Need advice! Married but both are unfaithful, why!

[Scififantasy78]

Hi. I'm 25 years old and have been married for 6 years. First I must say I have had the most happy moments in my life with my husband, and cannot fathom life without him and they way this are. We have 2 young children which we both love dearly. And we both have a deep love and need for each other.....I don't think either one of us would know where to start over without the other.

 

However, several years ago we began to have serious marital problems...beyond bickering and spats. Long story short...I guess I began to feel ignored and unimportant to him. It seemed every talk was a battle to which I always ended up somewhere crying alone without comfort. To fast forward....I met a man online, we began to have I guess what would be considered an "emotional affair." He was there for me and said all the things I had been wanting to hear. Needless to say, my husband found out...became livid, wanted a divorced, etc., and so on. But, we worked things out...for the moment...

 

It seems after that, we just went back and forth...back and forth. Being a stay at home mom, my primary means of infidelity was the Internet, meanwhile he also "talked" to females on the Internet...and had some questionable situations outside the Internet. We went back and forth...split up...then make up...split up...then make up. Things WOULD change for a while...and be great. However, eventually old patterns returned.

 

Not only did the patterns return, they also escalated. I was the first to be physically unfaithful. And this happened more than once. He too, was physically unfaithful. However....we again...patched things up.

 

Why was I unfaithful? Both emotionally and physically...I don't know for certain. I don't know why history keeps repeating itself for me in spite of hindsight. Why was he? Spite most likely.....spite and temporary infatuations. In my heart of hearts I was never unfaithful. But, this said. I don't know what to do next. I don't know if this can be fixed...I don't know if it should be. I don't know if I can trust him again, I don't know if he can trust me ever completely. I don't know if I am a corrupt person deep down...and I don't know if I can ever forgive myself or trust myself again. It seems like the more time goes by in life the more you realize just exactly what your capable of, and for me that's terrifying.

 

I think what plagues me most is that...lets say it does end..and I do start over...and god willing he does the same. What if I f*uck it all up again. What if it really is all my fault. I know he can be mentally and emotionally abusive at times (in recent years), I know he has a ferocious temper, and I know there is no line he wont cross to verbally hurt me.....but I do wonder...maybe I and I alone created a monster.....? I'd like to believe I am a loving, thoughtful, logical, and faithful person. But I don't know anything about myself anymore.

 

 

I do know one thing, if things in this marriage must end I want it to be civil with no regrets...no coulda, shoulda, or woulda's...but on the other hand I don't want to beat a dead horse. Either way I want to remain friends and he does too. Because, just because a marriage may end doesn't mean you have to lose your best friend too...or at least I hope not.

 

So if anyone has any insight or has had a similar experience and could throw some wisdom my way. Please to. Thanks

 

-C

[Bryanp]

Hello,

 

I thought your story was very sad. It seems you love your husband and he loves you and you are best friends while having two small children. When infidelity enters the picture it is very difficult to recover. Honestly I am lost with your statement that in your heart of hearts you were never unfaithful yet you admit you were physically and emotionally unfaithful first. Gosh, I hope you did not say that to your husband. I cannot imagine any husband that would be able to comprehend a statement by which a wife who was sleeping with another man behind his back telling him in my heart of hearts I was never unfaithful to you. I could see why he would go crazy.

 

Nevertheless, you explained your pain and problems very well.

I have no advise except it is a shame that with two small children, and having some of the best moments in your life with your spouse that you both seem willing to give up on each other. I hope you try counseling once more and really make sure this is what you want.

 

Concerning your other question of why you did what you did and whether you are defective in some way I cannot answer. I will tell you something that I always keep in mind when I am dealing with people of the opposite sex. I ask myself if I am unsure of my behavior the following question: How would I feel if my wife was doing to me what I was thinking of doing to her. This always keeps me in a good place. You may wish to think of this in the future. I wish you luck.

[Ladyjane14]

Geez....you two are in serious marital trouble. Have you had any marriage counseling? If not, consider starting immediately.

 

Think about getting the internet out of your house. You're in too much danger of divorce to have it in your home right now. Make a pact to stay away from it altogether until you are on firmer ground.

 

Better to get information from the library or bookstore than to have such a risky intrusion in your marriage when you can least afford the temptation and distraction.

[Devildog]

In my heart of hearts I was never unfaithful

 

WTF??? It's okay to be unfaithful in your mouth of mouths or your holiest of holies, but that isn't unfaithful in your heart of hearts?

 

Counselling can fix alot of the problems, because counselling helps you to understand each other's needs and desires and see where you are not meeting each other's desires. Even if you go at first you can learn to understand what you are doing wrong and that can lead to him improving as well.

[Scififantasy78]

We have a counseling session next week and have been once or twice before. But I'm not sure how much good it is going to do. But we will see…perhaps it will spark an epiphany.

