Don't like my nephew

[Elmo]

Here is a rant...and I guess alot of you will think I am a meanie.

 

Well, Xmas is nearly here...and I am dreading my nephew's visit.

 

He is my bro in laws son. I love my bro in law. He is just great. But, that kid is so out of control.

 

They will only be visiting for Xmas day, not staying here, so I feel evil for even having these thoughts....but the little guy tore my house up last year. Broke a few really nice things. (That were put away in a closet...on the top shelf!) Pulled the 12 ft. Xmas tree over. Took a cake (a pretty one!) and dug the middle out with his fingers, then wiped the icing on my old, but beautiful, silk curtains.

 

Plus he hit me for not giving him something he wanted. WHILE my BIL watched and did nothing but give him the thing he wanted! The excuse: He's got ADD. Okay, I don't buy the whole "everyone has a disorder" thing, but still, what about a time out or some kind of rebuke for hitting a woman?

 

My husband won't let him get away with anything...however, we will have a houseful and he can't monitor the kid the entire time.

 

I feel rotten, not liking the kid. My BIL recently married and the step mom is great. But that kid is so far gone. I know, it's horrid to say...but I swear he's going to hurt somebody or an animal. It had better not be one of my animals or there WILL be HELL to pay.

 

Every year it's worse. Last time he came (in the summer) we all went hiking and he took a small boulder and threw it at his uncle down the hill...who, by the way was carrying a toddler. Yep, he was jealous. Could have...nearly did...kill 2 people. I'm not exagerating but not sure if he knew the seriousness of his actions.

 

I don't want to be mean to this boy, but, dang. I don't like him.

 

Is it wrong to not like a 10 year old?

 

I know...the day will pass... Just wanted to vent. And, yes...I will hide anything breakable in the locked closet.

[JackieQ]

you say your husband won't put up with it...what does he do that's effective? and why don't you do it also?

 

Yes, kids have ADD but it really does bug me when it's used as an excuse so kids don't even have to try to behave.

 

Nowhere in the dx of ADD does it say that the child "can't learn"...he or she may have problems with behavior and impulses...the nature of the beast...but they will have to eventually live in the real world. Parent's don't do their kids any good by not even having them try to control those tendencies.

 

Whew...soapbox time. sorry.

 

That said, have you considered meeting somewhere besides your house? Like a community building...would at least save your stuff and maybe a bit of your sanity running around trying to protect the breakables.

[Merin]

Well.. How about this.. You don't like his BEHAVIOUR..

 

He's only 10.. and I know he sounds like a real pain in the A**.. but sometimes it really is those kids that behave the worst, that need the most emotionally.. know what I mean?

 

The hard part here is your Nephews Dad.. when a parent won't give thier child any direction or discipline it makes it miserable for everyone else who's hands and voices are dying to say or do something to redirect the child..

 

Be firm with this Kiddo.. If he is doing something you don't want him to do.. then redirect him. Tell him NO and give him something else to do.. a lot of his problem could be just boredom.. even if he has ADD he is also a kid.. and kid's get bored at family gatherings if they are not occupied.

 

With that said.. maybe you could "designate" a room for the children that will be coming for the Holiday.. put a television with a dvd player and rent some movies for them to watch.. get some art supplies paper, markers, construction paper.. games, things like that to give him a variety of things to do.

 

Look at it in a different way.. maybe it isn't so much this little boy you don't like, as it is his behaviour.. and honestly.. a kiddo's behaviour can only be as "good" or as "bad" as the parent allows it to be.. Just saying that again.. he may be not really a "bad kid" as much as it's "acceptable behaviour" at HIS home.

 

If all else fails.. feel free to put yourself into your happy chair in time out

 

Good Luck!

[JackieQ]

good points Merin...wish I'd made em. and I like the "time out" in the happy chair. we all can use those once in awhile. jq

[Merin]

Originally posted by JackieQ

good points Merin...wish I'd made em. and I like the "time out" in the happy chair. we all can use those once in awhile. jq

 

Damn, I look for that happy chair and a good time out at least once a week

[Elmo]

Originally posted by JackieQ

you say your husband won't put up with it...what does he do that's effective? and why don't you do it also?

 

Yes, kids have ADD but it really does bug me when it's used as an excuse so kids don't even have to try to behave.

