How I tried to pitch in for date night and how he told me to put my damn wallet away

[dreamingoftigers]

She didn't slowly pull out her wallet, count out 153 nickels, sigh, shake her head and say "are you sure you want me to pay for something tonight?"

 

She said (approximately): "which part of the date would you like to pay for?" As in: the obvious arrangement is one person has paid for, say "dinner" and the other one will buy the "movie tickets" or "mini-golf rounds" or "arcade games" etc. (ha, date night 1985).

 

So this time, instead of making the usual arrangement happen he says, "No! Tonight I go the extra mile! Stay away from my extra mile! I'm all over that!"

 

Not to minimize his gesture, but asking "do you want me to pay for this?" was kind of a set up. Who can say yes to that without feeling awkward? Or--

 

Her: I'll take care of the check this time

Him: No, please, I want to get it.

Her: Ok

 

Even that is an invitation for objection.

 

The real indication would be if, without saying anything, she were to take the check & open her wallet. In that case, his objection would have greater validity. Of course, whether or not he would choose to insist on paying wouldn't necessarily indicate his feelings as he may be showing respect by allowing her to pay or responding to his own social mores by refusing to allow her to.

[Lansing]

I also think the "which part do you want me to pay for" was kind of awkward. I would rather a girl say "Let me get this" or in later stages of dating say "hey, would love if you would join me for such and such concert/event/etc" and then pay for the tickets. Or, even something simple like getting the coffee for me without having to even say "my treat" or "I am paying".. just do it..

[emva07]

yes....we live in a society where men do not give a 7 month pregnant woman their seat because of equality.....and that is fine, I am glad to give up my seat.

 

I always expect the man to pay on first dates....if he doesn't, that's fine, he won't see me again. Yes, once in a relationship it is different.

 

I have always been with men that pay things for me...on the other token, every time I went shopping I'd buy him clothes and other things I knew he needed. If he ever needed to borrow money I'd give it to him and tell him it's ok, no pay back....

 

but everyone is different, there are men who pay and men who don't, it's up to what the woman wants honestly. Some expect it, some don't, some don't care. There is someone out there for everyone.

Edited November 20, 2013 by emva07

[dreamingoftigers]

Personally I think my age is right on the cusp between the "guys who pay" and the "we pay equally" mentalities.

 

Honestly, I wouldn't let it be a sign of anything on a first date etc. It's almost like a culture shift. Whereas in Culture A the guy pays and Culture B we pay evenly. BUT finding out whether they'd make a good mate would have more to do with "why" they are following whichever practice they follow.

 

In Culture A a guy could pay to show he's interested, more traditional or conscious how the work out into getting money and wants to have his work cover that bill so his lady doesn't need to make extra effort to see him. Coversely he may be viewing it as "she owes me," "I hate that guys HAVE to do this," or any series of control issues.

 

In Culture B the guy may share the bill because its viewed as fair practice since women earn as well nowadays, he wants to make sure he finds a partner that focuses on "spending fun time with him" instead of seeing "what she can get out of him." In this way they can have a more "fair" relationship instead of it tipping a power balance in his direction. Like she may feel guilt over him paying etc. (I'm sure historically this has even been a tactic.) Conversely he may just be cheap and believe women to be gold-diggers.

[emva07]

to be honest I think it's about who invites.....I invited a friend to Zumba....I paid for her. Why? Because I don't know if it's in her budget to go to Zumba with me but I didn't want to go alone.

 

Most time guys invite....therefore if he doesn't pay....he is not that interested. It is not about if a guy doesn't pay blah blah blah. If he invites, he pays....if you invite, you pay.

Edited November 20, 2013 by emva07

[Mascara]

Everything descends into complication. The OP was just recounting a cute story, that's all. There's way too much over-thinking on this topic.

 

I've been seeing someone for about a month. Last weekend, we got pizza and wine delivered. He paid. On Monday we went for a nice Greek lunch. I paid. Next weekend we're going to the movies. He's bought the tickets.

 

It's easy.

