FrankieFrank Posted December 23, 2013 Posted December 23, 2013 I don't mean self-proclaimed "nice guys" who get bitter and spout woman-hating nonsense anytime they get rejected or a girl can't read their mind. I mean actully nice people who do favors for each other without expecting anything in return, care about other people's well-being and can empathize with them. Are all these traits REALLY a hurdle? Because from observation I'm doubting it. In fact all the players I know actually mimic those nice people. So is whole "nice guys finish last" thing a bunch of crap?
GoodOnPaper Posted December 23, 2013 Posted December 23, 2013 The air quotes make all the difference. Nice behavior plus an innate sex appeal works great. "Nice" = nice behavior without the sex appeal but with the hope that you'll still get credit for being a good catch. That doesn't work well. 5
Onethirtyeight Posted December 23, 2013 Posted December 23, 2013 The air quotes make all the difference. Nice behavior plus an innate sex appeal works great. "Nice" = nice behavior without the sex appeal but with the hope that you'll still get credit for being a good catch. That doesn't work well. That pretty much sums it up.
Targetlock Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 well not to blow my own horn, but as a care worker i think i try and strive towards these qualities as much as i can in my job and in real life. though i don't think i have much sex appeal though
Damaged217 Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 As a girl, I can say that I have gotten turned off by a guy for being too nice. By that I mean constanly apologizing for things that don't need apologies or getting really worried if I don't respond to a text message quickly enough (worried as in thinking I died within 5 minutes lol). Now being chivalrous is completely different. I'm all for guys who have manners and know how to open a door for a lady. Just depends on what your definitely of "nice" is, I guess. 1
MsSmurf Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 Yep Damaged is right. Nice guys that are anxious doormats aren't good, but nice guys that are chivalrous are great. 1
Targetlock Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 i try and keep chivalry alive and well, and i was brought up with good manners so I'm gonna use them 1
fortyninethousand322 Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 Yes. Because "nice" people generally don't put their needs above the needs of everyone else. If you don't look out for yourself no one else is. Once you reach adulthood you have to be responsible for yourself. Including your dating life...
StanMusial Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 I don't think being a genuinely nice person is a hurdle. I think the problem is when people try to be nice to make up for other shortcomings - like not being attractive to the ones they want to like them. That's why people get bitter. I like to think I am a nice and pleasant person with good manners but I go after what I want and I fight for what I believe to be right.
Tayla Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 Genuine civil attitudes and deeds are rare. To those who possess them, it shines on....Ya can't fake goodness for long... And No genuine kindness is a bonus...its welcoming in the dating world.
Els Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 Not a bunch of crap. My guy fits the description to a T and I love him for it. That doesn't mean that everyone automatically gets partners just because they're nice and selfless though. Just like how not everyone automatically gets great jobs just because they're hardworking. World doesn't work like that. 2
Woggle Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 Being a good and honest person but letting people know you are not one to stepped on is the best way to weed out low quality people. I would never mistreat somebody but I don't let myself be walked on either.
Author FrankieFrank Posted December 24, 2013 Author Posted December 24, 2013 By that I mean constanly apologizing for things that don't need apologies or getting really worried if I don't respond to a text message quickly enough (worried as in thinking I died within 5 minutes lol) That's not nice, that's clinginess and lack of self-respect. It may be fault of some nice people, but not all of them. Because "nice" people generally don't put their needs above the needs of everyone else. Again, not necessarily true. Caring about others doesn't mean you don't care about yourself. Being a good and honest person but letting people know you are not one to stepped on is the best way to weed out low quality people. I would never mistreat somebody but I don't let myself be walked on either. Case in point. That doesn't mean that everyone automatically gets partners just because they're nice and selfless though. Just like how not everyone automatically gets great jobs just because they're hardworking. World doesn't work like that. The question isn't whether nice/jerky people automatically get partners. Question is whether being nice and selfless is a hurdle or an advantage. Ie. if a nice person would be beter off dating-wise if they were jerks or vice versa. The air quotes make all the difference. Nice behavior plus an innate sex appeal works great. "Nice" = nice behavior without the sex appeal but with the hope that you'll still get credit for being a good catch. That doesn't work well. I think the problem is when people try to be nice to make up for other shortcomings - like not being attractive to the ones they want to like them. That's why people get bitter. Interesting. So basically, being nice is not a hurdle, but you can't make your main selling point out of it if other things (like raw sex appeal) are lacking?
irc333 Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 Yes, they are rare....good deeds and being treated honorably, believe it or not, is somewhat off putting to people. I think some people have become used to NOT being treated so nicely that they look upon others with suspicion if they are treated as such. Ironic, isn't it? Their reaction is "Why is he/she treated me so nicely, I'm so used to being treated in a poor fashion, this person can't POSSIBLY be for real!" And there ya have it. Genuine civil attitudes and deeds are rare. To those who possess them, it shines on....Ya can't fake goodness for long... And No genuine kindness is a bonus...its welcoming in the dating world. 2
Guitarisgood Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 Sorry I havent read through all other comments but I don't think so. It's maintaining that delicate balance of not being a push over I think that draws the line. You can be a nice guy but you cannot be a push over and let everyone take advantage of you. Those types of people are few and hard to find. The majority whom are nice will forever go their life serving others but not themselves.
Titania22 Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 The majority whom are nice will forever go their life serving others but not themselves. Why do these things have to be exclusive. Isn't it possible to treat others well, and also treat ourselves well?