 

Nowhere in the dx of ADD does it say that the child "can't learn"...he or she may have problems with behavior and impulses...the nature of the beast...but they will have to eventually live in the real world. Parent's don't do their kids any good by not even having them try to control those tendencies.

 

Whew...soapbox time. sorry.

 

That said, have you considered meeting somewhere besides your house? Like a community building...would at least save your stuff and maybe a bit of your sanity running around trying to protect the breakables.

 

Thank you for replying.

 

My husband is the oldest in the family. He will just take a misbehaving kid...pick him up like a puppy....and carry him into a quiet area and tell them they are not to do this in THIS house. Very effective. His brothers all look up to him...but Jebus, I can't do that. I tried to redirect my nephew when he is being out of control but he just runs off. I don't have this problem with the other kids. I'm actually the NICE aunt!

 

I hear ya about learning to live in the real world. This boy is in for a rude awakening. Guess it will happen in middle school.

 

We always have the Xmas day thing here. Oh, how I would love to rent out a hall! Still, I love having everyone here. I love the kids! Just, this guy kinda scares me.

 

Did anyone read "We Have to talk About Kevin". He's not far from that. My poor BIL is dealing with alot of guilt...so he just gives in. Hey, I bet I'd do the same thing...just don't think it is benefiting my nephew at all. Oh, BTW, he still sleeps with his mom. He will be 11 in a month!

 

And I have to deal with him 3 days a year and am griping!

 

I'm not the kind that thinks "oh, he's going to ruin Xmas!"...I'm just freaked out by him. I don't ever let the other kids be alone with him. Better safe than sorry.

[Missy1171]

OMG!! You could be talking about my sister's step son! Except he is 8. He does not listen to anyone!

He also has ADHD, but he is on 3 different kinds of medication and it has not helped! I have seen my brother in law paddle his butt and the kid looks at him and says it didn't hurt!

 

He has actually threatened to kill my sister and her baby (3mths old) with a butcher knife, then he said that as soon as his baby sister, (4) is big enough he was going to kill her too!

 

He has been suspended from school 3 times this year, and last time he couldn't go back until he had a psychiatric evaluation. They are seriously thinking of putting this child into a mental institution!

 

My sister was taking him to his mothers a couple of weeks ago and he took the seat belt and wrapped it around his throat and choked his self,(my other sis's BF saw him do this) when he got to his mothers he told her that his dad had done it. So my Brother in law was arrested for 3rd degree assault. No he can't see him at all with supervision.

 

So I know where you are coming from, because I'm not fond of this kid either!

[moimeme]

Nowhere in the dx of ADD does it say that the child "can't learn"...

 

No, but it takes a lot of dedication and work to teach them, because one of the 'features' of AD/HD is forgetfulness and failure to learn from past lessons. Punishement rarely works, because when the kid is about to do something, he will *not* remember that he was punished the last time he did it.

 

If you want to dislike anybody, dislike your brother for not having this boy treated. He will not 'grow out' of this and he will have a hellaciously rotten life because nobody will like him because of his behaviour. This will extend to failure in schook and relationships. So why is this boy not being treated?????? And yes, meds may be necessary because you need someone to be able to pay attention long enough to learn the lessons you are trying to teach him.

 

OMG!! You could be talking about my sister's step son! Except he is 8. He does not listen to anyone!

He also has ADHD, but he is on 3 different kinds of medication and it has not helped

 

If he has been treated for AD/HD and the meds have not helped, chances are he is bipolar or at least has a couple other disorders. Only one type of AD/HD that mimics bipolar would produce those sorts of symptoms.

 

That boy needs to be taken to an expert in treating AD/HD who will do more extensive testing to see if it is actually AD/HD, if there are comorbid disorders, or if he has bipolar instead. And he needs to be treated FAST.

 

Physical punishment will NOT help a child like this. Tell your brother to quit doing things which are unhelpful and to get his kid to a doctor who knows what s/he's doing.

 

So my Brother in law was arrested for 3rd degree assault. No he can't see him at all with supervision. They do that as a precaution - they act first and ask questions later. Once the BF testifies to what happened, the supervision order will be lifted.