[Phantom888]

It took me several months to finally learn that my partner can pay sometimes. I have stopped her from paying for anything, even though she wants to so badly. Eventually I caved and she would pay for movies when I pay for dinner. Works out well. This works out well because we can do more stuff and no one has to spend too much.

[Iguanna]

Everything descends into complication. The OP was just recounting a cute story, that's all. There's way too much over-thinking on this topic.

 

It's easy.

 

If the money issue doesn't matter, why isn't it the usual thing to do each person pay his/her part? Why should someone pay the food / movie / transport of someone else? Why is it a factor on deciding if we'll see a person again?

 

I think it's cause there are deeper reasons that this happens. The habit of men paying for the woman they date comes (at least in my country) from past decades when women didn't have their own job or money so men had to pay when they were going out and feed them. Years have passed, huge changes have happened and this is one of the little things that has remained the same. It's not weird then that men accuse women for caring mostly for the money if women confess that if a man doesn't pay on the first date there won't be a second...

[Mascara]

If the money issue doesn't matter, why isn't it the usual thing to do each person pay his/her part? Why should someone pay the food / movie / transport of someone else?

 

Because when you're a couple it's nice to treat each other. You each end up spending roughly the same as you would if you always went Dutch. I don't like going Dutch, I prefer alternate paying and that's not to do with the money. I like to be taken out - and I like to reciprocate.

 

I'm talking about couples here, not first dates, the OP is in a relationship.

[Iguanna]

I'm sorry but I don't feel my partner "takes care of me" when he pays for my food and I pay for his movie. In the contrary I explain it more like "we are not capable of making money no issue cause we are not very honest to each other and we dislike difficult conversations" than showing caress. With my bf I cleared from the very beginning that I don't want him to pay for me, I have my own money. We just had a common wallet, we put occasionally the same amount of money in it and we pay everything from there. This way I don't feel like he pays me for sex and he doesn't feel I want him for money.

[dreamingoftigers]

So the OP's bf did something sweet and she liked it.

 

Uh-oh.

 

Feminazi gold digger user!

[Mascara]

I'm sorry but I don't feel my partner "takes care of me" when he pays for my food and I pay for his movie. In the contrary I explain it more like "we are not capable of making money no issue cause we are not very honest to each other and we dislike difficult conversations" than showing caress. With my bf I cleared from the very beginning that I don't want him to pay for me, I have my own money. We just had a common wallet, we put occasionally the same amount of money in it and we pay everything from there. This way I don't feel like he pays me for sex and he doesn't feel I want him for money.

 

Yeah, you're just not getting what I'm saying so lets leave it there.

[Dark_history]

So the OP's bf did something sweet and she liked it.

 

Uh-oh.

 

Feminazi gold digger user!

 

Clearly she is in the relationship just to get free happy meals

[emva07]

everyone is in a relationship for SOME benefit whether it be money, shelter, food, companionship, sex, pass the time, procreating, visa, protections, status, etc etc etc........AND in return, that person is getting a benefit as well, they don't have to be the same one.

 

Who are we to judge what makes another tick???

 

Just because a girl thinks it's nice that a guy paid for her (which in a fairly priced restaurant is about $14) doesn't mean she's a gold digger! Good lord. Some people don't know how to appreciate a nice gesture around here because everyone jumps on the "you're an abuser" band wagon.

 

If a guy wants to pay for her, so what? it's not your money he's spending. If you don't think a man should pay, don't get with one who pays, simple.

[PinkCarnations]

If you like this sorta thing, come to the South and date a real southern gentleman. Since moving from the deep south to California, i've met many men who buy me drinks only to expect me to give me their number or go home with them.. or guys who think men & women are equal so us splitting the bill on the first date is standard.. It might not be fair to say this, but the southern gentlemen back home always buys ladies drinks simply because they are a lady not because they want something from us.. guys run up to hold a door for a lady rather than your standard 'holding a door open behind you so it doesnt slam on you.' etc etc

[Iguanna]

Obviously everyone will do whatever they want, but we are here having a discussion and exchanging opinions, I don't get why get aggressive.

