Criticality Posted October 14, 2013 Posted October 14, 2013 So I guess it's my turn to unload and asks people's opinions... My wife (well partner. We're in a common law marriage but never made it official) and I have been together close to 13 years. I'm in my early thirties and she's about ten years older. We have two great kids: A 12 year old girl and a 7 year old son. Me and the kids usually hang out in the living room, play on ipads or Wii, watch TV, do Legos, read, whatever. Our daughter is starting to spend more time in her own room, but she still likes to be social with us. My favorite part is when we just sit and play on our iPads or watch TV. My daughter to my left or lying in my lap, and her brother on the other side. I guess I'm the "fun parent" and I really do like spending time with the kids. The thing is, when my wife comes home from work, she rarely joins us. Instead she just goes to the bedroom and either takes a nap or goes on the computer. Or both. She stays in there most of the rest of day, only comes out to sometimes do a little housework, or eat dinner with us, though she occasionally skips dinner. (And no, I'm 99% sure she doesn't have an a affair or contact other men on the computer. She reads up on her interests and news. I looked in her email one time, as she occasionally leaves the computer open, and there was nothing interesting or revelatory in there.) In the weekends she usually either does her part of the housework (the bathroom, basically. Me and the kids do most of the rest) goes out to wash her cars and do other errands, and every other weekend or so we all go for a trip somewhere, for example to the mall. Needless to say: I miss my wife, as ridiculous as it sounds, considering that she's in the same house. I especially would love to have some time just for the two of us, (either outside of the house, or just after the kids have gone to sleep) but her just hanging out with me and the kids would be great, as they also notice that she doesn't spend time with us and comment on it. A few years ago we used to sit and talk for 15 min or half an hour every night after the kids went to sleep, and that was great. Anyways, the kids have commented on it to her, and especially to me, and I have told her a few times that we miss her and spending time with her. I understand she wants to read and relax (hey, just like I do!) and suggested that she could just either bring her laptop to the living room or use one of our iPads. So what does she say when I bring it up? Mostly that she understands and likes spending time with us, but she is very tired after work and needs to relax. (She works in an office mainly on the phone btw. She doesn't run around all day and, lifts bricks or something like that...) Now I do understand that she needs to unwind and spend some time by herself. And her mother has been terminally ill this year, which I guess also adds to her stress. I guess she might also feel a little left out or feel a little resentment that I'm the fun dad and she's boring old mom. But she is kinda contributing to this herself. But it's starting to feel ridiculous that I miss my wife, despite that she's in the same house as me. I'm pretty sure that me and the kids aren't THAT boring to be around, in fact we usually have a blast. I'm not sure what else I should do, and would love to hear some suggestions. I've already brought it up a couple of times, and me bringing it up again won't make her feel any less tired and stressed I'm sure...
GorillaTheater Posted October 14, 2013 Posted October 14, 2013 I think it's fair to place an expectation on your wife to at least act like she's part of the family. I'd tell her that she has an hour after she gets home to decompress, but after that she'll join you and the kids to help make dinner, talk, play games, even watch TV or whatever. Take the lead in planning events and outings, even if it's just going for a walk as a family, and tell your wife she's going. Let her know that you think her isolation is hurting the family, apologize for letting it go too long, but tell her that you are no longer letting it go. 5
KathyM Posted October 14, 2013 Posted October 14, 2013 You are living disconnected lives, and you need to have a discussion with your wife, without the kids around, and talk about the distance you feel between you, and how much you want to get your marriage and family life back on track. Don't blame her, but do tell her you feel there needs to be some changes made to build the connection between you that you feel is starting to be neglected by both of you. You need to institute a date night once a week, for one thing, where both you and your wife have the opportunity to connect as a couple without the kids in tow. You need to have the kids in bed at a reasonable time so you have the 1/2 hour or hour, whatever, at night to spend adult time with your wife. Also invite your wife to join you and the kids in things where you are interacting with each other. Expecting her to sit there while you watch T.V. or play video games is not interacting with each other, and is not a reasonable expectation. She does need some