[Missy1171]

Moimeme:

 

What are the signs of bi-polar? R, (my step nefew) he can go from severe violance one day and then the next he acts like a normal child for a while, then something "clicks" and he starts up again. Trust me I know spanking him does not help, it makes it worse, me and my sis have told him this, but he said he was raised like that so he see's no difference.

 

Do you think they should switch Dr's since they don't seem to be treating the problem?

 

Any suggestion you can make would really help out my sister, she has no clue what to do anymore.

[moimeme]

It may not be bipolar, but one type of AD/HD can mimic bipolar or can be confused for bipolar. I could give you a symptom list, but the best course of action is for your sister to check the Chadd.org website for names of physicians known to be treating AD/HD at their site. There may also be a chapter of CHADD in her town and parents there will have referrals. If there isn't a referral for a doc in her area, then she can also get in touch with a university or teaching hospital near her and ask for a referral to someone expert in diagnosing and treating AD/HD and comorbidities. Most people with AD/HD have other disorders as well and he could have BPD or any number of things.

 

She might also consider reading The Explosive Child by Dr. Ross Greene. Good luck. If you post any more questions and I don't see them, by all means PM me and I'll do what I can to find info for you.

[JackieQ]

Originally posted by moimeme

Nowhere in the dx of ADD does it say that the child "can't learn"...

 

No, but it takes a lot of dedication and work to teach them, because one of the 'features' of AD/HD is forgetfulness and failure to learn from past lessons.

 

Very true. My point wasn't that these kids don't have problems. They very definitely do. And very definitely struggle with the things you talk about. BUT...I've seen too many parents and therapists alike start to use ADHD as a "catchall" for why a child can't do this or that. There's a fine line between realizing a child has troubles and excusing him from trying.

 

Punishement rarely works, because when the kid is about to do something, he will *not* remember that he was punished the last time he did it.

 

I'm not sure he doesn't remember so much as he doesn't naturally have the impulse control to think about the consequences first. Either way, you're right, punishment rarely does work.

 

 

If he has been treated for AD/HD and the meds have not helped, chances are he is bipolar or at least has a couple other disorders. Only one type of AD/HD that mimics bipolar would produce those sorts of symptoms.

 

He may have bipolar but he may also be responding a really bad environment of some sort. Medication can help but isn't always the whole answer either.

[Elmo]

Well, I've read all of your responses, and appreciate your thoughts. I guess I knew this would boil down to alot of people explaining his behavior as "disorders". And, yes he "has" ADD and is being medicated.

 

I don't think he "has" anything other than an overly permissive father and an odd mother who lets him run that household.

 

He is active, yes. Just like my husband and his brothers. All have very high energy temperments. I know it is popular to not believe in temperment or personality and blame misbehavior on brain disorders, but I'm not buying it in this case.

 

And yes, I believe ADD/ADHD does exist, but as an exception not the rule. This kid is spoiled, plain and simple.

 

And...yes I don't like him OR his behaviors. And, yes, I am judging his Dad and Mom. In my opinion, they let him get away with murder because: a) the Dad is feeling guilt over leaving the wierdo mother and b) the mother is bitter and lonely and has turned the boy into her new husband.

 

So, I feel bad for the kid that he is not being parented in the best manner...However, he is still an obnoxious brat who pitches a hissey fit if he does not get everything his way.

 

I know this is not politically correct...but someone please explain to me...is NO kid spoiled or bratty? Are they ALL suffering from a disorder?

[moimeme]

And yes, I believe ADD/ADHD does exist, but as an exception not the rule. This kid is spoiled, plain and simple.

 

It is estimated that between four and ten percent of ALL children have AD/HD. That makes it the most common childhood ailment. That means millions of children and that is far from an 'exception'.

 

However you asked for information and your answer is that no matter what you're told, you'll believe what you wish. Go ahead. Tell them to never visit you again because you do no child a favour by disapproving. You'll only make him worse in the end.

[Debster]

Have you thought of before he gets in the house you guys do something really active outside to help him lose some of his energy. If what your husband does works, then why can't you try it?

[zara]

you can whup the ass of a kid with adhd and he'll just laugh - heck, so would i if i was on that many drugs!!!!

 

What is it with the world today that thinks giving boisterous kids a 'disease' and pumping em full of amphetimines is the right way to raise our next generation - remember folks: these kids choose your rest home!

