Whether or not to tell

[tigerlily71]

Hi everyone,

 

I've lurked for a while but this is my first post. I need some outside advice on whether or not to expose my ex as a cheater to his wife.

 

I'll try to keep this somewhat brief, but it's kind of a long story ...

 

We met at a party and exchanged numbers. He didn't have a ring on however I learned that he was married. He texted me and asked me to dinner at which point I mentioned that I heard he was married to which he replied that he was separated. He did say that the separation was recent and that he was still living in the house - in the basement - until the house was sold. At which point his wife and kids would be moving to another state to be closer to her family. He indicated he'd be going back and forth between states during the transition phase. Over dinner he also gave me more background on the relationship, ie, they'd had problems for years, already tried therapy, etc. Anyway, I thought I was dating a separated man although I admit I was uncomfortable from the start that it was so recent.

 

Within the first month, I asked if his wife knew about me and he said no and that it was better that she didn't know he had met someone already as they had only just separated and were still working out details of the settlement. I suggested we put our romantic relationship on hold until he was ready to tell her. How I wish I had stuck to my guns on this point He pleaded with me not to breakup - I admit we did really have an amazing relationship and friendship. I guess I didn't really want to give up on it either since I hadnt' ever connected with anyone else so well. So even though it didn't' feel right in my gut, I agreed with him. I'll note here I'd dated two separated men in the past and they were both totally honest and ended up divorced within months. Well, to make a long story short, he continued to procrastinate telling his wife, although he introduced me to friends and invited me to a dinner with his mother and brother while they were in town (which I couldn't make due to being stuck at work. God, how I wish I had made it to that dinner in retrospect).

 

(ETA: Around this time they sold the house, he got an apartment here and she moved with the kids to another state which he visited - splitting his time about 50/50 between states.)

 

After about 5 months, I caught him in a lie. He had told me his wife wouldn't be at his brother's wedding ("because we're separated") and I found out that she had been. Well, I broke it off with him that night. Again, he pleaded and cried and begged me not to. He was adamant that "this was it" and he said that on his next trip he'd have the big talk with her. She (supposedly) had been procrastinating on moving forward to a formal separation and divorce and he was going to finally put his foot down. Supposedly he did this -although in hindsight I'm not sure he did. When he came back to town, he told me about it and it seemed to be worked out. We resumed the relationship cautiously, although we did sleep together the next weekend. I found out 2 weeks later that I'd become pregnant on that weekend.

 

Fast forward a few weeks and he tells me that he and his ex had yet another talk during which she asked him to stay until their kids were older and he had pretty much agreed to do so - although he insisted to me that he had no interest in her and would be in the basement and so he didn't see why he and I couldn't continue(!!). I made him take all of his things and leave my house that night. That was pretty much the end of the relationship. We obviously had to keep in touch because of the baby but we've never been together again.

 

I know the pregnancy was a 50/50 error -stupidity on both our parts, thinking we could be safe. He is stupid for pushing it and insisting he could be safe and I am stupid for allowing it and thinking it would be. But part of me thinks it really wasn't 50/50 because I was only with him that weekend because I'd been lied to.

 

He went from telling me he wanted to marry me to abandoning me with a pregnancy in the space of 5 weeks. He started calling less and less frequently over the pregnancy. I've never felt that you can argue with someone who wants to break up with you so I did my best to let him go, although I cried about the situation practically every night.

 

Nobody in his life other than one friend knows about this. I've gone back and forth about whether to tattle on him. I've just never gotten up the nerve to do it. Also, my son is 3 months old now and believe it or not, I've held out hope that my ex will be a father to him in some way. I'm afraid by tattling, I'll ruin any chance of that. I know, I know, who would want this guy as a father to their son. I guess it's just more difficult for me since I know him in real life and he does have many good qualities. I've been scared to burn the bridge. Thinking I can always tell but I can never un-tell.

 

Anyway, I let it go and let him go back to working on his family for his kids' sake, if that's what he wanted. We are actually very civil and even nice to one another. For me that's something I do for our son's sake. But this past week I found out he is flirting with another woman and trying to start a relationship with her. Our son is only 3 months old! I've been left to care for him myself even after having a c-section, which was incredibly hard. Some days I felt like I couldn't even do it. And I feel like I've been crying for almost a year now. I have no prospects for dating again for at least a year since the baby takes all my attention and time. I can't believe he gets to just move on and have another girlfriend. His emails to her are downright giddy - he's saying the things he used to say to me.

