Second best?

[Confused48]

I saw Coolit post this on another thread and almost TJ'ed. Instead I will start a new one.

 

First the quote:

 

As for me. My A was based on lust and physical attraction. I stayed with my H because I was only in it for the cheap thrill and pleasure. Leaving my H was not even on the table. It was either: cheat and experience the "chemistry" or pass up on this chance and remain married.

 

I'd like a do over and pick option B. but I cant. So I am working on being a healthy whole and honest person again.

 

Coolit - if you don't mind me asking, how does your BH feel about you thinking the OM was so much more attractive, more sexualy apealing? Or is that not what you meant?

 

 

Others in this situation, please chime in. WS, how does your BS deal with it? Do you hide it?

 

Even the BS, how do the BS deal with this kind of thing, with knowing you were second best in some category. Sexualy or emotionally. It could be either.

 

 

Please, no comments about how women are always more into the emotional part of the A and men the sexual. Coolit and others on this board are proof that those stereotypes don't hold true.

[Confused48]

I always felt like a freak for liking sex so much. It is nice to know I am not alone.

 

All good stuff in your post. Thanks. But this last part I don't understand.

[dichotomy]

Even the BS, how do the BS deal with this kind of thing, with knowing you were second best in some category. Sexualy or emotionally. It could be either.

 

 

 

I don't deal with it all that well many times. Most WS I think are going to struggle immensely to hide if the sex or parts or other things were more attractive or satisfying that for their BW/BH. I mean beyond coolit or a few others here - I suspect most WS are going to lie or hide or minimize on this.

 

I think perhaps it has helped me to expand the view to all other lovers. That is except in rare circumstances - each spouse likely had a few other parters before marriage. Well, did those folks have some sex, or parts, or other things that were better? You going to get in to detailed discussions about who was better at what or what felt better with who - or who had a better body, more attractive what ever?

 

Also is it really about me? or about her. In other words maybe some of AP's other lovers might not have ranked him as highly as WS or others. Who knows? Maybe I got some gals in my past who think I was the better than their current spouse.

 

However, as I have stated elsewhere beyond wether the affair with OW/OM was better in some aspect (sex, emtional) what burns me some times is dealing with the fact that WS was better FOR the AP. In other words they gave better.

 

Ugh ....

[jlola]

Not meaning to sound disrespectful, but did you have to drink this guy pretty? He sounds like the typical creeper that used to write to me on Plenty of Fish.

 

It seems from a lot of the post here , lots of OM or MOM are not lookers at all. Many are much older,but yese women seem to go nuts for them . It is sort of puzzling. Perhaps these not so good looking cheaters develop a sort of magnetism for their lack of looks. Push harder,act more appreciative,are more turned on by sex they can get with a woman much better looking than the handsome guy. Don't know.Perhaps it makes the woman feel she has more power in the relationship is the man is not good-looking.

 

When I hear women talking about "ugly" men not cheating I laugh. They are just as likely to cheat as handsome men. If not more.

[whichwayisup]

the loose skin flaps on the chin (can't think of the name right now)

That's either called doggy wrinkles (ones around chin) or under chin is turkey neck.

[ChooseTruth]

Cool it, you said xMM knew how to seduce a woman, so I'm kind of interpreting that as him having maybe a higher confidence level? That seems to be such a big thing for women...on the dating sites its something roughly 150% of the women mention. If you watch dating coaching videos for guys, it's a massive part of what they focus on, saying looks don't matter that much, it's all presence.

 

It was one of my ex's complaints, that I wasn't confident enough. She said physically and erm skillwise he wasn't any better than me. Of course she could have been lying...that would be no shock. I was in pretty bad shape when her A started.

[harrybrown]

She told me that I was better looking, made a lot more money, was a better husband and father.

 

I guess what I did not have were the stds and the drugs and the prison record.

 

But of course, the OM now gets free housing and food until he gets out.

[Spark1111]

For many cheaters, that forbidden fruit is so, so hot.

 

( This is NOT directed towards you Coolit)

 

And for the life of me, I cannot figure out why.

 

Did they not date enough in high school? Mommy or daddy or both too strict? do they marry the first person they have an emotional pull towards? Or sexual experience?

 

And then feel resentful they didn't experience more partners?

 

Why didn't they experience more partners before committing for life?

 

this is one of the main reasons why experts advise exposure and the 180: When it is no longer forbidden and they are free to live out loud with the AP, it is not sexually charged, lustfully as hot. It fizzles very, very quickly.

 

And that is why so many affairs smack of adolescent rebellion, IMO.

 

They didn't get to rebel as teenagers, so do it in adulthood much to the devastation of the BS. Such a shame.....

[2sure]

In my experience, it isn't usually a matter of "second best" , just different.

[2sure]

For many cheaters, that forbidden fruit is so, so hot.

 

( This is NOT directed towards you Coolit)

 

And for the life of me, I cannot figure out why.

