Now what?

[lollipopspot]

I'm tempted to tell him. But I wonder what good that will bring. Revenge feels like it would be sweet but there are no winners here.

 

Revenge for what? What did they do to you?

[not-so-sure]

Revenge is a poor choice of word.

 

I guess I really mean "imposing my own sense of morality" on their situation.

 

Partly because I'm a little jealous she was able to move on ahead of me and partly too because this person I thought was so compatible with me is not. She chooses to dodge accountability. Despite my affair I have never been one to do that.

[lollipopspot]

Partly because I'm a little jealous she was able to move on ahead of me and partly too because this person I thought was so compatible with me is not. She chooses to dodge accountability. Despite my affair I have never been one to do that.

 

There are different ways of thinking about it. Some people think that if an affair has ended, then it's actually a burden to saddle your spouse with that after the fact, and you should have to bear that guilt alone. Maybe you just have a different sense of the right thing to do.

[not-so-sure]

There are different ways of thinking about it. Some people think that if an affair has ended, then it's actually a burden to saddle your spouse with that after the fact, and you should have to bear that guilt alone. Maybe you just have a different sense of the right thing to do.

 

I originally took that view but it was becoming increasingly obvious to me that I could not look my wife in the eye and withhold this information from her. Hopefully I have another 40 years with this lady.

 

Secrets have no place in marriage.

[bubbaganoosh]

I got a feeling that you have a very smart, shrewd wife who is going to take her time while she's making her decision on what to do, and leave you hanging in the wind waiting for the bomb to go off in your shorts.

 

I would be scared too if someone was that calm about hearing that her husband cheated on her. Sound like a ticking time bomb or your going to come home one day and all of your posessions are in the front yard.

 

You did the right thing by coming clean but that doesn't make her feel much better. I'll keep my fingers crossed and hope that you can work it out.

[not-so-sure]

Bubbaganoosh,

 

It's been a trying 7 months since the break up.

 

While I was in the fog, I had seriously entertained the idea of leaving for this woman but after reading here and elsewhere I chose to tough it out for a while.

 

Unfortunately I ran the ILYBINILWY line during that phase and she said recently that had broken her heart. I desperately want the opportunity to say that I said those things in a period of heightened emotion and that it wasn't true.

 

I suspect she is a lot more level about my revelation because of this. It seems like she is already emotionally prepared for this. And possibly more. Even this morning we we had started to plan our next holiday for About six months away. It's unnerving.

[not-so-sure]

She has asked me two questions

 

1. What would you want to know?

2. Are there any other lies?

 

I started compiling a list of questions and their answers, but guys seem to thing differently from women. I suspect she doesn't really want to know anything. We are both conflict avoidant with each other but this isn't the time to be addressing each other in tangents :-(

 

How Long did it go for?

When did it end?

Who was it?

Did you fall in love?

Did you have sex?

Unprotected?

Why did you cheat?

Did you fall out of love with me?

Are you talking to her still?

[whatatangledweb]

She has asked me two questions

 

1. What would you want to know?

2. Are there any other lies?

 

I started compiling a list of questions and their answers, but guys seem to thing differently from women. I suspect she doesn't really want to know anything. We are both conflict avoidant with each other but this isn't the time to be addressing each other in tangents :-(

 

How Long did it go for?

When did it end?

Who was it?

Did you fall in love?

Did you have sex?

Unprotected?

Why did you cheat?

Did you fall out of love with me?

Are you talking to her still?

 

This is a good list to start with. I would add these...

 

How do I know you won't do it again?

 

How did the affair start?

 

What did you tell the OW about me and our marriage?

 

Did you feel guilty?

 

What did I do wrong? (no it is not her fault yet many bs do ask this)

 

You then will get was she prettier, better in bed, younger, thinner, etc

 

Many bs do not want the details of the sex. We want to know how many times but not the positions you did. Too many details haunt you. Now if she asks then tell her but not until she does. Also she will ask the same questions over and over for a long time. It helps us but it will be hard for you. Seriously if she was better in bed..please do not tell your wife that. It will always hurt her to remember you said it.

[not-so-sure]

This is a good list to start with. I would add these...

 

How do I know you won't do it again?

 

How did the affair start?

 

What did you tell the OW about me and our marriage?

 

Did you feel guilty?

