If my WS had done this, it would've been over...

December 8, 2013

In another thread, they are discussing the idea of whether one "sin" is worse than another or all equally sinful. I'll leave that one to the religious folk, but it makes me think of all the times I've read a BS say on LS, "If my WS had done what you/your WS did, it would've been too much and I would've kicked him/her out."

For H it was a threesome. "If you has done a threesome with OM, we would be done." Another poster said that to me because I had anal sex with OM. Another said it because OM was H's best friend.

Obviously, there IS a line, but the reality is that H (and other BSs concerning their spouses) had no idea I would do what I did, and with whom, but we are trying to R.

So my question: is there any way to know where you draw your personal line, or do you have to experience it to figure that out (or does it vary depending on your spouse?) And if you think you have a line, what is it? What would you absolutely not put up with?

December 8, 2013

I don't think there is any way to know what one will tolerate until they are in the situations. My husband always said cheating was a deal breaker and really thought if that happened we would be done. He was surprised afterwards that he really did want to try and reconcile. I think it was the same for xmom - he figured she would kick him to the curb and she did not - even after two ddays.

I can say, for me anyway, if my husband had had sex (and he says he didn't) in my home with his xmow I would not have come back here - I couldn't have done it. Its hard enough to know they had sex in the office building we own together, but I just don't stop by there much anymore and look forward to the day it will be sold.

Unfortunately, I am ashamed to say xmom and I did have sex in their home (not in the bed). According to xmom (at the time) she knew that. So apparently it is something she can live with - although the car, the boat, the guitar and everything else that was a reminder got sold.

Anyway all this to say you just don't know what your threshold is until it actually happens.

December 8, 2013

I think it is all a bunch of mental crap. My MOW is extremely sexual. Numerous things we have done including anal that she has never done with her H. I'm not going to get into specifics, but he sure seems to enjoy her.

If all of the sudden he knew? "You did that? And that and that and that? Well, that is just too much!" While the day before he had a clue he was like, "Oh yeah I like this."

Mental bull****tery.

December 8, 2013

People may think they have a line they wouldn't cross, and maybe they are right.

For example, let's assume that for someone, it's sex of any kind outside the marriage. Cross that line, and for them, it is over.

Five years down the road, they find out that there spouse has cheated. The line has been crossed. What do they do?

For some, divorce is the only option. Their " mental limit" has been crossed and they feel there is no turning back. For others, they reconcile, but they have still reached their "mental limit". For them, reconciliation can mean a lifetime of regret, sadness, poor self esteem, suspicion, resentment, anger, even substance abuse; all of these totally understandable given the situation. Of course, not all are healthy ways of dealing with trauma.

For others, their "mental limit" was more malleable, they are able to reconcile and move past they deceit, but they still carry scars. They may require extensive therapy to move forward.

A few unfortunate people reach their breaking point and are devastated. They know they can't live with the cheating, lying and pain, but can't live without the person either. They opt out of having to answer the question altogether and take the only exit they see as making any sense to them. They choose to end their life.

When it comes to handling trauma, each person has their individual breaking point, and they don't know what that is until they reach it. It's got zero to do with how much love they may or may not feel for the ws, rather it's a function of their own internal limits of what they know they can and can not handle or accept.

December 9, 2013

For me it was learning my ex-husband never used any protection and had intercourse with his OW while she was menstruating. As the posters above have said it is mental. Yep, it was mental and to me the ultimate betrayal and I could not get past it.

December 9, 2013

For me it was learning my ex-husband never used any protection and had intercourse with his OW while she was menstruating. As the posters above have said it is mental. Yep, it was mental and to me the ultimate betrayal and I could not get past it.

Did you end it with him? I get the not using protection, but I'm not sure I understand what's wrong with sex during a period - this seems more like a preference thing than a moral thing (unless he wouldn't do it with you - then I totally get it!). Is it that it's dirty to you?

December 9, 2013

I was thinking the same thing - I mean it makes sense that they might have unprotected when she's during menstruation because You are less likely to conceive, I mean that is definitely when xmom would. There were times I would say "let's cancel I'm on my period" but he was totally fine with it. I don't think that unusual and wonder why that would be a deal breaker, but again one person's deal breaker may not be someone else's.

December 9, 2013

Did you end it with him? I get the not using protection, but I'm not sure I understand what's wrong with sex during a period - this seems more like a preference thing than a moral thing (unless he wouldn't do it with you - then I totally get it!). Is it that it's dirty to you?

No, it is not dirty to me -not at all! He just wouldn't touch me when I had my period. I always felt so rejected. As I said, it was a mental thing for me. No aversions whatsoever.

December 9, 2013

I decided not to R for a variety of reasons. I think that the one thing that I could not have gotten over even if he did everything right after d-day would be an OC. I don't know how some BSs live with that.

December 9, 2013

For the first time in a while, I am not sure how to answer what seems like a simple question. I have written several different answers.