 

Did they not date enough in high school? Mommy or daddy or both too strict? do they marry the first person they have an emotional pull towards? Or sexual experience?

 

And then feel resentful they didn't experience more partners?

 

Why didn't they experience more partners before committing for life?

 

this is one of the main reasons why experts advise exposure and the 180: When it is no longer forbidden and they are free to live out loud with the AP, it is not sexually charged, lustfully as hot. It fizzles very, very quickly.

 

And that is why so many affairs smack of adolescent rebellion, IMO.

 

They didn't get to rebel as teenagers, so do it in adulthood much to the devastation of the BS. Such a shame.....

 

Those are good questions and food for thought Sparks!

Something interesting...

I'm not positive but I'm fairly certain my X was not a player when he was younger or when he was single. But I'm also nearly certain he cheated continuously during all of his committed relationships.

[Spark1111]

Those are good questions and food for thought Sparks!

Something interesting...

I'm not positive but I'm fairly certain my X was not a player when he was younger or when he was single. But I'm also nearly certain he cheated continuously during all of his committed relationships.

 

well it wouldn't take a rocket scientist to figure out he found commitment smothering even if he truly loved his partner.

 

And the obvious question is why?

 

And the next question would be which parent was the dominating,controlling parent? And did they expect him, pressure him to excel, achieve, be perfect?

 

because he was reliving that need to rebel once in a committed relationship. he brought adolescent dynamics to his unwitting committed partner.

 

happens all the time, IMO.

[2sure]

Oh. My. You know, you're on to something. His mom was brutal. I mean I loved her. He loved her. But I think she hated him.

 

Wow. This is something.

[Spark1111]

Oh. My. You know, you're on to something. His mom was brutal. I mean I loved her. He loved her. But I think she hated him.

 

Wow. This is something.

 

So was my fWS and HIS mother....Yes, we are onto something and it rings true.

 

Lots of therapy....and still...he could only go so far on that topic. Too painful.

[Sub]

Cool it, you said xMM knew how to seduce a woman, so I'm kind of interpreting that as him having maybe a higher confidence level? That seems to be such a big thing for women...on the dating sites its something roughly 150% of the women mention. If you watch dating coaching videos for guys, it's a massive part of what they focus on, saying looks don't matter that much, it's all presence.

 

It was one of my ex's complaints, that I wasn't confident enough. She said physically and erm skillwise he wasn't any better than me. Of course she could have been lying...that would be no shock. I was in pretty bad shape when her A started.

 

This was my experience. My W said the one thing the OM had on me was his confidence, bordering on arrogance. I had come out of a rough period professionally/career-wise and lost it, and it effected her ability to trust that I would be the type of provider she needed moving forward. I couldn't argue. But he was also, in her words, an a**hole. I didn't want to know too much about the A in terms of the sex, but the one thing she said that did help put me at ease: With him it was just "f**king", heightened by the newness of it all, the rush. With me, there was always love, which she could feel in the way I touched her. Plus, I'm really good at oral.

[waterwoman]

Still struggle with it from time to time. Self-esteem isn't my strong point! BUT when the cards were down and he risked losing me, he ended it with her so fast she must have been left spinning. That makes it better.

[beatcuff]

Coolit --- what a rollercoaster. you step out because H was not 'good enough' then after D-day AP has absolutely no redeeming qualities.

[jnel921]

All good stuff in your post. Thanks. But this last part I don't understand.

 

In this day of STDs It's better to bring the freak out in your own spouse. A life or death sentence with your health is not worth a few moments of pleasure.

 

I can give myself the same feelings and fantasize about it if necessary. No need to go to the extreme.

[lilmisscantbewrong]

This is an interesting thread. I love(d) - not sure how to phrase it- both my husband and xmom for different and yet similar reasons. They are both about the same height, very intelligent, successful, etc. Neither one is more good looking than the other.

 

I married my husband right out of high school, first sex partner, etc. I was emotionally bonded to him at an early age and, have since realized through therapy, he was my savior because my home life was a mess at the time. I didn't know it then, I just ran to what was safe - he loved me, his family loved me, it was all good. So I supported him through college and we had babies and made a life, but I left myself somewhere in the dust. I didn't follow through on the real career I wanted, for a lot of reasons, and became disenchanted with life as the kids didn't need me as much anymore.

 

Xmom re-entered my life (we had been friends a long time and he is younger than me) and we just connected strongly. Sex with him was heightened just because of the newness of the relationship, although our friendship and emotional attachment made it that much better. He wasn't really any better in bed than my husband - in some ways he was worse.

 

It's so bizarre - as friends we all enjoyed many of the same things and it's no wonder we connected the way we did. In another life, without spouses involved, we might have made a go of it. But xmom was very, very arrogant and before there was ever anything physical or anything, I would get so mad at him - he was an a@@hole and I expressed that on a number of occasions - even to my husband.

 

I sometimes wonder why I fell for such a man.

 

But to tell you the truth xmom and my husband are very much alike in many ways so it makes some sense.

