Quiet Storm Posted November 26, 2013 Posted November 26, 2013 Well, obviously, OP.... Us dirty atheists get our values straight FROM SATAN! They are praying for us! 1
Eggplant Posted November 27, 2013 Posted November 27, 2013 People in all cultures since cavemen have had marriages. The common denominator is having babies together and having the man stay and provide and being faithful. Religions all have their own spins, embellishments, versions, etc. But marriage is a universal human practice, common to all people, in all cultures, religious or not. You can talk about your husband to another person from an entirely different culture or religion or lack thereof, and there is no confusion as to what you are talking about.
HokeyReligions Posted November 27, 2013 Posted November 27, 2013 The quote I posted did ask where values come from for a non-Christian. But it also said that a non-Christian would not care about marriage, what is right or wrong, or care about infidelity That is what particularly bothers me and I do see that as a criticism of non-Christians. I am pretty sure many others would agree with me on that one. I read it again and I still don't get that tone from it. The words used were "I guess" which could be sarcasm or could be another form of of questioning. IMO so what if someone criticizes non-christians. Christians are constantly being told to 'tolerate' others so why can't othrrs 'tolerate' Christians? There have been civil unions for as long as there have been marriages sanctified by God. If a particular faith or church or subset of a religious group chooses not to recognize a marriage what should that matter to anyone outside that group? 1
Author anne1707 Posted November 27, 2013 Author Posted November 27, 2013 I read it again and I still don't get that tone from it. The words used were "I guess" which could be sarcasm or could be another form of of questioning. IMO so what if someone criticizes non-christians. Christians are constantly being told to 'tolerate' others so why can't othrrs 'tolerate' Christians? There have been civil unions for as long as there have been marriages sanctified by God. If a particular faith or church or subset of a religious group chooses not to recognize a marriage what should that matter to anyone outside that group? People often say "I guess..." when they mean "I think..." and just as there should be tolerance for Christians, there should also be tolerance for atheists. A tolerance that does not question whether people even have values, let alone what was the basis of their value system, a tolerance that does not (and not just IMO) suggest that atheists don't care about right or wrong, a tolerance that does not say that atheists don't care about marriage (which is what the person quoted said and is very different to saying they did not recognise a civil union). This is far from the first time on LS that I have seen a lack of tolerance for atheists. I doubt it will be the last either. 2
rumbleseat Posted November 28, 2013 Posted November 28, 2013 I think atheists/ agnostics can place more value on marriage than the religious people who marry for convienience, because " it's the right thing to do" or for some other reason that is external to the two people involved. They value it much more than the many religious people who cheat and then say " but ' god' (or whoever) forgives me because I am a good person in every other way" . Especially in the Christian religion, where one of the founding rules is to not commit adultery, to not covet thy neighbours spouse, etc., yet those commandments are broken when someone has an affair. Even deep religious belief is not enough to stop them, yet many with no particular religious beliefs do not cheat. Why? Maybe it's because morals come from within a person, and if someone depends wholly upon their religion to keep them in line, then I would have to wonder what sort of a person they really are. You can be a great person no matter what your beliefs may be, and the opposite is just as true. You can be an absolute appalling jerk no matter what your beliefs (or lack thereof ) may be. 5
BeingMe Posted November 28, 2013 Posted November 28, 2013 I think atheists/ agnostics can place more value on marriage than the religious people who marry for convienience, because " it's the right thing to do" or for some other reason that is external to the two people involved. They value it much more than the many religious people who cheat and then say " but ' god' (or whoever) forgives me because I am a good person in every other way" . Especially in the Christian religion, where one of the founding rules is to not commit adultery, to not covet thy neighbours spouse, etc., yet those commandments are broken when someone has an affair. Even deep religious belief is not enough to stop them, yet many with no particular religious beliefs do not cheat. Why? Maybe it's because morals come from within a person, and if someone depends wholly upon their religion to keep them in line, then I would have to wonder what sort of a person they really are. You can be a great person no matter what your beliefs may be, and the opposite is just as true. You can be an absolute appalling jerk no matter what your beliefs (or lack thereof ) may be. This, Very much this. My WH was a committed Christian, but it didn't stop him having an affair. Whereas my aunt (agnostic) only got married recently because she knew she wasn't ready for the commitment before now - she was able to be honest with herself because she didn't feel any kind of religious pressure to conform.
Untouchable_Fire Posted November 28, 2013 Posted November 28, 2013 Now as an atheist. I find the above viewpoint just completely at odds with mine. It implies that my vows mean nothing to me, that fidelity is not important, and that my value system must be pretty suspect. It implies to me that the only proper marriage is a Christian one and that anything outside that is I think you are reading too much into that statement. Marriage without the spiritual component is just a business contract. Atheists may care just as much about the relationship as anyone else. You need to separate those two things when discussing this. Much of our traditions for marriage are Christian, but most people don't understand their significance. The original post also questioned the moral code of Atheists. I'm not sure it's a fair question since everyone sins fairly equally. Most atheists act like hermit crabs and just take whatever morals surround them. I think that is what rubs people the wrong way. Moral relativism sucks hard and people should ditch the idea. 1
Author anne1707 Posted November 28, 2013 Author Posted November 28, 2013 I think you are reading too much into that statement. You may feel different if it was you who was being accused of not caring about what was right or wrong. The original post also questioned the moral code of Atheists. I'm not sure it's a fair question since everyone sins fairly equally I agree - which is one of the reasons why I had a problem with the statement Most atheists act like hermit crabs and just take whatever morals surround them. Couldn't the same be said about Christians?
janedoe67 Posted November 28, 2013 Posted November 28, 2013 I sat this as a Christian: Nine times out of ten, when someone is all mangled about atheists not caring about right and wrong and being very......pontificatory about religion, it isn't so much about Christianity.... It's usually about legalism. Don't worry, if another Harry Potter book comes out you atheists will be old news lol 1
maiden of rohan Posted November 29, 2013 Posted November 29, 2013 Christians need to be aware that this "showing us that we are mistaken" will one day come at the cost of your life. We will be called to deny Christ or face starvation/execution by these so-called moral atheists governed by the supposedly same basic feelings of right/wrong, empathy and kindness. I hope this is a 1000 years from now…but it's unintelligent and intolerant statements and threads like this that make it look like it will be sooner rather than later. The undercurrent of hatred and disdain for Christians exhibited, most often passively, by the followers of Atheism is palpable. Was it the pitchforks that gave us away? It was the pitchforks, wasn't it...I knew it! We shouldn't have brought the pitchforks! 3
Recommended Posts