 

This child needs some socialisation skills and even if his father is reluctant to furnish him with these skills, whilst in your house he should respect your standards. DO NOT feel in any way guilty about enforcing your rules whilst in your own home. Try your husband's patient but firm technique.

 

I think Debster's suggestion of an activity to tire him out is a great idea - get the youngsters together for some sort of outdoor game or activity then let them rest in front a video whilst the grown ups relax.

 

Please do not allow this to spoil your holiday!

[Elmo]

Originally posted by Debster

Have you thought of before he gets in the house you guys do something really active outside to help him lose some of his energy. If what your husband does works, then why can't you try it?

 

 

Thanks for replying!

 

Well, I've tried pinata's...and hide and seek (we have 2 acres!) and games and races and kick ball with the big guys playing too.

 

My husband picks him up (he's about 85 lbs.) and carries him to a quiet place to explain the rules.

 

Nephew does not kick or hit or throw a hissey with my husband. I guess nobody does, he is a very large, intimidating, kind, wonderful guy. And, yes, I am lucky I married such a man....guess I'm braggin there.

 

I try to re-direct him.

 

Look, I don't hate him. But he is spoiled. I don't like spoiled. I don't like spoiled kids or adults. It is hard for most of us to not get what we want.

[Elmo]

Originally posted by Debster

Have you thought of before he gets in the house you guys do something really active outside to help him lose some of his energy. If what your husband does works, then why can't you try it?

 

 

Originally posted by zara

you can whup the ass of a kid with adhd and he'll just laugh - heck, so would i if i was on that many drugs!!!!

 

What is it with the world today that thinks giving boisterous kids a 'disease' and pumping em full of amphetimines is the right way to raise our next generation - remember folks: these kids choose your rest home!

 

This child needs some socialisation skills and even if his father is reluctant to furnish him with these skills, whilst in your house he should respect your standards. DO NOT feel in any way guilty about enforcing your rules whilst in your own home. Try your husband's patient but firm technique.

 

I think Debster's suggestion of an activity to tire him out is a great idea - get the youngsters together for some sort of outdoor game or activity then let them rest in front a video whilst the grown ups relax.

 

Please do not allow this to spoil your holiday!

 

Thanks so much for your response! I know this seems trivial, because I only have to deal with it occasionally.

 

Yes, he does need some social skills.

 

Everyone tries the patient but firm stance with him. However, at his mother's house, he rules the roost and at his dad's house he is getting his way because his stepmom is "mean". A meaner person would be....hmm....anyone. She is a kind, sweet woman who wants to be a friend to this kid. However, she is a 7th grade teacher and has seen it all. So, she's not a pushover.

 

 

Oh, I forgot...I got a punching bag (Clown) and he deflowered it after another kid showed a talent at punching it down.

 

Hey, he's a bit older. We'll see!

[zara]

but if tiring him out doesn't work then maybe a dash of something in his Mountain Dew will help him sleep. My parents used to allow me a Christmas treat of whiskey and orange and i'd be out like a light by evening time. (and now i'm out of AA i'm doin just fine! )

 

-ok, ok, i take that back, the alcohol probably wouldn't be safe to mix with his 'medication' (speed and booze, my, why not book the kid into juvinile hall right now???! -lol!) - damn me and my British sense of humour!

 

Seriously, make sure the games are really active ones, where the kids have to run back and forth and round the block constantly; play statues where they have to be really still and quiet to win; make sure you don't feed him high sugar food or drinks with lots of additives and colourings.

 

Make sure that his good behaviour is rewarded and bad behaviour is punished - be that by his having to be in a different room or not allowed to join in a game.

 

 

Natural consequences may be enough to stop the behaviour -if he throws a drink on the floor, he doesn't get another.

 

Time-out can be helpful in dealing with tantrums, get him to sit at the foot of the stairs or in a corner- a good guide is one minute for every year of age. This will give him a chance to calm down.

 

Losing privileges such as not joining in with a game or sitting with the adults can also be effective.

 

When your nephew has calmed down and returned to his 'normal' self, talk to him and be clear about what was wrong and what you'd like him to do instead.

 

These are the best tips i can give. This isn't trivial because it has an effect on you at what should be a relaxing and enjoyable time.

