Author High_hopes Posted January 10, 2014 Author Posted January 10, 2014 The way I feel and this is based on my own experiences. You can agree or disagree.. When you meet someone you've met online for the first time it should be dutch if it's anything but a cup of coffee. I will suggest coffee but if someone suggest dinner and or drinks you both should pay. This has nothing to do with tradition or not being a gentlemen or any views I have about women. Traditions have changed in some ways. You may not agree with me but it doesn't make me a bad person or not a gentlemen.
clia Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 The way I feel and this is based on my own experiences. You can agree or disagree.. When you meet someone you've met online for the first time it should be dutch if it's anything but a cup of coffee. I will suggest coffee but if someone suggest dinner and or drinks you both should pay. This has nothing to do with tradition or not being a gentlemen or any views I have about women. Traditions have changed in some ways. You may not agree with me but it doesn't make me a bad person or not a gentlemen. Then why did you pay for all of it? If this is how you really feel, then you should've said that and asked her to pitch in. You do understand that not everyone feels this way, right? It doesn't make her a bad person; it doesn't make you a bad person. The two of you just failed to communicate your expectations for a first OLD meeting. 3
Author High_hopes Posted January 10, 2014 Author Posted January 10, 2014 When you originally agreed to meet her for a drink did you intend to pay? Or did your view change during the course of the date? Or did it change after she told you she didn't want to see you again? IMO if you didn't want to pay, then you shouldn't have paid. You can't expect her to read your mind. You picked up the tab and paid for it without asking her to chip in -- and somehow that's her fault? If this was such a concern, you should've stuck to your guns on meeting her for coffee. That is a good way to cheaply pay for a first date. A lot of women -- including me -- expect a man who asks us out to pay for the first date and typically do not offer to pay for the first date. It seems that the woman you met up with is one of these types. There are plenty of other women out there who want to split the bill on a first date. Obviously you are probably more compatible with one of them if you are complaining about buying this woman two drinks. At any rate, you have to speak up for yourself. You should've put in the cash for your two beers and then slid the check over to her. That is how you handle it. Clia, I understand what your saying but It wasn't a date. It was a meeting on a whim. She lives up the block. I said lets meet for coffee and she said lets go for a beer. Yes, you can say I could have insisted on going for coffee. I find it very difficult to speak up in these situations. before, during or after. How does a guy say. Ok that's 30 each? or Hey, lets go dutch. Yes, I do understand it doesn't make her a made person. Totally agree. I even said at the beginning that she seemed very sweet.
PegNosePete Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 I agree with your opinion, anyone with class who doesn't indent to see you again should pay their half. But it is a simple fact that many people do not share that viewpoint. If you feel so strongly about it then you should make it known in advance that you expect to split the bill, otherwise you are going to be similarly upset and frustrated many, many times in your life. Of course the problem then becomes, bringing up this subject may lose you quite a few dates with nice women who would have offered to pay without being prompted. Because bringing this topic up in advance makes you seem tight. So the best solution - just accept that, like it or not, it is the way the dating game works. You can either play or not, your choice. 2
Ninjainpajamas Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Wait...just got a great idea! Fill your car trunk with an assortment of ingredients for all the popular girly drinks and red wines, don't forget a small bag of ice in a chest (this could later be used in sexual endeavors as well) Now...when you take a girl out, and she orders a drink, say to her "No...I'll get it for you" Run out to your car, open your bartender catalog, make the drink then hurry back into the bar...but slow down as you walk through the door, and just play it cool and casual, and more importantly sing the below as you walk back to the table drink in hand... Man....in a week, or two, shhiiiiiiii...you could literally save hundreds if not thousands of dollars. 2
BlametheIrish Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 I always,offer to pay if I like the guy, then tell him he can pick up the check next time. If I dislike him I go dutch. Everyone has their own views on how first dates should go. No need to.get mad about it OP. To ninjainpajamas: you are one of my favorite posters on this site, you always seem to explain things in a direct way without being too nice or just plain mean. 1
Author High_hopes Posted January 10, 2014 Author Posted January 10, 2014 Wait...just got a great idea! Fill your car trunk with an assortment of ingredients for all the popular girly drinks and red wines, don't forget a small bag of ice in a chest (this could later be used in sexual endeavors as well) Now...when you take a girl out, and she orders a drink, say to her "No...I'll get it for you" Run out to your car, open your bartender catalog, make the drink then hurry back into the bar...but slow down as you walk through the door, and just play it cool and casual, and more importantly sing the below as you walk back to the table drink in hand... Man....in a week, or two, shhiiiiiiii...you could literally save hundreds if not thousands of dollars. Maybe I should put some burgers back there too? 2
Author High_hopes Posted January 10, 2014 Author Posted January 10, 2014 I always,offer to pay if I like the guy, then tell him he can pick up the check next time. If I dislike him I go dutch. Everyone has their own views on how first dates should go. No need to.get mad about it OP. To ninjainpajamas: you are one of my favorite posters on this site, you always seem to explain things in a direct way without being too nice or just plain mean. Not mad and yes of course everyone has there opinions. I do respect that. I don't like it when people bash me for mine instead of just stating there opinion how how they feel about it. Anyway, that's not the majority. 1
