Why Men Loves B*tches

[Treasa]

The book isn't about being insincere, following rules, jumping through hoops, making him jump through hoops, etc.

 

Once I got my self-esteem to the level it is now, I realized that I was doing most of the things in that book. I have my own activities that are mine, and that I won't give up for any guy, and if a guy wanted to go out with me and I had plans, or if I didn't feel like hanging out, I'd say no. Conversely, if I wanted to hang out, I'd just go hang out. I don't worry about those things. I just more or less do what makes me happy.

 

When I'm mad at my boyfriend, I just calmly, usually in about three sentences, tell him what upset me. I don't nag, I don't cry, I don't plead, I don't threaten. I explain, get space if I need it, and get over it. If he's doing something wrong, he shapes up. If the problem was me, I shape up.

 

I don't waste my time with loser guys anymore in dead-end relationships. I make sure to maintain my own life and have my own completely happiness independent of him.

 

Once you really have a lot of self-esteem and self-respect, the principles come pretty naturally.

 

Also, you can't and shouldn't change a guy. It's not fair to either of you, and it won't work. If a guy doesn't work out, move on to another one. My boyfriend and I are completely compatible, which is why we're together. We get each other and almost never fight. I'm confident, he's confident, and things are beautiful.

[BlessYourCottonSocks]

but its a girls own choice to read it and do what it says right?

 

You don't have to! If it works for you great, if it doesn't it doesn't!

 

Yes, it is my choice. Since I am seeking clarity on how to maintain a relationship and keep the fire burning...

 

A few people have mentioned the book to me, so I finally read most of it and just seemed almost disappointed with the premise of it.

 

I would like to hear what men have to say about the book and what they expect of women? Is it all true?

[PinkCarnations]

The book isn't about being insincere, following rules, jumping through hoops, making him jump through hoops, etc.

 

Once I got my self-esteem to the level it is now, I realized that I was doing most of the things in that book. I have my own activities that are mine, and that I won't give up for any guy, and if a guy wanted to go out with me and I had plans, or if I didn't feel like hanging out, I'd say no. Conversely, if I wanted to hang out, I'd just go hang out. I don't worry about those things. I just more or less do what makes me happy.

 

When I'm mad at my boyfriend, I just calmly, usually in about three sentences, tell him what upset me. I don't nag, I don't cry, I don't plead, I don't threaten. I explain, get space if I need it, and get over it. If he's doing something wrong, he shapes up. If the problem was me, I shape up.

 

I don't waste my time with loser guys anymore in dead-end relationships. I make sure to maintain my own life and have my own completely happiness independent of him.

 

Once you really have a lot of self-esteem and self-respect, the principles come pretty naturally.

 

Also, you can't and shouldn't change a guy. It's not fair to either of you, and it won't work. If a guy doesn't work out, move on to another one. My boyfriend and I are completely compatible, which is why we're together. We get each other and almost never fight. I'm confident, he's confident, and things are beautiful.

 

BASICALLY SUMS UP EVERYTHING IM TRYING TO CONVEY. Amen, sister! <3

[Treasa]

 

I would like to hear what men have to say about the book and what they expect of women? Is it all true?

 

Sweetie, how about doing what makes you happy, and finding a guy who fits into THAT?

[BlessYourCottonSocks]

BASICALLY SUMS UP EVERYTHING IM TRYING TO CONVEY. Amen, sister! <3

 

I agree, Teresa came on top! That is a lot less stressful and something I could follow and become!! Thanks Teresa!! :-)

[BlessYourCottonSocks]

Sweetie, how about doing what makes you happy, and finding a guy who fits into THAT?

 

You are right. But sadly, I've lost that. Instead, I've made my boyfriend my priority and focus. My happiness begins with him and that has become a heavy burden.

 

I need to somehow switch that around while making the relationship stronger and me more independent.

[Treasa]

What are your hobbies? Do you have good girl friends?

[BlessYourCottonSocks]

What are your hobbies? Do you have good girl friends?

 

The gym. and yes I have some friends, but lately they all have been busy. I am capable of having my own life, but I just always want to be with him. I enjoy him and love him.

[Treasa]

Well, do whatever makes you happy. Have fun. But if you feel pressured or stressed, take a step back and relax and go to the gym, or take up painting or something. Women can have caves, too.

[d0nnivain]

I'm curious how many people saying not to play games are married or in relationships vs. how many people who say "learn to play the games".