 

As for the Internet thing.... we have removed the net and other elements from the situation in the past… but honestly I don't think it’s the net that is the actual problem. Just as if a person is an alcoholic.... it isn’t the alcohol being there that’s the problem...and its not that alcohol can't be used safely...it’s the person who cannot longer moderate it that is the issue. Also, its not as if either one of us have an addiction to the Internet.... I really think it’s a case of. If it were not one thing it would be another. I personally spend most of my computer time playing games or chatting with platonic friends…rarely do I even post on a message bored such as this!

 

As for the “in my heart of hearts” statement…. I NEVER said it was OK in any way, shape, or form. Nor did I imply it was a lesser evil. But to me it does make a difference…giving your body to someone in a one-night affair is a lot different than investing emotions and/or falling in love with someone…and having a full on affair. I do not justify anything I have done nor can he justify anything he has done.

 

I guess I am just beginning to think perhaps there is too much water under the bridge…and maybe there has been too much that has happened to move beyond. But, if this is so…I guess I worry I have some sort of flaw. Maybe I am not capable of being functional in a relationship. I really hope this isn’t so and I’m just being eaten away by guilt.

[Devildog]

Originally posted by Scififantasy78

As for the “in my heart of hearts” statement…. I NEVER said it was OK in any way, shape, or form. Nor did I imply it was a lesser evil. But to me it does make a difference…giving your body to someone in a one-night affair is a lot different than investing emotions and/or falling in love with someone…and having a full on affair.

 

Perhaps in your opinion, but most times it is easier to forgive an emotional affair than a physical affair. In my opinion, the physical affair is something that can never be gotten rid of. Nothing can be done to remove that, and when you are married, that is just the most hurtful thing you can do. I could forgive my wife having an emotional affair, but if she slept with her "friend" that would be a different story. It would take alot more for me to forgive that. It is the ultimate betrayal in a marriage.

 

I guess I am just beginning to think perhaps there is too much water under the bridge…and maybe there has been too much that has happened to move beyond.

 

There is never too much water under the bridge if the people love each other enough. All things can be overcome with love, patience, communication, and honesty. You need to decide if you love your husband enough to make it work.

[Scififantasy78]

Well I think that it depends on the persons point of view, in reference to physical vs. emotional. I personally felt more hurt hearing my husband speak affectionatly to another woman, and tell another woman he loved her, than by him sleeping with her. Sleeping with someone is just that, sleeping with them...not that it isnt horrible when your in a commited relationship to sleep with another person, it is horrible. But for me...knowing your mate is emotionally involved with someone or at least seems to be is far harder for me to deal with. But, I think in general men see physical as being a bigger betrayal and women are more hurt by the emotional aspect...or at least with the people I have spoken to reguarding the subject.

 

For me being unfaithful was like a bandaid on a wound that wasent healing. As for him I don't know why he did what he did...spite I am assuming. I have to factor in that we got together at 18, and had a baby and got married at 19.

 

As for water under the bridge......I'd like to believe that no obsticle is too great but I cannot honestly believe that. I think to believe that would be a great notion but unrealistic.

 

-C

[Devildog]

But, I think in general men see physical as being a bigger betrayal and women are more hurt by the emotional aspect...or at least with the people I have spoken to reguarding the subject.

 

I agree with that statement. So if you slept with someone else don't you think it would be harder for yur husband to forgive that? It might not seem like as big a deal to you, but it is up to him to decide if that is a marriage breaker for him or not.

 

As for water under the bridge......I'd like to believe that no obsticle is too great but I cannot honestly believe that. I think to believe that would be a great notion but unrealistic.

 

You have complete control over if these obstacles are too much to overcome or not, at least from your end. It takes will, determination, and desire. If you have enough of those, you have the strength to get through anything.

[Owl]

My 2 cents worth...

 

I think that an affair is equally devastating....emotional, or physical. Granted, in my case my wife's online emotional affair didn't become physical...but it was a damn close thing. And it still hurts everyday...and it still comes to my mind everyday.

 

Sci-fi-

You're worry about it happening again is right on the money. For one very important reason...it sounds to me like the two of you have not worked through everything to figure out WHY the affairs happened. What did you get from your lover(s) that you weren't getting from your husband? What was he getting from his that he wasn't getting from YOU??? And what are the two of you going to do to START making sure you're providing those needs for each other?? THAT should be the focus and goals of your counseling...or else it's not going to do you a darn bit of good. And it DOES leave it open to happen again.

 

Read my thread on this site...it will likely sound a lot like what happened to you the first time.

 

I know your doubts and pain friend...trust me. BUT, if you REALLY do love your husband, and he does love you, and you had a great marriage at some point in the past, you can work through this. But what you've got to do is to start FIXING your relationship...no more bandaids. It's a lot harder than just putting a bandaid on...more like treating a 3rd degree burn. It hurts like HELL sometimes, and you wonder if you ever will recover, but if you don't treat it, your marriage will just die of the infection that was never treated.