 

Obviously, now I'm reconsidering telling his wife everything or forcing him to. I don't know if it's right for me to do it since there are kids involved and I don't even know how I would. I'm terrified since I feel really guilty that I allowed the relationship to go on when I knew his wife didn't know about me. I also am worried that it will end our amicable relationship forever and my son will grow up and blame me for that. It's easy for me to say that he shouldn't want this man for a father but I don't know if a child or teenager will see it that way and it breaks my heart to think he'll hate me if I burn this bridge.

 

I also think maybe I'm too upset to make good decisions right now and might just be acting out of spite. What would you do - would you say anything? Sorry this was so long.

Edited October 1, 2013 by tigerlily71

[harrybrown]

Is he paying child support?

[Jonah]

I am no fan of an OP notifying anyone but in this case...

 

You could have remained a secret, it was your choice to allow yourself to be duped by a married man, but your child should not have to be a secret by no means. He or she will have some half brothers and sisters. They should know about your child and your child should know about them. And unless you are independently wealthy, pops should be paying his fair share of child support and maintaining a healthy level of emotional support for the child. It sounds like he liked you so he shouldn't have all that much of a problem sucking it up.

 

Any muck from this guy about the child support... get a lawyer and stick your MM with the bill.

[BetrayedH]

Is he paying child support?

 

This is a good question. If he isn't, I'd bet my bottom dollar that his wife doesn't know jack about any of this (or that she was "separated," for that matter). My gut says that he made a big "oops" in getting his secret other woman pregnant and is now crossing his fingers that you go away quietly. And now he keeps his wife, family, and has a (not-so-pregnant) new model girlfriend. And you've been sitting here wondering "WTF?" while you raise his child, wishing for him to be a father (which doesn't seem real likely).

 

In the meantime, she's only a phone call away.

 

Of course, if he's paying you child support then his wife (probably) does know about you and my theory is out the window. But my gut says he isn't paying child support either (unless it's under-the-table hush money).

 

My vote is to get the truth out on the table for everyone involved so that they can all make informed decisions about how to move forward.

[tigerlily71]

Yes, he's paying, but I don't think he is paying enough. We completed a worksheet together and now that I had a friend look at it, I think he claimed too many expenses and his payment is probably a few hundred dollars short. So now I've called an attorney to help determine the correct amount and to get everything in writing and legal. I suspect he took a dispersement from a retirement account and setup a checking account just for this. The first check he gave me was #001 The wife definitely does not know.

 

I only remained secret because he was negotiating settlement terms - supposedly - including his rights with his children. It wasn't your typical "other woman" type of secrecy. Although, maybe it was and I just didn't know it at the time. I mean, he was in an apartment and inviting me to meet some of his family. I don't think I'll ever know exactly what happened without speaking with the wife.

 

I just wonder am I really doing it for her sake or because I"m so angry that he doesn't even ask about his son and is about to do the same thing with someone else. I'm so furious at him right now.

[yellowmaverick]

Tell her . You need the child support and she needs the truth about her life. I guarantee that virtually nothing that he told you about their lives is true.

 

I would advise you not to focus on dating right now. By your own admission, you have "dated" at least tbree married men. I think that you need to gain some independence and try to figure out why you are content with being a repeat mistress as opposed to a being with a true life partner.

 

Hope he doesn't make any trouble over the child support. It's time for him to step up.

[BetrayedH]

Yes, he's paying, but I don't think he is paying enough. We completed a worksheet together and now that I had a friend look at it, I think he claimed too many expenses and his payment is probably a few hundred dollars short. So now I've called an attorney to help determine the correct amount and to get everything in writing and legal. I suspect he took a dispersement from a retirement account and setup a checking account just for this. The first check he gave me was #001 The wife definitely does not know.

 

I only remained secret because he was negotiating settlement terms - supposedly - including his rights with his children. It wasn't your typical "other woman" type of secrecy. Although, maybe it was and I just didn't know it at the time. I mean, he was in an apartment and inviting me to meet some of his family. I don't think I'll ever know exactly what happened without speaking with the wife.