time alone to unwind also. But it sounds like you are all geared towards electronics at night, and therefore glued to a screen and not interacting with each other. You also should negotiate with your wife that family dinner time should have everyone at the table without electronics or phones as a distraction. It's an important time to talk with each other, and catch up on the day's activities. So, in short, have a discussion privately with your wife, to state your concerns without blaming, negotiate house rules that will allow for more interactions between family members, plan more activities where you can interact, both with your wife through date nights and reserving time alone at night, plus interactive activities as a family, such as games, sports/exercise, or other interactive activities during the week and on weekends. Reduce the amount of time you spend sitting in front of a screen. People are not interacting much when watching T.V. or playing video games. You need to limit that activity, and don't expect your wife to sit there with you while you watch T.V. or play video games if she is not interested in those activities. 1
Author Criticality Posted October 14, 2013 Author Posted October 14, 2013 I think it's fair to place an expectation on your wife to at least act like she's part of the family. I'd tell her that she has an hour after she gets home to decompress, but after that she'll join you and the kids to help make dinner, talk, play games, even watch TV or whatever. Take the lead in planning events and outings, even if it's just going for a walk as a family, and tell your wife she's going. Yeah, we used to go out on walks as a family more often than we do now, though its been a year or two since we got out of that habit. That might be an idea. Weekend outings aren't really the problem. The couple of times a month that we go out in the weekend, even though its just to the mall, is fine. She also planned a vacation for us this summer, though she's the type who loves to plan a vacation, spends six months doing it, and the vacation itself is almost the anticlimax. It's just the every day situation where I and the kids miss her. The thing is though: Our daughter is into playing ipad or Wii, trashy TV shows, a couple of teeny bopper bands, clothes, fashion and makeup. (Or rather exploring the topic of makeup. We dont let her wear any except lib balm and mascara on special occasions. She can spend hours on YouTube watching makeover videos though.) My wife isn't really interested in those things (Yes, a woman who doesn't spend an inordinate amount of time on fashion and shopping for clothes... They exist) So my daughter turns to me, to share those interests. And to go shopping with her. (I guess I'm good at feigning interest. Though I do find it interesting and cute to see her explore those topics and her growing femininity.) My son on the other hand likes Legos and video games. And sometimes board games and soccer. Again neither is anything my wife can do with him, or is interested in. She has joined is for a board game though, both just her and my son or all 3/4 of us. It's pretty rare though, doesn't really happen more than a couple of times a year. So maybe my wife has come to feel left out over the years? Or she's just not used to spending free time/downtime with them/us? I don't really expect her to do stuff like play videogames all of a sudden, but just having her in the same room as us a majority of the time would be welcome. Looking back, I do see that we used to go out for walks more in the past, and spend more time together. Whenever we go to the kids activities, she comes along too, unless its something really nearby where I sometimes go by myself. Has she been checked for depression? Good question. Not specifically that. She did have some health concerns earlier this year that could be tied to depression though. (Or anxiety. Something really vague though, that could also be a lot of different things.) I guess I should pursue this too. As I mentioned I brought up the fact that its taking its toll on both me and the kids, but didnt get much out of that except for "I'd like to, but I'm tired, I work hard, need to relax etc." So far I guess it could be one of the following: 1. Stress, made worse by her mothers illness and possibly her own health. 2. She depression or some autoimmune disease that drains her energy. 3. She is having an emotional or sexual affair. Really doubtful for a number of reasons, just the one that it isn't just me she's not spending time with but also the kids. 4. Me and the kids really are so boring that an afternoon in front of the computer is preferable. In also pretty sure that this isn't the case. 5. She gave up on our relationship a long time ago, and is just barely holding the facade together. Again possible but not that likely. It's not like she has completely changed, and there isn't a trace of the flirty, cute fun loving woman left. 6. Menopause? She's ten years older than me and in her early fourties, so I suppose an early menopause is a possibility. 7. An even mix of laziness and bad habits. Possibly made worse by 1,2 or 6.