 

But me and his bs? As different as night and day. I am tall and very attractive (not being arrogant - just truthful) - she is short and cute but not what you would call a beauty but attractive in her own way and she has her own career. I think for xmom I was someone that he never thought would be attracted to him. In fact he said that on a number of occasions. I was a conquest.

 

But I do know my daughter met with him (a 5 hour meeting that should have only taken 45 min) because she wanted to know if he really loved me or was I just a piece of a@@. My daughter came away from that meeting in tears - she said "mom he is really hurting. He said you will always be first in his heart but he has to do the right thing".

 

There would have been no reason for her to tell me that or lie about it - kids want their parents to stay together so I believe what she to me was true.

 

It's all so sad, all of the fall out from this - loss of friends, loss of family, loss, loss, loss - if I could go back and change it all I would do it in a heartbeat.

Edited October 30, 2013 by lilmisscantbewrong

[dichotomy]

But I do know my daughter met with him (a 5 hour meeting that should have only taken 45 min) because she wanted to know if he really loved me or was I just a piece of a@@. My daughter came away from that meeting in tears - she said "mom he is really hurting. He said you will always be first in his heart but he has to do the right thing".

 

There would have been no reason for her to tell me that or lie about it - kids want their parents to stay together so I believe what she to me was true.

 

.

 

 

Most of your post was insightful, thank you.. However, this section above, frankly, I find....uncomfortable to say the least. So, if I may ask - why is your daughter speaking with your affair partner about how he feels about you?

Edited October 30, 2013 by dichotomy

[lilmisscantbewrong]

Sorry - I should have qualified that. She met with him four months after dday - so that was like 3 1/2 years ago. Our families were close - she really felt like she needed to understand his decisions, why he did what he did, etc. She contacted him on her own - she is an adult and that was her choice. She wanted answers. As far as I know, they haven't had contact since that time.

[Confused48]

It's all so sad, all of the fall out from this - loss of friends, loss of family, loss, loss, loss - if I could go back and change it all I would do it in a heartbeat.

 

To get to the second best theme, what if you could change it to never being married to your H but having the OM instead, without all the loss. Like another life you mentioned.

[lilmisscantbewrong]

At this point the answer would be no - too much had happened. He threw me under the bus and then he never was even man enough to speak to my husband who he called his friend nor speak to my son (who he taught Sunday school to) nor my youngest daughter. He just walked away and let me burn.

 

So - what I speak of is a fantasy that cannot be because it never was the right time or right place - I guess my point is you can be compatible with many different people.

[Artie Lang]

no matter how you paint the BS in a good light and praise their attractiveness- whether it be physical, psychological, or emotional -they were second best at the time of the affair, and that's what stings.

 

no matter how you dice it up they(BS)were second best in the whole scheme of things- it is what it is.

 

the minute a person decided to cheat is the minute they place their SO on the shelf and put their AP at the forefront.

 

your love and devotion for someone should never take a backseat to lust..... it just sounds like true love takes a backseat to a cheap thrill.

[seren]

Being absolutely honest, I have never felt second best, I know that the man the OW met and had an A with was not the same man I had known, loved and lived with. Had he treated me the way he treated her, he wouldn't have lasted more than the first date. There are a lot of reasons why this was so which I have discussed previously. H felt himself second best and not good enough, hence the nature of the A and the OW, which isn't being snarky, just the truth. I feel that during that time, I wasn't able to be the person he needed, as in someone who validated his feelings of lack of worth and to be loved.

 

I accept our marriage problems were ours, but I know my worth, if H had chosen to be with OW or anyone else then I would have wished him well and moved along, but I have spent a long, long time getting to be who I am and like being, I could and would never be like OW, we are polar opposites. Different people, different values and personality, but second best, no, neither is she second best to me, different. It isn't a competition and the chips fall on D Day when everyone knows where they stand.

[atreides]

Your only second best if you view yourself and the A as that. If you have a different perspective then no, you aren't second best and getting te leftovers. POv, personality has everything to do with it.

 

I was not my best.

 

I agree with Artie, and as BetrayedH once said and i have reiterated, your H is an anomaly. But having read your other thread about your H's issues, definitely filled in some missing puzzle pieces.

 

Subjectivity IE the perception of either the WS or BS can be argued as to what, when and how is the BS "second best" but objectively they BS is always second best. Frankly, a choice is made to do A rather than B, it is an opportunity cost, something is forsaken for the other.

What i don't understand is why this is argued, why not admit they were second best but after the fog they are not? Why not admit that for certain needs or desires the AP was preferred?

To me it's a wasted argument as to whether one feels the BS is second best, we already know the answer.

What should be discussed is the process and realization to make the BS number one again. That is the real story.

 

As for stereotypes, saying women are for emotions and men sexual, all affairs are sexual in one fashion or another. The problem is that most things like affairs that cover so many variables are not going to produce absolutes but certainly have majority and minority behaviors.