[MalachiX]

Okay gentlemen,

 

Here's the thing: it isn't about "feminism" or "money."

 

It's about what a guy is "obligated" to do vs. what he actually does.

 

When a guy goes past "obligation" into a more giving or rewarding zone, it lights our fire.

 

In this instance it was about paying. She offered to pay, he basically said "I'm obligated to pay for half/or my share (whatever) but instead I am going to invest a little more here to show you in a symbolic way that I care. In a way that isn't as popular in mainstream society these days and some guys would even call me a chump for it."

 

Points.

 

Same as when a guy does nice small things that show he's thinking of his lady or is willing to go the extra mile for her.

 

Seriously, A LOT of women have been socially and traditionally trained to go the extra mile for guys (especially domestically) so we recognize and value it when it happens to us.

 

This generation of young men and women seem to be a mixed bag of people that DO NOT wish to cross personal responsibility lines and those who want a more "traditional in the modern world" sense of romance.

 

Here's the thing though, it's an obligation that basically re-enforces tranditional gender stereotypes that lead to a great number of things that many women seem to not like.

 

It's also not really all that big a deal for guys. It's just money, not effort.

 

If they had dinner at her place and he decided to do the dishes, or if maybe he tracked down a book she really cared about, then I would totally get the "I'm in love" stuff. Things that take effort, listening, and real caring are what I think is valuable. Throwing money around isn't. I've know a lot of deeply misogynistic men who treated their women like possessions but always insisted on paying for anything. It wasn't hard because they had the money.

 

I think if the woman hadn't said the bit about "I'll do laundry forever, it's woman's work" it would not only be less offensive but it would be a more apt analogy.

 

Well, I was going off his "don't have to pay for anything" comment which seemed similar to always doing laundry.

 

If the situation were more like:

"Hey Sweetheart, I notice you had a load ready to be washed so I did it and its folded on the bed. I didn't know where you want your dress shirts. And since you're coming in late I made you a sandwich. I know that you don't want to miss the game. Don't worry about it."

 

What guy wouldn't be in love after that LOL?

 

Ummm...me?

 

Seriously, I'm a big boy and I love to cook. I don't love laundry but I'm not in college and I don't want it from my GF.

 

Normally I'm most impressed with women who are strong and who are also compassionate. If a woman did something that showed she knew ME and cared about ME then yes I'd feel gushy. If she got me a Slurpee on the way back from work because she knew I liked them then that would be more worthwhile than all the laundry and sandwiches in the world.

 

If she did what you suggested, I'd probably appreciate it but actually be a little weirded out because, once again, it feels like something that's done out this sense of gender expectations that are out of date. Of course, I think it's a better gesture because it requires effort rather than money.

 

The extra mile isn't owned by one particular gender.

 

Of course, but it feels a bit odd to some of us when the "extra mile" is defined as a very simple thing which seems derived from antiquated times and which isn't really specific to the woman at all.

 

I like holding out a chair for a women, holding a door, and paying for meals. I don't want her to fall in love with me for that. I'm a hell of a lot more interesting. And I'm sure most women are a hell of a lot more interesting than their ability to do laundry.

[ChessPieceFace]

A LOT of women have been socially and traditionally trained to go the extra mile for guys (especially domestically)

 

What country is this in? China I guess.

[Sanman]

There is a great video that I would love to leave a link to related to this thread. Will that get me flagged mods?

[Phoe]

If you like this sorta thing, come to the South and date a real southern gentleman. Since moving from the deep south to California, i've met many men who buy me drinks only to expect me to give me their number or go home with them.. or guys who think men & women are equal so us splitting the bill on the first date is standard

 

See, I'm in California and I've always paid for myself on dates, but never thought it was a regional based thing. I've also never had a problem with paying for myself though.

[crederer]

Typically, if we're early in the relationship, I insist on paying for the dates. If we are in a deep committed relationship, she's paying half the time.

 

You can call it sexist or lack of equality or whatever, but that's just generally how I was raised and generally how I like to do things.

[Sanman]

Whatever, if anyone gets the chance, google a short film by Tom Antos called dinner date. It relates to the OP very well.