 

What did I do wrong? (no it is not her fault yet many bs do ask this)

 

You then will get was she prettier, better in bed, younger, thinner, etc

 

Many bs do not want the details of the sex. We want to know how many times but not the positions you did. Too many details haunt you. Now if she asks then tell her but not until she does. Also she will ask the same questions over and over for a long time. It helps us but it will be hard for you. Seriously if she was better in bed..please do not tell your wife that. It will always hurt her to remember you said it.

 

I can give you (and mrs me) easy answers to all of the above. I did answer 'how did it start' earlier today. That was pretty much a death of a thousand cuts, edging along and pushing back moral boundaries.

 

Sex with my wife was better for sure. no doubt. But exAP was prettier and younger and in better shape so I'm not sure how I'm going to communicate that at all.

 

One 'feature' of my relationship was exAP was that neither of us trashed the other's or our own spouse. When that happened I told her that conversation needed to happen with someone without any 'interest' in the situation. Honour among thieves? :-/

[not-so-sure]

I brought things up again today.

 

I told her that I'd come up with some questions. I answered some of them. (Who, when it ended, are we talking still).

 

I'm beginning to see some cracks, not only in her, but in myself. I spent some time in the shower crying, acknowledging to myself that i'd wrecked everything. That maybe I should have taken the coward's way out and let those sleeping dogs lie.

 

She had no idea I was having an affair, but was not surprised at my choice, despite not knowing this person.

 

Last night I bought her Christmas present - a season of theatre tickets for 2014. I know it's early days yet but I hope I get to share them with her. The vibe I'm getting is ambiguous.

 

Coincidentally, my email address has been used to sign up for on-line dating sites in last couple of days. I mentioned this to her, she said something along the lines of - 'well you're eligible'. That gave me some pause...

[lilmisscantbewrong]

I brought things up again today.

 

I told her that I'd come up with some questions. I answered some of them. (Who, when it ended, are we talking still).

 

I'm beginning to see some cracks, not only in her, but in myself. I spent some time in the shower crying, acknowledging to myself that i'd wrecked everything. That maybe I should have taken the coward's way out and let those sleeping dogs lie.

 

She had no idea I was having an affair, but was not surprised at my choice, despite not knowing this person.

 

Last night I bought her Christmas present - a season of theatre tickets for 2014. I know it's early days yet but I hope I get to share them with her. The vibe I'm getting is ambiguous.

 

Coincidentally, my email address has been used to sign up for on-line dating sites in last couple of days. I mentioned this to her, she said something along the lines of - 'well you're eligible'. That gave me some pause...

 

You signed up for online dating sites in the last few days? Why is this?

[Mickey_Fitzpatrick]

my email address has been used to sign up for on-line dating sites in last couple of days. I mentioned this to her, she said something along the lines of - 'well you're eligible'. That gave me some pause...

 

So, this is the way she's telling you it's over? She's using your email to sign you up for dating sites?

[GypsumSatellite]

not-so-sure, in all likelihood, your wife knew all the signs popping up. The ILYBINILWY is a huge sign to her that something was going on. She probably picked up on the change in your demeanor when you'd have days with your OW simply because unless you're a practiced liar, a woman's intuition would have sniffed it out.

 

To me it is interesting that your OW dropped her own bomb about disclosure to her H and then 6 weeks later you drop yours that she added no value to your life as a friend. That was your retaliation, whether you realized it or not. Your revenge. It is, in effect, a way of saying "You were nothing to me". Just sex, because if she can't be a friend without sex... then that's all that was to you. Nice one, no-so-sure. Real nice guy.

 

As for your wife, that she has signed you up for dating sites speaks to her sense of humor. She's probably needed a lot of that while she worried about what was to become of her as you dallied with your OW. Buying her theatre tickets is a pre-emptive move. Don't resort to bribes. Don't think that will soften the blow.

 

I decided that my wife needed to know what I was capable of. Give her some choices. Transparency. Respect. And hopefully the chance to show her my love.

 

In fairness, the time for that was the moment you began having feelings for the OW that were anything but work-friendly. That was the moment for the transparency and respect. What you're doing right now is not out of fairness or respect or showing love but everything to do with "I did bad, Mommy, please forgive me."

 

Just own that. She may forgive you, she may not. It is not up to your wife to heal your wrongs. That's up to you. The best way to heal your wrongs is to go to a good counselor (preferably male) and discuss all the things that lead you to the act of an affair. Go deep. Go back to how you value women, what your childhood was like, how you feel about yourself, positive and negative male role models in your life - everything. If your wife wants to know about the counseling, share the results with her.

