CrystalCastles Posted January 8, 2014 Posted January 8, 2014 I recently went on two dates with a guy who turned out to be a player. I didn't have sex with him but I did get carried away with heavy making out. I told my friend this, because I ended up rejecting the guy but I wasn't sure at the time if it was the right thing to do, and I needed a second opinion, plus her support. Instead of doing that, she sent me a really judgmental message about the guys I've dated in the past, and this guy too. She compared herself to me, and asked me why I always seem to be dating bad people, why does this never happen to her, why does she never get involved with players and bad men and I do. I called her out on this and she apologized, but I can't get over what she said. She's only had one bf, and she made him wait 2 years before she had sex with him. I'm aware I should not have mentioned anything, but that doesn't matter now. She painted me in a really bad light. We're both 21. I'm still figuring out what I want in men, and while I don't plan on having sex until I'm exclusive with someone, I also am a pretty physical person and my pace is not my friend's pace. My friend also bashed my bff for having a faster pace than her too (my bff had sex with her man after 3 months of dating). I feel like my friend pushed her morals onto me. My relationship life is virtually non-existent because I'm really picky with who I go out with, and it's also a sensitive issue for me. I feel like my friend completely disregarded that, and I cannot stop feeling angry at her. What do I do? Is my anger justified?
Heatemyheart89 Posted January 8, 2014 Posted January 8, 2014 (edited) Oh dear! Sounds like she is waaaaay to judgemental. You did nothing wrong as I see it. I think she is jealous she didn't go on a date.I got called a s*** by a friend at uni who had never had a boyfriend despite not sleeping with anyone but my ex boyfriend at uni :S Edited January 8, 2014 by Heatemyheart89 1
d0nnivain Posted January 8, 2014 Posted January 8, 2014 She insulted you. You are entitled to feel how you feel. There are no right & wrongs regarding feelings. She may have been trying to help you see a recurring mistake you make if you repeatedly chose players & "bad men". She just didn't do it nicely. Simmer through your anger. When you calm down, in person tell her that how she phrased it hurt & ask her what she meant by her comments. If she "never" picks bad guys, get her to teach you her secret.
Author CrystalCastles Posted January 9, 2014 Author Posted January 9, 2014 Well I don't "pick bad guys". I've gone on dates with 3 men in my whole life, and it took two dates to realize that. I didn't have relationships with these guys, I just went on one date with one and two dates with another. And rejected them straight after. I went on dates with them in the first place because there's no way I would know they were players otherwise (it's not like players wear signs around their necks saying they're players). And I didn't sleep with them either. So, I didn't actually know they were bad, and they were the ones who approached me first. My friend knows all of this. She's been in one relationship with a guy for 2 years and still is with the same guy. He's her first for everything. Her parents are also weird and judgmental like that. I don't think she was necessarily "jealous", per se. I just think she's got a very rigid outlook on relationships, and anyone who doesn't follow her mode of action is automatically assumed to be some kind of skank. While I respect her opinion, I think she didn't realize that relationships can be a sensitive topic for some people and it's not her place to criticize and slam me down simply because I have a different idea of how a relationship should progress. I see her sporadically so I don't know when I'll be able to see her, but I was planning on sending her a msg through facebook (we talk a lot over fb since our schedules are so busy and we have little time for face-time). I just don't know if she'll get mad since technically I accepted her apology, though the more I think about what she said, the angrier I get. I suppose because I feel like now I'm constantly justifying to her how making out with someone on the first date doesn't make me a skank. I feel like I'm a dirty whore in her eyes now, even though she's never explicitly called me that.
preraph Posted January 9, 2014 Posted January 9, 2014 Bottom line is you really didn't make any bad decisions. All you did is go out on a date or two and make out. That's what dating is about. Then you start deciding if you like the person or not. So shake off any shame she put on you. While it is true we all seem to attract certain types and some of us may seem to attract bad guys, it's not her place to just judge you for it. You're young. We live and learn. As an example, if we let, say, abusive men into our lives, then it's usually because as children, we became used to certain undesirable traits in our parents and what we grow up with is normal to us and we sort of learn to tolerate it -- and so sometimes as adults that makes us let someone who sort of acts the same way in some facet into our lives where someone else would not let them in. A real basic example of this would be say you had a father who criticized your mom a lot. It hurts her feelings but she puts up with it. You, on the other hand, may joke him out of it if he says something critical to you as a way of having learned how to deal with it. Well, then if you go out on a date with some guy and he begins being critical to you, because it's familiar to you, you may be comfortable to let the relationship go forward, which would be a mistake. So that is the only sense in which your friend's comment could have some basis, but I doubt she's put that much thought into it and it doesn't sound like from what you've said the guys you have gone out with are really bad or that if they are you're keeping them. So I guess lesson learned is you don't really need this friend's opinion next time! As long as once you find out a guy is undesirable you are able to say no and cut him off completely, you will be okay. But be sure you don't worry about their feelings so much that you can't say no because that will tend to let bad guys hang around.