Keenly Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Not mad and yes of course everyone has there opinions. I do respect that. I don't like it when people bash me for mine instead of just stating there opinion how how they feel about it. Anyway, that's not the majority. You are getting bashed because there is an ongoing thread about this issue ( even though this scenario is clearly different because you have never met this woman before ) so they are trying to make it into the same discussion, which it isn't. Some women beleive you owe them the drink for the time they took out of their day to see you. These women, like your former lady friend there, should be made to pay half so that they might come back down to earth a little. Its just too bad you caved. 1
emva07 Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 you seem to be talking a lot about what your expectations are (this wasn't a date, she should offer to pay, she should offer to pay if she didn't feel it), but in order for the girl to know this, you have to let it be known if this is how upset you are going to get when the girl isn't into you and you paid. OLD stands for Online DATING.So unless specifically told otherwise....she went into it as a date. Next time tell the girl "just to make things clear...the first time I meet a girl on here it's more informal, I don't consider them dates" Then when the bill comes ask something along the lines of "how do you want to split this?" If she is appalled then she's not your type, if she's cool with it then she's your type. You can't expect people to do what you think is the right thing to do....people are different...you have to let your opinions be known. 6
Art_Critic Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Consider it the best 12 bucks you've spent, 12 bucks to find out that the person isn't the kind of girl you want to spend time with... oh.. and cheap date IMO... 2
Art_Critic Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Price of dating and if you feel that way, you will lessen your field of possibilities. Sorry… but that's the way of the world. Complain all you want, but it is unlikely to change anything. Very True.... Cost to do business in a sense...
Phantom888 Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Dating is expensive. That's just the way it is. The older you get, the price of being single goes up because women get more expensive (refined) tastes. You can of course date women who offer to pay all the time... there are women like that. But if that's not your style, then you just gotta date less frequently. I think the drinks during first meet is too casual for my taste. I want a full date, but of course I take the time to communicate for weeks before the first meet. You should not have any expectations after paying for a date. I mean, OLD is a gamble. Just enjoy the evening with an attractive woman. If there is no chemistry, at least you had a nice conversation. I always kiss on the 1st date, so at least I get a nice kiss for the $100 meal for two. 1
Iguanna Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 If she was an honorable person, she would pay her half of the bill and then say that there is no chemistry, so it's better that they remain friends. But she chose to let him pay the bill, give him some hope that everything went well (for the chance that he actually liked her) and she rejected him the next day. This shows me that she isn't honorable or honest, but manipulative. OP you are right for being mad and defended. You dodged a bullet. Hang in there, there ARE honorable and fair women out there. 2
Ruby Slippers Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 I agree that if the woman doesn't see herself dating the man again, she should pay for her part. I also agree with other posters who say that if you don't want to pay for the first date, you need to make that clear, either up front or when the bill arrives. 1
normal person Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 (edited) Whenever this conversation comes up it always seems like splitting hairs. The more it gets dissected and scrutinized, the more absurd it all becomes especially when the whole thing was ignited by $12. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I feel like if you're a man living in the US you should just expect to pay for everything, regardless of how justifiable your belief on the matter is. If you don't, you run the risk of coming off in a variety on unflattering ways even if your suggestion to pay half is reasonable on paper. Even if it is right for a woman to pay half, if you don't at least offer to pay it in full, her opinion of you is going to be lowered whether or not you're right. It's a losing battle, you just have to buck up and pay it regardless of whether or not she likes you. It's just the society we live in. Sorry if that's counterproductive, but I do think it's realistic. OP, price of doing business. You gotta pay to play. This guy knows the score. Edited January 10, 2014 by normal person 5
FitChick Posted January 11, 2014 Posted January 11, 2014 Considering how difficult it seems to be for men on this board to even get that first date, they aren't exactly going broke dating. Avoid this awkward situation in the future by stating on your profile that you always go Dutch on the first 'meet and greet' but if you mutually decide to date each other afterward, you will gladly pay. 5
MissBee Posted January 11, 2014 Posted January 11, 2014 Thoughts?! I actually feel like telling her 'next time offer to pay for your 12 dollar martini' This will make you seem cheap and petty. Don't do it. But if I didn't feel a connection with a guy I would offer to pay. If any of you fellas ever go on a date with me that's the "tell" that I don't like you, as I will offer to pay for my stuff and will wish you well and that's that. If I like you I believe I will see you again and will possibly have many other opportunities to treat you. But to be honest, not sure how you can broach this subject. You can just flat out put it out there that you expect someone to pay their half but there have been many threads on this and for me personally I would be turned off by a man who would make such an announcement; but, I also do my part in that I am not gonna let you pay if I'm not interested. 1