I have set my boundaries since dDay with her. I guess I will cross bridge - if she brings me there and decide then what to do with her and the marriage. My indecision is not out of weakness.

Edited December 9, 2013 by dichotomy

December 9, 2013

Dichotomy - your post is so sad to me.

December 9, 2013

In another thread, they are discussing the idea of whether one "sin" is worse than another or all equally sinful. I'll leave that one to the religious folk, but it makes me think of all the times I've read a BS say on LS, "If my WS had done what you/your WS did, it would've been too much and I would've kicked him/her out."

The "all sin is equal" is from the viewpoint of God, not humans. Even in that context it is misunderstood. As far us mere mortals here on earth, all sin is not equal. Sins and actions have varying degrees of damage and destruction. Some are spiritual, some are relational, some are physical, some all legal.... you get the point. Do all crimes have the same sentences handed down from the courts? Is rape equal to a white lie? Ok, mini rant over.

I'm sure there are many things that would have been deal-breakers for me, I just can't think of them specifically right now except for one.

Soon after my wife's affair the co-worker (OM) moved on to another job. From what she told me, and from what I have been able to verify, she has not had any contact with ex-OM since he left the job where they worked together. For me, a deal-breaker would be if she had kept in contact with him. Even if it was intermittently, that would be too much. If I had found (or gone back an found) any emails or Facebook messages between the two of them, I would divorce.

I take some comfort in the fact that she ended the affair on her own (no D-Day per se), and that she ceased all communication with the OM.

December 9, 2013

I just think it's a way to have an "at least my WS didn't do THAT" moment. The hierarchy of betrayal. My WS isn't as wayward as yours. It's all betrayal to me. Some with more layers. I think one has to be met in the eyes with certain things before they can know without a doubt what they would do. Just like the AP's that would never in a million years take back a cheater but..... yeah. You just don't know sometimes. You just don't know what you would do.

The years long A's make my skin crawl. I'm not sure how I would handle that. A broken heart is hard to mend in any case. I just think that some things that are done in A's seem like overkill to a BS. It just piles on and on and on. Thinking about adding another punch in the gut to the beating just may be the death blow, ya know? Just too much.

December 9, 2013

In another thread, they are discussing the idea of whether one "sin" is worse than another or all equally sinful. I'll leave that one to the religious folk, but it makes me think of all the times I've read a BS say on LS, "If my WS had done what you/your WS did, it would've been too much and I would've kicked him/her out."

For H it was a threesome. "If you has done a threesome with OM, we would be done." Another poster said that to me because I had anal sex with OM. Another said it because OM was H's best friend.

Obviously, there IS a line, but the reality is that H (and other BSs concerning their spouses) had no idea I would do what I did, and with whom, but we are trying to R.

So my question: is there any way to know where you draw your personal line, or do you have to experience it to figure that out (or does it vary depending on your spouse?) And if you think you have a line, what is it? What would you absolutely not put up with?

I have personal lines that I draw and things that beforehand are worse than others to me. However, I do know that when in fact faced with the situation things may play out differently.

However, for me, I would have a hard time reconciling if you're just reckless and overly brazen about your cheating, which includes:

1)Multiple women

2)You have unprotected sex with the OW and then have sex with me too

3)Get our kids involved somehow - introducing her to them etc.

4) Divulge very personal things about me to her, have her pick out gifts for me, give her access to our bank account or other sensitive materials, sleep with her in our bed/home and other things like that that I have heard OW say MM allowed them to do

5)Your AP is a man

6)You impregnate the OW

7)You give me an STD

8)The A is years long

Pretty much those are the lines I draw beforehand where I really do not see myself even wanting to forgive someone for those things and I don't see HOW, even if I wanted to, I'd ever truly forgive and move on from it. If any of those things happened, esp multiple ones, I am almost sure things would not be reconciled.

December 9, 2013

I decided to not make the line dependent on my ex. The line had more to do with what I observed in myself and how things were affecting my daughter. If it came to the point when I felt like things would be better for my daughter if we split, then I split. I was fine at home but was no longer functioning at work, and not getting better...so that ended up being my canary. I usually say it was because she wouldn't quit the MA class with OM, and that's true, but I also tolerated quite a bit before giving up. The line was how I was handling it.

December 9, 2013

In another thread, they are discussing the idea of whether one "sin" is worse than another or all equally sinful. I'll leave that one to the religious folk, but it makes me think of all the times I've read a BS say on LS, "If my WS had done what you/your WS did, it would've been too much and I would've kicked him/her out."

For H it was a threesome. "If you has done a threesome with OM, we would be done." Another poster said that to me because I had anal sex with OM. Another said it because OM was H's best friend.

Obviously, there IS a line, but the reality is that H (and other BSs concerning their spouses) had no idea I would do what I did, and with whom, but we are trying to R.