Author CrystalCastles Posted January 9, 2014 Author Posted January 9, 2014 Thanks preraph! In terms of attracting bad guys, I've only ever attracted a few. I've attracted many good guys too, and I've been on dates with a good guy as well, so I'd say roughly half the guys who have approached me were good and half were bad (the good I rejected because I just wasn't attracted to them). There's no way I would know a guy is bad until I go on a date with him and find out. I am by no means a magnet for bad guys, so I feel that my friend's judgment was really out of place. I'm still young and I'm learning about what I like/don't like. I think it's unfair for her to have pointed fingers at me when she'd never been in those kinds of situations. Not everyone can stumble across their soul mate at first try. Maybe she did, but I didn't. That's not my fault and it doesn't mean my soul mate isn't out there. While I wait for him, I'll be out getting experience. It's not her place to make such judgment calls.
HokeyReligions Posted January 9, 2014 Posted January 9, 2014 She's as entitled to her opinions as you are. What I don't understand is why her opinion of you is so important to you? She's not making you feel bad - YOU are choosing to feel this way. Is there a part of you that thinks your behavior is "skank-like"? If not then her judgement shouldn't bother you. Its hers. If your 'style' bothers her that is HER problem. Its not up to you to fix her problem. 1
bubbaganoosh Posted January 9, 2014 Posted January 9, 2014 My best friend and I have a rule when it comes to women in our lives. The rule is "If your happy, I'm happy but if you need to vent then you have an ear." Now I'm 66 and he's 53. His taste in women is far different than mine. I pick the ones that when it's over, she runs me down and I look like road kill and she never looks back. He picks the "Needy insecure" ones that can't walk and chew gum at the same time and they attach themselves to him like a tick and when he's had enough and wants to move on, he can't pry them away with a crow bar. He listens to me vent and gives his opinion. I do the same. Have we learned from our advice to each other? Hell no. Right now he has one that's as dumb as a box of rocks and the maturity level of a 14 year old girl and is in her mid 40's but it goes back to the above. Your happy, I'm happy but I have an ear if you need it. 2
Author CrystalCastles Posted January 9, 2014 Author Posted January 9, 2014 She's as entitled to her opinions as you are. What I don't understand is why her opinion of you is so important to you? She's not making you feel bad - YOU are choosing to feel this way. Is there a part of you that thinks your behavior is "skank-like"? If not then her judgement shouldn't bother you. Its hers. If your 'style' bothers her that is HER problem. Its not up to you to fix her problem. Can I help it if I do feel that way? I don't think I'm skank-like whatsoever. In fact, apart from a few slip-ups, I've been very careful otherwise in terms of how I conduct myself around men during dates/relationships etc. I suppose its important because she's a close friend. Is it wrong to want close friends to think well of me? I suppose I should ultimately do what's best for me regardless of other people's opinions, but sometimes it's easy to focus on what other people think. @bubba- that was more along the lines of what I was looking for from her.