 

I just wonder am I really doing it for her sake or because I"m so angry that he doesn't even ask about his son and is about to do the same thing with someone else. I'm so furious at him right now.

 

As I suspected, he's paying you hush money.

 

Good move on the attorney. Please follow-thru.

 

Personally, I don't care about your motives in contacting the wife. This has gone too far when a secret other child is involved (and he's doing it again) and the truth needs to come out for everyone involved (you, his wife, and the children). This mess needs to be cleaned up.

 

My $.02

[JamesM]

I only remained secret because he was negotiating settlement terms - supposedly - including his rights with his children. It wasn't your typical "other woman" type of secrecy. Although, maybe it was and I just didn't know it at the time. I mean, he was in an apartment and inviting me to meet some of his family. I don't think I'll ever know exactly what happened without speaking with the wife.

 

Was he actually separated? If you met his family and he was in an apartment, then this says he was separated. While I don't think you should meet with a separated man anymore than a married man, you did.

 

I just wonder am I really doing it for her sake or because I"m so angry that he doesn't even ask about his son and is about to do the same thing with someone else. I'm so furious at him right now.

 

IMO you are doing it out of anger AND out of concern for his and your son. I doubt you really care about her....just my opinion.

 

But that isn't your problem. It is his.

 

How do you know he is about to do the same thing again? If you know for sure, then you should let this new woman know about your son and you, too.

[tigerlily71]

 

I would advise you not to focus on dating right now. By your own admission, you have "dated" at least tbree married men. I think that you need to gain some independence and try to figure out why you are content with being a repeat mistress as opposed to a being with a true life partner.

 

 

No, I'm definitely not focused on dating. Not even interested. The separated men I'd dated were already out of the house and finalizing divorces. One was quick and they finalized things within a month of us dating and the other one I barely went out with but I know he finalized things very quickly also. In both those cases, the soon-to-be-exes were already seeing other people, too. I guess each person has their own definition but I didn't consider myself to be a "mistress" in either situation because everything was totally in the open and public. But I was stupid with this guy in hindsight and I'll probably never trust or date someone who is separated again.

[yellowmaverick]

No, I'm definitely not focused on dating. Not even interested. The separated men I'd dated were already out of the house and finalizing divorces. One was quick and they finalized things within a month of us dating and the other one I barely went out with but I know he finalized things very quickly also. In both those cases, the soon-to-be-exes were already seeing other people, too. I guess each person has their own definition but I didn't consider myself to be a "mistress" in either situation because everything was totally in the open and public. But I was stupid with this guy in hindsight and I'll probably never trust or date someone who is separated again.

 

I think that's a good plan. Frankly, with the responsibilities of working and caring for a young child, you don't need the baggage.

[TigerCub]

As I suspected, he's paying you hush money.

 

Good move on the attorney. Please follow-thru.

 

Personally, I don't care about your motives in contacting the wife. This has gone too far when a secret other child is involved (and he's doing it again) and the truth needs to come out for everyone involved (you, his wife, and the children). This mess needs to be cleaned up.

 

My $.02

 

So true.

I can imagine cheating on it's own is heartbreaking enough - but to realize that one's spouse had a child with someone else, would be crushing - but it something that a BS deserves to know - Gosh! It would shine a light on who they are married to.

 

The only thing I would worry about thought Tigerlily is that if after you tell, (a while after) - they decide to still stay together and go for shared custody of your son. Would you really want your son to be raised by him and his wife? (I'm not trying to say that his wife will be mean on purpose, but wouldn't there be resentment towards your kid)?

 

I dunno, I'm sorry I'm not trying to be extra gloomy, or scare you, it's just something I'd worry about if I was in your shoes.

 

My initial instinct says to out him, because he should be outed for the sleaze he is, and because his wife deserves to know what kind of ass she married, but then, on the other hand, what would happen if they went for shared custody?

[tigerlily71]

So true.

 

The only thing I would worry about thought Tigerlily is that if after you tell, (a while after) - they decide to still stay together and go for shared custody of your son. Would you really want your son to be raised by him and his wife? (I'm not trying to say that his wife will be mean on purpose, but wouldn't there be resentment towards your kid)?

