dreamcatcher975 Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 I have been reading articles online trying to figure out how to effectively talk to my H and i stumbled upon an article about unemotional partners. I read the article more than once because it described my H perfectly. Some of the things they said were:They have a hard time expressing their emotions because they encountered people or experiences in life that discouraged emotions. I know my H's childhood wasn't the best. UE people are notorious for "stating facts and logic" rather than emotions of the heart. They Don't understand the concept of emotion. There are more but i just want to list a few. I wish i could have considered this sooner. Can anyone who has dealt with someone who is UE offer advice on how to communicate with them? We're supposed to talk about some things in a couple of days and i want to change my communication style to see if it helps. advice on how to "validate" feelings would be helpful too. What are some things to say/show to validate another persons feelings? I thought i was validating his feelings but according to some articles i was totally doing it wrong! Thank you for reading
oldshirt Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 advice on how to "validate" feelings would be helpful too. What are some things to say/show to validate another persons feelings? I thought i was validating his feelings but according to some articles i was totally doing it wrong! I'm not sure I would lay awake nights worrying on how to "validate" and unemotional persons feelings. Seems like that would be like a cat trying to catch the shadow of his tail. Vulcans (a Star Trek analogy in case you are not a sci fi geek) have a hard time processing, expressing and responding to emotions. I'm not sure they really even want their feelings to be validated because they have been raised up to distrust and even discount their own feelings. If you validate a feeling that they don't even trust or validate in themselves that will just further lower their trust and respect in you. If you want a Vulcans trust and respect you have to address their logic and state your own. If you agree with their logic and think it is wise and correct, agree with it and move on to the next topic. If you disagree with it, state your disagreement clearly (but unemotionally. no anger, resentment, disgust etc) and state what you think is the better choice logically. You may be at an impass and unable to reach an agreement but they will at least appreciate and respect your opinion and will have more trust in what you stand for. This is just my personal opinion (and I am part Vulcan myself in many ways and drive emotional people nuts as they do me as well) I am sure the shrinks and self help books will advise you a much different approach.
oldshirt Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 now to address your general topic. In your other "Lost' thread you imply that you are somewhat resigned to follow through with a divorce. If that is truly the case and you have reached a conclusion to formally split, I would have to advocate using your husband's methodology and try to keep emotions out of it as best you can and just deal with the facts and the nuts and bolts tasks at hand and keep things as pragmatic as possible. You can cry and be angry and hurt and sad on your time. If deep down you are wanting to save the marriage and reconcile and be together. I would state that as matter of factly and as pragmatically as possible as well. It's ok to state your emotional state and state what emotions you have/are having, just acknowledge them in a factual manner. Example - " I do not want to divorce at present because I still love you and want to be with you and I know you still love me. I believe that our problems can be managed better and that we will both be better off together as a couple as opposed to divorcing. I do not want to proceed with this divorce. What do you see as options in reconciling our issues and arriving at a healthy and happy state in our marriage?" To an emotional person, that sounds incredibly robotic and contrived. However to a Vulcan who distrusts and discounts emotions, it's a very affirmative statement and a statement which has been thought out and formulated. Remember a Vulcan distrusts emotions and believes they are just fleets of fancy and temporary state of emotional and chemical stimulation to the brain. A Vulcan sees a person crying in sadness one minute and then in a fit of anger the next. He gives neither credit for each is just a response to a stimuli and the world is full of conflicting stimuli. If you give a position statement that shows self-reflection, thought and resolve, you'll have their attention. if you snivvle and cry or react in anger, defensiveness or bitterness etc they will just think you are reacting to ever-changing stimuli and will distrust and discount anything you say. Are you following me here or are we talking two different languages?