d0nnivain Posted January 9, 2014 Posted January 9, 2014 CrystalCastles . . . Don't talk to her about this over FB. That won't work at all & will make things worse. Save it for when you can talk to her in person or at least on the phone. If you have only been on 3 dates then nobody can say that you "pick bad men". I had a friend who legitimately "picked bad men" . . . there were dozens of them & they all turned out to be creeps. Me, I could always spot a gem even in a pile of manure. I set out to find a player (because I didn't want anything serious & players give good date, as long as you don't give them your heart) when I met my husband. Although he looks like a player -- he's that movie star handsome & well dressed -- he couldn't be a player if I gave him written directions & a YouTube video. lol Anyway, as you are trying to figure out what you want, look to see if you have any patterns. With such limited experience it will be hard to see a pattern. If you do start to see bad patterns, change them. Throughout life, everyone dates a few clunkers because as you realize, in the beginning everyone looks OK, their true colors come out later. You are also right that she probably just got lucky with her BF. Because she has no experience trying to weed out the bad guys, try to ignore her since she doesn't know what she's talking about. 1
Author CrystalCastles Posted January 9, 2014 Author Posted January 9, 2014 CrystalCastles . . . Don't talk to her about this over FB. That won't work at all & will make things worse. Save it for when you can talk to her in person or at least on the phone. If you have only been on 3 dates then nobody can say that you "pick bad men". I had a friend who legitimately "picked bad men" . . . there were dozens of them & they all turned out to be creeps. Me, I could always spot a gem even in a pile of manure. I set out to find a player (because I didn't want anything serious & players give good date, as long as you don't give them your heart) when I met my husband. Although he looks like a player -- he's that movie star handsome & well dressed -- he couldn't be a player if I gave him written directions & a YouTube video. lol Anyway, as you are trying to figure out what you want, look to see if you have any patterns. With such limited experience it will be hard to see a pattern. If you do start to see bad patterns, change them. Throughout life, everyone dates a few clunkers because as you realize, in the beginning everyone looks OK, their true colors come out later. You are also right that she probably just got lucky with her BF. Because she has no experience trying to weed out the bad guys, try to ignore her since she doesn't know what she's talking about. I appreciate your advice and I agree with it. It's unfortunate that I did not see it earlier because I did end up addressing this issue over facebook, and as you predicted, it did blow up into a massive drama. I told her how I felt, and she basically accused me of being self-righteous, presumptuous and judgmental. And that I had apparently made a lot of inaccurate assumptions about her relationship (the only thing I said was that it's great that she's happily in a relationship but that doesn't mean my life will go as smoothly as hers, and that seeing as I'm only starting to date, I could really use her support instead of criticism). I really don't see how that could have warranted her name-calling me and such. I sent her 3 apology messages, taking full responsibility of my actions and absolving her of any responsibility. I think that in the future I will no longer discuss my private issues with her, or anyone else for that matter. Much of what she said was untrue and deeply insulting, but it was my fault to have brought it to facebook and not discussed it face-to-face as you said. My mistake. I really appreciate your help. I am happy to know I'm not one to simply "pick bad men", and as you so well put it, there's no way to know if a man is bad or not until you go on a date with him and find out.
pteromom Posted January 9, 2014 Posted January 9, 2014 I think that in the future I will no longer discuss my private issues with her, or anyone else for that matter. I guess the main thing to analyze is whether her feedback, wrong as it may be, came from a place of good intention. Did she give you her opinion in an attempt to help you, or did she do it to cut you down and make you hurt worse? If the former, consider what she said, and if it doesn't apply to you, discard it. She's entitled to her opinions, and you have to realize that her opinions are based only on what she sees, and come from her perspective (and her experience is very different than yours.) If the latter, cut her loose and unfriend her and don't look back. 3
what_a_blonde Posted January 11, 2014 Posted January 11, 2014 I guess the main thing to analyze is whether her feedback, wrong as it may be, came from a place of good intention. Did she give you her opinion in an attempt to help you, or did she do it to cut you down and make you hurt worse? If the former, consider what she said, and if it doesn't apply to you, discard it. She's entitled to her opinions, and you have to realize that her opinions are based only on what she sees, and come from her perspective (and her experience is very different than yours.) If the latter, cut her loose and unfriend her and don't look back. Agree with this. Also, as a friend it is her place to tell you the truth even if it hurts sometimes. However, when it turns into her being condescending and judgemental, comparing you to her (and how you're "lacking" and not measuring up to her)... that's not ok and you deserve better. You have your own set of morals and values, as does she. Pushing those on you, especially when you are reaching out to her for her opinion/feedback or ever just to vent, is not ok. You're definitely justified in how you feel, and depending on how long you've been friends with her or your situation, you may want to consider distancing yourself. When I was in college I learned there were many "friends" that I needed to start distancing myself from unfortunately... because just like you've experienced, rather than being supportive and understanding, would constantly put me down and judge rather than providing constructive feedback.
VeronicaRoss Posted January 14, 2014 Posted January 14, 2014 Can I help it if I do feel that way? I don't think I'm skank-like whatsoever. In fact, apart from a few slip-ups, I've been very careful otherwise in terms of how I conduct myself around men during dates/relationships etc. I suppose its important because she's a close friend. Is it wrong to want close friends to think well of me? I suppose I should ultimately do what's best for me regardless of other people's opinions, but sometimes it's easy to focus on what other people think. It's hard to know what she did that was offensive based on what you've written. Few people in your life will have the nerve to tell you a tough truth, and it's really hard to know how to do it, especially when you're so young. That said, some people use the truth as a way to hurt people or feel powerful. Only you know how she tends to treat people close to her. I hope you can look at the big picture. Did she actually call you a name like 'skank'? That is not good at all. If so remind her it isn't respectful to call people names and you won't allow it from her in your friendship. Comparing her men to yours, maybe her point is bad guys aren't the only ones around, but that would be a point poorly made. Does she have a valid point in that you tend to go out with men that have a reputation for not treating women well, which you ignore thinking they'll treat you different or you like the 'bad boys' -- and you just didn't like hearing about it? That would be a rare friend. It takes time to figure out who people really are, but if you're ignoring warning signs from the beginning that can really harm your life. I'd just be really specific and open with her about what hurt you. In your heart you know if she cares about you or not. I'm hoping she's someone who cares and was trying to help and can treat you with respect too, who is willing to learn to make her point with better finesse!