Green Light Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 My own experience has been that it doesn't really matter if I am nice or selfish, I still don't get much either way. So now I do whichever requires less energy. 1
Mrlonelyone Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 Yes, they are rare....good deeds and being treated honorably, believe it or not, is somewhat off putting to people. I think some people have become used to NOT being treated so nicely that they look upon others with suspicion if they are treated as such. Ironic, isn't it? Their reaction is "Why is he/she treated me so nicely, I'm so used to being treated in a poor fashion, this person can't POSSIBLY be for real!" And there ya have it. It really is this. I you are "too nice" to most people they think you must want something. What too nice is varies and to some people too nice means not being a total @$$hole. In dating dark primal drives revealed by psychological testing show women select men who display certain physical and behavioral cues, cads, for short term mating while they are fertile . They select other men for long term companions, dads. Women Like Cads for Sex, Dads for Mating Overall, researchers found that the women thought they would like the dads more than the cads. But they preferred cads for a short-term relationship and dads for the long haul. When forced to choose between a pair of dad and cad characters, the dad was the top choice for a formal date, marriage, and as a son-in-law. But the results were mixed on the other options. When it came down to choosing who they would like to have sexual relations with or go on a road trip, the women preferred cads in one comparison, but had no clear preference in the other. The results appear in the current issue of the journal Human Nature. Researchers say the findings show that the dad vs. cad distinction is intuitive to women, and when given only a brief character sketch, women seem to be able to make informed dating decisions. Notice in that study it was all about personality not looks. The college age women prefer the moody arrogant cads for short term dating (i.e. as the overwhelming amount of college dating is.). Yet they would choose dads to marry. So if you are a young man being nice is keeping you from getting a date.The women are thinking, on a sub conscious level, they will have fun with dbags then switch to nice guysStudies that use pictures show women pick men whose facial features show more masculine cues while ovulating and fertile....so on a instinctive level they want to get pregnant by the cads. The result is if you are not of the age where most women look to get married, late 20's or older, being nice will hurt you in dating. After that age being a cad will hurt you.
Philosoraptor Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 I tend to prefer the word honorable. I've always been nice and caring, little surprises all the time. Never has it been a negative with dating. As long as you're not a pushover it's never a bad trait. The "nice guys" tend to be pushovers without backbones and apologize endlessly for every little thing that happens. It's an emotional drain for the woman to have a so called man walking around with his panties in a bunch.
ChessPieceFace Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 I don't mean self-proclaimed "nice guys" who get bitter and spout woman-hating nonsense anytime they get rejected or a girl can't read their mind. I wouldn't worry about it, since anyone who would label an entire group of people "bitter & spouting woman-hating nonsense" isn't a nice guy.
GravityMan Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 The vast majority of genuine nice guys who are confident, have a sense of humor, have lives of their own and stand up for themselves will do just fine on the dating scene. In fact some of them will probably be highly desired. They can be among the best catches out there. I also don't think this type of guy is rare either. There are many such guys who are out there...it's just that most of them are in relationships and have probably been in relationships since high school or college. Their periods being single seldom last longer than 3-6 months. The "nice" guys who are being nice because they have an agenda will struggle. Being "nice" is a strategy for these guys. It's like they're tossing away their entire self-worth in the hopes that the woman will stay with them. They aren't nice; they are soft, weak, pathetic, insecure and have no balls. And then they're usually confused and eventually turn bitter when women frequently reject them. These guys aren't rare either, but I doubt they're as prevalent as it seems sometimes. It's just that there's a disproportionate number of them who are still single in their mid 20s and beyond. For people who are truly nice, that niceness comes naturally, it's a part of who you are. Likewise with having a spine. They were likely raised that way from childhood and grew up in a good environment. 2
Author FrankieFrank Posted December 24, 2013 Author Posted December 24, 2013 I wouldn't worry about it, since anyone who would label an entire group of people "bitter & spouting woman-hating nonsense" isn't a nice guy. Why wouldn't they be? Some people do bad or stupid things. Calling them out on it doesn't mean you're not a nice person. Unless you refer to "nice" as in "no backbone", then maybe, but I don't use that definition and don't see how it even should be used at all.
repoman Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 being nice is a hurdle in dating. it is pc to say that isn't so, but its not about being pc. the question is why. being nice in itself is not bad. in fact lots of women like it. issue is, fairly or unfairly, niceness is sometimes associated with these words. doormat, boring, apologizing, bitter, angry, passive aggressive etc. even so lots of not nice people pretend to be nice. when a guy is actually nice, women are suspicious that he's not really nice but just putting on an act just to get in her pants. lots of women do like nice and lots of nice guys are happily married. on the other hand, the biggest failures of dating and mating, the 'never had a girlfriend at 36' or the '41 year old virgin' do tend to be nice guys. make what you want out of this.
Tayla Posted December 24, 2013 Posted December 24, 2013 It just dawned on me how vague the term "nice" is. It's subjective to some. Take for example- If a guy shows chivalry and opens a door, it can be construed as a "nice" gesture or a "downcast" gesture. If a girl cleans her boyfriends apartment and re-arranges things, he can look at it as "she is controlling" or "gosh wasn't that nice that she cleaned and organized things. Point being we each have a different meaning for "nice". I prefer diplomatic, well mannered and socially adaptable with a smidge of humor as "nice". 1
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