All's fair in love and war. Is it?

[TheGuard13]

I don't see the issue. She's not with him...she's apparently not going to be with him.

 

 

So you should just ignore your feelings for him?

 

 

That sounds like girl logic to me.

 

 

If she gets upset over something like this, I'd say it's a sign you need more mature friends.

[Scales]

No it's really not the same thing. The other girl was in no way involved with the guy in question. She was just crushing on him and never even asked him out.

 

The guy was clearly interested in OP - so we can't realistically expect her to not go for the guy she likes if he likes her back because her friends has a crush on him.

Like I said earlier, this whole friends first bull**** goes both way.

 

And now that the guy and the girl aren't even seeing each other anymore, it would be ridiculous to ruin the friendship for this IMO.

 

Actually, if the OP asked her friend if she could go for him knowing full well that her friend wanted him and her friend said no, then yes I can realistically expect her to hold back. The story painted by her is that the guy in question came on to her and that she resisted to some extent but eventually gave in. I don't buy it. I'm not saying its a lie, but there are always plenty of chances in an interaction to shut it down. I feel like the friend in this situation never got a chance. If she took a shot and then got rejected then sure fair game. To say that nothing was happening between them is subjective at best if the friend never made a move.

 

From a guys perspective, guys like to tell guys who they like to show interest and let other dudes know when the girl is someone everyone knows in a social circle. If another guy moves in after that without saying anything before the other guy makes his move, sleeping with her, telling her the other guy likes her then wtf. I wouldn't be friends with either of them. Especially a friend of 17 years. I have lots of friends, no time for people who are busy trying to get what they want over the feelings of others who they pretend to respect.

 

All is fair in love and war, and that includes the consequences too. OP could have shut down the interaction at anytime. This is a case of having your cake and eating it too.

[GoreSP]

Actually, if the OP asked her friend if she could go for him knowing full well that her friend wanted him and her friend said no, then yes I can realistically expect her to hold back.

 

 

Why? Her friend obviously didn't do anything about this crush on the guy and the guy was obviously not interested in the friend - otherwise he would have hit on her and not OP.

 

So you think it's ok for a friend to say 'Hey, there's this guy I like, I'm not gonna tell him though. He never made a move on me so I will most likely never be with him. But you can't have him'

 

She is the ****ty friend if you ask me - not the OP.

[KathyM]

Kathy (and others who might agree with you) - would you ever really trust a woman again who did this and then apologized?

 

How about if your man cheated and apologized?

 

Isn't this essentially the same thing - a romantic/sexual betrayal of trust?

Once trust is broken, it is difficult to rebuild. Such a breach of trust shows blatant disregard for the betrayed person's feelings, and lack of respect and lack of loyalty. Although a sincere apology would go a long way to start to repair the damaged relationship, broken trust is very difficult to repair. It may never be completely restored. Although the situation of this thread is not at all of the magnitude of a husband breaking marital vows and deceiving his wife, it still brings out the importance of loyalty in a relationship, and respect and caring about a friend's feelings. One could also make the comparison about a good friend who told his friend about this great new job he found advertised and was going to apply for, and then the friend, upon hearing about it, goes and applies for the job first, gets the job, and the good friend is told the job is no longer available when he contacts the prospective employer. Or let's say the friend finds his dream home advertised, puts in an offer, tells his friend about what a great house he is hoping to get, and the friend decides he wants the house, puts in a better offer, and gets the house, thereby using the information provided by the friend to take away the dream home the friend was hoping to get. You just don't treat friends that way, if you value their friendship. But it sounds like the OP realizes she messed up, and has apologized to her friend. It will be up to the friend now whether she is willing to continue the relationship. I know many women who terminated a friendship with a good friend after the friend flirted or made a move on a guy they were interested in. My sister terminated her friendship with her best friend she's known since grade school. Most of the girls in my sons' friend group would no longer talk to each other after this type of thing happened, and they still are no longer friends after five years. Even one of my clients has dropped friends over this type of thing. Loyalty is probably the most important thing in a friendship, as it is in any relationship.