Author Criticality Posted October 14, 2013 Author Posted October 14, 2013 (edited) But it sounds like you are all geared towards electronics at night, and therefore glued to a screen and not interacting with each other. s. Well here's the thing. The games, sometimes me and my son, sometimes both the kids and me, is usually stuff we play together. Either at the same time or we take turns. Sometimes we look at things online. When we watch something. It's often something my daughter wants me to see and talk about with her (Like a makeup video or something else that interests her. So yeah, while there is a screen there, its also quality time where we sit and talk with each other. Talking about it probably takes up more time than the video itself, if you know what I mean. Personally I don't watch a lot of TV, a year or two ago my wife used to watch a lot of TV though. Well we usually watched it together in the evening. Going out and do something together is a good though ironic suggestion, considering my wife used to be a semiprofessional athlete when she was younger. When me and the kids go out, and we do that pretty often in the summer it's either to play soccer, or usually for water gun fights. For the life of me I can't imagine her joining us for that, though she has been out to play tennis with the kids a couple of times. Edited October 14, 2013 by Criticality
xxoo Posted October 14, 2013 Posted October 14, 2013 Spending some time with you and the kids every day is not too much to ask. If my spouse were to isolate himself from us, I'd start asking some questions, and I wouldn't be satisfied with tired and stressed. Push harder, and find out what is really going on. If she can't identify reasons that she'd rather be alone with the computer than with family, push for a doctor visit. 1
KathyM Posted October 14, 2013 Posted October 14, 2013 Well here's the thing. The games, sometimes me and my son, sometimes both the kids and me, is usually stuff we play together. Either at the same time or we take turns. Sometimes we look at things online. When we watch something. It's often something my daughter wants me to see and talk about with her (Like a makeup video or something else that interests her. So yeah, while there is a screen there, its also quality time where we sit and talk with each other. Talking about it probably takes up more time than the video itself, if you know what I mean. Personally I don't watch a lot of TV, a year or two ago my wife used to watch a lot of TV though. Well we usually watched it together in the evening. Going out and do something together is a good though ironic suggestion, considering my wife used to be a semiprofessional athlete when she was younger. When me and the kids go out, and we do that pretty often in the summer it's either to play soccer, or usually for water gun fights. For the life of me I can't imagine her joining us for that, though she has been out to play tennis with the kids a couple of times. Find activities that you can all do together that don't involve sitting around a video/computer screen. Plan date nights that don't revolve around errands, where you are actually going out as a couple to do something fun together. You need to replace the screen time with interactive time. Talking to family members while reading or listening to screens does not qualify as interacting or spending quality time together.
GorillaTheater Posted October 14, 2013 Posted October 14, 2013 Well here's the thing. The games, sometimes me and my son, sometimes both the kids and me, is usually stuff we play together. Either at the same time or we take turns. Sometimes we look at things online. When we watch something. It's often something my daughter wants me to see and talk about with her (Like a makeup video or something else that interests her. So yeah, while there is a screen there, its also quality time where we sit and talk with each other. Talking about it probably takes up more time than the video itself, if you know what I mean. Personally I don't watch a lot of TV, a year or two ago my wife used to watch a lot of TV though. Well we usually watched it together in the evening. Going out and do something together is a good though ironic suggestion, considering my wife used to be a semiprofessional athlete when she was younger. When me and the kids go out, and we do that pretty often in the summer it's either to play soccer, or usually for water gun fights. For the life of me I can't imagine her joining us for that, though she has been out to play tennis with the kids a couple of times. The thing is, it's not a matter of being interested in what your kids are into as much as being interested in your kids, period. I was pretty damn bored as one of my kids was showing me every. single. Pokemon. card. he. owned. But you know what? He wanted to share his interest with me, and I love him, so I sat there very patiently and asked some questions about it. Childhood is short, and your wife is missing it. 5
GorillaTheater Posted October 14, 2013 Posted October 14, 2013 Loving your children and listening to them list off Pokemon cards may not be mutually exclusive for parents. I think the biggest issue is making sure that his wife is showing her love to the children, in some way that they can understand. My parents have a unique way of showing love that is different from each other. Don't get hung up on my Pokemon card example. The point is that she needs to be spending time with them, and that's awfully hard to do if she's barricaded in her bedroom. 1
Solcita2 Posted October 14, 2013 Posted October 14, 2013 Can I ask how is your life as a couple? Do you have intimicy? How are you as a couple? Do you speak about anything? How is the dinamic between you two? Do you consider her your partner? Are YOU a good partner? How supportive were you through her mom's disease? Or the only problem is the family dinamics? (because if it does the kids will think she doesn't love them or like them... I say this because of my own experience while growing up) Your family makes me remember of mine when growing up, the only difference is that the absence parent was my dad... he never knew when our birthdays were, what schools we attended and any time we had problems like bullying at school he would only say to defend ourselves... he always said things like "if you don't kick their ass*s I'm not interested"... he said he would be willing to go to the principal's office to defend me for kicking the bullyers ass*s instead of listening me crying whenever I was bullied... The thing with my dad was that his work came first (always did and always will)... so the only parent around was my mom, even when she also worked very much... All of this made us all believe he just didn't want us or loved us... I think my father told me he loved me for the first time last year (I'm 32 years old and I checked out from him long time ago, however my 34 year old sister is going through a Electra type relationship right now, but the rest of us just moved on from him). I would say that it's necessary to correct this as soon as possible, the longer it takes the harder it will be... I think you're getting good advices here... hope it helps!
crederer Posted October 15, 2013 Posted October 15, 2013 Has she been checked for depression? That's what I immediately thought too. Depression or even a physical problem (i,e iron deficiency or nutrient deficiency, sleep apnea, diabetes, etc).