 

Hang in there...keep the counseling going...and start TALKING with your husband. If you love him...SHOW him that in ways that HE can see. Realize that often we don't tell our spouses that we love them in ways that they can see...like we're not speaking the same language. Think about it.

[Cecelius]

Originally posted by Scififantasy78

 

As for the “in my heart of hearts” statement…. I NEVER said it was OK in any way, shape, or form. Nor did I imply it was a lesser evil. But to me it does make a difference…giving your body to someone in a one-night affair is a lot different than investing emotions and/or falling in love with someone…and having a full on affair. I do not justify anything I have done nor can he justify anything he has done.

 

Actually, I disagree: a cheap one nighter where you give out your body to someone else for ego benefits or attention or whatever is a WHOLE lot more offensive to most men than the idea of their wife developing romantic feelings for someone. Frankly, drunken hooking up strikes me as cheaper and dirtier than an emotional affair, and so would my wife if she were to have such a hook up.

[Scififantasy78]

Originally posted by Bryanp

 

Nevertheless, you explained your pain and problems very well.

I have no advise except it is a shame that with two small children, and having some of the best moments in your life with your spouse that you both seem willing to give up on each other. I hope you try counseling once more and really make sure this is what you want.

 

 

I think thats one of the things that bugs me the most (no offese to you). My sister and alot of people make comments about giving up and it being a shame...and how I should be willing to fight harder. I have been fighting for probably around 4 years. I have modified my behavior to PLEASE HIM to the point that I am barly recognizable as the person I once was. I used to be angery, immature, and a fight picker when I was young. Now I don't even fight back. I don't name call. I just sit and take whats coming to me. When he get angery at me...deserved or not...I listen to him tell me what a horrible person I am..what a whore I am..how I am a waste of air in this world...and I don't once fight back. I just try my best to hold back the tears and block it out. 75% of the time when he comes home from work his dinner is ready and waiting (at 1 or 2 am mind you), I clean the house best I can, deal with his mother whom we live with, etc and so on. I don't have friends cause he dosent approve. I don't drive or have a job because he dosent approve. So when someone says to me anything that resembles the statement that I havent given it my all...I wanna say ok....I cheated...and I was wrong and I'm sorry...go ahead and stitch the scarlet letter directly to my flesh. But what f'ing else do I have to give?....

 

Sorry....had to rant.

[Bryanp]

Hello again,

 

After reading your reply I certainly understand your feelings. Remember we only make suggestions based on the information at hand. I guess it was the thought of the two children you have to deal with is a problem. On the other hand, the way you describe things sounds absolutely intolerable and unacceptable. You have a right to a productive and fullfilling life. From what you have written it seems clear it cannot be done in this marriage. I wish you luck and hope you find happiness in the future.

[Scififantasy78]

I understand and it is unfortunate for the children...but on the other hand I guess my thinking is that children deserve the chance to see a functional and healthy relationship rather than a disfunctional and hostile one. I dunno....maybe I can make things work.......we will see.

 

-C

[TMCM]

Scififantasy78,

 

While the following may not have anything to do with infidelity, it probably has some relevancy to your present situation. From a thread titled Serious Trust Issues Volume #2 that you may find interesting. It is from the viewpoint of a man but it can be equally applied to a woman. Please pay special attention to the paragraph in italics:

 

"I was at the breaking point in my own marriage. I woke up one day and decided after almost 19 years of bending over backwards for my wife I was losing all my love for her. Nothing I did was good enough and she withheld sex to get her way and would blackmail me by threatening me if she did not get her way.

 

I had tried everything I knew so I decided to try one more thing. I tried to meet all her needs and not ask her to meet my needs at all. I was more attentive and went the extra mile in everything I did. This went on for about 6 months and she was happy and acted very happy. At that point I decided I wanted my needs met and told her what my needs were and she said she would try. She did not try very hard and then I started to build up resentment.

 

I finally realized something, Why should she change? I mean she was getting her needs met had a beautiful home I mean why should she bother with me? I then decided that I no longer wanted to be with my wife in this marriage. She had never respected me and I never stood up for myself. I do almost all the laundry and now most of the cooking and half of the cleaning in our house. We both work the same hours outside the home and if my W does not want to have SF with me or finds me unattractive then I want her to find a man that she does find attractive.

 

I don't buy in to the fact that if you meet someones needs then everything else will follow. Some people are selfish and they will be come happy at their spouses expense. My W had an excuse why she would not meet my needs and if I addressed that problem then she would say well it is something else. I grew tired of this game and realized I didn't want to play anymore.