[Scales]

Why? Her friend obviously didn't do anything about this crush on the guy and the guy was obviously not interested in the friend - otherwise he would have hit on her and not OP.

 

So you think it's ok for a friend to say 'Hey, there's this guy I like, I'm not gonna tell him though. He never made a move on me so I will most likely never be with him. But you can't have him'

 

She is the ****ty friend if you ask me - not the OP.

 

The problem comes in how much of a chance the friend really had. I think certain amount of warning and intention should be made. Like "hey, make a move on that guy or I will" If she gets flat out rejected then its over, you get a shot. She liked the guy and claimed interest. I honestly don't know enough of the background of the situation to make a real call. If the friend was holding to something that was over for sure, then yeah. If she absolutely refused to make a move after you told her you would, then sure. But jumping the gun on your friend after she asks you not to isn't OK.

 

Also, this isn't her dream dude: it was a one night stand. There weren't any other guys at the club that night or around for that matter? This is a choice you make for a friend. Communication would have been effective here instead of just acting.

 

OP liked the guy, wanted to sleep with him regardless of her friends feelings about it, and hoped her friend would forgive her after doing it anyways. Thats putting your own desires ahead of others suffering, regardless of whether her friend is crappy or not.

[GoreSP]

The problem comes in how much of a chance the friend really had. I think certain amount of warning and intention should be made. Like "hey, make a move on that guy or I will" If she gets flat out rejected then its over, you get a shot. She liked the guy and claimed interest. I honestly don't know enough of the background of the situation to make a real call. If the friend was holding to something that was over for sure, then yeah. If she absolutely refused to make a move after you told her you would, then sure. But jumping the gun on your friend after she asks you not to isn't OK.

 

Also, this isn't her dream dude: it was a one night stand. There weren't any other guys at the club that night or around for that matter? This is a choice you make for a friend. Communication would have been effective here instead of just acting.

 

OP liked the guy, wanted to sleep with him regardless of her friends feelings about it, and hoped her friend would forgive her after doing it anyways. Thats putting your own desires ahead of others suffering, regardless of whether her friend is crappy or not.

 

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one.

 

But basically, in this story the general consensus is that one person cannot put her desires ahead of others' suffering but the other could.

What if OP and the guy fell in love? They would have to break it off because of the friend's crush on the guy?

Who is putting her desires ahead of other's suffering now?

 

There is a slight double standard happening here.

 

Edit: also, if you read the original post, OP said she also liked the guy at first but backed off because her friend liked him.

[edgygirl]

This is EXACTLY what happened.

 

Why? Her friend obviously didn't do anything about this crush on the guy and the guy was obviously not interested in the friend - otherwise he would have hit on her and not OP.

 

So you think it's ok for a friend to say 'Hey, there's this guy I like, I'm not gonna tell him though. He never made a move on me so I will most likely never be with him. But you can't have him'

 

She is the ****ty friend if you ask me - not the OP.

 

While I still feel somewhat ****ty about what happened, thank you for noting the important points below - you seem a pretty intuitive person, I appreciate that. Funny thing is I backed out for a year after she told me... she didn't do anything about it. When I asked her if I could be with him, she said no. I thought about her. If you look at what happened now, she didn't think about me.

 

Still, there's no excuse in me telling him she was into him because I was drunk. I really regret sharing her secrets which is not okay at all.

 

There is a slight double standard happening here.

 

Edit: also, if you read the original post, OP said she also liked the guy at first but backed off because her friend liked him.

[stillafool]

All I can say is you're absolutely right in all the things you said and these were exactly her claims. And I do owe her.

 

I was drunk although I know that's not a valid good excuse. When I drink too much I say things without thinking too much. I thought at the moment it was a "funny" way to make things lighter, meaning, if I talked about the absurdity of the situation, and to feel less bad about what I was about to do, if that makes sense. Bad judgement on my part, and a drunken stupor, that is absolutely unjustified.

 

The other reason I told him about it, was when he went to kiss me, it was the first thing I thought about and just said it: "I can't do it! My friend is into you".

 

I think you should stop drinking, or at least stop getting drunk.