 

I've been thinking about this all night. I'm going to ask the attorney if I can have him sign something that will include his support payment and will also waive all his rights to the baby and any decision-making (since I know he'll always just want the cheapest option for everything). I feel like I should do this before saying anything since his wife is probably going to lose her mind and start her own proceedings against him. I'm afraid now that my son would end up getting the leftovers if she takes him to the cleaners before we can sign something.

[TigerCub]

I've been thinking about this all night. I'm going to ask the attorney if I can have him sign something that will include his support payment and will also waive all his rights to the baby and any decision-making (since I know he'll always just want the cheapest option for everything). I feel like I should do this before saying anything since his wife is probably going to lose her mind and start her own proceedings against him. I'm afraid now that my son would end up getting the leftovers if she takes him to the cleaners before we can sign something.

 

Look into it, your exMM might be fool enough to fall for it, but it seems doubtful, like why would he agree to pay and support the kid, but not have any say at all in how he was raised? - But I mean considering the situation, he might go for it - talk to the lawyer.

 

I dunno about that part in bold. It is a possibility, but then again, a lot of people experience a cheating spouse and stay. So we don't know what SHE will do.

 

Definitely try to do what you can to cover your bases when it comes to protecting your son.

 

Keep us posted.

[Jonah]

why would he agree to pay and support the kid, but not have any say at all in how he was raised?

 

What? Having dad around would be a problem? That's agenda is bit selfish and would be a negative for the kid wouldn't it? That the poster writes that she is angry at the OP for being absent is more normal maternally I think.

 

Barring anything extreme, how would it be a negative having help raising the kid? Sadly it's more common and more likely in this circumstance that dad ain't gonna be around.

 

Studies show that kids that have to grow up in two households, having to deal with different sets of rules more easily adapt to changing conditions in the real world. They learn early on how to "roll with it".

 

I'm thinking that after the bomb drops, step mom, if there ever is one... might be someone totally new to this storyline... and that's if the OP is man enough to be a dad. Heck the OW might actually wind up owning the schmuck.

[2sure]

HE CALCULATED HIS CHILD SUPPORT BASED ON HIS EXPENSES?

 

Uh, No. That's not the way it works honey. Child support is based on his earnings , your earnings, and the EXPENSES OF THE CHILD.

 

You are the care taker and sole representative of your son. Getting a legal chld support order is your responsibility and obligation because it is in your child's best interest if not yours.

 

What if dad disappears, what if something happens to you, what if there are medical expenses. His bio dad might not be there for him physically ever, but your child will need financial help.

 

Your upset because your MM has another OW. Be upset because he is neglecting your child's life .

[tigerlily71]

Thank for the input, everyone. Let me try to answer some things that came up...

 

He has total freedom to be with our son and I would love it, but he doesn't seem interested. He didn't come here for his birth. He doesn't ask about him. I've never seen him take a pic of him when visiting. Having him involved in our son's life was my whole rationale for going along with the secrecy and being a pushover - I thought if things stayed amicable and that his home life with his other kids wasn't destroyed that he'd have no reason to resent me or avoid his son. Believe me, no one in my life thought I should go along. My brothers want to kill him.

 

We just had what I thought was a nice visit a few weeks ago but then I found out he was in our town last week and didn't contact me to arrange to see the baby during that visit at all.

 

I want him in his life, but so far he isn't showing up and I just hate that someone who isn't showing any interest, love or pride in him would get to make his medical or educational decisions but I guess that's the legality that I will have to live with in exchange for support payments.

 

The worksheet we used calculates based on income but allows you to subtract expenses for other children. He completed that portion incorrectly and took too many allowances for his other kids but I don't know if it was intentional or not.

 

I'm not as much upset about the OW as I am mad at him and myself that I gave him this leeway so that he could work on his relationship with his kids and supposedly continue to work on the divorce under the best conditions possible and instead of using it for that, he's using it to hit on other women while ignoring his son. And I guarantee hasn't made any progress on the divorce in the past year.

 

And, no, the baby wasn't intentional. He was temporarily in charge of BC due to some medical issues I had just had. Those same issues gave me painful periods which is how I became worried fairly quickly - because not only was I a few days late but I hadn't had a single cramp whereas in the past I had been needing prescription painkillers. No conspiracy here.