 

That's no promise she'll want to remain M with you, but this is for you. This is about working through what made you do this and fixing that for the future of any relationship you have, be it this marriage or beyond.

[not-so-sure]

not-so-sure, in all likelihood, your wife knew all the signs popping up. The ILYBINILWY is a huge sign to her that something was going on. She probably picked up on the change in your demeanor when you'd have days with your OW simply because unless you're a practiced liar, a woman's intuition would have sniffed it out.

 

To me it is interesting that your OW dropped her own bomb about disclosure to her H and then 6 weeks later you drop yours that she added no value to your life as a friend. That was your retaliation, whether you realized it or not. Your revenge. It is, in effect, a way of saying "You were nothing to me". Just sex, because if she can't be a friend without sex... then that's all that was to you. Nice one, no-so-sure. Real nice guy.

 

I think you have the time line wrong. The affair ended seven months ago. We spent about three months in NC, then tried to be friends. In my mind she was adding no value to my life - we couldn't talk about anything but ourselves - and I was not able to emotionally detach from the very limited contact we were having. I didn't tell her that she added no value. I told that I'm sorry I couldn't get past this and that it was time to say goodbye. Fully. She was a friend without sex before. Once that line was crossed there was no going back. No winners.

 

For what it's worth, her husband had a sense something was going on. He doesn't know the full extent of it, as far as I'm aware. In our conversations since ending the affair, she described it to him as losing a close personal relationship. They don't have children so I guess it was easier to pick up on the cues without the minutiae of family life to distract.

 

 

As for your wife, that she has signed you up for dating sites speaks to her sense of humor. She's probably needed a lot of that while she worried about what was to become of her as you dallied with your OW. Buying her theatre tickets is a pre-emptive move. Don't resort to bribes. Don't think that will soften the blow.

 

it was not her. There is someone elsewhere who uses my email address to register for stuff. It's been happening for years.

 

She had no idea I was having an affair.

 

The threater tickets she doesn't know about. I bought them as a Christmas present.

 

 

In fairness, the time for that was the moment you began having feelings for the OW that were anything but work-friendly. That was the moment for the transparency and respect. What you're doing right now is not out of fairness or respect or showing love but everything to do with "I did bad, Mommy, please forgive me."

 

I get that. I wouldn't be posting here if I was honest enough to discuss this in the first place. My other option until a week or so ago was to bottle it up. Would that have been preferable?

 

 

Just own that. She may forgive you, she may not. It is not up to your wife to heal your wrongs. That's up to you. The best way to heal your wrongs is to go to a good counselor (preferably male) and discuss all the things that lead you to the act of an affair. Go deep. Go back to how you value women, what your childhood was like, how you feel about yourself, positive and negative male role models in your life - everything. If your wife wants to know about the counseling, share the results with her.

I've been in counselling for months. I've learned a few ugly things about myself and I'm working on them. The secret was severely hindering my connection with my wife and I saw no other way out.

 

Some of what you say is relevant to me and gives me pause for thought. I don't want to roll out my family life for fear or being branded as someone who tries to make excuses, but there are nuggets in there which absolutely ring true.

 

That's no promise she'll want to remain M with you, but this is for you. This is about working through what made you do this and fixing that for the future of any relationship you have, be it this marriage or beyond.

 

I've always been clear to my wife that I'm the one who is broken. My infidelity has added an extra dimension to the counselling. I entered counselling shortly after my affair ended to get insight into why I did this terrible thing and how to avoid it ever happening again. Don't get me wrong. Please. I understand (and yes, too late) that I've done something terrible. I'm taking the right steps to address it. I've been reporting to her on my counselling process and I have been improving as a person, hard to believe.

 

We spoke again last night and she let loose on me. Every word I deserved. Some of those harsh truths were reinforced and it's going to be a huge fight for me to get her to journey further down this road with me. She knows the who what how and for how long (for as much as she asked). This may be our last Christmas. She wants to change the boys surnames. She not sure whether she wants me to leave the house. She slept with the boys last night but she came back because they were kicking her.

 

That's something that makes me hopeful. I'm grabbing onto anything at this point.

Edited November 24, 2013 by not-so-sure

[avelonia2013]

I think you have the time line wrong. The affair ended seven months ago. We spent about three months in NC, then tried to be friends. In my mind she was adding no value to my life - we couldn't talk about anything but ourselves - and I was not able to emotionally detach from the very limited contact we were having. I didn't tell her that she added no value. I told that I'm sorry I couldn't get past this and that it was time to say goodbye. Fully. She was a friend without sex before. Once that line was crossed there was no going back. No winners.