[moimeme]

What is it with the world today that thinks giving boisterous kids a 'disease' and pumping em full of amphetimines is the right way to raise our next generation - remember folks: these kids choose your rest home!

 

DAMN IT TO HELL.

 

I am SO SICK of people with NO CLUE spouting off about geniune medical conditons. What if what he had was diabetes and everyone were to post 'what is this crap about insulin - all he needs is more exercise'. You do not have clue one about this so how dare you make such inane remarks??????

 

AD/HD is a REAL PHYSICAL CONDITION. There are DEFINITE DIFFERENCES IN THE BRAINS OF PEOPLE WHO HAVE AD/HD WHEN COMPARED WITH PEOPLE WHO DO NOT. And the people with AD/HD deserve help, not this constant bullshxt from non-professionals who have NO right to 'believe' or 'not believe' in it.

[zara]

Originally posted by moimeme

DAMN IT TO HELL.

You do not have clue one about this so how dare you make such inane remarks??????... There are DEFINITE DIFFERENCES IN THE BRAINS OF PEOPLE WHO HAVE AD/HD WHEN COMPARED WITH PEOPLE WHO DO NOT.

 

I make such remarks because i have an opinion, to which i am entitled. There are differences in the brain of left handed people from right handed people, that in itself does not make it a disorder nor does it mean that people should tolerate unacceptable behaviour from left-handed people.

 

I am not dismissing adhd as a medical condition, but rather trying to make the point that there are a good many children who are 'diagnosed' with conditions such as adhd when there is nothing at all wrong with them and that they are actually damaged by long term medication throughout their childhood. Whether or not this is the case here is irrelevant. Elmo wanted advice about how to cope with this situation and i did my best to advise based upon my experience looking after children.

[JackieQ]

Originally posted by moimeme

 

 

DAMN IT TO HELL.

 

I am SO SICK of people with NO CLUE spouting off about geniune medical conditons. What if what he had was diabetes and everyone were to post 'what is this crap about insulin - all he needs is more exercise'. You do not have clue one about this so how dare you make such inane remarks??????

 

AD/HD is a REAL PHYSICAL CONDITION. There are DEFINITE DIFFERENCES IN THE BRAINS OF PEOPLE WHO HAVE AD/HD WHEN COMPARED WITH PEOPLE WHO DO NOT. And the people with AD/HD deserve help, not this constant bullshxt from non-professionals who have NO right to 'believe' or 'not believe' in it.

 

Moimeme? sounds like you've had first hand experience with this somewhere?

 

My first reaction is to let you know that I have had experience with ADHD. I've worked on a study with perhaps around 400 ADHD kids...we looked at how attentional processes in these kids differ from other kids.

 

Yes, there are differences. And, no these kids can't just turn the switch off. What they do have to do is to live in the same world as the rest of us and so .. to teach a child that he/she can't control his behavior at all is not helpful nor responsible. It would be like saying to the diabetic that he has a disease and therefore can't control his blood sugar at all...there are medications AND there are things that can be done in everyday life that allow control.

 

I'm not sure how things are there...?you live in British Columbia right? Here, unfortunately, lots of kids get dx of ADHD by simply having a teacher or other adult complain enough about bad behavior and then a gp prescribes ritalin. Its a big problem. So, you have kids with real problems on one end of the spectrum. Simply overactive or underdisciplined kids at the other end of the spectrum. The diagnosis is a real real mixed bag. I've seen kids with the dx of ADHD who's hx of abuse and neglect would curl anyones toes. So, is it the dx causing the behavior or the abuse or both or what. I imagine as a therapist at some point it becomes moot...you do what helps and what works.

 

I certainly understand Elmo's frustration. Regardless of whether this kid is a brat / has ADHD / or something in between, this kid doesn't sound like he's easy to be around. You can't (or at least I can't) totally ignore a reaction like that. If nothing else I need to vent!

 

Elmo...off the wall suggestion...heck if i know if it would work. Is the kid old enough that you can get him to take a role that would make him easier to be around... Like, could he help with setting up a game of tag outside since he's so good at running. Or, you and he work out something where if he's able to keep his hands to himself during dinner he gets to help with or get first pick at dessert. Or, do you think that might just backfire?

