Nice guys finish...

[Kingkaneda]

Hi there, Im new to this forum and Id like some advice/support. Might be a bit of a long story, I appreciate the time you take to read it. Also Im from Holland so my english might be off.

 

I just came out of a 6 year long relationship wich ended about 5 months ago. We lived together for 5 years and she didnt feel the love for me anymore. I was pretty shocked and broken when it happened, and became really needy. Calling her/texting her to give it another chance. Didnt work at all. So after about 3 months of living in this needy self pity hell, I had enough and focussed on my life again. Going to the gym, hanging out with friends alot and started dating.

 

I was feeling better again and totally getting over my ex. I was in a good place. Then after 1 month of dating I met this girl and we really hit it of on the first date. We only chatted 1 evening, and met up the evening after it. Went out for dinner, talked all evening till she had to catch one of the last trains. I brought her to the station and waited with her. We kissed till the traindoors closed, and I had a great feeling! Then when I walked to my bike, she sent me a text that shed wish i had went with her. I took the next train to her city and she waited to pick me up. I slept over and we had sex. Ive never had sex with any girl on the first date but it felt right. Damn I was happy.

 

We saw eachother about 5-6 days a week for 2 weeks. Id go to work, go to the boxing gym and then go to her. Id sleep over and go to work from her place. We texted alot when we werent together. And every time we saw eachother we had sex. Every date was a sleepover. I remember thinking this is going really fast, but I was falling madly in love so I didnt care.

 

After 2 week i put on facebook that she was my girlfriend, and she accepted. The next day I told her I loved her! Oh man I wasnt holding back anything! The the day after she texted me: were going too fast I want to slow things down. Ouch! It hurt a bit, but I understood. We decided to see eachother only 3-4 days a week. Everytime we met we had a great time. Always holding hands, hugging, kissing laughing. We increased our texting because we saw eachother less often. We both texted that we missed eachother alot.

 

After 2 weeks of slowing down she hit me with this text: I really dont think I want a relationship with you. I like you, and I really like being together, but I think you have more feelings for me than I have for you. I went into the same stupid routine as I did with my ex: Give me a chance we had such a great time etc. Didnt work. I asked her if this meant that she never wanted to see me anymore. She said yes i think so. I had seen her 2 days prior to this message, and she hadnt said anything. Ugh.

 

Ok i was pretty down but decided it would be better to not contact her anymore. After 2 days of no contact she send ne a text: hey how are you? im worried about you. We te texted for a while and she told me it was harder to not see me than see would have thought.

Then came this request: can we still keep talking and sometimes meet up and hug and such? But no sex.

I told her it would be impossible for me not to kiss her. Then the conversation went to sex. And in the end i texted: what would happenif I was at your place right now? She answered: Wed probably kiss and have sex.

But at the same time she makes it clear she doesnt want a relationship, and she diesnt want a sex relationship either. Ugh!

 

Im still in love with her, and I have to pick up some of my things from her house next monday. Im planning on no contact unless she contacts me till monday. Foolishly hoping that she will miss me this weekend so that she might reconsider monday.

 

Should I no contact? What should I do when she texts? And should I go for the kiss on monday?

Last time I saw her was 5 days ago. We slept together and everything seemed great. Just this breakup texting is killing me!

[Philosoraptor]

You were projecting the feelings missing from your past relationship onto her. You did move a little fast here and you scared her away.

 

You weren't being a "nice guy", you were rebounding and moving way too fast for her. Maybe you weren't rebounding if you want to tell yourself that, but either way it was a bad match as you two are looking for two different things right now.

 

Just slow it down and let her control the pace as you've already went above and beyond here. Just do things to make yourself happy and let the world work itself out. But you're coming off very clingy and this love and relationship talk is obviously way too fast for her right now. She was enjoying her time with you. Give her some space and she might enjoy her time with you again.

[Phantom888]

Ya you are rebounding and repeating history. I know it's hard not to move fast, especially when you feel vulnerable. It feels great being in love and having all that great sex. But if you slow down and try to get to know each other, you might not be such a great match. She apparently sees it that way.