[Weezy1973]

OP, is this someone you want to build a life with? Someone that you can see yourself with long term? If the answer is yes, then I think the possible sacrifice of a good friend is probably worth it. If / when you guys get married, hopefully your friend would see that he was a better match for you.

 

However; if this was just a short term, sexual thing (which from previous posts of yours, seems to be your pattern) then you clearly betrayed her and broke her trust. He's just another attractive guy out of many that you could do the same thing with. But your friend liked him, and you didn't care.

[edgygirl]

I don't really expect someone from Canada (where I lived and know the culture) to understand but the country I'm visiting and come from is really open minded and having one night stands is a fairly common and accepted thing. So, I'm sorry if you don't appreciate my "pattern".

 

I'm looking for a relationship - but I am very sexual too and not ashamed about it as most women probably are.

 

Did she care about my feelings in this? Did you read all my posts? When she got interested in him, being a friend who does care about her feelings, I backed out. She had over a year to do something about it and didn't do a thing. Does he "belong" to her forever if she does nothing about it? It's a little kindergarten to expect that.

 

Again - it seems the main issue was me telling people she was into him when I had a moral hangover that night (which I did as I was drunk and it was admittedly ridiculous). That was my main mistake. But maybe she said that because she won't admit now it angered her I was with him. She also told me her self esteem is very low now and that added to her feeling bad.

 

OP, is this someone you want to build a life with? Someone that you can see yourself with long term? If the answer is yes, then I think the possible sacrifice of a good friend is probably worth it. If / when you guys get married, hopefully your friend would see that he was a better match for you.

 

However; if this was just a short term, sexual thing (which from previous posts of yours, seems to be your pattern) then you clearly betrayed her and broke her trust. He's just another attractive guy out of many that you could do the same thing with. But your friend liked him, and you didn't care.

[gaius]

You didn't do anything wrong but you're also in a little bit of denial about how much this friend means to you.

[GoreSP]

I don't really expect someone from Canada (where I lived and know the culture) to understand but the country I'm visiting and come from is really open minded and having one night stands is a fairly common and accepted thing. So, I'm sorry if you don't appreciate my "pattern".

 

I'm looking for a relationship - but I am very sexual too and not ashamed about it as most women probably are.

 

Did she care about my feelings in this? Did you read all my posts? When she got interested in him, being a friend who does care about her feelings, I backed out. She had over a year to do something about it and didn't do a thing. Does he "belong" to her forever if she does nothing about it? It's a little kindergarten to expect that.

 

Again - it seems the main issue was me telling people she was into him when I had a moral hangover that night (which I did as I was drunk and it was admittedly ridiculous). That was my main mistake. But maybe she said that because she won't admit now it angered her I was with him. She also told me her self esteem is very low now and that added to her feeling bad.

 

 

Hey! I'm Canadian! lol

[Antenna_Of_Destiny]

Typical woman, deferring all responsibility for the ONS to the man. "I couldn't stop it..it just happened."

 

Reality check: It takes two to tango. No one is responsible for your actions except you. Unless you consider yourself a servant with no mind of your own.

 

That being said, I have never seen anything wrong with having sex with someone just because a friend happens to be interested.

[nomadic_butterfly]

I don't really expect someone from Canada (where I lived and know the culture) to understand but the country I'm visiting and come from is really open minded and having one night stands is a fairly common and accepted thing. So, I'm sorry if you don't appreciate my "pattern".

 

I'm looking for a relationship - but I am very sexual too and not ashamed about it as most women probably are.

 

Did she care about my feelings in this? Did you read all my posts? When she got interested in him, being a friend who does care about her feelings, I backed out. She had over a year to do something about it and didn't do a thing. Does he "belong" to her forever if she does nothing about it? It's a little kindergarten to expect that.

 

Again - it seems the main issue was me telling people she was into him when I had a moral hangover that night (which I did as I was drunk and it was admittedly ridiculous). That was my main mistake. But maybe she said that because she won't admit now it angered her I was with him. She also told me her self esteem is very low now and that added to her feeling bad.

 

Well if you have it all figured out why bother to post on here? A lot people will think it is foul, others will not. Simple. What does YOUR moral compass tell YOU?