So my question: is there any way to know where you draw your personal line, or do you have to experience it to figure that out (or does it vary depending on your spouse?) And if you think you have a line, what is it? What would you absolutely not put up with?

This is why a line drawn in the sand is worthless. To easy to erase and move the line.

It is easy to say this is how I would handle something. However the way people think they will reacted when faced with a hypothetical situation and one that is real often cause people to respond differently then they thought they would.

December 9, 2013

No, it is not dirty to me -not at all! He just wouldn't touch me when I had my period. I always felt so rejected. As I said, it was a mental thing for me. No aversions whatsoever.

Gotcha. I would be upset, too.

December 9, 2013

I decided not to R for a variety of reasons. I think that the one thing that I could not have gotten over even if he did everything right after d-day would be an OC. I don't know how some BSs live with that.

What is an OC?

December 9, 2013

The "all sin is equal" is from the viewpoint of God, not humans. Even in that context it is misunderstood. As far us mere mortals here on earth, all sin is not equal. Sins and actions have varying degrees of damage and destruction. Some are spiritual, some are relational, some are physical, some all legal.... you get the point. Do all crimes have the same sentences handed down from the courts? Is rape equal to a white lie? Ok, mini rant over.

I'm sure there are many things that would have been deal-breakers for me, I just can't think of them specifically right now except for one.

Soon after my wife's affair the co-worker (OM) moved on to another job. From what she told me, and from what I have been able to verify, she has not had any contact with ex-OM since he left the job where they worked together. For me, a deal-breaker would be if she had kept in contact with him. Even if it was intermittently, that would be too much. If I had found (or gone back an found) any emails or Facebook messages between the two of them, I would divorce.

I take some comfort in the fact that she ended the affair on her own (no D-Day per se), and that she ceased all communication with the OM.

H was very clear that any contact would mean divorce. He said that would mean I wasnt serious about the changes I had made, and I didn't respect him or any of the conversations we had had.

December 9, 2013

For me (not very religious), it is about respect. There isn't anything that my W and I have not done sexually and for that context only, I would not take offense to some specific sexual act. Hypothetically, anything she would do outside of our shared sexual experiences in an A, i would have to question her sanity, that is based on knowing who she is and has changed to be over the years.

Nope, it's respect with me. My W early on because of so much infidelity that has happened in her family, she had set expectations about me. We have had discussions and agreements to talk before engaging in an A. Whether that holds true remains to be seen; however, it does leave the ONS.

You know my story and more of what she did, she (as you posted before) could easily fall in that category of an ONS.

Now, she having 2 strikes an ONS would be the out.

As for an A, 90% of the stories here while i have some respect for the WS, I would D. A few went overboard with respect to the lengths they went with shuffling kids and how, when and where, and one example, such close proximity to the spouse. (not naming names) Other examples of communication with the AP at the cost family and spouse time or in such proximity to the spouse and etc.

So that is how I feel, and as others have said, perhaps if heaven forbid she had an A, i go a completely different direction... maybe... but i doubt it. However there is the A that one story said they found out 12 years later... that one... i don't know what i would do.

hmmmm...

Edited December 9, 2013 by atreides

December 9, 2013

Reconciliation for me was a big mistake, and I wish I could get a do-over on that one. If she had cheated with a friend of mine it would have been great because I could never live with that and we would have divorced.

December 9, 2013

Like many of you, I thought any sort of affair would have meant the end. Reality was different. H was shocked by my pain, really shocked. If he had seen that and still kept seeing OW I think I would have had to say 'enough!' .

I don't think I would have drawn any lines sexually - it's not something that matters that much to me. Once he'd crossed the line to get emotionally close to someone else all the boundaries that matter have been crossed.

December 9, 2013

Reconciliation for me was a big mistake, and I wish I could get a do-over on that one. If she had cheated with a friend of mine it would have been great because I could never live with that and we would have divorced.

It's interesting to me that that would be a deal breaker for you (or for others) and I totally get that. For my husband, apparently it's not (at least so far), however he hasn't talked to xmom or seen him since dday four years ago. No apologies or anything (even after being his friend for years).

For me, even though I wasn't really friends with his xmow, I knew her. I don't know - I guess I would rather it be someone he had developed a relationship with than someone off the street or a one night stand or something. The idea of just meeting someone and having sex with them that night repulses me. For me, it would mean that he had absolutely no respect for women.

I know - what a dichotomy - choosing between which type of betrayal is better than another - sad conversation.

December 9, 2013

I decided not to R for a variety of reasons. I think that the one thing that I could not have gotten over even if he did everything right after d-day would be an OC. I don't know how some BSs live with that.

What does "OC" mean? also what is XMOM? sorry but these acronyms are new to me.

December 9, 2013

What does "OC" mean? also what is XMOM? sorry but these acronyms are new to me.

OC- other child

xMOM - ex married other man

I think there is a list of some in the other woman/man section

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If my WS had done this, it would've been over...

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