 

I think you should pick up your stuff and no more contact. You are doing well by going to the gym and hanging with friends. Try to rebuild your own confidence, and NEVER beg any woman to come back. When a woman says she is done, she really has thought about it for a while. Move on...and try to enjoy yourself. Make yourself healthy emotionally before you date again.

[ConstantVoyager]

An "I love you" that early would have sent me running for the hill from any guy, no matter how much I liked him.

 

Get your things. Give her space. Maybe she'll contact you.

[Criticality]

First of all, you know who always say "nice guys finish last"? Whiny guys and sore losers. And sometimes nice guys who are also whiny or also losers. So don't say it. Especially not to girls. The only people who are probably interested in your opinions on nice guys and where they finish, are your mates at the pub after a couple of beers.

 

The other thing: You probably scared her away with the "I love you". Maybe you fell for her too fast, or maybe you're the kind of guy who says it liberally. Like when they're just infatuated, or still falling in love with the person.

 

Next time sat something else. Like: "I love everything about you". Or "You're amazing!" Just not "I love you". Some girls freak out when you say it too soon, even though you're really just on the same page.

 

Now do you love this girl, or are you infatuated and really falling for her?

 

Cause maybe you can explain her that. Say you didn't mean to scare her away, you don't love her, but you just came out of a relationship where you're used to saying that, but you do really like her, and would like to try again, but a little slower.

 

It MIGHT just work, since it doesn't sound like she's over you, but she's just worried its moving too fast.

[TheBladeRunner]

Next time sat something else. Like: "I love everything about you". Or "You're amazing!" Just not "I love you". Some girls freak out when you say it too soon, even though you're really just on the same page.

 

Freakin' nice one criticality! I'm not much of a quick "I love you" guy, but If meet someone I am into that would be a good thing to say. I think falling in love regarding time is dependent upon the individual, but for me, it takes time just to figure out if I do love someone.......and you don't want to freak them out. My last short relationship said this to me after 2 weeks.......and yup, I ran for that reason and a few others .

[Criticality]

Yeah, I used to say that myself way too quick as the dumbass I was when I started dating and having girlfriends.

 

They should make a book for teenagers and hand it out to them when they're like 14. Should be called "Everything you need to know about dating and the opposite sex!" And in there, right in one of the first chapters it should explain how "I love you" can mean different things to different people. For a lot of people (mostly guys, I suspect) it just means "I really like spending time with you, I'm crazy infatuated and I think I might be falling for you. Unfortunately, there isn't really any good phrase to express it besides I love you".

 

It's very different from the dreaded "I want to be with you till I die, please have my children ASAP"-I love you.

 

BIG difference there. It took me like 3 girlfriends to figure out!

[TheBladeRunner]

It's very different from the dreaded "I want to be with you till I die, please have my children ASAP"-I love you.

 

Thanks! I'll now have to stop asking them to make babies 15 minutes into the date.......maybe wait 30 minutes instead...ha ha ha.

 

I get it though, I've met a lot of woman that are in "commitment mode" before I even know who they are. Too much too fast is never good, the same goes for a good single malt scotch as well .

[hogwild]

Hey Kingkaneda,

 

What the fine folks here have said so far is correct. I will add one important principle of human psychology, "People want what they can't have."

 

You're coming off as too easy. This isn't about playing games. It's because you ARE too easy.

 

It makes her question if you really love HER or if you love the IDEA of being in a relationship again. Yes, like has been mentioned earlier, you are rebounding and in need of healing your confidence. This can make a person quick to "fall in love."

 

Take your time to evaluate her. Find out her core values to see if they match yours.

 

If she's still talking to you, you can have her.

 

Agree with her. Tell her what has happened, "Hey babe, listen. The truth is I recently go out of a serious relationship and everything has been so great with you that I got carried away by the fun we're having. It's been awesome. But you're right, we need to slow down. So I think yeah we should be friends and take it slow. I don't want a relationship just to have one. I want a relationship if it's meant to be. Let's get to know each other better as friends without sex clouding our judgement."

 

Now you're thinking, "OMG! NO SEX! I'd rather cuddle a porcupine than hang out with her and not squeeze her snuggle bubbles!"