Author dreamcatcher975 Posted January 5, 2014 Author Posted January 5, 2014 I'm not sure I would lay awake nights worrying on how to "validate" and unemotional persons feelings. Seems like that would be like a cat trying to catch the shadow of his tail. Vulcans (a Star Trek analogy in case you are not a sci fi geek) have a hard time processing, expressing and responding to emotions. I'm not sure they really even want their feelings to be validated because they have been raised up to distrust and even discount their own feelings. If you validate a feeling that they don't even trust or validate in themselves that will just further lower their trust and respect in you. If you want a Vulcans trust and respect you have to address their logic and state your own. If you agree with their logic and think it is wise and correct, agree with it and move on to the next topic. If you disagree with it, state your disagreement clearly (but unemotionally. no anger, resentment, disgust etc) and state what you think is the better choice logically. You may be at an impass and unable to reach an agreement but they will at least appreciate and respect your opinion and will have more trust in what you stand for. This is just my personal opinion (and I am part Vulcan myself in many ways and drive emotional people nuts as they do me as well) I am sure the shrinks and self help books will advise you a much different approach. Lol at your Star Trek reference...My H is a huge Star Trek fan.. I'm very familiar with vulcans. I think I should watch a couple Star Trek episodes and freshen up that way? Jk Lol thank you for your advice! I never thought of it in that sense. I think all we did was disagree with each other we never bothered to really listen. I'm a working progress. I just hope it isn't too late. Thank you once again
Author dreamcatcher975 Posted January 5, 2014 Author Posted January 5, 2014 Example - " I do not want to divorce at present because I still love you and want to be with you and I know you still love me. I believe that our problems can be managed better and that we will both be better off together as a couple as opposed to divorcing. I do not want to proceed with this divorce. What do you see as options in reconciling our issues and arriving at a healthy and happy state in our marriage?" To an emotional person, that sounds incredibly robotic and contrived. However to a Vulcan who distrusts and discounts emotions, it's a very affirmative statement and a statement which has been thought out and formulated. Remember a Vulcan distrusts emotions and believes they are just fleets of fancy and temporary state of emotional and chemical stimulation to the brain. A Vulcan sees a person crying in sadness one minute and then in a fit of anger the next. He gives neither credit for each is just a response to a stimuli and the world is full of conflicting stimuli. If you give a position statement that shows self-reflection, thought and resolve, you'll have their attention. if you snivvle and cry or react in anger, defensiveness or bitterness etc they will just think you are reacting to ever-changing stimuli and will distrust and discount anything you say. Are you following me here or are we talking two different languages? You're example statement was excellent. I can totally relate -- u sounded just like my H! and i now understand y he talks to me that way! (like a robot) lol i always thought he was being rude. I guess i'm just "emotional" but to him it's just him being "logical." If i take on this "vulcan" persona when we talk.. would that be validating him?
oldshirt Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 You're example statement was excellent. I can totally relate -- u sounded just like my H! and i now understand y he talks to me that way! (like a robot) lol i always thought he was being rude. I guess i'm just "emotional" but to him it's just him being "logical." If i take on this "vulcan" persona when we talk.. would that be validating him? I'm not sure I am understanding what you mean by 'validating' him or what that would have to do with anything. ( Is that something that you emotional people do?? LOL) What I am saying is if you try to approach this from a more pragmatic and matter of fact perspective and try to take some of the emotional response out of everything and deal with the nuts and bolts, if anything it may validate yourself and give yourself a little more credibility. Again, Vulcans don't trust emotional responses or give them any validity. emotions come and go and are a response to ever-changing stimuli so they tend to discount them as fleets of fancy. If you show that you are giving this some honest evaluation, reflection and forethought and are not just responding to all of your ever-changing moods and emotional states and stimuli, you get him to actual listen to you and understand where you are coming from. It's not that you are emotionless. all people have emotions. Vulcans themselves have the same emotional make up as humans (I'm talking Star Trek again) they have just learned to distrust and discount them and they try not to let them dictate their decisions. It's ok to reference your emotions and acknowledge your emotional state, you just have to show that you have given this a lot of thought, introspection and consideration and that your decisions and your objectives have been arrived through pragmatic and matter of fact pathways and not based on just a whim of your mood at that moment. Moods and feelings and emotions to a Vulcan are just changes in chemicals in the brain that are based on sleep cycles, menstrual cycles, hydration levels, blood sugar levels, hormone levels, stimulation from outside sources blah blah blah blah blah. Moods and feelings fluctuate and change by the minute and are not to be relied upon, believed or trusted. If you can show that you have given it honest thought, have honestly weighed the pros and cons, and have come up with conclusions and objectives that are not based on where you are at in your menstrual cycle and not depending on how much sleep you had last night or what your blood sugar level is, he will be inclined to listen to you and validate YOUR thoughts and wishes. This is not about you validating him. This is about getting him to hear and validate YOU.
d0nnivain Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 My DH is also unemotional. I blame the military. I talk to him logically. I taught him to deal with my emotions. When I'm crying, hug me. When I'm upset listen to me, even if you don't get it. While he doesn't always understand why I want what I want from him, he can appreciate the logic of giving it to me, helps. I know he has emotions but he's just not comfortable expressing them.