 

Tell her (if you haven't already) that you think her feelings are inconsequential. The friendship is breached and will need to be repaired either way. Hope it was worth it in the end...it might very well be. There are just too many men in the world to target a friend's crush/interest. It is what it is.

[Weezy1973]

I don't really expect someone from Canada (where I lived and know the culture) to understand but the country I'm visiting and come from is really open minded and having one night stands is a fairly common and accepted thing. So, I'm sorry if you don't appreciate my "pattern".

 

I'm looking for a relationship - but I am very sexual too and not ashamed about it as most women probably are.

 

Did she care about my feelings in this? Did you read all my posts? When she got interested in him, being a friend who does care about her feelings, I backed out. She had over a year to do something about it and didn't do a thing. Does he "belong" to her forever if she does nothing about it? It's a little kindergarten to expect that.

 

Again - it seems the main issue was me telling people she was into him when I had a moral hangover that night (which I did as I was drunk and it was admittedly ridiculous). That was my main mistake. But maybe she said that because she won't admit now it angered her I was with him. She also told me her self esteem is very low now and that added to her feeling bad.

 

To be clear - I have absolutely no problems with casual sex or one night stands. My point (which the above has made for me) is that if one night stands are as matter of fact in your culture as you made it out to be, why have a one night stand with someone your good friend was interested in? You could have done that with anyone.

[edgygirl]

Did I say that quote you made? Too lazy to look now, but I don't think so as it doesn't explain how I am in general and how I usually feel. I was into the guy and I don't deny that. I just froze this desire in the last year after she told me she was into him, specially as I do not live in this city and well, why would I spoil it? But the fact is it's been over a year she told me and she doesn't act on it at all.

 

When he insisted several times during the night and after I've had one too many drinks... yes, I stopped resisting. Lust speaks really strong to me when I'm not sober and there's someone I'm into around. I guess I'm human and imperfect.

 

Typical woman, deferring all responsibility for the ONS to the man. "I couldn't stop it..it just happened."

 

Reality check: It takes two to tango. No one is responsible for your actions except you. Unless you consider yourself a servant with no mind of your own.

 

That being said, I have never seen anything wrong with having sex with someone just because a friend happens to be interested.

[edgygirl]

Why? Cause desire spoke stronger specially with too much alcohol.

 

And... in all my drunkenness it occurred to me it's been a long time since she told me, and did nothing to make it happen with said guy.

 

Is it really fair when people put an "unavailable plaque" on someone for an extended amount of time and do nothing to try and get them?

 

To be clear - I have absolutely no problems with casual sex or one night stands. My point (which the above has made for me) is that if one night stands are as matter of fact in your culture as you made it out to be, why have a one night stand with someone your good friend was interested in? You could have done that with anyone.

[Weezy1973]

Why? Cause desire spoke stronger specially with too much alcohol.

 

And... in all my drunkenness it occurred to me it's been a long time since she told me, and did nothing to make it happen with said guy.

 

Is it really fair when people put an "unavailable plaque" on someone for an extended amount of time and do nothing to try and get them?

 

Fair is an interesting word. If you're a good friend, you wouldn't even think of the fairness of it, you just wouldn't pursue him for a casual fling knowing that your friend liked him.

 

You strike me as someone that isn't good marriage material - there will always be attractive people in the world - if desire (as you put it above) is more powerful for you than loyalty or fidelity, perhaps you should stay single and just partake in casual sex. And of course probably best not to develop any deep friendships either (obviously)...

[edgygirl]

Man... I've been her friend for 15+ years and never once did anything wrong.

 

As I said, I let my attraction of him go, in her name. She did nothing to pursue him or show she was interested. Are we in kindergarten? Is he "hers" til the end of times, when she doesn't even show him she's interested? I'm not sure yet how I feel about it and the things I posted here are things I've been thinking in the last 2 days but they're not my final thoughts yet.

 

I don't see any relation to being marriage material. I don't betray people, friends or lovers. This was a once in a lifetime situation where things went wrong and I'm obviously not feeling good about the whole thing and trying to make peace or absorb what happened.