 

The thing is, you will be friendly but flirty. Don't push. Look in her eyes like you will kiss her, then give a little peck on the cheek. Tease her with the idea of sex but withhold it. Have discipline.

 

She still likes you. At some point you two will be having a great time like watching a movie while snuggling and you'll kiss her neck and she'll be like, "I thought we're just friends." And you'll say, "We are. We should stop." Then keep kissing her and making her hot for you."

 

If she says no then it's no. But if she likes you she'll kiss you back. It will be "forbidden" lust taking over. Hot.

 

But take it slow. Get to know her before you choose to love her.

 

If you don't you'll be cuddling a porcupine and spanking your monkey.

[Kingkaneda]

Thanks for all the advice people, it strenghtens my resolve of not being the one to initiate contact. Yesterday I shot her a "are you enjoying your day off?" Text in a moment of weakness. I really have to fight the urge. We had a little chat about our plans for the weekend, and she told me she missed me. Calling me "babe" and "dear". I ended with saying that Id like to hang out on monday when I get my stuff from her place. To make some dinner and watch a movie. She agreed. Now im thinking Ill give her a nice hug when I see her, but Im really unsure about the kiss. Guess Ill just have to feel the moment? Ill give her a short explanation about agreeing that its been going way too fast, but that I do enjoy her company. You think this is good, or is it too much again?

 

This weekend I will not initiate contact with her, just responding. This way I can respect her need for space.

 

Im feeling quite hopefull compared to a few days ago. Just wondering if its the fools hope?

 

Yeah and I understand my clingy/needy behaviour isnt really being nice, but more being selfish in thinking only about what I need/want.

[Criticality]

Nah, that's not fools hope... Yours is the hope of a guy who'll get some if he plays his cards right. Good luck!

[Kingkaneda]

Ok so I saw her again yesterday. She had said before that she didnt want me to sleep over this time, cause I had slept over everytime I saw her. And she wanted to take it slow with sex too, since we had sex everytime we saw eachother. I joked that I wasnt sure she would be able to hold back, but said I was fine with that.

 

I went to her place and bought some red roses for her. She picked me up from the station and we kissed right there. At her place we mostly cuddled on the couch and talked, while half watching the tv a bit. When it became late she would remind me of making sure I didnt miss the last train home. I kind of bugged me, but I guess she had told me before that this time I wouldnt sleep over. The last half hour we were making out very passionately and she was busy dryhumping me the whole time, but when I got some of her clothes of she reminded me about the no sex rule. I kept my pants on and we just did some light foreplay. She seemed really into it and then she said we should stop cause my train would leave in half an hour. I got my shirt on, we kissed and I left. Oh how I would have liked to stay! So while walking I texted her that Id prefer staying the night over having sex. She texted back when I was already in the train. Saying that she was still horny, but she felt allright with me going home. She wanted her own wakeup routine for work. I send her a link to "Girl you really got me" from the kinks, and she liked it. She sent me "waiting on the day" from John Mayer. Its about him waiting for this chick to love him completely and go for a serious long term relationship.

 

We didnt make plans for when we see eachother, and Im basically leaving it up to her cause I dont want to come across too desperate. While in reality I really want to see her as soon as possible!

 

On a sidenote: on Sundaynight she was bothered that I didnt text back fast enough while I was in the movies with some friends(she didnt know). And she said she really missed me, and shed wish one of us had a car. I replied that having no car wouldnt stop me from seeing her(trains go till bout 00:30 here). We talked about some other stuff and then she said: you should have come over 30 mins ago when I told you hoe much I missed you. So I sent her this pic of the train schedule showing I could catch the last train in 10 mins. And added: Last chance She responded: I wont say a thing I responded: Then you wont get anything. I really wanted her to ask to come to her place before I made that commitment because she has been so about her space this past week. If she hadnt been so standofish this week I would definately have jumped over to her place in the middele of the night. Ah **** me! I really feel like im playing a game, and its totally not what my gut tells me to do.

[Assasda]

You seem like an easy guy to manipulate.

 

Dont be an easy target. Play the game with her too;)

[Kingkaneda]

You seem like an easy guy to manipulate.