 

I got to the point I could not take it anymore and I told her to leave. I told her I was losing my love for her and since she has said for years she was leaving I wanted her to go because my fear of her leaving was making me miserable. I never knew what I would do to set her off. She said she did not want to leave so I told her fine then I would leave. I told her I gave her unconditional love for years but now I did not know if I loved her anymore. She had worn me down and I just said you win you will now get to experience life without me.

 

I have a new job offer that I am suppose to start on Feb 1st so I told her I would be leaving and we need to decide what to do with everything including the kids. I was dead serious I just wanted my W to be happy. I had done my best but it wasn't good enough so I was ready to let her go.

 

Then something happened that I did not expect, my W suddenly turned into the person she use to be when we were dating. All of a sudden she was scared because she knew for the 1st time in her life that she could lose me. I had resigned myself that it was over so I was a little shocked to say the least. She did a 180 and acted more like the woman I knew when we first met?? [smile]

 

All of a sudden she was thankful for what I had given her all of these years. We started having more SF and she started showing me appreciation. I am now starting to feel my love returning for her but I feel better about our chances. She has appologized and told me she was so selfish and asked me for another chance. I told her I am willing but she must remain this current woman and I never want to see that other woman she was for so many years.

 

What does this have to do with you well here is my opinion. Your Wife treats you the way she does because you allow it. You have to accept it and live with it or you can demand that it stop. She does not hold all the cards, you do!

 

I am not saying you should threaten her or leave her or divorce her, I am just saying you need to decide what you are going to do from now on. You need to ask yourself some questions and answer honestly.

 

Have you been a good husband? I did not say a perfect husband but a good husband. If you have been a good H then why do you deserve to be treated like you have been by this woman? Why do you put up with it? If you have not been a good H then you will have a lot of work to do."

[Scififantasy78]

Originally posted by TMCM

Scififantasy78,

 

While the following may not have anything to do with infidelity, it probably has some relevancy to your present situation. From a thread titled Serious Trust Issues Volume #2 that you may find interesting. It is from the viewpoint of a man but it can be equally applied to a woman. Please pay special attention to the paragraph in italics:

 

That post is very true TMCM, and I have experience moments very similar. My husband and I were separated for 8 months once, and have had bouts of splitting up and reconciling. And it is true, that often when one person says they have had enough, the other is suddenly scared s*itless, and become the person they used to be (the person whom the other fell in love with). However, for me, it hasn’t lasted. I'm not sure why that is.

 

I love my husband I have never doubted that and I always will love him. A part of me will love him till the day I die. But, I don't think I am in love with him, just as it could be he isn’t in love with me either.

 

The person who I fell in love with doesn’t exist anymore; I only see glimpses on occasion of the old person. I don't know whom the new person is, and at times I'm not sure I want to know. Although, it’s probably true the person he fell in love with doesn’t exist anymore either...perhaps because she was weak and couldn’t withstand the emotional trials and tribulations and was replaced by someone a little bit colder and less loving.

 

Either way I guess I'm at my wits end as was stated in the quote you posted. I can't go on living with the fear of what I'll do, what he'll do, what the punishment will be...of the cold feeling in the pit of your chest when faced with splitting up over and over again. I don't cry anymore, I don't get angery anymore, I don't have the strength to fight anymore. I'm just spent. I'm living in a listless limbo of knowing I'll never be good enough and having my face rubbed in all my mistakes like I'm a bad dog.

 

But hopefully I have one more round left in me and we'll see where it goes.

 

-C

[TMCM]

Scififantasy78,

 

I'm very sorry that you [and your H] are suffering and while it is your call whether or not you have any hope for the future of your marriage, once thing you have to keep in mind is that while you can attain a divorce from your H, you can never attain a divorce from yourself. As someone who has gone through divorce and remarriage, I can tell you that divorce can only help you only so much in terms of your emotional recovery but the vast bulk of the work for recovery will still fall on your shoulders whether you decide to continue with your marriage or not. You must also always be honest with your H about your feelings even if he choses not to listen or beleive you, why? because if you do decide to divorce and move on with your life, you can look yourself into the mirror and into your two young childrens eyes and know that you gave it your all to save the marriage and the family but your H chose not participate in the effort. Lastly, be proud of the efforts you have put in to becoming a better mother and W, even if they are never acknowledge by the ones you love.

 

God bless you and yours.

 

TMCM

[InThisSkinAgain]

if you did it before then you'll probably do it again........and so will he.

 

Infidelity, at the end of the day, after all the insecurity, excuses, self-hate, lust and justification...............is about ethics.

 

Ethics are what you do when no one's looking.

 

The commitment to marital fidelity is primarily a commitment to yourself, and only secondarily to your spouse........"I will keep myself only unto thee........"

 

regardless of how shady he is................if you can't keep yours in your pants, that's on you