[Grumpybutfun]

If you like this sorta thing, come to the South and date a real southern gentleman. Since moving from the deep south to California, i've met many men who buy me drinks only to expect me to give me their number or go home with them.. or guys who think men & women are equal so us splitting the bill on the first date is standard.. It might not be fair to say this, but the southern gentlemen back home always buys ladies drinks simply because they are a lady not because they want something from us.. guys run up to hold a door for a lady rather than your standard 'holding a door open behind you so it doesnt slam on you.' etc etc

 

PC:

Southern women are wonderful too...my favorite. My wife could read me the phonebook and I would be happy. I never knew what "being a lady" meant until I met her. She is so smart she makes people's jaw drop, love it! Wowser.

G

[dreamingoftigers]

What country is this in? China I guess.

 

Canada.

 

Unfortunately for you, you'd freeze your balls off in the effort to find a nice wife up here. A lot of people from climates all over the world come here and can't handle it as well they think they will. It's -27C where I am right now and I spent most of the day outside wiping off moisture from my phone to type!

 

But yes, women TEND to be relationship-oriented and have genèrally been socialized as such.

[dreamingoftigers]

Okay, seriously. You are beating the heck out of the obvious point I made.

 

Of course 110% of men in the world do not value sandwiches and laundry first and foremost. However I think most people, when fàlling behind on the day-to-day wouldn't be "weirded out" in having a spouse that cared enough about THEM to make a little extra effort. This is whether it was a "gender stereotype" or not.

 

This isn't about a guy whose trying to purchase and control a girl. It was an effort to BE NICE AND CONSIDERATE.

 

To take the analogy in an even weirder non-political/feminism direction, if I was super-into really kinky sex and my husband brought home some kind of warped dildo/handcuff/whip/plug/shock device thing I would be all "oh wow honey that's great, be still my heart." But if I wasn't at all into kinky sex but HE THOUGHT I was and did that, I could still appreciate the effort. Even though I might actually have nightmares.

 

Of course everyone is different and everyone does things for different reasons but for the love of Shocking Dildos can this stopped being turned into a "male/female" role vs. "power play/user" issue.

 

It was a NICE gesture and SHE liked it.

 

Ironically enough, if he made the kinky sex toy mistake I doubt the thrasd would've gone on this back and forth.

 

Here's the thing though, it's an obligation that basically re-enforces tranditional gender stereotypes that lead to a great number of things that many women seem to not like.

 

It's also not really all that big a deal for guys. It's just money, not effort.

 

If they had dinner at her place and he decided to do the dishes, or if maybe he tracked down a book she really cared about, then I would totally get the "I'm in love" stuff. Things that take effort, listening, and real caring are what I think is valuable. Throwing money around isn't. I've know a lot of deeply misogynistic men who treated their women like possessions but always insisted on paying for anything. It wasn't hard because they had the money.

 

 

 

Well, I was going off his "don't have to pay for anything" comment which seemed similar to always doing laundry.

 

 

 

Ummm...me?

 

Seriously, I'm a big boy and I love to cook. I don't love laundry but I'm not in college and I don't want it from my GF.

 

Normally I'm most impressed with women who are strong and who are also compassionate. If a woman did something that showed she knew ME and cared about ME then yes I'd feel gushy. If she got me a Slurpee on the way back from work because she knew I liked them then that would be more worthwhile than all the laundry and sandwiches in the world.

 

If she did what you suggested, I'd probably appreciate it but actually be a little weirded out because, once again, it feels like something that's done out this sense of gender expectations that are out of date. Of course, I think it's a better gesture because it requires effort rather than money.

 

 

 

Of course, but it feels a bit odd to some of us when the "extra mile" is defined as a very simple thing which seems derived from antiquated times and which isn't really specific to the woman at all.

 

I like holding out a chair for a women, holding a door, and paying for meals. I don't want her to fall in love with me for that. I'm a hell of a lot more interesting. And I'm sure most women are a hell of a lot more interesting than their ability to do laundry.