 

Dont be an easy target. Play the game with her too;)

 

Yeah I really suck at this game.

 

Edit: And to be honest it already seems like a weakness to be even playing this game. But she comes across as a really nice and vulnerable girl. She tells me its a chaos in her head. So it doesnt feel like she chooses to play this game with me. While on the other hand I feel totally manipulated. Bleh, I need to punch some sparring partners today and get this weakness feeling out of my system.

Edited October 22, 2013 by Kingkaneda

[todreaminblue]

although i agree with some of the concepts and advice that has been given ...i dont see the point in playing this game of push pull......

 

 

from either side doesnt matter who initiates it....sooner or later the game ends and you are who you are ...if you are keen you are still keen whether you hide it or not..i think having some self restraint goes along way some peopel call it mastery ...i think mastery is for wizards..... rather than game playing sefl restraint is the go...if you feel something....you let it be know that you do feel but you take it slow......i do believe in taking it slow, building some common ground..a sense fo expectancy the promise of tomorrows to come.......because when there are problems you can come back there.....back to where it was new and not so much pressure....before the action started.....the build up phase is perfect to remember when life throws spin balls at you.......so i dont know what to say...yes take it slow build some desire for tomorrow but dont play push pull games and act like someone you are not...that will end when you get tired of not being who you are...thats just my thoughts though......and i am selectively single so dont know if you can take my advice ver batim.........deb

[Kingkaneda]

Bah I getting really fed up with this situation and my insecurity about it. Is asked her when I'd see her next. She answeredthat she really didnt know and that her weekend was full.... When Im with her its great, she is REALLY clingy and basically like a little lovemonkey wrapped all around me. But she keeps thing sooo vague. She wants to date exclusively, but doesnt want a relationship. Ugh

 

Edit: Im fine with doing things more slowly, but these vague answers give me such a bad vibe. Even if shed be really busy the whole weekend, then why not say lets meetup monday for sure or something? That wouldnt be fast at all. Would it? Am I too pushy/needy? Or is she just not feeling it?

Edited October 22, 2013 by Kingkaneda

[myothernic2]

Bah I getting really fed up with this situation and my insecurity about it. Is asked her when I'd see her next. She answeredthat she really didnt know and that her weekend was full.... When Im with her its great, she is REALLY clingy and basically like a little lovemonkey wrapped all around me. But she keeps thing sooo vague. She wants to date exclusively, but doesnt want a relationship. Ugh

 

Edit: Im fine with doing things more slowly, but these vague answers give me such a bad vibe. Even if shed be really busy the whole weekend, then why not say lets meetup monday for sure or something? That wouldnt be fast at all. Would it? Am I too pushy/needy? Or is she just not feeling it?

 

I disagree with the advice you have been given in here. It seems to me that you were going with the flow with the pacing of the relationship and she's the one being fickle. I wouldn't play games with her and I would move on personally.

[Kingkaneda]

Alright **** it! I just told her I rather just be friends than do this hot-cold game with her. I surprised myself by being able to do this so easily, but the whole thing just irritated me. I still dont really understand why her feelings for me changed so abruptly after 2 weeks. She says her feelings just blocked at that moment and things were going to fast.

 

Next time I start dating I will not jump in like a mad loving fool like I did this time, even if it seems the girl wants it. I will play it slow and cool, and will most definetly not be the first to say "I love you".

Edited October 22, 2013 by Kingkaneda

[myothernic2]

Alright **** it! I just told her I rather just be friends than do this hot-cold game with her. I surprised myself by being able to do this so easily, but the whole thing just irritated me. I still dont really understand why her feelings for me changed so abruptly after 2 weeks. She says her feelings just blocked at that moment and things were going to fast.

 

Goof for you. No one has time for mind games.

[Kingkaneda]

Thanks for all the responses people. It really helped me to vent some frustrations here, and get some different points of view from you all. I dont know if I wouldve been able to take this step so easily without you

[Kingkaneda]

Ugh and today I feel like crap about it all. I'm just hoping she'll say she misses me. I know she will go to a concert tonight, so for sure she wont miss me today. I guess no contact till she reaches out, or not.

[Lost561]

First of all nice guys DO finish last.