veggirl Posted January 11, 2014 Posted January 11, 2014 Personally I wouldn't be interested in paying for a guy if he wasn't interested in going out again. I don't know why people are getting hung up on the $12, it's kinda the principle behind the matter imo, not the exact dollar amount. I'd never let a guy pay for me if I knew I wasn't gonna see him again. It's rude & it's classless. 4
MissBee Posted January 11, 2014 Posted January 11, 2014 Personally I wouldn't be interested in paying for a guy if he wasn't interested in going out again. I don't know why people are getting hung up on the $12, it's kinda the principle behind the matter imo, not the exact dollar amount. I'd never let a guy pay for me if I knew I wasn't gonna see him again. It's rude & it's classless. I wouldn't either, and it is the principle. But since the OP seemed to really make it a point that he would send a message about "Next time pay for your $12 martini", he seemed really peeved about that price tag in particular. If for some reason a guy felt he should message me about the $12 he spent, I would ask for his address and mail him $20 and tell him to keep the change and put it towards his savings since apparently he's that hard-pressed. 3
Tayla Posted January 11, 2014 Posted January 11, 2014 Whenever this conversation comes up it always seems like splitting hairs. The more it gets dissected and scrutinized, the more absurd it all becomes especially when the whole thing was ignited by $12. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I feel like if you're a man living in the US you should just expect to pay for everything, regardless of how justifiable your belief on the matter is. If you don't, you run the risk of coming off in a variety on unflattering ways even if your suggestion to pay half is reasonable on paper. Even if it is right for a woman to pay half, if you don't at least offer to pay it in full, her opinion of you is going to be lowered whether or not you're right. It's a losing battle, you just have to buck up and pay it regardless of whether or not she likes you. It's just the society we live in. Sorry if that's counterproductive, but I do think it's realistic. This guy knows the score. Pretty sure I live in America and pay taxes. And I respectfully and whole heartedly disagree that its a MANs" DUTY" to pay. I'm all about pay your way thru life and accept generosity with proper reciprication. Its a winning delight when two adults can be responsible for themselves ! To the OP- As a lady , I can assure you that you are well within your opinion and standards to be a bit miffed /ired. The girl was less then forthright in paying or offering her fair share. Do not ever think its the "price" you have to pay to date or meet a lady...most ladies who are worth it, know that its proper to offer a tip or pay the tab even 2
CrystalCastles Posted January 11, 2014 Posted January 11, 2014 And then women wonder why they get labelled as "gold-diggers" by men. I'm in agreement with Keenly. The woman you were with, OP, should have paid if she didn't feel chemistry. As others have said, she behaved in an entitled and manipulative way. I always offer to pay, at least for my own share when I'm out with someone who I feel no chemistry with. Even when I do feel chemistry with someone, I still bring out my wallet because I don't want the man to feel like I expect him to pay. I love it when a man pays, not because I've saved some money, but because I feel cared for. But it's not a requirement and it was rude of this girl to expect that the OP pay. That being said, OP, there are many women out there who will gladly pay, at least for their share. And of course, there are many women who would seize any opportunity for a free dinner/drink/etc. because oh right, they're entitled princesses and it's obviously the man's job to pay. You just need to communicate next time about who pays. Don't do it in a mean way, but by all means express your views. If the girl is a nice girl, she will understand. If not, why would you want to keep dating her anyway. 2
veggirl Posted January 11, 2014 Posted January 11, 2014 Is wanting someone else to pay their FAIR SHARE when that person is not gonna see you again really being "hung up" on money though? I mean if so, you could say that placing value on a man paying (ie: he paid, so he likes me! he is a gentleman!) is ALSO being "hung up" on money. We see plenty of threads where girls say "I don't get it. We had such a romantic date, and he insisted on paying for EVERYTHING!!! But then he disappeared?!?!" Sorry but basically requiring a man to pay to prove he is generous & a gentleman is just as "hung up on money" as a guy feeling sh*t on when he did pay & didn't even get a call back. I just don't get why you'd sit back & let someone (anyone) pay for you if you were never gonna see him/her again. 3
veggirl Posted January 11, 2014 Posted January 11, 2014 TBH worrying about "he didn't pay for me, I'm so turned off" or "She didn't offer to pay her share, I'm so turned off"..............both of those just show the date was NOT successful. I know I paid 1/2 on my first date with my bf (he paid first activity and I paid the 2nd) and it NEVER crossed my mind that there was ANYthing amiss with that. I was too busy enjoying my date to care about who paid for what. If you're thinking about it, it probably isn't right. 2
Keenly Posted January 11, 2014 Posted January 11, 2014 Is wanting someone else to pay their FAIR SHARE when that person is not gonna see you again really being "hung up" on money though? I mean if so, you could say that placing value on a man paying (ie: he paid, so he likes me! he is a gentleman!) is ALSO being "hung up" on money. We see plenty of threads where girls say "I don't get it. We had such a romantic date, and he insisted on paying for EVERYTHING!!! But then he disappeared?!?!" Sorry but basically requiring a man to pay to prove he is generous & a gentleman is just as "hung up on money" as a guy feeling sh*t on when he did pay & didn't even get a call back. I just don't get why you'd sit back & let someone (anyone) pay for you if you were never gonna see him/her again. In my professional loveshack therapist opinion, she was too much of a coward to tell him to his face, so she played helpless. 1
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