 

I decided to reflect on it here, not to be judged, but because I feel this is like a therapy session where I can say what is passing through my mind... I don't have a firm conclusion of how I feel about what happened yet.

 

So, not that cool to judge my morals here when you don't know me. If I was a usual traitor of friends and lovers I wouldn't be even thinking twice about what happened.

 

Good for you that you are a perfect human being that never ever fails... not sure I want to be someone (or be with someone) who doesn't understand that sexual desire makes you do stupid things sometimes. If I get married, it's a whole different situation, but still something I'm open to discuss with the person I'll be with. I'm not a black and white thinker in regards to desire. But it's okay if you think differently. I bet you think polyamorous people are morally wrong too? (I know it's a different situation, but it sounds like this).

 

edit: flying back tomorrow so won't be responding in a while.

 

Fair is an interesting word. If you're a good friend, you wouldn't even think of the fairness of it, you just wouldn't pursue him for a casual fling knowing that your friend liked him.

 

You strike me as someone that isn't good marriage material - there will always be attractive people in the world - if desire (as you put it above) is more powerful for you than loyalty or fidelity, perhaps you should stay single and just partake in casual sex. And of course probably best not to develop any deep friendships either (obviously)...

Edited December 30, 2013 by edgygirl

[stillafool]

I decided to reflect on it here, not to be judged, but because I feel

this is like a therapy session where I can say what is passing through my

mind... I don't have a firm conclusion of how I feel about what happened yet.

 

 

So, not that cool to judge my morals here when you don't know me. If I

was a usual traitor of friends and lovers I wouldn't be even thinking twice

about what happened.

 

C'mon, you have over 1,000 posts, you know how things work here at LS. How did you think you weren't going to be judged?

[Scales]

Did I say that quote you made? Too lazy to look now, but I don't think so as it doesn't explain how I am in general and how I usually feel. I was into the guy and I don't deny that. I just froze this desire in the last year after she told me she was into him, specially as I do not live in this city and well, why would I spoil it? But the fact is it's been over a year she told me and she doesn't act on it at all.

 

When he insisted several times during the night and after I've had one too many drinks... yes, I stopped resisting. Lust speaks really strong to me when I'm not sober and there's someone I'm into around. I guess I'm human and imperfect.

 

Oh wow over a year!? sincerest apologies I hope it was awesome. This falls on your friend completely, No problems here:laugh: Hell after 2 months I would have been like check it out girlfriend, I'm on this if you don't throw yourself on him.

[kaylan]

I am feeling a total "moral hangover". I'm visiting my family's city on vacation. Went out with my best girlfriend who lives here and her friends several times in the past 2 weeks.

 

I ended up having a one night stand with a guy she's been into lately. Nothing ever happened between them. Truth be told I've been interested in him in the past but stopped it after she told me about her interest.

 

But yesterday I couldn't help myself when he hit on me. I feel terrible. But I knew this would be the outcome even before doing anything. Am I a bad person?

 

I think the thing that bothered her the most was that I mentioned in front of 2-3 people what was going on, and she's a very private person. (Yes I was totally drunk and I say things before I think and I was trying to make a laugh of the situation or make it lighter than it really was). Ugh I am so stupid.

 

So - here I ask: is all fair in love indeed?

bros b4 hoes.

 

Id stop being friends with someone who did that. And I have stopped being friends with someone who stepped on my toes to get to a girl. If my friend at least made sure I was 100% ok with it, Id have no beef...but you didn't do that. And you handled yourself poorly thanks to alcohol to top everything off.

 

It shows what you truly value more. Be prepared to lose a friend, cus its a strong possibility. My close friends I would never ever betray for a woman. As soon as my buddy shows interest in a girl, shes a no-go zone for me, unless he absolutely positively clears it. Friends can last a lifetime, romantic interests (especially flings) many times do not.

Edited December 30, 2013 by kaylan

[truth_seeker]

Bottomline: you slept with a guy your friend liked. You hurt her feelings. You gave into your desires over your friendship. Your friend doesn't mean that much to you. If she did, you would have turned the guy down for a one night stand.