 

And, yes, his name is on the birth certificate.

[yellowmaverick]

I just hate that someone who isn't showing any interest, love or pride in him would get to make his medical or educational decisions but I guess that's the legality that I will have to live with in exchange for support payments.

 

 

 

Not necessarily. You can still have sole custody for purposes of deciding medical issues, schooling, etc. Ask your attorney about this.

[Spotme]

Not necessarily. You can still have sole custody for purposes of deciding medical issues, schooling, etc. Ask your attorney about this.

 

Yes, custody and child support are separate issues. You can file for full physical and legal custody as well as child support.* In most states, just FYI, he cannot voluntarily terminate his parental rights (no longer be considered even a noncustodial parent and be freed of child support requirements), unless someone else is willing to adopt the child (a step-parent usually).

 

To sum up, get thee to a lawyer who deals in custody issues, and legally file for child support. It's all about your child's best interest.

 

*terminology and organizational structure varies from state to state.

Edited October 1, 2013 by Spotme
Typo

[SincereOnlineGuy]

What say you hold off on telling the wife until such a point as when you clearly have something to gain from so doing??

[road]

Hi everyone,

 

I've lurked for a while but this is my first post. I need some outside advice on whether or not to expose my ex as a cheater to his wife.

 

 

 

I also think maybe I'm too upset to make good decisions right now and might just be acting out of spite. What would you do - would you say anything? Sorry this was so long.

 

 

Easy to figure out what to do when you eliminate the unimportant stuff.

 

You have to accept that you got played by a MM.

 

Learn from this. And forget the MM and telling his BW.

[ClemsonTigers]

What would you do - would you say anything? Sorry this was so long.

 

What would I do in your situation.....

 

I would put that lovely child up for adoption so he or she would have a chance at a normal life in a home with a mother AND a loving father in an intact and hopefully enduring marriage. I would likely consider one of the more modern open adoption arrangements that are available these days allowing me some visitation and involvement in the child's life.

 

Instead of focusing on what I was entitled to and treating my child like he or she is a trump card in a mixed up love triangle between MM, his wife, his newest mistress and myself, I would try looking at this from my child's standpoint. He or she just wants and needs a dad. MM is never gonna be a proper father to him|her. It's beyond his capabilities. Even if he divorces his wife, I'd have to realize he's not coming around my henhouse again (unless it's for another quick "lay"). I'd read and read and read until I realized these situation NEVER work out for the OW like I dreamed (there's evidence of this all over the internet). MM is not my nor my child's knight in shining armor, never was and never will be. I would realize that hatred and resentment encircle and entrap all the parties to these situations. Then I would look upon my child sleeping and consider the 1000's of stable and loving 2 parent homes out there that would practically kill for the opportunity to raise this beautiful child and say "wow, adoption truly solves this dilemma on so many levels". Sure it let's MM off the hook but I'd realize it let's me off the hook too from a lifetime of bitterness and resentment. It also provides the child with the best opportunity for a normal life.

 

In the alternative, realizing I'm likely just too selfish to give up this perfect child even though it would be the best for him|her, I'd keep the child but leave the MM and his wife alone. I would definitely inform her about the affair and the OC first because she deserves the truth about her own life but at the same time assure her that you don't want or need anything from them. That even though you'd been lied to - you did know he was still married and you had no right to invade her marriage and; accordingly, have no right to demand access to her family treasury. Now I'd probably reserve the right to demand support if MM does divorce his wife. I may seek support at that time after his wife carves out her piece of the pie, but while he remains married I wouldn't double victimize his wife by taking money from her (and the children of their legitimate relationship). I'd accept the fact that I alone really chose to have this baby as a single mother and I can and will do it myself. Again, I'd hopefully realize that MM isn't going to ever be a real father to this child so I'm doing this all on my own anyway. I also would fear seeking and making him pay support because then my child might be exposed to him MORE than I ever wanted or feel comfortable with. I may end up being stuck in this town and have visitation court ordered. I know he's a philanderer, adulterer, and a liar. He's not exactly a good role model and I certainly don't want my child ending up in visitation situations with the MM's wife, alone and|or with MM's children, alone. These people are gonna have longstanding inner secret resentments against my child and I won't be able to protect him|her. My dear child is better off far away from these people....seeking support may be jeopardizing his|her safety.