Author Criticality Posted October 15, 2013 Author Posted October 15, 2013 Can I ask how is your life as a couple? Do you have intimicy? How are you as a couple? Do you speak about anything? How is the dinamic between you two? Do you consider her your partner? Are YOU a good partner? How supportive were you through her mom's disease? Hmmm, tough questions... Overall I've been as supportive as I could. The thing is, she's the kind of person her bottles stuff up inside to an extent. She's not the kind of person to share her problems with the world, a doctor or a therapist. We do talk about the difficult stuff though, her mother, the future, how she feels and so on. I'm probably her best (or one of her best) friends. And one of the only people she shares these things. She says she loves me, and often tells me how she appreciates the things I do for her, or around the house. I can still make her laugh, often do, and she still shows her girly, playful, loving personality throughout the week, though maybe less than she used to. As for intimacy and whether Im a good partner, that's a tough one and I think I am. I try at least. I like to surprise her with little gifts or treats or flowers and do that once or twice a month. It's hard to compare cause I was only 21-22 when we originally met, so I don't have a lot of other LTR to compare to. We drifted apart for awhile 5-6 years ago, but after that our relationship got dramatically better. For awhile we were like newly weds. She tells me occasionally that I'm a good partner/husband/father and she's lucky. Intimacy... Well, sex is a couple of times a month and has been better in the past. As often its a combination of timing, libido, kids and tiredness. (And yes, most of those are only excuses in the end.) As for other intimacy, we often sleep in different bedrooms during the week (a combination of her being a light sleeper, me snoring and needing to be up at night sometimes) in the weekend however we sleep in the same bed, and it seems like she likes it and looks forward to it. She enjoys laying and talking in bed like always. As I mentioned we don't have much time by the two of us. But we sometimes try to make an effort to spend time: For example, recently she drove me to an appointment I could have easily gone to myself, mainly because it gave us a good hour or two to just be the two of us. I understand that not making/spending time together to an extent is by choice when it boils down to it. So Im encouraged that we still try, though we could try harder. Or the only problem is the family dinamics? (because if it does the kids will think she doesn't love them or like them... I say this because of my own experience while growing up) I think so... The kids have more or less resigned themselves to how this. Despite this she gets along good with our son, but not as well with our daughter. The issues are mainly that my daughter doesn't feel accepted or maybe even loved unconditionally, I think, which is why she comes to me with a lot of things. She tends to dismiss or marginalize her interests, which is why DD comes to me to go shopping etc. and obviously she's not always the easiest girl in the world though I love her like crazy. I would say that it's necessary to correct this as soon as possible, the longer it takes the harder it will be... I think you're getting good advices here... hope it helps! Thanks! I hope so and agree with a lot of things. Hopefully a little more background explains the situation better... Honestly, I think she is overwhelmed. She sound overwhelmed. I barricade myself in my room and it pisses my fiancé off but sometimes I just want to be left alone. I'm sure she loves her kids and I'm sure that this will pass. Thanks Maylie! That makes sense, and I'm leaning towards overworked, overwhelmed and over stressed. The kids have always been a big part of her life, and I know she loves them.
Nyla Posted October 15, 2013 Posted October 15, 2013 How did your wife feel about becoming a mother? Did she want children? Maybe she is just an introvert and likes to be left alone.
xxoo Posted October 15, 2013 Posted October 15, 2013 You drifted apart 5 years ago, had a renewed honeymoon stage, and are drifting apart again. Did you ever figure out what caused the first drift?
Author Criticality Posted October 15, 2013 Author Posted October 15, 2013 How did your wife feel about becoming a mother? Did she want children? Maybe she is just an introvert and likes to be left alone. Yeah, she is an introvert. Very private. Except with me I guess, lol! She wasn't planning for our first, but when it happened she really grew into it and loved it. It was amazing to see really, that transformation, how she embraced it and everything in her came together for motherhood, just like it happened in hundreds of generations of women before her. Of course she had to give up on a lot too. The first couple of years we dealt with those occasional frustrations there were about being "just a parent" and about the stuff we had to give up on, but it didnt become a recurring issue. She loves the kids a lot, I'm sure.
Author Criticality Posted October 15, 2013 Author Posted October 15, 2013 You drifted apart 5 years ago, had a renewed honeymoon stage, and are drifting apart again. Did you ever figure out what caused the first drift? Lack of communication, resentments building up over time. Pushing each other away. I wouldn't say we're drifting apart again, we may end there one day if we don't watch out, but there's still a lot of love and intimacy. Back then it was different, there was a palpable coldness in a way. We just didn't care anymore.