 

 

I'm an alpha female. I have been for most of my life. I was shy & mousey until I grew into my personality. Over the years people have accused me of wanting to be the man in my relationship. I'm not sure I agree with that, but things are usually better when I'm in charge.

 

 

I am happily married, something I wasn't sure was ever going to happen.

 

 

I played a lot of games but mostly with myself.

 

 

I watched the clock before I'd call a guy back.

 

 

In the beginning of a relationship, I would purposely plan things with girl friends for Friday or Saturday nights to make sure I was legitimately busy & unavailable.

 

 

I counted dates before I would even let myself consider sleeping with him . . . & as I got closer to that magic number I'd use the

old

standbys of not shaving my legs & wearing less than fabulous undies

so

I would be forced to not cave, lest he think I was gross.

 

 

I had some litmus tests. I would talk about certain hotly contested taboo subjects: religion, politics, etc. to see if the guy could have an intelligent conversation about them. I didn't care

so

much about what his opinion was (he didn't have to agree with me) but I needed him to have an opinion.

 

Ironically, when I met DH I was on the hunt for a new relationship & I was taking advice I got from the books & from sites like this to dial it back & be more feminine. I was desperately trying to be more meek & give the guy the space to take charge. Believe it or not, as I was leaving the event where I met the man who is now my husband, in an attempt to keep him talking & to be more "feminine" I asked him to walk me to my car in the nearby parking garage because I told him I don't like parking garages after dark. I really don't but we were in an incredibly safe, well lit area. He walked me but later confessed that he thought I was very ditzy for asking / saying that. When he mentioned my behavior to a buddy the buddy correctly assured him that I was manipulating him into asking me out by trying to arrange something where we'd be alone. DUH. Also when we got married, I tried to be deferential & let DH make decisions / be in charge. It was a disaster. He finally sat me down & said, just do it because I won't & you'll end up resenting me.

 

 

You aren't going to be happy until you understand yourself & are happy in your own skin.

[clia]

Yeah, the point of these types of books is to provide boundary setting behavior for women who consistently allow themselves to be treated like doormats. They provide guidance on not being needy and clingy and essentially tell women to "get a life." You obviously don't have to follow any of the advice if it bothers you.

 

It's easy to follow the rules, but am I still gonna be happy changing who I am to satisfy HIM? If I were to comply by the rules of this book, I'd go crazy checking things off the list to make sure "I make him happy".

 

So it goes like this:

1. He calls, it's 8:04 PM.

2. I put him on hold while I flip through the chapters of how to answer his question "Will you come over tonight?"

3. Finally find the answer and the books says "Don't go over after 8pm and not if he just hung out with his guy friends because then that would mean you put your life on hold for him and he won't respect you"

4. "Crap, I really wanted to come over", I think.

5. I take him off hold and muster the most convincing sweet voice and say, "Sorry honey, not tonight, I'm out with my girlfriend"

6. Sure, I won the most convincing lie of the night, but in the end the man doesn't really give a toot either way and I'm stuck thinking about how much fun we could have had...

 

What does this make of me? If I want to do something, why can't I?

 

You shouldn't change yourself to satisfy anyone. However, that doesn't mean you will have relationship success by just doing whatever you want all the time. Sometimes you have to exercise some restraint. We all do it in other facets of our life -- i.e. at work, interactions with family and friends -- so why not in relationships? I don't see why people call it "game playing" in the context of relationships.

 

In the scenario above (which I hope didn't actually happen), the bigger question to ask yourself is why, at 8:04 p.m., you don't already have plans for the evening? Plans do not have to mean going out. Plans can mean you intend to clean out your closets, do your laundry, curl up and read a book, catch up on Game of Thrones on your DVR, dye your hair, whatever. You shouldn't be lying to your boyfriend or pretending like you have plans when you don't. This only leads to bigger lies. What do you say when he asks you what you and your girlfriends did the night before?

 

The point is that accepting last minute invites only encourages more last minute invites. Personally, I don't like last minute invites from anyone. It makes me feel like I was their last resort. Like they didn't have anything better to do. This is doubly so when it is a new man asking you to come over. So, you have to get off your couch, primp yourself up, and drive over to his house. He gets to sit on the couch and drink a beer and will probably get sex out of it. Then you have to drive yourself home at midnight or whenever. Yuck. Obviously in longer term relationships you do things last minute sometimes. That's fine. But the larger point is that you shouldn't always be so available. You should have your own life. You should have plans of your own so you aren't constantly sitting around hoping he is going to call and ask you to do something. Let him miss you a little bit.