 

Additionally, I'd be concerned about my future relationships. What kind of guy is going to want to sign up for this mess. It'd be much easier for me to say the father isn't involved in the life of the child and lives far, far away than to have to remain by court order in proximity to MM and explain his ultimately very toxic presence and continuing involvement in my life. This is the guy that lied to me and apparently had a VERY negative effect on my life and goals. There's nothing he can do to make amends for this. Once I come to my senses I'm going to hate this guy for what he did to me and my child. Sure the child is a blessing but MM is and shall remain very toxic to me. I should seek and maintain distance from him and realize that no super great guy is going to be around me if I force or keep MM in my life. MM's toxicity will rub off on me.

 

I would accept full responsibility for trying to take something that wasn't mine. The consequences are immense but they are mine and they will happen regardless of MM's consequences. Fairness doesn't matter. I would therefore focus on trying to minimize the consequences to me AND my child. I would realize they can be minimized to the greatest extent by adoption and to a lessor extent by me just disclosing to MM's wife and then disappearing from MM's (and his wife's) life completely. Then, in time and after much reading, learning and maturing, seek out a new healthy relationship with a wonderful and available single man that can eventually help me raise this child without any toxic entanglements.

[SincereOnlineGuy]

Why? doesn't she deserve the truth?

 

 

 

Who cares what the wife deserves?

 

 

It is never the place of the other woman to be telling the wife anything.

 

Her motives for so doing would always be something other than purely ethical.

 

 

The dumb guy should realize that a shared child is clearly reason to expect the possibility that the wife could find out through other means, and with that factor as the singular determination heeeeeeeee should tell his wife about the affair/child.

[Mycteria]

Please don't listen to the two posters above me. Especially clemsontigers. I don't think I need to explain why.

 

You HAVE to tell his wife if you want your child to have any chance of knowing his father. Just think about this for a second. How could he possibly have a real relationship with his son if he's having to hide it from his wife? What about when your son is older and finds out that his dad is hiding him? How will he be able to hide going to school events, graduation, etc? The wife must be told. Your ex will be very angry for a while but maybe once it's out in the open, he won't have such an obvious barrier to being able to see his child.

 

Of course, from the sounds of it, he's not going to be much of a father anyway. But at least if you tell, there might be a chance. I wouldn't want to risk the chance of your ex actually managing to keep it a secret from his wife, continuing to drop in every now and then, and them your son finding out later why his dad was never around: because he has a whole other family he is hiding, including your son's brothers and sisters. Get this cleared up now before your son gets older, so that he may have a chance to have a relationship with his father and siblings. Or not. But at least this way you'll know.

 

And yes, the wife does deserve to know and it IS your place to tell her. It doesn't matter if your reasons aren't 100% ethical. The result is the same - she will be given the choice that everyone deserves. Although you used poor judgement in regards to your MM, he deceived both of you! You found out about the deception. Do her the favor of telling her.

[Goodbye]

Easy to figure out what to do when you eliminate the unimportant stuff.

 

You have to accept that you got played by a MM.

 

Learn from this. And forget the MM and telling his BW.

 

 

Hmm, this is a first. Aren't you generally a staunch advocate of the BS knowing the truth and reconciliation? Or, do you think the only way the BS should find out is from high tech snooping and stalking? Confusing.

[yellowmaverick]

realizing I'm likely just too selfish to give up this perfect child even though it would be the best for him|her, I'd keep the child but leave the MM and his wife alone.

 

WOW. Presumptious and mean. You have no idea what kind of parent she would be. There is nothing selfish about raising a child who you love and are devoted to, regardless of the circumstances.

 

I may seek support at that time after his wife carves out her piece of the pie, but while he remains married I wouldn't double victimize his wife by taking money from her (and the children of their legitimate relationship).

 

While I agree that this is an all-around sh***y situation for his wife, the fact is, the MM's responsibility to this child is as great as is his responsibility for his children with his wife. This child is not entitled to merely the "leftovers".

 

That being said, I feel for the wife and ALL of the children in this situation. Infidelity s**ks.