 

it was not her. There is someone elsewhere who uses my email address to register for stuff. It's been happening for years.

 

She had no idea I was having an affair.

 

The threater tickets she doesn't know about. I bought them as a Christmas present.

 

 

 

I get that. I wouldn't be posting here if I was honest enough to discuss this in the first place. My other option until a week or so ago was to bottle it up. Would that have been preferable?

 

 

I've been in counselling for months. I've learned a few ugly things about myself and I'm working on them. The secret was severely hindering my connection with my wife and I saw no other way out.

 

Some of what you say is relevant to me and gives me pause for thought. I don't want to roll out my family life for fear or being branded as someone who tries to make excuses, but there are nuggets in there which absolutely ring true.

 

 

I've always been clear to my wife that I'm the one who is broken. My infidelity has added an extra dimension to the counselling. I entered counselling shortly after my affair ended to get insight into why I did this terrible thing and how to avoid it ever happening again. Don't get me wrong. Please. I understand (and yes, too late) that I've done something terrible. I'm taking the right steps to address it. I've been reporting to her on my counselling process and I have been improving as a person, hard to believe.

 

We spoke again last night and she let loose on me. Every word I deserved. Some of those harsh truths were reinforced and it's going to be a huge fight for me to get her to journey further down this road with me. She knows the who what how and for how long (for as much as she asked). This may be our last Christmas. She wants to change the boys surnames. She not sure whether she wants me to leave the house. She slept with the boys last night but she came back because they were kicking her.

 

That's something that makes me hopeful. I'm grabbing onto anything at this point.

 

At least you came to your senses and have given your wife the gift of choice. I can identify with how she feels except the person didn't come clean outright; they told me everything without saying a word (he doesn't realize he did). I observed and learned all I needed to know and now I'm feeling much like your wife. I go back and forth with how I feel, but one main thought is certain - he is free and available now. I have no desire to get involved with what I saw. You have come to your senses at least. My guy has no clue I know the truth and have decided to remove myself from a potentially toxic situation. "No thank you."

[GypsumSatellite]

not-so-sure, sorry about the wrong timelines. In any case, don't trot out the family stuff here that you think may have led you to the affair... no need to do that. I will say that my MM has plenty that he has spoken about his past during our friendship until now that explains why he has had an affair, and one so targeted with a layer of revenge to his M.

 

It's not so much being broken as it is having too many factors in our lives morphing our values. We learn to react to people because of how we were treated, or not treated, or how we were raised. Who we had as friends, who became our enemies. Loves, heartbreaks. It's endless. It's important, too. It's the sort of thing that everyone should discuss more often.

 

Can you imagine what it would be like to look at your W and be able to say "You know when I do ____, it's because I learned to respond that way as a result of _____. I'm working on changing that."

 

Hopefully, it's a technique you can use and it's beneficial. Discuss the merits of it with your counselor and see what they think.

[Fluttershy]

I am glad you came clean, not-so-sure, while there are different schools of thought on it I believe as you said, giving the truth to your spouse gives them a chance to make their own decisions. Instead of you unanimously voting for her. Disregard people who say your motives to tell were selfish or the like. Only you know your true motives and I am sure there were a lot of reasons you decided to confess.

I hope your family is saved. But whatever happens remember to stay on the path of integrity. Sometimes it doesn't seem to pay off but in the end it is far better than continuing in deceit and having no self respect.

Just remember that even if you and your wife do split the kids are still your kids. She cannot change their surnames and she cannot take them from you. Don't let her. Hopefully she was only joking but their are people who believe someone who participates in an affair is an unfit parent and will try to separate the kids from the the unfaithful parent. Hopefully your situation never comes to that.

Good luck and keep us posted.

[not-so-sure]

My life before the affair was fine. Unspectacular. Suburban. Perhaps some last spark in my marriage.

 

Basically, and my counsellor has not really helped me with this - I have low self esteem and need constant validation.

 

I also realised that the joy I was getting from my marriage was in making my wife happy. I stopped doing that and a selfish streak started to take its place. And then it wasn't long before this happened. And then I got swept up in it, all the time just thinking about myself.

 

There's a lot I can do for my wife, but we haven't really done conflict. In my assessment there's been little need for it in my marriage. So I have little experience in making amends from a conflict, and certainly none of this magnitude.

 

I really feel lost and don't know where to start. Listening would be a good first step. I guess.