 

I get it. The moral of the story is to be independent. But if I want to talk about things, why can't I? If I want to get upset at him for something, why can't I show it? Why does it have to be labeled as needy and dependent?

 

You can do all these things, but it is about how you do it. You're right -- men and women are different. You shouldn't be treating your boyfriend like he's one of your girlfriends. It's not a turn on for him.

[Treasa]

Ha, I'm that type of female, too. It works out well because my mate is the opposite of me. He's strong and confident, but he likes following, and I like leading.

 

Dear God, nothing would ever happen if I just waited for him. LOL

[CptSaveAho]

i love how women try to put perfume on their crap and paint it gold...

[BlessYourCottonSocks]

Alright. So perfect example, oddly enough. I was texting my boyfriend today and said "Hope you are having a great day" and he asked how I was and yada yada.

 

He asked me what I was doing tonight, I said "Gym. Relax and pack for the weekend" Then he told me what he was doing tonight, and I said an hour later: "Miss you!" and he said "I would like to see you but I'll be honest, I'm running around a lot today getting stuff done cause yesterday I couldn't do ****, so I won't be able to spend quality time with you." (which I found weird that he said that because I didn't ask to come over). I think the reason he had to give that disclaimer was because last time I complained about him being too busy when I'm over at his house...

 

Now normally I would respond in a way that he would know I am not happy with that answer. So instead, I said, "That's fine! No worries :-) "

 

He then wrote, "Call me when you get off work."

 

I think he was kind of shocked at my calm answer. Funny because in the book it mentioned this kind of situation. Where the guy knows he isn't doing something the girl would necessarily like and is expecting a reaction, but when he doesn't get one, he starts to wonder why.

 

So I'm going to call him after work, but not the minute I get off. I'm going to go home, change, settle in and then call him. As the book would suggest.

 

What do you think?

[CptSaveAho]

the same games (sorry "rules") can be played on women..... and its 1000x's more effective

[BlessYourCottonSocks]

the same games (sorry "rules") can be played on women..... and its 1000x's more effective

 

Is this regarding to what I just wrote? If so, what do you mean? He is playing a game?

[blueskyday]

Naw, don't call when you get home from work. Let him call you. He's the one who said he was busy, so he knows it's on him to call you!

 

In reference to the book, I've read it and I think it has some very good points in it. In short, it says to take the focus off of him and put it more on you. That's always a good idea. No need to lie. If a guy calls after 8 o'clock for me to come over, I simply tell him that I'm busy. Or I don't answer the phone at all. Then he gets the message to make plans with me sooner. It's simple. Get a life and don't make him the center of it.

 

The book did teach me one very important concept. When I'm upset, instead of going on and on just to bottom line it to a guy. That alone makes me feel very powerful! Plus I don't have to over explain.

[BlessYourCottonSocks]

Naw, don't call when you get home from work. Let him call you. He's the one who said he was busy, so he knows it's on him to call you!

 

In reference to the book, I've read it and I think it has some very good points in it. In short, it says to take the focus off of him and put it more on you. That's always a good idea. No need to lie. If a guy calls after 8 o'clock for me to come over, I simply tell him that I'm busy. Or I don't answer the phone at all. Then he gets the message to make plans with me sooner. It's simple. Get a life and don't make him the center of it.

 

The book did teach me one very important concept. When I'm upset, instead of going on and on just to bottom line it to a guy. That alone makes me feel very powerful! Plus I don't have to over explain.

 

You are right. I should let him call me instead. Because I will probably call and he won't answer (since he is busy).

 

I agree, the book has some great concepts and I will use them. Well, like I am now.

 

So you are saying, instead of dragging a talk out you just point blank say "This is what I'm upset about"??

[CptSaveAho]

yes to you and no you are playing the game

 

he told you to call him, so do it "oh im going to go home unwind blah blah blah" and you over rationalize that. just call him when you get off work.

 

if i was dating someone and i told them to call me when they get off work and they said oh im home ate dinner watched a few tv shows but now im calling you, i would say "oh thats nice, well my new girlfriend is calling so I have to go" and that would be the end of it

[Treasa]

 

So you are saying, instead of dragging a talk out you just point blank say "This is what I'm upset about"??

 

That's what I do. Of course, to be honest, instead of telling him to have fun I probably would have said, "Oh, no worries, I'm going to be out tonight myself."

 

And I'd actually be out.

[BlessYourCottonSocks]

yes to you and no you are playing the game

 

he told you to call him, so do it "oh im going to go home unwind blah blah blah" and you over rationalize that. just call him when you get off work.