 

jackieq

[moimeme]

Moimeme? sounds like you've had first hand experience with this somewhere?

 

You bet your butt I did. Two years living with an adult who had grown up without having had his AD/HD diagnosed ever. Then doing heaps of research only to find there is almost no help for couples dealing with this issue and that there is little help for adults with AD/HD - because people don't 'believe it exists' in many cases.

 

And then I ended up on the board of a small association advocating for adults with AD/HD and met a whole bunch of other grownups who also were fighting battles just to be diagnosed.

 

My first reaction is to let you know that I have had experience with ADHD. I've worked on a study with perhaps around 400 ADHD kids...we looked at how attentional processes in these kids differ from other kids.

 

Very cool. Kids have gotten a lot of attention and that's great - because without help, they grow into adults who still have the disorder and they don't do well in very many cases.

 

to teach a child that he/she can't control his behavior at all is not helpful nor responsible.

 

I don't think there's a soul here who has advocated that. Certainly not me.

 

AND there are things that can be done in everyday life that allow control.

 

Absolutely. But you know very well that disliking the kid and treating him as though he is willfully disobedient is not helpful. Treating him as a kid with a disorder that requires special attention and different ways of relating to get them to listen and obey is.

 

Here, unfortunately, lots of kids get dx of ADHD by simply having a teacher or other adult complain enough about bad behavior and then a gp prescribes ritalin. Its a big problem.

 

So then don't doubt the kids - deal with the AMA and get this fixed that way.

 

So, is it the dx causing the behavior or the abuse or both or what.

 

Well you must know that if the kid gets bashed around the head, the frontal lobe damage may then bring about AD/HD-like symptoms. And lots of kids have injured that bit of their noggins - through abuse or just through accidents.

 

 

 

________________

[Elmo]

Originally posted by JackieQ

 

 

Moimeme? sounds like you've had first hand experience with this somewhere?

 

My first reaction is to let you know that I have had experience with ADHD. I've worked on a study with perhaps around 400 ADHD kids...we looked at how attentional processes in these kids differ from other kids.

 

Yes, there are differences. And, no these kids can't just turn the switch off. What they do have to do is to live in the same world as the rest of us and so .. to teach a child that he/she can't control his behavior at all is not helpful nor responsible. It would be like saying to the diabetic that he has a disease and therefore can't control his blood sugar at all...there are medications AND there are things that can be done in everyday life that allow control.

 

I'm not sure how things are there...?you live in British Columbia right? Here, unfortunately, lots of kids get dx of ADHD by simply having a teacher or other adult complain enough about bad behavior and then a gp prescribes ritalin. Its a big problem. So, you have kids with real problems on one end of the spectrum. Simply overactive or underdisciplined kids at the other end of the spectrum. The diagnosis is a real real mixed bag. I've seen kids with the dx of ADHD who's hx of abuse and neglect would curl anyones toes. So, is it the dx causing the behavior or the abuse or both or what. I imagine as a therapist at some point it becomes moot...you do what helps and what works.

 

I certainly understand Elmo's frustration. Regardless of whether this kid is a brat / has ADHD / or something in between, this kid doesn't sound like he's easy to be around. You can't (or at least I can't) totally ignore a reaction like that. If nothing else I need to vent!

 

Elmo...off the wall suggestion...heck if i know if it would work. Is the kid old enough that you can get him to take a role that would make him easier to be around... Like, could he help with setting up a game of tag outside since he's so good at running. Or, you and he work out something where if he's able to keep his hands to himself during dinner he gets to help with or get first pick at dessert. Or, do you think that might just backfire?

 

jackieq

 

 

 

Hey Jackieq...

 

Thank you for taking the time to reply.

 

I have tried to "take him under my wing". I had better success when he was very little.

 

Stil...I love those middle school kids...and he is there now. So, I'll give it another try.

 

Just very, very tired of people blaming the world for their "spayshul" brats!

[JackieQ]

hang in there and good luck...

[TexasWife]

I'm late replying to this thread....but here goes anyway. Have you tried talking to your BIL about this?? If he is a great guy,as you said, he may be open to discussing your concerns. I'm assuming he's aware of the things his DS has broken and ruined in your home? Yikes!! Good luck, I really hope things will run smoothly for your holiday!