 

The problem here is that you haven't exhibited any power in this relationship. You gave her everything she wanted and when you decided to hop on that train and go spend the night with her it bit you in the ass.

 

It sounds like you just wanted sex at that point(which I understand) and you thought with your d**k instead of your head.

 

The proper response when she sent you that text saying she wishes you were with her would have been for you to say " I wish I was with you too. I feel as though it's a good idea if we take this a bit slower and get to know each other first"

 

If she is relationship material than I would back off contact and let her initiate like you plan on doing and if she asks why say " I feel like you need your space right now"

 

There might still be a possible relationship out of this but you need to show dominance and power and can't give her what she wants all the time. That's my take.

[Lost561]

Never mind. Disregard my above post. You gave yourself away I think. Still see how she responds.

[happydate]

Ok so I saw her again yesterday. She had said before that she didnt want me to sleep over this time, cause I had slept over everytime I saw her. And she wanted to take it slow with sex too, since we had sex everytime we saw eachother. I joked that I wasnt sure she would be able to hold back, but said I was fine with that.

 

I went to her place and bought some red roses for her. She picked me up from the station and we kissed right there. At her place we mostly cuddled on the couch and talked, while half watching the tv a bit. When it became late she would remind me of making sure I didnt miss the last train home. I kind of bugged me, but I guess she had told me before that this time I wouldnt sleep over. The last half hour we were making out very passionately and she was busy dryhumping me the whole time, but when I got some of her clothes of she reminded me about the no sex rule. I kept my pants on and we just did some light foreplay. She seemed really into it and then she said we should stop cause my train would leave in half an hour. I got my shirt on, we kissed and I left. Oh how I would have liked to stay! So while walking I texted her that Id prefer staying the night over having sex. She texted back when I was already in the train. Saying that she was still horny, but she felt allright with me going home. She wanted her own wakeup routine for work. I send her a link to "Girl you really got me" from the kinks, and she liked it. She sent me "waiting on the day" from John Mayer. Its about him waiting for this chick to love him completely and go for a serious long term relationship.

 

We didnt make plans for when we see eachother, and Im basically leaving it up to her cause I dont want to come across too desperate. While in reality I really want to see her as soon as possible!

 

On a sidenote: on Sundaynight she was bothered that I didnt text back fast enough while I was in the movies with some friends(she didnt know). And she said she really missed me, and shed wish one of us had a car. I replied that having no car wouldnt stop me from seeing her(trains go till bout 00:30 here). We talked about some other stuff and then she said: you should have come over 30 mins ago when I told you hoe much I missed you. So I sent her this pic of the train schedule showing I could catch the last train in 10 mins. And added: Last chance She responded: I wont say a thing I responded: Then you wont get anything. I really wanted her to ask to come to her place before I made that commitment because she has been so about her space this past week. If she hadnt been so standofish this week I would definately have jumped over to her place in the middele of the night. Ah **** me! I really feel like im playing a game, and its totally not what my gut tells me to do.

 

You are being played by this fine lady. While I think you rebounding has something to do with it, haven't you considered that she might also be in rebound mode as well? A rebound girl.

 

I mean, a woman who lets a man sex her on the first date is looking for some sort of emotional confirmation. Something that she may have missed from her other boyfriend who may have dumped her. So she prowls around and you happened to be a guy who's willing to jump into the sack her. You see, women who is one foot in and one foot out usually has an accelerated sex schedule. They would have sex almost immediately with a man who would initiate it for the sakes of emotional confirmation. And you did sleep with her quick and that's how you get into the sack with her. If you execute a normal dating ritual of no sex until you get to know her, then you're be either written off as history or be friendzoned by her. No, with her and any woman like her, you got to move in and have sex with her no more than 3 dates. Having said; you are not forming any relationships at all. It's strictly FWB on her, cause she actually does have a boyfriend, a real one on the side and that perhaps they had a falling out and she's looking for another guy to make her feel better. Of course then, she's got a big mouth and then relay what you guys did. This make her real or ex boyfriend jealous and then eventually come running back to her. In the meantime, she catches wind of this and then cut off the sex in the attempt to control you and him (two stupid DUFUS). Her doing dry humping on you is to manipulate you into thinking she's still like you, but really all she's doing is to teach you that if you want sex, you are at her mercy. Her main point is SEX is her control on you and she knows it. Cause that's what you go to her for!