jimloveslips Posted January 14, 2014 Posted January 14, 2014 I don't know why you are so upset - maybe she was too close to the bone for comfort...
Author CrystalCastles Posted January 17, 2014 Author Posted January 17, 2014 Does she have a valid point in that you tend to go out with men that have a reputation for not treating women well, which you ignore thinking they'll treat you different or you like the 'bad boys' -- and you just didn't like hearing about it? That would be a rare friend. No, I have only been out with 3 guys. Two of them I got rid of right away because they were a-holes. The first didn't make it past date 1. The second didn't make it past date 2. So obviously, I am not ignoring the flags that bad men wave, and I get rid of those men ASAP. My friend knows this. I also explicitly told her that I know the guy I went out with is a bad guy, and that I have no intention of seeing him again. Then, I told her the details of the situation. So her input was really not needed whatsoever. I already knew how to handle the situation. I just wanted to vent. That was it. And I explicitly told her that I already knew how to take it from here, and I already knew what to do, before I launched into the details.
Author CrystalCastles Posted January 17, 2014 Author Posted January 17, 2014 maybe she was too close to the bone for comfort... ^What does that mean? That I didn't have a clue how to handle the situation? That I liked the guy? Um, I already told her that I knew what to do and how to handle the situation. And no, I didn't like the guy otherwise I wouldn't have gotten rid of him if I liked him.
SpiralOut Posted January 17, 2014 Posted January 17, 2014 It is one thing to point out that you've dated wrong men, it is quite another to compare herself to you. That to me is a big red flag. I don't think it was necessary for her to point out that she has a better sense of judgement. So what if she does? What point was she trying to make exactly? You aren't the same person, so of course you'll both pick different men. It doesn't make her better than you. If you want to keep the friendship, say something about how her opinions are fine but you don't appreciate her comparing herself to you. That's not healthy for either one of you.
Author CrystalCastles Posted January 17, 2014 Author Posted January 17, 2014 It is one thing to point out that you've dated wrong men, it is quite another to compare herself to you. That to me is a big red flag. I don't think it was necessary for her to point out that she has a better sense of judgement. So what if she does? What point was she trying to make exactly? You aren't the same person, so of course you'll both pick different men. It doesn't make her better than you. If you want to keep the friendship, say something about how her opinions are fine but you don't appreciate her comparing herself to you. That's not healthy for either one of you. My thought exactly. Only I already did point out that I didn't appreciate that, and that I felt she was judging me, and she completely exploded and called me "self-righteous" and "judgmental" and so I ended up apologizing because I didn't want the drama (not because I'm actually sorry for what I said, because I didn't say anything bad- she's just hypersensitive and never takes criticism well).
Kizza Posted January 17, 2014 Posted January 17, 2014 Your friend had an opinion and expressed it, her way. If you are confident within yourself and your decisions then what she says really should be a drop in the ocean. If you are happy with who you are then continue on your path and disallow her thoughts to penetrate your emotional well being. You have choices. Choose to discontinue friendship, limit friendship or keep it but not let her ideas of what should be influence you. She said what she thought and what you do with her thoughts is up to you. Time always tells as you get older and if she is still around as your friend and you have kept true to yourself she will respect you evermore. If she isn't around then well.... I am sure you will find someone who understands you
SpiralOut Posted January 18, 2014 Posted January 18, 2014 My thought exactly. Only I already did point out that I didn't appreciate that, and that I felt she was judging me, and she completely exploded and called me "self-righteous" and "judgmental" and so I ended up apologizing because I didn't want the drama (not because I'm actually sorry for what I said, because I didn't say anything bad- she's just hypersensitive and never takes criticism well). Ah sorry, I must have missed that part of your post. Well I'm wondering if this is more about her insensitivity and inability to apologize to you, than it is about the opinion she expressed. You've done all you can do at this point. She's been informed that you don't like that sort of thing. Whether she does it again or not will tell you if she's worth keeping as a friend.
Recommended Posts