' girl? Granted, you didn't have to go there - but if you did - you gotta face up to the fact that you just may not be feeling the love in the morning. You don't want to share toast and you don't want to call her. You test drove and didn't buy. That doesn't make youa jerk - just a smart shopper.
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