 

And now you're begging and asking her back. Pathetic! You guys never developed any loving foundation. It's all based on physical sex and once that honeymoon period ends, which is soon, then all you're going to get is either a FWB or a manipulated friend zone. If you want to play this game a little longer and enjoy sex with her, you have to make yourself HARD TO GET!

 

But really, you don't want to mess with these kind of women. If she lets you f*ck her on the first date, she would do the same with other men as well. She is not dating material. She is f*ck material only.

Edited October 23, 2013 by happydate

[Easyguy14]

Hi there, Im new to this forum and Id like some advice/support. Might be a bit of a long story, I appreciate the time you take to read it. Also Im from Holland so my english might be off.

 

I just came out of a 6 year long relationship wich ended about 5 months ago. We lived together for 5 years and she didnt feel the love for me anymore. I was pretty shocked and broken when it happened, and became really needy. Calling her/texting her to give it another chance. Didnt work at all. So after about 3 months of living in this needy self pity hell, I had enough and focussed on my life again. Going to the gym, hanging out with friends alot and started dating.

 

I was feeling better again and totally getting over my ex. I was in a good place. Then after 1 month of dating I met this girl and we really hit it of on the first date. We only chatted 1 evening, and met up the evening after it. Went out for dinner, talked all evening till she had to catch one of the last trains. I brought her to the station and waited with her. We kissed till the traindoors closed, and I had a great feeling! Then when I walked to my bike, she sent me a text that shed wish i had went with her. I took the next train to her city and she waited to pick me up. I slept over and we had sex. Ive never had sex with any girl on the first date but it felt right. Damn I was happy.

 

We saw eachother about 5-6 days a week for 2 weeks. Id go to work, go to the boxing gym and then go to her. Id sleep over and go to work from her place. We texted alot when we werent together. And every time we saw eachother we had sex. Every date was a sleepover. I remember thinking this is going really fast, but I was falling madly in love so I didnt care.

 

After 2 week i put on facebook that she was my girlfriend, and she accepted. The next day I told her I loved her! Oh man I wasnt holding back anything! The the day after she texted me: were going too fast I want to slow things down. Ouch! It hurt a bit, but I understood. We decided to see eachother only 3-4 days a week. Everytime we met we had a great time. Always holding hands, hugging, kissing laughing. We increased our texting because we saw eachother less often. We both texted that we missed eachother alot.

 

After 2 weeks of slowing down she hit me with this text: I really dont think I want a relationship with you. I like you, and I really like being together, but I think you have more feelings for me than I have for you. I went into the same stupid routine as I did with my ex: Give me a chance we had such a great time etc. Didnt work. I asked her if this meant that she never wanted to see me anymore. She said yes i think so. I had seen her 2 days prior to this message, and she hadnt said anything. Ugh.

 

Ok i was pretty down but decided it would be better to not contact her anymore. After 2 days of no contact she send ne a text: hey how are you? im worried about you. We te texted for a while and she told me it was harder to not see me than see would have thought.

Then came this request: can we still keep talking and sometimes meet up and hug and such? But no sex.

I told her it would be impossible for me not to kiss her. Then the conversation went to sex. And in the end i texted: what would happenif I was at your place right now? She answered: Wed probably kiss and have sex.

But at the same time she makes it clear she doesnt want a relationship, and she diesnt want a sex relationship either. Ugh!

 

Im still in love with her, and I have to pick up some of my things from her house next monday. Im planning on no contact unless she contacts me till monday. Foolishly hoping that she will miss me this weekend so that she might reconsider monday.

 

Should I no contact? What should I do when she texts? And should I go for the kiss on monday?

Last time I saw her was 5 days ago. We slept together and everything seemed great. Just this breakup texting is killing me!

 

Looks like she's playing games with you because she don't know where to put you right now. She wants to see you but is scared of falling in love and then things going wrong causing another heartbreak. I would just get the sex and then bail. Sounds like some headcase.