 

if i was dating someone and i told them to call me when they get off work and they said oh im home ate dinner watched a few tv shows but now im calling you, i would say "oh thats nice, well my new girlfriend is calling so I have to go" and that would be the end of it

 

I didn't really mean that as unwinding. I meant instead of calling him the MINUTE I get off work, I'm going to drive home first, change into comfy clothes and sit down on the couch so I can actually talk to him.

 

So obviously, in your opinion, you must not agree with the book...

[clia]

Alright. So perfect example, oddly enough. I was texting my boyfriend today and said "Hope you are having a great day" and he asked how I was and yada yada.

 

Are you initiating all this texting?

 

He asked me what I was doing tonight, I said "Gym. Relax and pack for the weekend" Then he told me what he was doing tonight,

 

Okay. So you knew he had plans that did not include you.

 

and I said an hour later: "Miss you!" and he said "I would like to see you but I'll be honest, I'm running around a lot today getting stuff done cause yesterday I couldn't do ****, so I won't be able to spend quality time with you." (which I found weird that he said that because I didn't ask to come over). I think the reason he had to give that disclaimer was because last time I complained about him being too busy when I'm over at his house...

 

When is the last time you saw him? He said what he said because your "Miss you" text out of the blue made him feel guilty, so he felt the need to explain to you why he couldn't see you tonight. Even though you didn't specifically ask to go to his house, by saying "Miss you" to him it felt like you wanted to come over. So he explained to you why you couldn't come over.

 

Now normally I would respond in a way that he would know I am not happy with that answer. So instead, I said, "That's fine! No worries :-) "

 

I don't understand at all why you would not be happy with his answer. He was busy and had other plans and you knew that. Is a response like that something you would normally blow up at him about?

 

He then wrote, "Call me when you get off work."

I think he was kind of shocked at my calm answer. Funny because in the book it mentioned this kind of situation. Where the guy knows he isn't doing something the girl would necessarily like and is expecting a reaction, but when he doesn't get one, he starts to wonder why.

 

I don't see where he did anything that would necessitate anything less than a calm and rational response. If he was shocked that you didn't freak out because he had other things to do tonight and explained that to you, then you have probably been acting way too needy. It's good that you are recognizing that and are backing off.

 

So I'm going to call him after work, but not the minute I get off. I'm going to go home, change, settle in and then call him. As the book would suggest. What do you think?

 

I think you should call him after work whenever you are ready to call him. I seriously doubt he meant that you should call him the second you got off work. It's perfectly fine to change your clothes and settle in before you call him. You might even eat dinner first.

[Treasa]

Ooh, yes, agree with my sister from another mister. I don't normally tell someone I miss them unless I'm really close to them and haven't seen them for a few weeks.

[runningfar]

I'm curious how many people saying not to play games are married or in relationships vs. how many people who say "learn to play the games".

 

.

 

Not play here.

I'm happily engaged.

[BlessYourCottonSocks]

Are you initiating all this texting?

Yes, today I did. And I don't see anything wrong with that. These are the games I'm talking about. Why does it matter who texts first when I've been with him for 3 years?

 

 

Okay. So you knew he had plans that did not include you.

Yes, and I told him my plans also that didn't say anything about him. In fact, on Monday I told him this week I was taking it easy at home because I've been tired lately, so he knows I had no intention of seeing him this week since I am packing (to move in with him) and doing stuff around the house.

 

 

When is the last time you saw him? He said what he said because your "Miss you" text out of the blue made him feel guilty, so he felt the need to explain to you why he couldn't see you tonight. Even though you didn't specifically ask to go to his house, by saying "Miss you" to him it felt like you wanted to come over. So he explained to you why you couldn't come over.

I get that now. I didn't think about that. I just said I miss him because well, I missed him. I saw him on Monday. But he knew I didn't want to come over as I already told him on Monday I wouldn't be seeing him this week.

 

 

I don't understand at all why you would not be happy with his answer. He was busy and had other plans and you knew that. Is a response like that something you would normally blow up at him about?

I wouldn't blow up, per say. But I would be offended and would've replied, "k" which he knows means "I'm pissed". So instead of being like that I'm trying to change and be more understanding.

 

I think you should call him after work whenever you are ready to call him. I seriously doubt he meant that you should call him the second you got off work. It's perfectly fine to change your clothes and settle in before you call him. You might even eat dinner first.

I'm not trying to play games. I'm trying to do what the book said. Instead of being so anxious to call him like I used to. I am trying to put myself first, do what I gotta do, then call him. Not trying to start anything.