oldshirt Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 What I am saying is if you try to approach this from a more pragmatic and matter of fact perspective . If you show that you are giving this some honest evaluation, reflection and forethought and are not just responding to all of your ever-changing moods and emotional states and stimuli, you get him to actual listen to you and understand where you are coming from. It's not that you are emotionless. Vulcans themselves have the same emotional make up as humans It's ok to reference your emotions and acknowledge your emotional state, you just have to show that you have given this a lot of thought, and your objectives have been arrived through pragmatic and matter of fact pathways and not based on just a whim of your mood at that moment. . I took out some of the fluff. Here is the key features. I am not advocating being emotionless at all. It's important to acknowledge your feelings. If you love him, it's critical that he knows that. What I am saying is that you need to show that you have given this thought and that your conclusions, wishes, goals, objectives etc have been arrived at through conscious thought and are not an emotional whim in the moment based on moods, feelings etc . 1
Author dreamcatcher975 Posted January 6, 2014 Author Posted January 6, 2014 We talked. Kept my cool. Still, the conversation turned however he was able to admit why he was upset even if he hung up after. I responded via text and told him how I felt about certain issues. Tried to remain as "Vulcan" as I can be. The only difference is granted the texts aren't pleasant.. Our communication is actually more than before. He actually calls when he says and responds to texts if I send him one. Idk if that can be considered improvement for a person who has a difficult time communicating. I'm exhausted. I feel like I should leave him alone at this point completely but I'm afraid it will go against me and I'll wake up with divorce papers.
MsOptimist Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 I don't know your full story, but I was in your shoes. My exH was unhappy, and very emotionally unavailable, and he quickly and vehemently sprung a divorce on me that I didn't want. I had always known about our emotional differences and over the years tried to be less emotional with him since that's how he responded the best. In the end it was very, very exhausting. I tried to let him know things to help me (as another posted said, for example - if I'm crying, give me a hug). It didn't work in the end, he'd sometimes mechanically give me a hug but I could see and feel the resentment building in what he thought was a weak reaction from me (crying). When we first separated I very logically tried to explain why I wanted to give us more time - to separate, to re-evaluate everything, etc. It didn't matter in the end. Once he made up his mind to pull the plug, he pulled it and turned his back. I had no choice but to go through with the divorce. Post-divorce, my current boyfriend is a very emotional and empathetic person like I am - I am amazed at how much more compatible we are together. Knowing what I know now, I never want to go back to being with someone who is so much unlike me in that regard. I'm not telling you to give up fighting - back when I was separated I initially didn't want to let go. But if you have no choice but to go through with the divorce, know that you will be ok and can eventually find someone who may be more compatible and fulfill your emotional needs a lot better.
Emilia Posted January 7, 2014 Posted January 7, 2014 As a self-confessed Vulcan I concur with oldshirt's posts. However there could be something else here as I have no issues with communication. I just don't like and don't trust knee-jerk reactions and drama. I only cut people off who in my eyes are not capable of making rational decisions and are too self centered to consider those around them as they are unable to take a step back and be pragmatic. Men get frustrated with my communication style because I am direct, state what I want and I am happy to face uncomfortable truths when they make sense in order to find resolution. A lot of people are not like that, regardless of gender. Oldshirt is right though, if he demonstrates that he has thought things through, he understands my point of view and isn't just kicking out at me, I will pay very close attention to what he says. If it's all about satisfying his hormonal changes (namely raising his dopamine levels) then I switch off and lose interest. So my advice is to display rational thought to your best ability. Demonstrate that you think as opposed to react mindlessly like so many people.
oldshirt Posted January 7, 2014 Posted January 7, 2014 Our communication is actually more than before. He actually calls when he says and responds to texts if I send him one. Idk if that can be considered improvement for a person who has a difficult time communicating. I'm exhausted. Is it really that he has trouble communicating or do you each just have trouble interpreting the other's language????? You keep saying he doesn't communicate, could it be you just aren't hearing what he is saying? Could it be that he just doesn't get the message you are trying to relay? You seem to have at least made a little bit of headway when you try to speak Vulcan. Maybe if you can get him to try to learn a little Human you can at least understand each other a little better.
Author dreamcatcher975 Posted January 8, 2014 Author Posted January 8, 2014 Is it really that he has trouble communicating or do you each just have trouble interpreting the other's language????? You keep saying he doesn't communicate, could it be you just aren't hearing what he is saying? That is a possibility. I have thought about it and told myself that next time we talk i am just going to listen. He always did say that i "don't listen" so next time that's all i'm going to do. At this point idk how that could hurt. I think he just really wants a divorce so i feel like i have no choice at all in the matter and i just have to go through with it. Could it be that he just doesn't get the message you are trying to relay? You seem to have at least made a little bit of headway when you try to speak Vulcan. Maybe if you can get him to try to learn a little Human you can at least understand each other a little better. Idk how else to tell him that i DON'T want a divorce. I want to tell him that i want to work things out and go to a MC but every time i try to -- he just refuses. I told him i'd go fly back but he says he'd just avoid me. I feel so hopeless and i hate feeling like this. Idk what more i can do.
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