Author Criticality Posted October 15, 2013 Author Posted October 15, 2013 It sounds to me like she is: 1. a lucky woman 2. Just tired. I'm not in my 40's (not quite) and sometimes I feel like I'm 100!! I come home from work and all I want to do is curl up on the couch..... Veg'n is a habit. a hard one to break. The more you laze around the more you don't want to do anything but laze around..... So! Date night for you guys! Make her get all gussied up and go out for a movie. The more active she is the more active she'll want to be. Oh...HORMONES! Have her go get her hormones checked. Hormones can reak havoc on your life...make you irritable, tired, just plain Blah feeling. It might be something as simple as that Good luck You sound like a great H and Father. Just giving you some kudos!! Thanks, that was great to hear And good suggestions too. We gotta make some more date nights and time for each other. Even if its just sometimes something as mundane as one of us driving the other for something.
Mr. Lucky Posted October 15, 2013 Posted October 15, 2013 Find activities that you can all do together that don't involve sitting around a video/computer screen. Plan date nights that don't revolve around errands, where you are actually going out as a couple to do something fun together. You need to replace the screen time with interactive time. Talking to family members while reading or listening to screens does not qualify as interacting or spending quality time together. Agreed. We've tried to carve out part of the weekend "unplugged" and have found it to be valuable. There's a big difference between the family playing the Monopoly board game and Words with Friends with a partner online... Mr. Lucky
Solcita2 Posted October 16, 2013 Posted October 16, 2013 Agreed. We've tried to carve out part of the weekend "unplugged" and have found it to be valuable. There's a big difference between the family playing the Monopoly board game and Words with Friends with a partner online... Mr. Lucky I swear I was just about to say something like this. I liked what I read about your relationship with her, however the time with the kids might seem an issue. I would suggest you to do a date, a play date... maybe Friday nights? Junk food, movie, board games, etc... the world is only the four of you... I think it would be a nice first step... to get them closer together. The relationship between your wife and the kids sounds very much like a dad-kids relationship... dad comes home after work, doesn't pay much attention to the kids, however the relationship with his wife is ok... (sounds like my brother's relationship with his son). What you have to be careful with is that eventually it will damage your relationship with her as well, because you will start feeling more and more close to the kids and farther away from her. The relationship between my brother and his son does affect the relationship with his wife. I stayed over their house for two weeks once and she kept complaining and complaining about it... he just came back home and went directly to the computer, and it didn't matter that the kid was waiting for him all happy... For them it did help them the playdates, or the weekends for the kids... however, I just wanted to kick his ass while watching him playing online and his kid just sitting next to him wanting to interact with him (the kid was 4 or 5 by that time and his father was his hero). Best of lucks! You sound like a nice guy and your wife as a nice lady, maybe she just need a little bit more support I'm not concerned about you because I know you will be fine, but I do wish you things to get better
2sunny Posted October 16, 2013 Posted October 16, 2013 Do you take your wife out - just the two of you - once every week or so?
crederer Posted October 16, 2013 Posted October 16, 2013 If she's doing it for any reason other than medical or emotional reasons, it's completely selfish. Some posters saying "oh maybe she's worn out/tired/wants to veg" Well you know what? She has children to look after. That simply is not an option. If that's the case she needs to get her head outta her azz.
xxoo Posted October 16, 2013 Posted October 16, 2013 If she's doing it for any reason other than medical or emotional reasons, it's completely selfish. Some posters saying "oh maybe she's worn out/tired/wants to veg" Well you know what? She has children to look after. That simply is not an option. If that's the case she needs to get her head outta her azz. I agree. Taking SOME time for yourself is completely reasonable. Spending ALL your time by yourself, to the point that you don't come out for family dinners, is rude and neglectful. Why don't the kids bug her more? Do you enable by telling them to leave mommy alone? Or have they given up? My kids would make their needs known. 2
Els Posted October 16, 2013 Posted October 16, 2013 The others have given you lots of great advice. One point of your post does stand out at me, though. You mention that you're playing with the kids, etc, and when she gets home she 'doesn't join you'. That means she gets home consistently later than you? What time does she get home, or how many hours does she work in a week? Even if work isn't physical, it can be tiring, especially if she's doing long hours or has a long commute.
2sunny Posted October 16, 2013 Posted October 16, 2013 How can you allow your wife to understand that SHE IS EXPECTED to participate with the family? Your kids need to see mom actively playing a role in THEIR lives. Let her know that she is harming them by not participating. They are essentially learning that a mom is invisible and absent. IF you were to place more of the parenting responsibilities on her - they may start to get an idea that you TWO are a TEAM, yes? Do you work as much as she does? Does she make dinners, do homework with them half the time? Think of ways to express to her she is NEEDED in the kids lives on a daily basis - otherwise - SHE has reduced herself to a paycheck. 1
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