[whichwayisup]

And, find another therapist who you can trust and open up to, fix 'you'. This one you have now is not working out.

[waterwoman]

not-so-sure - I can't tell you what is going to happen, but I can say that you deserve to be able to reconcile with your wife if any WS does. You are doing the right things and I hope that with time your BS comes to realise this.

 

What can you do? Be remorseful and show it. Try not to get defensive and angry at the things your BS does. Understand that her anger comes from her pain and shock. Be transparent and think ahead - try to recognise her triggers and her moods. It's going to be hard but you have made a good start.

[not-so-sure]

And, find another therapist who you can trust and open up to, fix 'you'. This one you have now is not working out.

 

I'm getting this guy for free - it's all above board and he's a recognised whatever and so-what. I'm eligible for treatment for a number of a reasons.

 

Anyway he was ambivalent about the confession thing. Hmmm. That set of alarm bells but he did tell me his job was to get me answers out of me. He's not an infidelity counsellor, put it that way.

 

My wife told me I'm getting her rings back today. The symbolism means nothing to her anymore. I guess that's fair enough. I still have no idea where this is headed but today was pleasant enough. We didn't speak about things until just before she went to sleep. I want to focus on this and get it all out because I don't want her to get this all in dribs and drabs.

 

After committing to not seeing the OW I glimpsed her twice today - impeccable timing. All in the course of doing my work (and we work in the same building).

 

We saw each other both times. I suspect she's on tenterhooks at the moment because the only person who doesn't know the whole thing now is her husband.

I'm wondering whether I apologise to him for interfering in their marriage.

[Snowflower]

I'm getting this guy for free - it's all above board and he's a recognised whatever and so-what. I'm eligible for treatment for a number of a reasons.

 

Anyway he was ambivalent about the confession thing. Hmmm. That set of alarm bells but he did tell me his job was to get me answers out of me. He's not an infidelity counsellor, put it that way.

 

My wife told me I'm getting her rings back today. The symbolism means nothing to her anymore. I guess that's fair enough. I still have no idea where this is headed but today was pleasant enough. We didn't speak about things until just before she went to sleep. I want to focus on this and get it all out because I don't want her to get this all in dribs and drabs.

 

 

 

I agree, your counselor is not really helpful. Find another one. If you are truly serious about saving your marriage, find a MC (marriage counselor) who specializes in infidelity. Go by yourself if you need to and maybe your wife will agree to attend eventually too.

 

As for your wife giving her rings back, this is one of her ways of letting you know how badly you have hurt her/screwed up. She is testing you. She wants to see how you will react when/if she gives you her wedding ring.

 

What are you going to do if she hands you her ring?

[not-so-sure]

I think she said that in a metaphoric way - to say she won't be wearing them again.

 

We spoke again last night - she said she may never love me again. They were hard words to hear. One minute we're talking about the future and perhaps even starting a business, then telling me my counsellor may be right, perhaps we don't have anything in common (I've been discussing my interactions with my counsellor with her over a number of months). I told her that my affair had sucked the life out of my relationship with her, and in fact not just with her but with everybody important in my life. Where you see we've lost the common spark, it really was the energy sucked out of all my important relationships.

 

I told her to please not make any decisions about us while this confusion of emotion is swirling. I've made a terribly regretful choice, I don't want her to make another, whether that is to stay or to go.

[whiterabbit46]

God bless you both. I wish you all the best. Don't give up.

[not-so-sure]

Yesterday, my wife said to me that she had come to a decision.

 

She said we work well together, and we have been a great team over our marriage, and that she was prepared to stay. However, her engagement and wedding rings no longer mean anything to her and she will no longer wear them.

 

She said that I have a lot of work to do and one stage of that will end with us renewing our vows in the next year or two.

 

I have a sense of relief about this, it makes me happy that my wife thinks I'm worth a second chance. She would never have known had I not confessed but the weight of this secret was destroying my relationship with her (until this occurred I couldn't even buy her birthday presents until the night before). But I still think it's very early on in the piece. It's only been a week and I've seen none of what I read on these boards, except for a lot of anger when we first started discussing details. Otherwise, it's been business-at-usual.

 

I am grateful at least that she is leaning in that direction. I am still bracing myself for much deeper soul searching over the next few weeks.

 

There are moments when I think I should have kept this too myself, I must admit. But my whole life up till now has been doing what is right, I don't even tweak my taxes. In the end, there was no choice but honesty, no matter how grave the consequences.

 

Which is more than can be said for the AP who I thought I was in love with.